The most important nation of all, the imagiNATION.

[Jeff Davis]

Without a doubt a very fun and brilliant read. Man, do we ever NEED more people like Eric!


Psychic Astronauts: Remote Viewing, Space Exploration, and UFOs @ The Nightshirt

 

[Randall]

Without a doubt a very fun and brilliant read. Man, do we ever NEED more people like Eric!

There's insufficient evidence from remote viewing for me to conclude that consciousness is non-local. It seems to me that other explanations involve less of a leap. For example it may not be the case that the remote viewer is picking up a remote location as if they are attending the actual location in-person in real time, but instead, picking up someone else's thoughts or memories about the location. At first, telepathic communication seems as far out as remote viewing, but actually it's not, and that's because it doesn't require some supernatural explanation for perception at the remote end of the connection. This may mean that the RV phenomenon doesn't mean that one's consciousness is flitting around "out there" beyond one's body, but that it's still right there in the room, and receiving perceptual signals via another method of transmission we don't fully understand.

 

[technomage]

Double blind RV protocols were designed to eliminate the telepathic connection since the interviewers didn't know where the target was either.

I agree that RV may have another explanation than non-local consciousness. It could be some sort of information emanation from the target that reaches the remote viewer (I just made that explanation up off the top of my head).

 

[Randall]

Double blind RV protocols were designed to eliminate the telepathic connection since the interviewers didn't know where the target was either.
I agree that RV may have another explanation than non-local consciousness. It could be some sort of information emanation from the target that reaches the remote viewer (I just made that explanation up off the top of my head).

Telepathic communication doesn't necessarily have to involve the interviewers. What's needed is a location where it has been proven that nobody alive has any knowledge of what it's like ( theoretical or otherwise ), and where the resulting information could not have been extrapolated somehow by subconscious processes. I've not seen any RV situation where that is the case. For that matter, I've not seen any RV case that is remarkable enough to claim non-locality of consciousness. If actual non-locality of consciousness were happening, then the information gained should be detailed and accurate, not vague and constrained and subject to interpretation. Our conscious experience is extremely detailed and fast compared to anything I've seen claimed by an RVer.

 

[Jeff Davis]

Double blind RV protocols were designed to eliminate the telepathic connection since the interviewers didn't know where the target was either.

I agree that RV may have another explanation than non-local consciousness. It could be some sort of information emanation from the target that reaches the remote viewer (I just made that explanation up off the top of my head).

Remote Viewing seems to indicate that there is a virtual, or informational copy of the entirety of space time. If we can truly go anywhere via RV, and survey matters for ourselves extraterrestrial, might there be an informational copy of everything we might possibly become aware of, including ourselves as well? Could this copy of ourselves be the psychonaut? This is a really cool magazine that someone commenting on Eric's post left clues concerning. Everyone is going to enjoy this and find it at very least entertaining.

http://www.eightmartinis.com/downloads/eight martinis issue4.pdf

What blows my mind, is how that something as paramount to human awareness as RV would seem to be, could be brushed aside as tomfoolery via programming within mainstream science and nothing more. The former speaks of the most powerful exploration tool ever described, the latter, well it speaks clearly of the single most common and dominating instinctual motive we have as a species, namely fear. Oh that science could get it's head out of it's assets. Maybe someday eh?

 

[ALPHA ROMEO UNIFORM]

Therefore is their a so called ' Electrical Data Base' of all once living organism from all animals not just humans and does the elements with in the make up of structures give off electronica nodes which so called 'Remote Viewers' tap into when focusing on a subject when using his or her Brain? Does his or her act as some power switch for the Brain which light up 'Connectors' and does the blood minerals increases the circulation of the body? and creates a surge for a electrical transfer does this electrical currents leap out of the human body and tap into some element of the 'Earth Magnetic Field 'and further into the solar system ? Or is their a spiritual aspect to this concept which science cannot answer currently ?

 

[nameless]

"The most important nation of all,"
..thought it was the peoples Democratic republic of congo.

 

[Jeff Davis]

"The most important nation of all,"
..thought it was the peoples Democratic republic of congo.

I am sitting here just busting up! OMG, the way that struck me out of the blue was just insane...I love it!

