Is the ETH just folklore?

[Burnt State]

This has to be the biggest debate in ufology and is worthy of a revisit for anyone who wants to stake their claim. Since the beginning of the phenomena in the modern era the earliest suspicions were that these were little green men from mars. In fact the more science investigated it the more it seemed that an advanced species was in fact visiting us, monitoring us, perhaps even taking samples from not just the soil but from us as well.

But many believe that this is a tired refrain and an highly inaccurate one. For one who can't access the video above which not only provides a condenstation of UFO investigation but it outlines five main arguments against the ETH courtesy of Vallée who first provided Ufology with a comprehensive pro-ETH argument. But the more Vallée investigated, the more he realized that the evidence just did not add up.

His main contentions were:

1. How many millions of visits are needed to get the exploratory science right? Is it reasonable to believe that all the junior Ph.D.'s in the local galactic cluster are getting their papers through probing us earthlings? How much data do they need?
2. The craft do not act like nuts and bolts at all, though they provide that appearance. But frequently they are reported as having just appeared and just as suddenly disappeared. They move through objects and appear to be moving in and out of dimensions. Some just plain dissolve and defy what we know about physics. They are both material and immaterial.
3. The aliens appear to look relatively like us, breathe our air and behave like we do in our gravity. How the hell does that work? Aren't we the only super smart species that evolved on this planet?
4. What's up with all the primitive, sadistic and psychologically scaring abductions? Much like the soil samples, just how many humans do you need do violate using such arcane, and as Chris O'Brien recently described, medieval methods?
5. There is evidence to support that 'they' have always been with us: they have been faeries, demons, goblins and elves. Now they're alien creatures: greys, reptilians, Nordics etc. in fact stories of their presence appear to stretch backwards into time and they are still here with us - could they be even closer to home than we think, or just in another kind of space altogether?

Vallée continues to extrapolate on these points based on untampered witness statements. From here he considered the notion of a social control system, that Joan of Arc, Our Lady in the sky and other religious prompts may be part of their ongoing manipulation of the species, creating our religions and creating a social theromstat in society. In this way the idea of aliens visiting us is just another disguise they have invented for the benefit of the story they are trying to weave into our social fabric.

But, perhaps papa Jaques is full of it, though I'm hard pressed to find another thinker, scientist with as much knowledge, time and investigation given over to the subject. Who has done more work in the field and has the kind of credentials he has? Still if you've got a nuts and bolts theory or feel the Interdimensional Hypothesis is not meritorious then please let's show the cards.

Just what arguments are there for the ETH as it seems to be mostly folklore and nothing more?

 

[Polterwurst]

Huh. Lookit that. I voted No but Yeah. It's just that while I think it's too complex, tricksterish and strange, I guess it still remains a possibility.

 

[Burnt State]

Huh. Lookit that. I voted No but Yeah. It's just that while I think it's too complex, tricksterish and strange, I guess it still remains a possibility.

I was going to do the same but I dd not want to start my own thread from a tricksterish position right from the get go. But if I could hear some arguments that validate the ETH in a more concrete manner then I'm certainly open to changing my mind.

 

[Jeff Davis]

Again, we have a poll situation where I am unable to really nail down my beliefs based on the answer possibilities. Yes unquestionably, the ETH is period specific folklore IMO, but that does not disavow it from being both a constituent of reality, as well as a very possible exception to possible rules concerning the same. Meaning that, IMO, our beliefs and periodic orientations influence the phenomenon's identity, but apart from that much, it is possible that an exception might exist. Possibly intelligent life originating on other planets could send space fairing exploratory probes here in one form or another. None have been identified so far, which I am thinking they truly would be due to our familiarity with space fairing vehicles, but it could happen some day despite present scientific assessments to the contrary.

Just like every other window in time prior to this one, anomalous phenomena are typically perceived as being relevant to the observer. CE4/5 studies *really* seem to indicate as much in spades, collectively speaking. This is socially typified sentient evolution in time line relevant progressive action IMO. The latter is responsible with respect to Fortean derived folklore, resultantly.

Reality is far to undefined a means to be defined as an end. "Is" is a question mark prefaced by both a "how", and a "why".

