Scientist re-creates Turin shroud to show it's fake.

[swatcher]

Interesting article on CNN:


Scientist re-creates Turin Shroud to show it's fake - CNN.com

 

[Sean Elifritz]

It won't convince the believers that it is a fake. When carbon dating that pointed to the 12th-13th century or something like that failed to convince them it became pretty obvious to me that nothing would. Additionally, it doesn't show up in any historical records prior to that same period. But again, they don't care.

 

[Rudolf Steiner]

The good thing about the shroud is that isn't it an dogma, an article of Faith, you can be Catholic and don't believe in the Turin'd shroud. All seem s to indicate that is a 12th Century fabrication.

 

[KEROUAC]

Oh boy. I could actually feel my blood boiling while reading that article. This is another example of someone trying to reproduce the shroud without checking the facts.

Firstly as discussed in this thread https://www.theparacast.com/forum/unexplainedi-turin-shroud-t5371.html?t=5371&highlight=turin the image on the shroud produces a three dimensional signature when tested with ultraviolet spectrometry. A painting can't produce this same result. Also there is no pigment on the image part of the shroud.

Secondly the carbon dating has been called into serious doubt by a team of scientist at Los Alamos National Laboratory:

In his presentation today at The Ohio State University’s Blackwell Center, Los Alamos National Laboratory (LANL) chemist, Robert Villarreal, disclosed startling new findings proving that the sample of material used in 1988 to Carbon-14 (C-14) date the Shroud of Turin, which categorized the cloth as a medieval fake, could not have been from the original linen cloth because it was cotton. According to Villarreal, who lead the LANL team working on the project, thread samples they examined from directly adjacent to the C-14 sampling area were “definitely not linen” and, instead, matched cotton. Villarreal pointed out that “the [1988] age-dating process failed to recognize one of the first rules of analytical chemistry that any sample taken for characterization of an area or population must necessarily be representative of the whole. The part must be representative of the whole. Our analyses of the three thread samples taken from the Raes and C-14 sampling corner showed that this was not the case.” Villarreal also revealed that, during testing, one of the threads came apart in the middle forming two separate pieces. A surface resin, that may have been holding the two pieces together, fell off and was analyzed. Surprisingly, the two ends of the thread had different chemical compositions, lending credence to the theory that the threads were spliced together during a repair.
LANL’s work confirms the research published in Thermochimica Acta (Jan. 2005) by the late Raymond Rogers, a chemist who had studied actual C-14 samples and concluded the sample was not part of the original cloth possibly due to the area having been repaired. This hypothesis was presented by M. Sue Benford and Joseph G. Marino in Orvieto, Italy in 2000. Benford and Marino proposed that a 16th Century patch of cotton/linen material was skillfully spliced into the 1st Century original Shroud cloth in the region ultimately used for dating. The intermixed threads combined to give the dates found by the labs ranging between 1260 and 1390 AD. Benford and Marino contend that this expert repair was necessary to disguise an unauthorized relic taken from the corner of the cloth. A paper presented today at the conference by Benford and Marino, and to be published in the July/August issue of the international journal Chemistry Today, provided additional corroborating evidence for the repair theory.

Add to all that that the images that the Italian man has produced do not resemble what we see on the shroud and all the other points made in my original thread.

There is a real analogy to be drawn from this and the UFO debunking scenario. It's the equivalent of a "swamp gas" explanation.

Also note this line from the article: "The Vatican has not responded to Garlaschelli's research, which was funded by the Union of Rationalist Atheists and Agnostics"

No bias there then.

PS I'm not a believer. Just someone who takes the time to look at the data, something this guy obviously has not.

 

[aNorthernSoul]

Yup, I disregarded most of this "replication as a means of debunking" (that idea, while useful at times is not really a valid means to debunk something on it's own, in my opinion) simply because they didn't even have all the facts straight. Is the shroud really from a man named Jesus' burial cloth? I have no clue but this replication and many of the arguments made against the strange artifact clearly show that they need to do their homework on the topic.

 

[Rudolf Steiner]

Oh boy. I could actually feel my blood boiling while reading that article. This is another example of someone trying to reproduce the shroud without checking the facts.

Firstly as discussed in this thread https://www.theparacast.com/forum/unexplainedi-turin-shroud-t5371.html?t=5371&highlight=turin the image on the shroud produces a three dimensional signature when tested with ultraviolet spectrometry. A painting can't produce this same result. Also there is no pigment on the image part of the shroud.

Secondly the carbon dating has been called into serious doubt by a team of scientist at Los Alamos National Laboratory:


Add to all that that the images that the Italian man has produced do not resemble what we see on the shroud and all the other points made in my original thread.

There is a real analogy to be drawn from this and the UFO debunking scenario. It's the equivalent of a "swamp gas" explanation.

Also note this line from the article: "The Vatican has not responded to Garlaschelli's research, which was funded by the Union of Rationalist Atheists and Agnostics"

No bias there then.

PS I'm not a believer. Just someone who takes the time to look at the data, something this guy obviously has not.

Carbono-14 and Swamp gas, they are the source of everything paranormal. It's common knowledge than aliens are born of swamp gas