UFOs: Shoot them down or Don't shoot

[Ezechiel]

Should we shoot them down or not ?

I honestly think humans should affirm themselves and shoot anything down that doesn't acknowledge our presence on this planet.

Showing up without attempting communication should trigger automatic retaliation... Imagine if the US had launched a large scale operation against the phoenix lights

Nukes, lasers, armor piercing shells, EMP bombs... we've got the goods to knock these mute condescending critters out of the sky.

The UFO farce has lasted way too long. Whatever the phenomenon is (probes, organic material extraction operation, cow carving... etc) it deserves an appropriate response from humans to get its attention.

In the end its all about being respected. We're ants with nukes now

 

[Randall]

Should we shoot them down or not ? I honestly think humans should affirm themselves and shoot anything down that doesn't acknowledge our presence on this planet. Showing up without attempting communication should trigger automatic retaliation... Imagine if the US had launched a large scale operation against the phoenix lights

Nukes, lasers, armor piercing shells, EMP bombs... we've got the goods to knock these mute condescending critters out of the sky. The UFO farce has lasted way too long. Whatever the phenomenon is (probes, organic material extraction operation, cow carving... etc) it deserves an appropriate response from humans to get its attention. In the end its all about being respected. We're ants with nukes now

Ya we're the 5 year olds in the game playing with real guns ... so they better watch out or we'll not only mess them up, but ourselves too ... we'll blow our little "ant nest" all to hell.

 

[Ezechiel]

Ya we're the 5 year olds in the game playing with real guns ... so they better watch out or we'll not only mess them up, but ourselves too ... we'll blow our little "ant nest" all to hell.

I think a large percentage of these apparitions are unmanned probes from who knows where... Thus explaining why there are no attempts at communication. Disrupting one of these with... Hmmm... Space-based equipment would make sense... Wouldn't it ?

 

[mike]

Well in our own history, natives who shot first, usually ended up being hunted down and wiped out.
Native american and australian examples spring to mind.

 

[Ezechiel]

Well in our own history, natives who shot first, usually ended up being hunted down and wiped out.
Native american and australian examples spring to mind.

This is a bit different, this is on a planetary scale. We would at least get the ultimate answer as to our destiny on a galactic scale.

Whether or not a human life is worth living might be on the table here and also whether or not our race is under quarantine are fundamental questions which might be resolved just by interfering with these apparitions...

At worst we'll end up in disclosed quarantine and earth will be managed by some alien being

Just shoot em, then we'll know for sure. Intent is priceless.

 

[Randall]

But then again ...

​

 

[Ezechiel]

But then again ...

​

Thus you have revealed the true hidden question here. Do we want to know or not.

Hawking says: we really don't want to find out at our stage of evolution.
Einstein was terrified at the idea of alien visitation. Don't forget that his life's work is totally at odds with faster than light operations (so is the neutrino it seems...).

If the greatest thinkers of our time instinctively believe that it's not a good idea, then what is Steven Bassett ? LOL

 

[trainedobserver]

I think there should be a special task force whose only purpose is to solve the question of the origin and nature of UFOs by any means necessary. The overflight of national borders by unidentified aircraft is a national security issue. We should shoot them down and do whatever it takes to track them back to their point of origin.

If alien abduction stories turn out to be true for example, it should be a national security imperative to put a stop to them. Aliens as largely depicted in UFO lore are criminals by all human standards. Kidnappers, rapists, reckless endangerment, home invasion, violation of controlled airspace, etc., etc., etc. They need to be brought in for questioning at the very least and probably treated as enemy combatants until we know better.

That will never happen. We apparently cannot touch these things. The Tehran UFO case comes to mind.

I think if you look at the sometimes questionable history of the subject you'll see we used to try to shoot them down and then stopped. Apparently after they started shooting us down. That's all part of the lore, I don't know how accurate that really is however.

 

[Randall]

I think there should be a special task force whose only purpose is to solve the question of the origin and nature of UFOs by any means necessary. The overflight of national borders by unidentified aircraft is a national security issue. We should shoot them down and do whatever it takes to track them back to their point of origin.

If alien abduction stories turn out to be true for example, it should be a national security imperative to put a stop to them. Aliens as largely depicted in UFO lore are criminals by all human standards. Kidnappers, rapists, reckless endangerment, home invasion, violation of controlled airspace, etc., etc., etc. They need to be brought in for questioning at the very least and probably treated as enemy combatants until we know better.

