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Arrogance in UFOlogy?

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Paranormal Novice
Here in Texas, arrogance oozes out of us. We can't help it. It's a natural phenomenon. Yet, even here, most people aren't arrogant enough to believe that on this planet is the only place in all of the universes that has sentient life.

However, is it also arrogant to believe that we're such an amazing place that all sort of extra-terrestrial species gather and observe us for hundreds, if not millions of years? Sure, we're interesting to ourselves, but any kid who has ever had an ant farm will tell you that interest wanes after a relatively short period of time.
 
Here in Texas, arrogance oozes out of us. We can't help it. It's a natural phenomenon. Yet, even here, most people aren't arrogant enough to believe that on this planet is the only place in all of the universes that has sentient life.

However, is it also arrogant to believe that we're such an amazing place that all sort of extra-terrestrial species gather and observe us for hundreds, if not millions of years? Sure, we're interesting to ourselves, but any kid who has ever had an ant farm will tell you that interest wanes after a relatively short period of time.

Well don't beat yourself up too much. It's OK to have pride in our accomplishments as individuals and as a collectives ( states, countries, teams or whatever ). It's only when that pride includes a contemptuous disregard for others that it becomes arrogant, and I really don't see a lot of that coming from Texas or anyplace else in the USA or Canada ... or other civilized nations. Just the fact that you can joke about yourself means you're not that bad :D
 
The view that we are not alone as a planet of beings in the universe is passed off as almost a known fact nowadays, even though we base our theories on the calculated number of possible planets that could possibly have life on them. It is viewed as absurd to think otherwise UNLESS we take in to account a creator and what the creator decides to create. From that perpective we could either have millions of other inhabited planets or only ours. I heve never thought there was arrogance in either view.

I guess my view is summed up in my song here-

 
The view that we are not alone as a planet of beings in the universe is passed off as almost a known fact nowadays, even though we base our theories on the calculated number of possible planets that could possibly have life on them. It is viewed as absurd to think otherwise UNLESS we take in to account a creator and what the creator decides to create. From that perpective we could either have millions of other inhabited planets or only ours. I heve never thought there was arrogance in either view.

Cool sound clip. I didn't even know we could embed those into the forum. Now I'll try to stop this thread from getting derailed by religion by pointing out that a universe creator and a God are two entirely separate concepts, and that it makes no difference which one was involved or even if they were involved, because the universe, whether created or otherwise, clearly shows the capacity to create things on its own. In other words, "what the creator decides to create" is separate from what the universe itself can create without any further involvement from either a God or a creator, which means it's faulty to propose that after the universe was born, the existence of other life in the universe is in any way dependent on the existence of a creator ( other than perhaps to keep the machine running or whatever ). Furthermore, the evidence suggests that life should exist in many other places due to nothing more than the conditions that already exist. Therefore it would take a concentrated effort to prevent life from arising on its own. Consequently the absence of other life elsewhere in the universe would suggest that the role of any so-called God or creator would be one of prevention or destruction of life, not creation.
 
I agree that what has been created may be continuing a cycle on it's own although this in no way ascertains the absence of creation.
I am not trying to derail anything.
Creation can be an ongoing thing either in real time or as an effect of something prior. Since the universe is expanding it seems that creation can be still happening.
 
I've often heard the argument against ET visitation that we must be so unworthy and uninteresting for an advanced species to both become aware of our existence and their wish to come here to study us.
I think this argument is flawed in a number of ways which I'll try to briefly outline:

For a start - thinking we are uninteresting/unworthy is an anthropomorphic way of thinking. We cannot begin to necessarily understand the motives of a non-human intelligence.
Also, I think we could be infinitely interesting to another species. If we really are so very different than an ET species they may find our culture, our way of having wars etc an amazing opportunity to study an intelligent species whose morals and values etc totally different than their own. It maybe because of what we see as negative about ourselves that makes us worthy of study. Imagine an ET race is very automaton-like with little or no emotions; they may find our psychology utterly fascinating.

WE would no doubt find ANY other intelligent species in the universe fascinating. If we became aware of a nearby planet with an indigenous intelligent race, and we could actually reach their planet and study them without revealing ourselves to them initially, well I don't think you'd be short of takers to go on that mission! We would jump at the chance.

Even if another species is more technologically advanced than us, there may still be a lot of chemicals, naturally occuring alkaloids etc, or other technology that has not been discovered by them yet and they may welcome the chance to become aware of things not yet known to them.

Life might indeed be all throughout the universe, millions of inhabited planets and maybe even galactic type III civilisations. But even so, it might be the case that in our corner of the Milky Way, there may not be that many advanced species and we might simply be the nearest other inhabited world to some ET race so they might be reaching out into space bit by bit with us early on in their exploration.