 

[Burnt State]

Again, we have a poll situation where I am unable to really nail down my beliefs based on the answer possibilities. Yes unquestionably, the ETH is period specific folklore IMO, but that does not disavow it from being both a constituent of reality, as well as a very possible exception to possible rules concerning the same. Meaning that, IMO, our beliefs and periodic orientations influence the phenomenon's identity, but apart from that much, it is possible that an exception might exist. Possibly intelligent life originating on other planets could send space fairing exploratory probes here in one form or another. None have been identified so far, which I am thinking they truly would be due to our familiarity with space fairing vehicles, but it could happen some day despite present scientific assessments to the contrary.

Just like every other window in time prior to this one, anomalous phenomena are typically perceived as being relevant to the observer. CE4/5 studies *really* seem to indicate as much in spades, collectively speaking. This is socially typified sentient evolution in time line relevant progressive action IMO. The latter is responsible with respect to Fortean derived folklore, resultantly.

Reality is far to undefined a means to be defined as an end. "Is" is a question mark prefaced by both a "how", and a "why".

Lots of strong insights there, Jeff, especially your last statements. These investigations into consciousness and our interactions with reality have an intersection with paranormal events and UFO experiences that should be question marks with exclamation points attached to them as they appear to be clues of some sort.

But, if it is a possibility that other life from elsewhere has graced our shores, then I created option 3 as a possibility for just such a sensation. Maybe something could be visiting and engaging us through very unique methodologies and possibly interacting with us in ways where they are consciously manipulating our own sensory systems so we see what they want us to see. I was hoping to provide a robust enough set of options that all personal interpretations would have some ground to attach to. If option 3 does not fit the bill for you then what option would you like to see crafted and we can try to get that thrown up there.

 

[PCarr]

Just what arguments are there for the ETH as it seems to be mostly folklore and nothing more?

Not very happy with the poll choices there. My main problem with the "ETH" is the "H". There is no way to form a real scientific hypothesis, and Vallee's arguments against a strawman standing in for an ETH (which we have not got) are an illustration of why. We just have no idea at all how an ET visitation would manifest itself, and nowhere near enough hard data to separate that from the normal human activity of telling each other fantastic stories.

This has as much to do with the nature of science as the nature of the phenomenon. There is pseudoscience, protoscience, and normal science, and the borders and transitions between them aren't all that clear. When skeptics say that all study of UAPs is pseudoscience, what they really mean is that it's not normal science, which is clearly true (there is lots of pseudoscience in the mix as well, which doesn't help). All sciences, however, start in a messy, uneven way as protosciences, and it takes a seriously painful process and all kinds of wrong ideas to move it forward. The progress comes when someone is willing to put the dogmas to the test against hard data, just like James Hutton in the 18th century when he challenged the notion that the Earth was only 6000 years old - that was the start of geology growing up into a science.

The problem is, you need at least the start of a good theory to understand how your observations would differ if some UAPs are ETs vs. if they are not. At this point, no good theory is possible, so we have to be wrong a lot, and try to take better data. It's not crazy or stupid to conjecture that some UAPs are from another planet, it's just not a hypothesis.

 

[Gene Steinberg]

Interesting to see where the votes have gone so far.

 

[Jeff Davis]

These investigations into consciousness and our interactions with reality have an intersection with paranormal events and UFO experiences that should be question marks with exclamation points attached to them as they appear to be clues of some sort.

Absolutely! I did go ahead and select an option, and despite #4 being a huge temptation to select because of how much I love the title "Disneyland of The Gods", I selected #5. It's a very hardline stance, but I am afraid that the ETH is just too hard a pill to swallow. Of course you are correct that it could be because they desire as much in appearances as they psychologically manipulate us for whatever reason, but really, if they have that much control over our personal realities, what would there be left for them to experiment with and determine exactly? I'm thinking they would already know all there is to know about the animal human.

So many possibilities exist, and what gets incredibly interesting is how much those possibilities are given form by the platforms that we initially "dive in" from. Be it that the phenomenon is a closed loop, one that is based on a natural state of interdependency, or whether there is in fact a non-human agency involved, these are incredibly focusing motives that serve as framework for our best guesswork. I think that it is possible that it could be a combination of all three of those, but more than likely, we (informed consciousness) play a much larger part in this culture of phenomena than we suppose.