 

[Jeff Davis]

Therefore is their a so called ' Electrical Data Base' of all once living organism from all animals not just humans and does the elements with in the make up of structures give off electronica nodes which so called 'Remote Viewers' tap into when focusing on a subject when using his or her Brain? Does his or her act as some power switch for the Brain which light up 'Connectors' and does the blood minerals increases the circulation of the body? and creates a surge for a electrical transfer does this electrical currents leap out of the human body and tap into some element of the 'Earth Magnetic Field 'and further into the solar system ? Or is their a spiritual aspect to this concept which science cannot answer currently ?

I really have no clue. Lots of hypothetical imaginings, but a "real" understanding, not a chance. What I am thinking about doing is learning, or experimenting with RV, myself. I am intrigued by the idea that there may be two possible environments that mirror one another, one informational, and one physical, yet may provide a tremendously widened perspective with respect to a singular combining of each.

It would seem to me that the matter is down to consciousness itself. If consciousness is as I imagine it to be, it is an environmental attribute to which humanity adapted many thousands of years ago.

The link to this medium may in fact be as rudimentary initializing as the act of physically observing itself, however that would seem to preclude, or negate the basic premise that, in mankind's pre-erectus, non-sentient animal state, it (the animal's mental faculties) lacked this present sophistication and relied on sheer brute instinct to survive until it attained sentience by virtue of specialization.

Do you want to know a distinct, but utterly fantastic premise in question? What if there is only one actual sentient species involved here to begin with? What if consciousness itself is the holographic universe? What if the entirety of our reality is the consciousness demonstration of one incredibly sophisticated life form? Each human incidence of consciousness merely representing an alternate sentient reflection within a mother consciousness of infinite progressions.

This could explain why sentient "cells" within such a mother consciousness could access the informational realm which might be nothing more than a rogue neural synaptic practice of accessing mom's subconscious memories.

This "grid" of virtual space time may be the filing system of what is our environmental consciousness's SC memory.

 

[Jeff Davis]

Another truly mind blowing aspect of consciousness considerations is reincarnation. Stunning new evidence from someone who's book just sailed to the top of my MUST READ list. Bottom line, if reincarnation is real, there is no question that what is consciousness is in fact non-local. It doesn't get much more non-local than changing physiological IDs.

New book reveals the children who believe they have been reincarnated | Mail Online

 

[Burnt State]

I've not seen any RV case that is remarkable enough to claim non-locality of consciousness. If actual non-locality of consciousness were happening, then the information gained should be detailed and accurate, not vague and constrained and subject to interpretation.

Are you saying that in Penetration, when Ingo said he saw alien life forms on the moon looking back at him and his holographic viewing of 'Them,' that it was all bogus!? I mean what more proof do you need of either RV or alien existence?

 

[ALPHA ROMEO UNIFORM]

Like us all Jeff and its such a interesting subject RV and some say its all smoke and mirrors which does have a element regards folks like so called Ed Dames predictions. The Ingo Swan viewpoint on so called ET ? or Humans on the Moon? Some suggest it was a work of fiction? others thinks its real like most who enjoyed the adventure of the book left with a open mind and it reminds me of the Sci-Fi show
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fringe_(TV_series) Pre-programing ? do RV change in the way they act and body language compared to other folks who never do the course??

 

[Burnt State]

Theoretically the discussion around RV is entirely fascinating, especially with the historical perspectives of protocols developed and the mind-blowing narratives. However, if RV was an actual, tangible practice that allowed a trained individual to experience the universe as a hologram in their mind, which only needs to bring focus to points in time and space, then certainly it should be a dominant feature in our midsts, no?

I like to think I'm pretty open minded, but I measure RV based on the lack of contemporary practice and Swan's fanciful sci-fi, homoerotic tale of 'penetration.' When RV is being used in name only to charge exorbitant pricing for so-called "training" courses by elite RV'ers it starts to slide into bogus territory for me.

Like other aspects of the paranormal we are left with many colourful anecdotes that lends its narrative to endless speculation and confabulation. Nice to think about how it works but I haven't seen/heard enough to get past "if it works" yet.

