Acharya S and a Historical Jesus

[Rick Deckard]

What if people DID have this built in, but in some people the instinct is broken?

What if some people's ability to think objectively is 'broken' putting them at the mercy of those that elevate their own status above all others...

 

[nightlark]

What if some people's ability to think objectively is 'broken' putting them at the mercy of those that elevate their own status above all others...

Touch?... One would hope that one could think objectively and explore ones inner spiritual inklings. I hope I can.

 

[Rick Deckard]

Touch?... One would hope that one could think objectively and explore ones inner spiritual inklings. I hope I can.

Me too - I'm not against the principle of a 'supreme being' or a 'collective consciousness' or a 'higher spiritual plane'. If any of those things *do* exist then I'm pretty sure that I *don't* need a self-appointed church and it's leaders to 'show me the way'...

...I'll find out for myself, thank you very much.

 

[Alea]

A few comments...

1. Professionally, because someone "studies" a subject for "decades" does not make her a "researcher". Research constitutes an academically accepted and approved process of conducting a study or investigating a thesis that acknowledges the work of others in the field and espouses new ideas with documented valid and reliable sources. Research also includes publishing or presenting one's work to the larger academic community through juried or peer reviewed publications or at academically recognized conferences for comment and critique by other experts in the field. Unbiased research includes investigating the research that has been completed on both sides of an argument and presenting a balanced view with referenced support for the thesis offered.

2. Regarding the American School of Classical Studies, please check their web site for information regarding "membership". I'm not a stalker nor am I casting aspersions; I'm suggesting that you contact them regarding the text on their website if you have issues.
Servece Moved: Connecting to ASCSA new WEB SITE

3. Acharya made some very intriguing points that made me want to learn more. Is anyone who questions the validity of someone's comments regarding the existence of Jesus labeled a "Christian Fundamentalist"? Can't one be a seeker of truth...no matter what the truth may be and without "religious affiliation"?

As a thinker, isn't it absolutely fine to say "I don't know" and "I want to learn" and be an AGNOSTIC. Especially in the fields of spirituality and paranormal phenomena, unless hard evidence exists, can one be anything else?

4. Regarding Rome and Nero, and the documented historical evidence that exists concerning the burning of Rome, I never heard that this was a matter of FAITH. This, my dear, is HISTORY. Take a look in any valid and reliable reference resource and you'll see. Check the Encyclopedia Britannica, for example, for more information.

Since my interest has been so piqued, I'm going to look very closely at all of Acharya's theories and works...and all of the cited references. Some of the points, as I mentioned, are very intriguing and I want to learn more! I hope the valid and reliable references are there to support the theories and it's not just more personal opinion rather than real research.

 

[Aaron LeClair]

Someone recently stated on TV "If the church has so much faith in God, why do they have lightening conductors on their buildings?" - I think that pretty much sums it up for me.

Late comedian Bill Hicks did a bit on the Pope, and the pope-mobile. Ever seen those parades with him waving behind bullet proof glass? As Bill Hicks said, "There's faith in action".

 

[turblom79]

I am not going to say that I have all the answers about religion, or that I am a huge supporter of organized religion, however, IMO there has to be a God. When we look at where we came from, monkeys, there is such a large gap in cognition that I have to believe a higher power has intervened to grant us this gift of awareness and free will. I believe in evolution, I just feel that it is impossible for sucha drastic mental leap to have been made by only primates.

 

[auntiegrav]

What if some people's ability to think objectively is 'broken' putting them at the mercy of those that elevate their own status above all others...

What if it gets broken by the food they are eating? What if the marketers know this already? What if the government is ignoring the evidence that the food we eat makes us stupid, lazy, and addicted to spending money on even worse foods?

How will our children ever find out?

 

[auntiegrav]

Yes, indeed. One scarcely knows where to begin.

<snip>
The reason the very logical and most scientific argument that Jesus Christ is a fictional character "died out" is because of tactics precisely like these: Mindlessly insult the person who dares to point out the emperor's transparent nakedness. The status quo has even gone so far to not only ridicule those who sensibly pointed out all of the problems with accepting a "historical" Jesus, they drove them out of their livelihood - and worse. The tide has turned again, as it is quite clear that there is no scientific evidence of any value showing that Jesus Christ is a historical character.