I feel sad sometimes for those that are caught up in this whole ET thing. It is a very religious matter for many. The supposition for many is that if ET is out there, things are really under control. It's all very God like in it's belief systematics, but man if you tell them that they about lose it. Some of them immediately cry out, "but I'm an Atheist!" Like it's less delusional to believe in things just as invisible and unproved. Yet just because ET might not necessarily be that different from us, just much more advanced intelligent animals from other planets, it's OK and much closer to something that they can ascribe to realism. The bottom line is that no one is coming down from the sky. If they were, don't you think they would have done it a LONG time ago. I mean, how much suffering and strife could they have helped us to avoid? "But we can't learn that way..." many of them claim. We're right back to beliefs in God almighty watching over us all. Like we're all in some lesser animal's cruel school or whatever. It's sad.

Here's my thing though. My own personal delusions for you at this very time, right here and now. I *do* believe in a supreme creator. However this creator is not into control, and honestly will have no part of it. Control is just a animalistic characteristic manifestation of the will. My creator is too infinite for that, far too generous. Too many possibilities exist for such a great, all encompassing, and powerful creator to be burdened down with such limited notions of just one. You know what I mean by "one", as our friend The Highlander would proclaim, "There can be only one!" My creator exists that dominance is no greater than submission, and after all, we all know that one couldn't exist without the other. Yin and Yang are but grains of sand on the beach of my creator.

You know who my creator is, don't you?

 

[Stagger Lee]

One thing I learned from Ivan Sanderson's book "Invisible Residents" - Countless cases of flying objects crashing in or out of oceans. Captain's logs describing such going back as far as such logs have been kept, or at least preserved. If an advanced race of beings from our galaxy have set up shop at the bottom of earth's oceans- we still wouldn't have the technology to locate such a site. We know space travel is possible. We know that a highly advanced technology can appear to a witness as magical, inter-dimensional, or that of time traveling machinery. I'm not saying the ETH must be the source, only that in my opinion it makes the most sense. Just because a vehicle appears to move through solid objects or vanish, does not mean such a vehicle is jumping through dimensions. Only that the technology makes it appear as such. I also think it safe to say these objects are more than just unmanned probes- what with so many mid 20th century cases of creatures seen entering or leaving these vehicles.

 

[Jeff Davis]

One thing I learned from Ivan Sanderson's book "Invisible Residents" - Countless cases of flying objects crashing in or out of oceans. Captain's logs describing such going back as far as such logs have been kept, or at least preserved. If an advanced race of beings from our galaxy have set up shop at the bottom of earth's oceans- we still wouldn't have the technology to locate such a site. We know space travel is possible. We know that a highly advanced technology can appear to a witness as magical, inter-dimensional, or that of time traveling machinery. I'm not saying the ETH must be the source, only that in my opinion it makes the most sense. Just because a vehicle appears to move through solid objects or vanish, does not mean such a vehicle is jumping through dimensions. Only that the technology makes it appear as such. I also think it safe to say these objects are more than just unmanned probes- what with so many mid 20th century cases of creatures seen entering or leaving these vehicles.

Stagger,
I do not disagree with you. Anything is possible, as we are referring to a complete unknown. However, from the stance of highly credible witness testimonies describing UFOs/USOs throughout time for hundreds of years now, (captains of ships for instance) we see these objects enter and leave the water many times without making a single ripple or splash. We see them in the air flying minus any obedience with respect to aerodynamics, or physical gravitational laws, yet we never seem to see anything indicative of what we do know of space travel, air travel, or underwater navigation. These matters are pretty well understood at this point in our physical realm provided we don't use our science fiction prone imaginations as a future projection of likelihoods. Yes, we can imagine ourselves accomplishing these forms of travel, yet we don't have a single shred of evidence to support the immensely huge gap between our guesswork as applied to non-human beings (strawman #1), and, our abilities to traverse space, air, and the oceans in such a lawless fantastic manner which we can already accomplish these tasks with some great proficiency.

If we go back in time we find these paranormal occurrences coinciding within the realm of human awareness on two levels. One is strictly phenomenal, the other is typically the product of a quasi state of lucidity in which the witness is interacting with any myriad of what is typically culture relevant phenomena. If we study humanoid encounters, all manner of them, we soon find that peoples from around the world have startling experiences that are so acutely lucid and so formidably "real" that they are impossible to distinguish apart from any other occurrence within their catalog of experiences.

