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Richard Dolan &, um....
- Thread starter David Biedny
- Start date
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Gareth
Nothin' to see here
Goddam it. I really want to wear my Dolan apologist hat and say "It's just Rich being a nice guy. Probably didn't want to say no". But THIS.
THIS IS JUST TOO MUCH
Camelot? Dolan is speaking at a camelot cult party now? That's just embarrassing. Look at the names and faces in that line up. Hope they are paying a shit load.
This is basically my reaction:
THIS IS JUST TOO MUCH
Camelot? Dolan is speaking at a camelot cult party now? That's just embarrassing. Look at the names and faces in that line up. Hope they are paying a shit load.
This is basically my reaction:
*Pending Funding and Venue
Wouldn't doubt Rich said "yeah, I'll do it for $$$$" (everyone's gotta pay the mortgage these days eh? - SHOW ME THE MONEY!)
Now they're just using that confirmation (and probably have no intention of paying him) as a draw..can't think of anyone else listed they'd need to pay (Most attention whores do it for free :
).Giving Dolan the benefit here obviously...
David Biedny
Paranormal Adept
With very few exceptions, NO ONE gets paid to speak at these things. I seriously doubt that Dolan is getting a dime. I could be wrong, of course, but in this case, I don't think so. Perhaps we wants to pitch his books to the audience? Only logical conclusion I can come up with. Like I said, very sad.
dB
dB
I'm a little tired of the negativity towards Dolan. Especially considering he isn't even able to defend himself or his position(although I suppose he could join the forum). Is this really supposed to negate any good research he has done?? Sometimes a researcher has something to say, or something to promote, aside from the carnival that accompanies them.
Isn't it more important what Rich says than who he says it to or who he shares the conference with?? Sometimes musicians have to share venues with other bands that just plain suck. Does that make their music less enjoyable or meaningful?? I suppose some might think "yes", but I don't. You have to take each individual as just that, an individual.
Is Rich coming back on the Paracast?? If so, when?? Because from every other interview I've heard, Rich isn't afraid to defend his position. Can we allow him to do that?? He seems reasonable and confident enough to share this with everyone here.
I mean, how many conferences DON'T have some delusion and fantasy with it?? If Rich were to confine himself to only the conferences with ONLY the highest credible researchers, he wouldn't be able to attend a single one. So what is he supposed to do?? He has an interest in speaking about his research regardless of who else is there. He does need to survive right?? He does have a book upcoming right??
It may indeed be sad to see a conference of such low credibility, but you can't throw everything out that Dolan has done because of his mere presence at this event. Everyone has their faults and makes mistakes. It doesn't mean he believes everything that everyone is touting on stage. But it is one of a few appearances that he can make to help further his work.
I guess I just think his work should be measured by itself, not in association with the other head vacancies. If everyone was guilty by association then there would be absolutely zero credibility in this field.
Isn't it more important what Rich says than who he says it to or who he shares the conference with?? Sometimes musicians have to share venues with other bands that just plain suck. Does that make their music less enjoyable or meaningful?? I suppose some might think "yes", but I don't. You have to take each individual as just that, an individual.
Is Rich coming back on the Paracast?? If so, when?? Because from every other interview I've heard, Rich isn't afraid to defend his position. Can we allow him to do that?? He seems reasonable and confident enough to share this with everyone here.
I mean, how many conferences DON'T have some delusion and fantasy with it?? If Rich were to confine himself to only the conferences with ONLY the highest credible researchers, he wouldn't be able to attend a single one. So what is he supposed to do?? He has an interest in speaking about his research regardless of who else is there. He does need to survive right?? He does have a book upcoming right??
It may indeed be sad to see a conference of such low credibility, but you can't throw everything out that Dolan has done because of his mere presence at this event. Everyone has their faults and makes mistakes. It doesn't mean he believes everything that everyone is touting on stage. But it is one of a few appearances that he can make to help further his work.
I guess I just think his work should be measured by itself, not in association with the other head vacancies. If everyone was guilty by association then there would be absolutely zero credibility in this field.
Schuyler
Misanthrope
You're correct and I think you could easily prove it. The difference here is not that there's a nut or two in a conference filled with otherwise credible researchers, but that the conference itself is delusional. This conference makes the Exo-politics conference look sane and sober by comparison. When this same issue came up when Dolan spoke at Exo-politics, most people were willing to give him a pass for some of the same reasons you mentioned.
I think the dismay here is precisely because Dolan is considered a sane and sober researcher. His book inevitably winds up on any 'Top Ten" list of the best books on the subject ever written. Why, then, does he choose to associate with an entire conference full of discredited speakers? Dan Burisch? Matt Ryan? C'mon! Burisch is a complete fraud. Ryan is as credulous as they come. The rest of the speakers are not far behind.