Thanks for joining the forum. I hope you check back once in a while.
One book I found that discusses the evidence in support of a 'created' Christ character is "Who Wrote The New Testament?"
An exercise in language and syntax analysis that will certainly help you sleep, but is detailed in the analysis of where the Crystos figure came from.
Sun, Son, "Worship the Son of God, not the God of the Sun"--Roman/Christian marketing slogan (even they realized that it's all in the marketing).

 

[Mogwa]

I found Acharya's nom de plume to be rather amusing given the subject matter she covers. Unless, of course, her parents actually laid that one on her. Have mercy.

 

[Raccoon]

At the risk of taking this off topic, I recommend people also watch the BBC movie Second Coming (2003) [Amazon listing here].

Interesting conclusion arrived at by the end of the movie, regarding religions impact on the world and a potential way forward.

as for this topic, I look forward to continued informed debate and less ad hominem attacks.

 

[DVS]

One scarcely knows where to begin.

As an aside, I often wonder why we don't hear any shows critiquing the foundational tenets of Islam. Considering Islam's impact on the world and the threat it poses to western civilization, one would presume that humanists would be scurrying about, lining up shows and guests to discredit the miracles attributed to Mohammed, poking holes in the idea of his ascension into heaven, etc. But, alas - nary a word.

Interesting.

I agree with your post. I do notice that there are efforts by people who try to 'debunk Jesus' and basically bash the basis of Christianity. The bottom line is that they are against Christianity for some reason and do not view Islam as a threat to their beliefs, or lack of. People have no problem attacking Christianity these days, but will tip-toe around challenging Islam or insult Muhammed. I don't know how many times i heard someone yelling 'Jesus Christ!' in the movies, probably thousands, but if someone were to scream 'Prophet Mohammed!' in one movie, you can be sure a worldwide outrage would follow along with apologies.

Yes, it is true right now, but look at the impact that Christianity has had on the world for the last 2000 years and all the devistation it has caused. We like to think otherwise becuase it is the custom we inhereited in this country; it's "our" religion. Sure, Christians didn't fly any planes into any buildings, but they have blown up abortion clinics, robbed cultures of THEIR beliefs and traditions, molested a monstrous amount of children, and those soldiers in Iraq: you think they are not fighting for "God". Think again.

This what I am talking about, the notion that Islamic terrorists are bad BUT Chritianity did this and that the last 2000 years, etc.. Why don't you also make a comparison of Islam's conquests throughout the centuries and keep it in context. Take a look at how extremist muslims have hijacked Islam into a world-wide jihad. Christianity didnt molest children, individual sick priests did it, but it wasn't in the name of Christianity. You think there arent pedohiles & homosexuals in Islam? Its funny you say that, because their is an idea out there that Muhammed was actually a pedophile himself based on Islamic scruptures. Islam didn't attack us on 9/11, Islamic extremists did and they continue to murder innocent people in the name of Islam.

Abortion clinics have been bombed by christian fundamentalist nut cases, but how many people have they killed? Now, how many people were murdered, maimed and beheaded in the name of the extremist version of Jihad? You are completely off base with you notion that US Soldiers are fighting for "God" as if they are the religious extremists. I am not going to get into the politics of the war, but you are overgeneralizing 100,000s of troops. Some of which might be devout christians, but they are fighting along-side muslims against extremists who want to die and bring as many innocents with them as possible in the name of Islam. Did you not know that Islamic terrorists have killed more innocent muslims than anyone and continue to do so on a daily basis? The Jihad in africa that has islamic africans murdering entire tribes of christians when they don't convert to Islam. This is being done now, not centuries ago.

---------------------------

I am not a religious person, but I dont believe all of the bible is to be taken literally and scientifically.

Why doesnt anyone question if Mohammed existed? I suspect that there is the same type evidence available as Jesus' existence. Not much.

How about the Shroud of Turin for scientific evidence of Jesus' existence? The debunking efforts have failed last time I checked.

 

[CapnG]

Uh... when it comes to christians and extremist violence, if you think it's a product of by-gone centuries, I got two words for you: Northern Ireland.