What does this mean? To me, my best guess work is NOT that human beings are simply imagining things that they themselves are previously programmed to dream or imagine. That's just stupid, arrogant, presumptuously short sighted and ultimately, ignorant. Anyone that has invested any amount of significant time into the paranormal knows this much unequivocally, or at very least, should. We are dealing with an aspect of our reality that we simply do not understand at this time. A component of consciousness that we do not have any definition for whatsoever. You see, my guesswork's best framework would be entirely different if we were dealing with just UFOs, but we are not. If that were the case, the ETH would make far more sense. However, we are dealing with a grouping of phenomena too numerous to even begin to innumerate that all follow very similar patterns of observation and interaction. Humanoids, animals (cryptid and known), monsters, dinosaurs, human characters (apparitions and actual), faeries, UFOs, USOs, elves, and an untold and unaccounted for folkloric imagery catalog in such great numbers that a volume set the size of the Encyclopedia Britannica would have a difficult time containing. And the former represents just a smattering of the many phenomenons to be considered in this paranormal realm.

I do think that UFOs represent a very probable non-human exterior agency. One that may find a natural environment in this as of yet undefined component of our awareness of reality or consciousness. There are many reasons for this, but it would not be appropriate to go "there" now.

Here is an interesting folkloric multi-cultural consideration in which we can find more than one socially derived stigmatic parallel. It is assuredly paranormal in nature. One such quick observation of social parallels might be the fact that the children are holding what looks like large leaves, or dinner plates over their little faces. It seems that even far further on down south kids are easily embarrassed by their parents. Could it be that such culturally derived paranormal curiosities are too out of fashion for the "in crowd" these days? The forefront of the generational gap here may just seem to think so. You decide. BTW, this blog is most likely the best ongoing Spanish UFO blog that I have ever became familiar with. Of course that could have something to do with the fact that I can't read, write, and speak Spanish and it's published in English.

Inexplicata-The Journal of Hispanic Ufology: Paraguay: Woman Claims Having Given Birth to "El Pombero's" Baby

 

[Constance]

it could be because they desire as much in appearances as they psychologically manipulate us for whatever reason, but really, if they have that much control over our personal realities, what would there be left for them to experiment with and determine exactly? I'm thinking they would already know all there is to know about the animal human.

A really good point, Jeff.

 

[Jeff Davis]

A really good point, Jeff.

Here is the bottom line. If one knows anything about UFOs, they understand clearly that they are not anything new with respect to human observations of them right here on this planet. There are clear records that are depicted on stone walls going back to absolutely the most primitive of times. Clearly the phenomenon does not represent an alien interest that developed over the last 80 years to come to earth from other planets with the intent purpose of monitoring our nuclear capabilities. The truth of this matter is that UFOs have always been here. There is more evidence to support the record keeping that supports the notion that this is their home as much as it is ours, than there is to support the ETH notion that they come here via space travels. If those responsible for the UFOs were actually terrestrial physical beings, extraterrestrial or not, they would be openly running the planet due to having a direct stake in their survival here. It seems that they are clearly our superiors, so why don't they? The truth IMO is that the agency that are responsible for UFOs do not seem able to directly physically confront humankind within our natural environment beyond what are their appearances to us. Our perceptions of all things UFO are solely based upon speculations derived from our own imaginations via those appearances. In fact, the same can be stated concerning the vastest majority of all living representations of Fortean interest.

There are other hard and fast rules with respect to the UFO phenomenon and it's quasi interactions with our experiential awareness of them that we might consider.

1) Since the beginning of time they have interacted with humankind definitively as either being strictly evil, or good. That is to state that they either completely disregard us and are totally apathetic to our feelings, sometimes even seemingly hateful of us, or they are caring, gentle, and ultimately compassionate with the abilities to heal and impart wisdom. We have never witnessed or has there ever been any medium ground with them. Why is this?

2) They are reported to have directly killed people.

3) They are reported to have directly intervened and saved people's lives.

4) UFOs are most present in terms of highly credible mass sightings, with oft times direct interactions, during times of mass annihilation/war.

5) UFOs have the distinct ability to completely manipulate human reality. It's like the language they speak, if so chosen, is seemingly best likened to actuated human hypnosis. The only difference being that they achieve actual material results in the sense, that like those MIB in the movie the Matrix, they literally seem to be able to stop time, change the stage around, and then command "resume reality" at will. We appear to have zero control over this ability via our best material efforts.

6) Up until the Vietnam War, military pilots were instructed via command to engage UFOs. Since then they have been instructed to avoid UFOs post appearances at all cost.