Dolan needs to make a choice here. Does he want to be associated in reputation with Jacques Vallee, Stan Friedman, Nick Pope, Robert Hastings, J. Allen Hynek, and researchers of this class (though you may not agree with all they say), or does Dolan want to be associated with Matt Ryan, Dan Burisch, John Lear, Bob Lazar, and others who have become a laughingstock within the UFO field itself, much more so outside of it.
The thing is, Dolan is a one-trick pony. He's earned accolades for his one trick, but he doesn't have decades of contributions behind him that give him a solid standing in the field. At some point he is going to take on the reputation of those he hangs out with. I think people are worried that if Dolan continues to hang out with the loonies, his credibility will suffer.
Schuyler - I get it. I get what you're saying and in large part I agree. I'm just saying that he has a great reputation for coming on the show and answering these types of questions. Please let him.
Bishop was just on the show. He was basically saying that a mistake (like hanging with the loonies) doesn't diminish the contributions he has made. (I'm not trying to put words in his mouth, but it seemed to be essentially what he was saying) But you are correct in saying he has a choice whether to follow the herd of believers or contribute to more serious research. I guess we'll have to wait and see what his next move is. Perhaps he has a worthy motive that is somehow missing from this conversation. And perhaps he doesn't. He definitely seems out of place.
Maybe thats the question that should be asked. Go through the entire roll call and ask Rich "Whats wrong with this picture??"
As many fruitcakes as the Paracast has had on I would just hope that Dolan would get another interview to see what is on his mind. At least he has always seemed genuine and honest.
David Biedny
Paranormal Adept
We have every intention of having Dolan back on the show, the moment he ships his new book. Lots to talk about, including some of the recent oddities, like the decision to appear at this event, which as Schuyler pointed out, is as far out there - and not in a good way - as you can get with this stuff.
dB
dB
Gareth
Nothin' to see here
What Schuyler said.
Dan Burisch is a guy who makes people like Peckman, Webre and Nussbeck look sane (well, maybe not Nussbeck). The shit that comes out of his camp is just absurd, and the sad thing is I think he believes it all.
There's that one "security cam" vid of him on youtube apparently having a private conversation. I use quotes around security cam because the footage clearly is NOT from a security camera. Believers use this as proof that Burisch is legit based on the conversation he is having ("If he says that stuff in private it must be true!"). But the whole thing just looks like a staged setup to me. So maybe he doesn't believe it all - who knows with these people.
Anyway, the point is that is extremely concerning that Rich Dolan is lumping himself in with these nutjobs.
Dan Burisch is a guy who makes people like Peckman, Webre and Nussbeck look sane (well, maybe not Nussbeck). The shit that comes out of his camp is just absurd, and the sad thing is I think he believes it all.
There's that one "security cam" vid of him on youtube apparently having a private conversation. I use quotes around security cam because the footage clearly is NOT from a security camera. Believers use this as proof that Burisch is legit based on the conversation he is having ("If he says that stuff in private it must be true!"). But the whole thing just looks like a staged setup to me. So maybe he doesn't believe it all - who knows with these people.
Anyway, the point is that is extremely concerning that Rich Dolan is lumping himself in with these nutjobs.
111uminate
One and None
A perceptive conclusion, and I agree. We all love Dolan and appreciate the breath of fresh air he brings to the field, so that's where the concern is stemming from, TClaeys. I for one certainly don't wish to attack him personally or call into question his research and offerings on the subject. I've been a huge, huge fan of his since he began gaining noteriety years and years ago. Admittedly, I first caught wind of him on one of those dime a dozen History channel documentaries, but even then he stood out to me, which is saying a lot (Some of those documentaries are .. I'll spare my choice words.)
I'm just speculating here, but Dolan is certainly a smart guy, and aware of his surroundings. I'm willing to go on the line and say that he's probably aware that he stands out in the field, especially compared to the shit slinging loonies you find in Camelot, Exopolitics, The Disclosure Project, etc. He might not be aware of it, or maybe he is, but in a way he's playing to his strengths by touting his research and work in the field in the presence of those fruit pies. On the same token though, as Schuyler mentioned, the worry is that he may end up tarnishing himself in the process. If this thread is any indication, that certainly seems to be plausible.
Miah
Skilled Investigator
Can we finally ask him about his comments on thinking Bob Lazar is legit?
Ron Collins
Curiously Confused
I may be in the minority but, for me it certainly calls some of it into question. Throughout his book he alludes to getting some of his information from inside sources. If he can not vet his acquaintances and understand the adverse affects of keeping their company, then how are we to trust the sources of his information and his insightful conclusions. you don't exactly need a crystal ball to get the scoop on some of these rats.