Some people bring up the point 'how would another intelligent species even be aware of us' and that is a fair point. I would answer that already with our own radioastronomy we have discovered extra-solar planets that inhabit the 'Goldilocks Zone' where scientists think there is the possibility of life. A more advanced species may also be scanning the sky and looking for characteristic spectra of chemicals in the atmosphere that could only be the by-product of a living organism. There are ways, even at great distances, to increase our chances of identifying extra-solar inhabited planets. If we can do it, they can probably do it and probably do it better than us.

There could be things on this Earth of value to others that we are not even aware of. There could be something utterly unique and special about existence here of high value or interest to ET. If there for instance, is real truth to events at the Sherman Ranch or ghosts and other paranormal phenomena, then that might be unique to the Earth and very worthy of study. There have been many UFO reports in the Uintah Basin and perhaps some of those reports are of a kind of psychicly-created aircraft and others 'real' UFOs - maybe the 'real' UFOs are there investigating the high-strangeness too. Is it not possible that some ETs are from our own Galaxy and they could be just as interested in some inter-dimensional shenanigans as we/NIDS are?

Lastly, but not at all exhaustively, there may be natural resources in abundance here that are hard to come by in other planets. There have been many reports of USOs going in/out of oceans and lakes etc and there have been reports (and videos) of UFOs going into volcanoes and around other natural forces. Maybe UFOs are extracting heavy water (tritium) from the sea.
One former policeman turned UFO researcher in the UK, Tony Dodd, claimed he had found out there was official suspicion of a large undersea base near Iceland in the North Atlantic. The sea around Puerto Rico is known for heavy USO sightings too.

This has not been a complete list of arguments FOR ET coming here but I hope it may have given pause to someone of the opinion 'we are just not worthy of study' etc as I think that is a very narrow and human perspective and we just cannot assume to know the mind of an ET race. It would not be very ETish if we did!:)
 
I've often heard the argument against ET visitation that we must be so unworthy and uninteresting for an advanced species to both become aware of our existence and their wish to come here to study us. I think this argument is flawed in a number of ways which I'll try to briefly outline:

Excellent post Goggs!
 
Here in Texas, arrogance oozes out of us. We can't help it. It's a natural phenomenon. Yet, even here, most people aren't arrogant enough to believe that on this planet is the only place in all of the universes that has sentient life.

However, is it also arrogant to believe that we're such an amazing place that all sort of extra-terrestrial species gather and observe us for hundreds, if not millions of years? Sure, we're interesting to ourselves, but any kid who has ever had an ant farm will tell you that interest wanes after a relatively short period of time.

given the way we're cracking up the planet we might be one of the silliest species out there, if there are any, but because we figured out how to master all the other species for our own purposes (and for their worst fate) we think we're the smartest guys of the universe...that's just as arrogant as we are.
 
I've often heard the argument against ET visitation that we must be so unworthy and uninteresting for an advanced species to both become aware of our existence and their wish to come here to study us...
You bring up some very good points. I agree, we are interesting in our own way. Probably unique throughout the universe, just as any other race is probably unique.
 
However, is it also arrogant to believe that we're such an amazing place that all sort of extra-terrestrial species gather and observe us for hundreds, if not millions of years?

We're in the midst of an exponential increase in capabilities--possibly rare in the galaxy at any given time.

Sure, we're interesting to ourselves, but any kid who has ever had an ant farm will tell you that interest wanes after a relatively short period of time.

Apples and oranges. Ants don't have the potential to equal you.;)
 
We're in the midst of an exponential increase in capabilities--possibly rare in the galaxy at any given time.

Ants don't have the potential to equal you.;)

Time and opportunity gives all life the potential to equal you.

If dinosaurs had not been exterminated, a reptilian bipod might have emerged on earth.
Real-life Crazy Frog: Dancing amphibian can stand on his own two legs (but thankfully he's not going to release his own ringtone) | Mail Online
article-2113834-12217B64000005DC-930_634x1000.jpg
 
Parking the anthropomorphic arguments for a sec. The ant farm analogy is flawed because you only assume a kid's point of interest. What about all the biologists that study ants and their colonies for their entire professional life?.. with a view to applying what they learn to the human world around them, or just out of curiosity. If you take that view, then having ET's visit us makes a lot of sense - we may be ants, but something may be interested in what we do and how we do it.

IIRC in the E.T. The Extra Terrestrial books, it's implied that E.T is a "biologist" of some sort and to me it logically makes sense that once a race can take care of itself and begin to understand it's own physiology, then the next step is analyse other physiologies (whatever they may be) to understand the differences, crudely at first and then as they begin to understand how they work, they are more empathetic to invasion of the physiology under study. <--- we still have a way to go on this.


given the way we're cracking up the planet we might be one of the silliest species out there, if there are any, but because we figured out how to master all the other species for our own purposes (and for their worst fate) we think we're the smartest guys of the universe...that's just as arrogant as we are.

and the opposite is also true, plenty of people study the breakdown of civilisations and extinction of species, so we might of interest from that perspective as well.

tldr; we're interesting no matter what way you look at it. :)
cheers,
bb
 
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