 

[boomerang]

A problem I have with RV is that its developers seem to present it as a set of techniques and protocols that are somehow a new innovation and yet involve no new technologies. It's hard to see how there could be anything "new under the sun" in terms of mental psychic disciplines given the many thousands of years mankind has been seeking a means if divining what is just over the hill, so to speak. Or do originators of the Army's remote viewing program even claim it to represent recently developed innovations? It doesn't make sense to me from a historical point of view.

 

[Jeff Davis]

A problem I have with RV is that its developers seem to present it as a set of techniques and protocols that are somehow a new innovation and yet involve no new technologies. It's hard to see how there could be anything "new under the sun" in terms of mental psychic disciplines given the many thousands of years mankind has been seeking a means if divining what is just over the hill, so to speak. Or do originators of the Army's remote viewing program even claim it to represent recently developed innovations? It doesn't make sense to me from a historical point of view.

Boomerang,
You do make an excellent point here, and that is precisely why we find in every legitimate RV circle I have looked into, and every researcher I have so far read, all making the claim that, "this is nothing new". It's not. It is true that in these times with all our present technology that we can find ways to measure and attain a far more accurate RV result with the lab based technology. We can also do a much better job of substantively correlating the evidence supporting the process. For instance the Ingo's Jupiter rings, etc. However, RV itself is nothing new in the least. It's described in literature thousands of years ago in the same precise manner it's used today. The problem is, is that it works and works well. You can prove it to yourself if you care to. Look into that remote viewing magazine I offered a link to. See the chapter that has something to do with RV and skeptics.

There will always be the Ed Dames, and the Steven Greer likes out there, that are charlatans.

The only thing that matters to me with respect for the the RV process is what it implies. The process itself is not that fascinating. In fact, apart from an Ingo/Pat level of capable experience, it's rather mundane. The part I find beyond fascinating is the nature of all things informational. How that information can be accessed without a physical connection to it is mind boggling, but not half as much as what this informational access means to our place in this environment.

If what I think, or suspect to be true is the actual case, humankind is so far off it's natural track that it will take a miracle for us not destroy ourselves at this point. I believe that this progression has happened several times already. No wonder this world is so upside down and without anything resembling a natural environmentally progressive existence. That's what happens when people have too much time on their hands. They get destructive in a hurry due to fear.

 

[ALPHA ROMEO UNIFORM]

The RV mob should be able to pick up the so called Secret Space Program and any odd goings on the Moon and wonder if Gene and Chris might get say Mr Paul Smith and other credible RV to do a show on the subject and pre-recorded show doing a search??

 

[Jeff Davis]

The RV mob should be able to pick up the so called Secret Space Program and any odd goings on the Moon and wonder if Gene and Chris might get say Mr Paul Smith and other credible RV to do a show on the subject and pre-recorded show doing a search??

The whole RV thing is quite misunderstood unfortunately. Let me give you an example. An intelligence operative trained in the act of RV is given a target.

Stop.

It's hard to stop at this point because frankly the average instantaneous response we have internally compels us forward as we crave this mystical armchair's ultimately comfy perspective exploration of the universe, right? I mean lets set the controls for the heart of the sun and be done with it baby! But is that what was really just stated? Nope. It's what we wanted to be stated, but it is not what was stated despite our eager interpretations of matters that we ourselves make slightly, well not so much "slightly", but rather, HUMONGOUSLY more so fantastic than what the process actually consists of.

RV is a specific technique that bases itself on two very undeniable precepts. They are coordinates, and informational retrieval. Without those two integral processes existing in tandem, synchronized into a composite essential to the overall act of informational retrieval, results will be less than stellar with respect to unfamiliar locations.

As an example. Your wife or girlfriend choses an object and places that object in a shoebox under the bed in your guest room. She then relates to you precisely where in the house the object is located and precisely what the object is contained within. So, your target is the box under the bed, not the object in the box. Your job as a practitioner of RV is to retrieve the informational contents of the target. In order for this to happen, it is prerequisite that you are supplied with an accurate and accessibly defined target.