It all comes down to managing your credibility. Putting yourself out there with known hacks, hoaxers, liars, and thieves is fine if you are calling them out. But, smiling and ignoring or downplaying their nefarious nature is to accept the association and the credibility hit.
Personally, I think this is a marketing decision. Whacko's, conferences, media interviews and a good story sells books.
His first book was very good. But it does have its flaws. Dolan's household income (or at least part of it) and the majority of it's prestige come from these topics. I suspect that his next 2 books will be well researched but will draw more on anecdotal evidence, leaps of logic, and shadow figures to draw more stunning conclusions. It's just marketing. If you want a #2 to be successful it needs to be sexier than the first. In some of his earliest books, Jim Maars seemed to be a better researcher. The deeper he got the more BS he spewed, until you finally reach his current level of "research".
Again, I think Dolan is aligning himself were he perceives the most money and adoration is. Nobody pays for a 600 page book that concludes that its all hogwash and should be forgotten. Or pays to see a speaker that is timid and boring. It helps to come up with new stuff to say at every event, like Dolan does. Regurgitating the same dribble, unless your Stan Friedman, doesn't usually fly. After all, its all about money and the sooner you realize that the better off you'll be.
Ron
David Biedny
Paranormal Adept
Well, then I guess we better shut down this show, because we're definitely NOT doing this for some enormous payoff. As far as I know - and Gene can fill in the blanks here - we're not even covering our hosting fees with the advertising money coming in right now. I'm not attacking what you're saying, Ron, I agree with your post, it's just frustrating, that's all.
dB
Schuyler
Misanthrope
How about a fund-raising drive like the NPR guys do? Wikipedia has also done this to the tune of millions. I know you have the donations links and all, but I was thinking of something a little more aggressive. You could just lay it out there like this:
(Note: Figures here are FAKE because I don't know what I'm talking about. Beginning of FAKE quote:
Look folks. We've been running a deficit here for the last three years. We've already lost $3,000. We don't expect to make that up, but we can't continue like this. We're now paying $2500 per year in hosting and bandwidth costs and we're taking in about $800 per year in ads. That means we need to make $1700 more per year, so our goal is to raise that amount in the next month. Donate this way or that way or this other way, but please help us out. All we want to do is break even, OK?
(End of FAKE quote. These are not real figures. I made them up.)
I think if people knew what you guys were facing, that might prompt some donations.
Just a thought.....
(Note: Figures here are FAKE because I don't know what I'm talking about. Beginning of FAKE quote:
Look folks. We've been running a deficit here for the last three years. We've already lost $3,000. We don't expect to make that up, but we can't continue like this. We're now paying $2500 per year in hosting and bandwidth costs and we're taking in about $800 per year in ads. That means we need to make $1700 more per year, so our goal is to raise that amount in the next month. Donate this way or that way or this other way, but please help us out. All we want to do is break even, OK?
(End of FAKE quote. These are not real figures. I made them up.)
I think if people knew what you guys were facing, that might prompt some donations.
Just a thought.....
Here are a few basics on this:
Our annual cost for a powerful dedicated server with sufficient bandwidth, including domains and dedicated IP numbers, offsite backups and a support license for control panel software, is actually closer to $7,000 per year. This is something that has to be done properly to provide the kind of show you listeners clearly want.
Yes, we can get cheap hosting, but our busy forums would exceed resource allotments real fast, and, in the end, they'd just bump us up to a high-end server. We've been there.
There are also free or cheap ways to have a Podcast hosted on a site. Once you get popular, the monthly fees attach to your efforts, and soon you're not saving any money, and you don't have the control.
Beyond that core expense is the fact that David and I deserve a little lunch money from time to time, to be blunt about it, plus some cash to pay for equipment, utilities and maybe at the end of the process our time.
Holding a fund-raiser? We can do that via PayPal and this forum. I'd rather hope that we can get enough cash courtesy of our advertisers to avoid that need.
For that, though, we need sales and marketing help. David and I are artists not salespeople, and I barely cope in selling ads for the tech radio show.
So if you think you can assist us, we invite your inquiries.
Thanks.
aNorthernSoul
Professional Breather
I know many really popular podcasts that are also not making a killing off their shows who have their server space donated by a listener. You would think SOMEONE in the forums was running a decent hosting company that could donate the space.... I would think so anyway.
The requirement is a full server with specific OS and control panel specs and plenty of bandwidth (five to six terabytes guaranteed per month). It's not just a simple hosting service -- and the promises of unlimited bandwidth in some of those cheap offers are largely bogus. We are under contract with our current provider for six more months.