7) In every other ancient history concerning it's *religious structuring and record keeping, UFOs and their interactions with humankind have been termed what are Angels and/or Demons. Every action they take, be it positive or negative, parallels these religious archetypical caricatures and activities.


*(read: humankind's supernatural perceptions as they parallel gnostic or contemporary religious teachings and record keeping)

 

[Angel of Ioren]

So far, we have nothing that proves concretely that we are regularly visited by aliens from another planet. However, the chances that there is life out there are probably quite high - there just isn't any evidence that they've visited us.

Something that really bothers me, and I've said it many times in this forum: With so many high quality cameras out there, we actually seem to have less shots of UFOs than we did when cameras weren't anywhere near as good. That leads me to the conclusion that we had more UFO sightings pre-internet and pocket cameras because we had less of an idea of what we were looking at and the pictures turned out blurry.

I'm not sure if I'm being clear with my point.... knowledge and technology has improved significantly, therefore we are seeing fewer things in the sky that we don't understand.

 

[ALPHA ROMEO UNIFORM]

Good thoughts but lets not forget if other life is out there don't you think their technology would improve as well or just not interested in humanity itself.

 

[Angel of Ioren]

Good thoughts but lets not forget if other life is out there don't you think their technology would improve as well or just not interested in humanity itself.

Of course, but it could be that they are so far away that they have no idea we exist.
No one knows for sure that we are being visited or not, my point is that there really isn't enough evidence, and despite the fact that we have more ways of capturing evidence, we haven't.

 

[Jeff Davis]

So far, we have nothing that proves concretely that we are regularly visited by aliens from another planet. However, the chances that there is life out there are probably quite high - there just isn't any evidence that they've visited us.

Something that really bothers me, and I've said it many times in this forum: With so many high quality cameras out there, we actually seem to have less shots of UFOs than we did when cameras weren't anywhere near as good. That leads me to the conclusion that we had more UFO sightings pre-internet and pocket cameras because we had less of an idea of what we were looking at and the pictures turned out blurry.

I'm not sure if I'm being clear with my point.... knowledge and technology has improved significantly, therefore we are seeing fewer things in the sky that we don't understand.

I am not so certain this actually the case at all. I certainly notice no shortage of photos and videos of UFOs these days. Where are you getting that information? I think the real issue is one of immense desensitivity. We are bombarded with so much information that we shut it off and turn a weary blind eye to it routinely. If you check the MUFON data base, I think you will be really surprised just how many photos and videos are routinely submitted.

http://mufoncms.com/cgi-bin/report_handler.pl?req=latest_reports

Another decent site: UFO Sighting Reports | Openminds.tv

The other thing is, have you noticed just how many people are buried in their hand held technology? If it's not on their little screen, they don't see or know about it.

 

[Angel of Ioren]

Thanks for the sites.
What I meant was there these are all still just lights in the sky, nothing concrete unfortunately. Are they interesting? For sure, but they bring us no closer to concrete evidence, no?

And yes, people are preoccupied with their phones, that's for sure, but it's only because it exists. Commuters have replaced books and newspapers with phones and tablets. As long as people aren't driving or walking, it's cool.

 

[PCarr]

We know that a highly advanced technology can appear to a witness as magical, inter-dimensional, or that of time traveling machinery.

There is, from a practical point of view, little difference between interstellar space travellers and interdimensionals (not manyhave any idea what they're talking about there), visitors from a parallel universe, or time travellers. None of them originate local to us, and come from places we no nothing of (well, at least we know a little about outer space) by means we know nothing of, for purposes we know nothing of. The only difference is that we do know that outer space exists, is vast, and is full of habitable planets. We do not know that other dimensions (especially habitable ones) exist, or that time travel is possible.

 

[Heidi Lemmer]

Here is the bottom line. If one knows anything about UFOs, they understand clearly that they are not anything new with respect to human observations of them right here on this planet. There are clear records that are depicted on stone walls going back to absolutely the most primitive of times. Clearly the phenomenon does not represent an alien interest that developed over the last 80 years to come to earth from other planets with the intent purpose of monitoring our nuclear capabilities. The truth of this matter is that UFOs have always been here. There is more evidence to support the record keeping that supports the notion that this is their home as much as it is ours, than there is to support the ETH notion that they come here via space travels. If those responsible for the UFOs were actually terrestrial physical beings, extraterrestrial or not, they would be openly running the planet due to having a direct stake in their survival here. It seems that they are clearly our superiors, so why don't they? The truth IMO is that the agency that are responsible for UFOs do not seem able to directly physically confront humankind within our natural environment beyond what are their appearances to us. Our perceptions of all things UFO are solely based upon speculations derived from our own imaginations via those appearances. In fact, the same can be stated concerning the vastest majority of all living representations of Fortean interest.