That will never happen. We apparently cannot touch these things. The Tehran UFO case comes to mind.

I think if you look at the sometimes questionable history of the subject you'll see we used to try to shoot them down and then stopped. Apparently after they started shooting us down. That's all part of the lore, I don't know how accurate that really is however.

Train,

Your logic is hard to dispute. To me the whole "space brother" attitude seems akin to some kind of Stockholm Syndrome, particularly with some abductees. Essentially, so long as the aliens can do as they please with complete impunity, then we're essentially reduced to some third world planet. However the flip side is that we haven't earned the right to confront them as equals yet either. For example, suppose Mars had turned out to have intelligent but comparatively primitive and warring cultures. Would it be wise to land there and give them access to our ships and technology, or would it be wiser to study them first to see if there would be any advantage for us in making contact? Would we really care whether or not their laws required us to land and turn our spacecraft over to the local witch doctor? I don't think so, and you'd probably agree ... so it's not quite as simple when you look at the bigger picture.

 

[pixelsmith]

when humans see something living we tend to kill it and eat it. i wouldnt land on the white house lawn either.

 

[Randall]

when humans see something living we tend to kill it and eat it. i wouldnt land on the white house lawn either.

lol ... on the other hand, pixel's portrayal is about as simple as you can get !

 

[trainedobserver]

when humans see something living we tend to kill it and eat it. i wouldnt land on the white house lawn either.

And like I've said before, if these things aren't human, if they are insects, reptiles, or some other thing than mammals, right or wrong we'll go at them tooth and nail. If these stories about Greys, Reptilians, and Manta aliens are true, then those things are our natural enemies at a very basic level. We would and probably should kill them on principle alone. Other species that prey upon ours need to be eradicated.

I am telling you. There is nothing about the implications of UFOs that is "cool and groovy" except in some cartoon version of reality. This business should have the entire planet united and militarized. It doesn't. That in itself may signal the fight was over before it started or that it isn't a reality in any real sense of the word at all.

It's all smoke, mirrors, and lights in the night sky.

 

[pixelsmith]

being consumed by a big bug from outer space sounds pretty cool. it is something i would not have expected.

 

[Randall]

If these stories about Greys, Reptilians, and Manta aliens are true, then those things are our natural enemies at a very basic level. We would and probably should kill them on principle alone. Other species that prey upon ours need to be eradicated ...

But in the end Kirk shows the advanced trait of mercy and is therefore not destroyed by the metrones. Eradicating the lizard aliens would demonstrate we are no better ... perhaps worse, since they are obviously much more advanced and could probably do us much more harm than they have.

 

[Ezechiel]

I am telling you. There is nothing about the implications of UFOs that is "cool and groovy" except in some cartoon version of reality. This business should have the entire planet united and militarized. It doesn't. That in itself may signal the fight was over before it started or that it isn't a reality in any real sense of the word at all.

Instinctively, I think you are correct. Why shouldn't it be a jungle out there ?



Religions have thought us that entities originating from the sky are judgmental, must be feared and respected. So we're all conditioned not to shoot upwards for fear of troubling the gods.

If human ants can find a way to wake up the giants to our presence, we might have a chance to progress to another level. Michio Kaku would approve .... or we might see a huge foot for one last time lol
Either way, any question about our cosmic status would be resolved.

 

[trainedobserver]

But in the end Kirk shows the advanced trait of mercy and is therefore not destroyed by the metrones. Eradicating the lizard aliens would demonstrate we are no better ... perhaps worse, since they are obviously much more advanced and could probably do us much more harm than they have.

I know that you understand that is a complete fantasy. What relevance do science fiction and fantasy entertainment have to do with anything? Is there any other subject other than Ufology where fictional stories are attempted to be used in some evidentiary fashion? It makes no sense whatsoever.

Are UFOs real world problems or not? If so then using real world logic, not Hollywood logic, is what is called for.

If the commonly promoted UFO mythos is true, then what is actually described is not the activity of benevolent altruistic beings. You have to really wonder why that meme is so powerful and so pervasive when nature, human history, and the reported activity signal anything but.

I seriously doubt we can shoot them down or face off against them technologically in any significant way. The only alternative is to discover their purpose and point of origin through Intelligence. This gets back to the argument that somewhere within the United States military there must be a group devoted to the problem. If so, perhaps they have concluded the only answer is in detection and tracking instead of direct confrontation. Of course, if these others have infiltrated society and the institutions within in then any real efforts to address the problem is probably neutralized before it can get underway. It always gets back to a big unknown.