So unfortunately, RV is not quick access to some consciousness demonstration of a cosmic library of all that is wherein we find information just waiting to be checked out by the prospective RVer. Not at all. Like any spy, our RV has to first be adeptly trained in the process of developing a coordinated means of accessing target info. Like all spies, his mission is dependent on intel quality and accuracy. The informational retrieval process is thoroughly dependent on a very real consciousness navigational cartography that the RVer must maintain during info ret. It's heavy shit when you get to the actual 3D spacetime grid and not something that a truly adept RVer would even consider demonstrating on a whim. It's just not how it works. Unfortunately!

 

[Trajanus]

The credibility of RV surely suffered due to its association with Courtney Brown's books like Cosmic Yoyage. A lot of garbage was supposedly based on "remote viewing." Surprised nobody mentioned that.

 

[Jeff Davis]

The credibility of RV surely suffered due to its association with Courtney Brown's books like Cosmic Yoyage. A lot of garbage was supposedly based on "remote viewing." Surprised nobody mentioned that.

Trajanus,
This is a very large and fascinating subject in aspect , if we stop to think about it from a alternate perspective.

In fact, and possibly more so potentially clear as an example, consider the US intelligence community's initiative that planted a seemingly very credible interactive evidential informational agency, such as was the case with the Bill Moore disinformation agent plant not too long ago. Amongst the stunned, specifically the numerous high profile, dues paid, established (published/lecture) and experienced UFO researchers that had worked ardently and eagerly, directly with Moore himself when he was in UFOlogy's endearing vogue perspective, what really stood out was the blank, zombie like, forward glare in the men and women's eyes, their lower jaws lay directly beneath them, having fallen from their faces and shattered in a thousand pieces like fine china. It was an unexpected and immediately crippling shock. If only that Bill Moore guy would have been more so a fruit cake like the Courtney Brown clan instead of appearing so....so, uh, right on the money.

The interesting thing here is how the polar opposite (disinformation) was used to achieve the Bill Moore con. In fact, what had accomplished the most real damage of all was Bill's impeccable track, and credential record, in his short tenure in the Ufology fringe itself.

Those false externally apparent characteristics served in an effort to misdirect attention and incite critical infrastructure damage in the form of imploded morale that resulted in further organizational breakdown. One thing that always struck me as being very funny or odd however. Why? This being without ever revealing any new truths whatsoever. IMO, this was no espionage mission as much as it was a sheer calculated militant strike on a very potential enemy target. It's objective, inflict as much damage as possible, and get out.

What was the real motive for this strike?

Isn't it interesting that the intelligence agencies involved here are specifically interested in deceiving us first and foremost, rather than ever revealing any newly derived information, or previously known information concerning UFOs, or Remote Viewing?

It's like they (the alphabet boys) have arrogantly made clear to private sector researchers , "We're not in the truth business. We're not in the justice, nor the peace keeping business either. We're in the information business, and frankly, we are a very powerfully funded and extremely jealous bunch of shadow creeps. Step out of line with respect to your best guesses concerning "The UFOs" and we'll take that very information from you, and we will beat you silly with it six ways from Sunday. Here's a nice friendly tip, get out of town. Just to make the journey a pleasant one, we packed you a picnic to enjoy along the way. Some nice left over subterfuge sandwiches for you to choke on, er, I mean chew on. Here's a little battery acid to help wash it all down.

 

[Trajanus]

such as was the case with the Bill Moore disinformation agent plant not too long ago.

IIRC it was quite some time ago, 1989, and somebody--Lance Moody--said Moore must've been laughing since the disinfo admission was phoney. But while my memory on this is vague, Moore was said to have looked depressed, almost bawling.

Those false externally apparent characteristics served in an effort to misdirect attention and incite critical infrastructure damage in the form of imploded morale that resulted in further organizational breakdown. One thing that always struck me as being very funny or odd however. Why? This being without ever revealing any new truths whatsoever. IMO, this was no espionage mission as much as it was a sheer calculated militant strike on a very potential enemy target. It's objective, inflict as much damage as possible, and get out.

What was the real motive for this strike?

Reminds me of Tim Good's remark: While much of what we're told may be disinformation "it is important to stress that there would be no point in disinformation if there was nothing to cover up."