There are other hard and fast rules with respect to the UFO phenomenon and it's quasi interactions with our experiential awareness of them that we might consider.

1) Since the beginning of time they have interacted with humankind definitively as either being strictly evil, or good. That is to state that they either completely disregard us and are totally apathetic to our feelings, sometimes even seemingly hateful of us, or they are caring, gentle, and ultimately compassionate with the abilities to heal and impart wisdom. We have never witnessed or has there ever been any medium ground with them. Why is this?

2) They are reported to have directly killed people.

3) They are reported to have directly intervened and saved people's lives.

4) UFOs are most present in terms of highly credible mass sightings, with oft times direct interactions, during times of mass annihilation/war.

5) UFOs have the distinct ability to completely manipulate human reality. It's like the language they speak, if so chosen, is seemingly best likened to actuated human hypnosis. The only difference being that they achieve actual material results in the sense, that like those MIB in the movie the Matrix, they literally seem to be able to stop time, change the stage around, and then command "resume reality" at will. We appear to have zero control over this ability via our best material efforts.

6) Up until the Vietnam War, military pilots were instructed via command to engage UFOs. Since then they have been instructed to avoid UFOs post appearances at all cost.

7) In every other ancient history concerning it's *religious structuring and record keeping, UFOs and their interactions with humankind have been termed what are Angels and/or Demons. Every action they take, be it positive or negative, parallels these religious archetypical caricatures and activities.


*(read: humankind's supernatural perceptions as they parallel gnostic or contemporary religious teachings and record keeping)

Best assessment I've read in awhile. Granted we all splinter off as to where they are coming from, why they are here, but from all accounts both written, drawn and witnesses, they are here.

 

[Jeff Davis]

Thanks for the sites.
What I meant was there these are all still just lights in the sky, nothing concrete unfortunately. Are they interesting? For sure, but they bring us no closer to concrete evidence, no?

And yes, people are preoccupied with their phones, that's for sure, but it's only because it exists. Commuters have replaced books and newspapers with phones and tablets. As long as people aren't driving or walking, it's cool.

Absolutely the truth. The best and most opinion forming information is just that, it's imagery based upon informational reporting. The most telling information to me comes from lengthy (beyond the two minute range) sightings and interactions with them. It seems to me that in many cases, certainly not all, but many of them, that they completely control these experiences. Especially CE4/5 experiences. There is no way to determine in many cases what has actually taken place because it's all contained within the minds of the experiencers. There are some extremely bizarre events that have become public knowledge that took place during the Vietnam War involving UFOs attacking and possibly manipulating military engagements with them to whatever desired outcome. So, either (a) "they" are a real external agency to which any and all understanding is truly beyond reconciliation, or (b) the military staged some incredibly vivid illusions that cost some of their own, their lives. I seriously doubt that the latter was the case, even though intelligence agencies have a well known reputation for being beyond humanity in terms of their means justifying their ends.

There simply is no reason to suspect that the truth of UFOs is one that lends itself to "exploring visitors" from outer space. Mankind's biggest problem is just accepting that it is not the top dog here in terms of a controlling superiority, and these things just don't care about most of the things that we do. I have a feeling that their dominion is so much greater than ours in this world that to them, we are basically like primates would be to us. There is no question, that they could run this whole show tomorrow, but how many men would take the time to further engineer an anthill to their own ends, or regulate the monkey house at a zoo?

Sometimes I cannot get over why they have not just wiped us off the face of the planet, and of course that's why when I consider as much that one comes to several possible conclusions that many already have. If nature's laws obey systematic uniformity applicable to realms that we are as yet unfamiliar with, possibly there is a control mechanism in place the disavows such extermination. Possibly their existence is as reliant on us as we are unknowingly on them. This is often the puzzling manner in which nature's integral systems are intertwined. However there can be no question that of course many gaps exist in such fantastic speculations.