Stepping back from this you have to realize that 99.9% of the world population's activity seems pretty unaffected by the UFO mystery. Does that tell us that our speculations about them are all based on fiction?

 

[Ezechiel]

I seriously doubt we can shoot them down or face off against them technologically in any significant way. The only alternative is to discover their purpose and point of origin through Intelligence. This gets back to the argument that somewhere within the United States military there must be a group devoted to the problem. If so, perhaps they have concluded the only answer is in detection and tracking instead of direct confrontation. Of course, if these others have infiltrated society and the institutions within in then any real efforts to address the problem is probably neutralized before it can get underway. It always gets back to a big unknown.

This begs the question: What if we've tried to shoot them down in the past, they responded and there is now a hidden agreement.... Holloman AFB/Eisenhower rings a bell.

We don't shoot them down anymore.
Phoenix lights are non-events.
ET's are funny green guys made for Hollywood.

After the deal, bottom line is:
Humans and all earthly creatures can be messed around with and this planet really doesn't belong to us. We can live as long as we don't interfere with the real landlords.

Another good argument to try to shoot them and let the planet know what the real deal is about. Are we slaves/tenants/organic material bank ? ... or is there no deal at all

 

[mike]

Its all relative though,
We trap and tag creatures like dolphins, Usually for purposes we describe as "for their own good"
My dog hates the vet, he gets given bizzare medical proceedures including a rectal thermometer.
On the subject of dogs, one tactic employed by trainers, is to take the dog on its lead away from its owner, walk it out of sight of its owner. After a few minutes the dog is returned to its owner thus establishing that the trainer can be trusted to bring him home.
One fundamental aspect of the abductee scenario is they are returned.
Why bother ? why not just take what you want and dump it in the ocean or out the airlock on your way back home.
The current scenario doesnt appear on the surface of it, to be any different to how we treat the lessor lifeforms here.
Whether its the painful experience of a trip to the vet, or the capture and tagging for study of wild animals, it doesnt imply (though im sure the subjects might feel otherwise) that we are evil for doing so.

 

[trainedobserver]

Its all relative though,
We trap and tag creatures like dolphins, Usually for purposes we describe as "for their own good"

If you think it is appropriate to surrender your sovereignty (for lack of a better term) to some thing I think it is terribly misguided notion. The idea it would be agreeable or even understandable that something higher up on the evolutionary chain would have some sort of unchallenged dominion over us is categorically inhuman. No, if we are being tagged by someone else we should invite them to conduct their studies elsewhere.

If the Earth is nothing more than a stock pond and we are just seeing the bottoms of the fisherman's boats as they bait and hook us on some cosmic game reserve, if we are just some thing's property, we owe them some serious grief and not loyalty or complacency.

 

[mike]

If you think it is appropriate to surrender your sovereignty (for lack of a better term) to some thing I think it is terribly misguided notion. The idea it would be agreeable or even understandable that something higher up on the evolutionary chain would have some sort of unchallenged dominion over us is categorically inhuman. No, if we are being tagged by someone else we should invite them to conduct their studies elsewhere.

If the Earth is nothing more than a stock pond and we are just seeing the bottoms of the fisherman's boats as they bait and hook us on some cosmic game reserve, if we are just some thing's property, we owe them some serious grief and not loyalty or complacency.

And yet we assume unchallenged dominion over all the life forms here,
Religious texts set this in stone " i give thee dominion over all the fowls of the air etc etc"

But really they are playing by the single prerequisite the universe demands for doing a thing.

Right or wrong are human constructs they dont count,
What gives the lion the right to take the lamb.

"The ability to do so"

What gives us the right to kill other animals for food, and each other ?

That same basic prerequisite the ability to do so.

They are simply playing by the exact same rule, it applies from the jungle to the boardroom
Indeed they told streiber IIRC the same thing when he demanded what gave them the right to take him from his bed.

The ability to do a thing, is all the right you need to do it

Its a rule we apply to our dealings with the planet and other life forms, and it applies to us as well

What right do they have to treat us like cattle ?, the same as we do with cows.

The ability to do so

We like to assume we are the top of the heap, but if this phenomena is real then clearly we are not, we are just another rung on a long ladder.
In the words of Dirty Harry

"Mans got to know his limitations......."