 

[DVS]

Understood, I could be wrong but haven't they recently disarmed and disavowed violence? Even so, have the IRA targeted innocent civilians worldwide as a predominant target in order to get their ideolgy or political goals across? I understood that they mostly give warnings before they bomb and do not target civilians, although I'm sure civilians have been killed and probably were targeted. However, much different than wanting to kill as many innocents as possible to get their points across. As you can see i'm not a moral relativist.

Make no mistake, I am not saying Christians are not capable of violence and havent killed people in the past in the name of Christianity nor that Christian extremists do not exist. In fact, the fundamenatal extremists on each side probably want to usher in the apocalypse; one for the second coming of Jesus, the other for the 12th Imam and an Islamic empire. My point is that Islamic fundamentalist terrorists, right now, as in today, are actively in a battle of civilizations with the West/infidels by their own statements and actions. Just my observations, anyone can disagree with this.

 

[Raccoon]

Some interesting thoughts can be found here.

ERADICATING EXTREMISM

Isolating and eradicating extremists does not, however, appear to be Sookhdeo's agenda. Rather he wishes to misrepresent the Qur'an, history, and contemporary Muslims in order to substantiate his own claim that terrorism and extremism are inherent to Islam. Following this approach is exactly how we will lose the war on terrorism. The true war is the war of ideas. The lynch-pin in the arguments of Bin Laden, Zarqawi and others is that they think they represent Islam. Traditional Muslim scholars from around the world have confirmed that such deviant ideologies and actions violate the very principles of Islam. By working with such scholars we can help them to consolidate the traditional middle ground of Islam and further expose the extremists for being just that.

This is the most efficient, most peaceful and most effective weapon in the war against extremist interpretations of Islam. If we do not use it, we will have surrendered the higher ground in the war of ideas. By responding with extremism of another kind, Sookhdeo and those like him allow the extremists to determine the general inter-religious ambiance and thus the course of events.

Rather than providing a realistic presentation of the challenges we face and their possible peaceful solutions, they take advantage of the situation to advance their own hidden polemical agenda and prejudices. In doing so they work not only against Muslims and Islam, but against the whole of humanity, Christians included (or perhaps especially). Onward Christian soldiers, Reverend Sookhdeo?

When it comes to these debates I am definetely in agreement with David B's belief that people today want to be spoon fed ideas and not think, investigate and try to understand the other side.

"We must learn to live together as brothers or perish together as fools." Martin Luther King

 

[CapnG]

My point is that Islamic fundamentalist terrorists, right now, as in today, are actively in a battle of civilizations with the West/infidels by their own statements and actions. Just my observations, anyone can disagree with this.

I'm not disagreeing, I just get a little alarmed by this amnesiac tendancy (not of you, specifically but of people in general) that's been cropping up lately to whitewash christianity, or at least relegate it's bloody-handedness to the middle ages.

I'm reminded of one of George Carlin's rants (seemingly prescient, in the post 9/11 era) on the nature of terrorism:

(paraphrased)"You've got to look at this thing reasonably, you have to be realistic about terrorism. Certain groups of people; muslim fundamentalists, jewish fundamentalists, christian fundamentalists and just plain old guys from Montana are going to continue to do things that will make life in this country very interesting for a long time to come."

 

[Mogwa]

The violence in Northern Ireland was predicated upon much more than a conflict between two Christian religious sects. It's also interesting to note that negotiations seem to have resolved the situation peacefully for the last few years.
So I suppose we can look forward to a time when Catholics will no longer be paying cash bonuses to families that strap bombs to their minor children's bodies and send them toddling into wedding parties to slaughter their enemies. And perhaps now those pesky Protestants will put an end to breaking into the homes of those they have theological disagreements with and lopping off the heads of entire families, including infants.
We should now immediately employ the same approach in the mideast. I'm quite certain Hezbollah, Al Quaeda, the Mujahideen and the Taliban would me more than willing lay down their arms in hopes of a peacefully negotiated solution. Archaya S would make a fine chief neogiator. After all, the self effacing title she has chosen for herself means "Great Teacher" or "Guru." The supernatural implications of such a title alone would certainly go a long way to squelching any rowdy elements.