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David's revelation of an up close encounter
- Thread starter Indrids Cold
- Start date
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David Biedny
Paranormal Adept
Rob,
Exactly what proof do you expect me to produce?
What claims have I made about my experiences? Do I say I understand what has happened to me, that I know the How and the Why?
My brother and two of my friends - who have exactly nothing to gain by going public with the fact that they underwent paranormal experiences with me - are they all lying? Why would they do that? To placate me, to pull the wool over the eyes a bunch of strangers?
Believe whatever you want, your avatar speaks volumes. I know what I've experienced, I know what my eyes have seen, and I'm laughing at no one here. You have legitimate questions, fine, shoot away, otherwise you can stuff it.
dB
Exactly what proof do you expect me to produce?
What claims have I made about my experiences? Do I say I understand what has happened to me, that I know the How and the Why?
My brother and two of my friends - who have exactly nothing to gain by going public with the fact that they underwent paranormal experiences with me - are they all lying? Why would they do that? To placate me, to pull the wool over the eyes a bunch of strangers?
Believe whatever you want, your avatar speaks volumes. I know what I've experienced, I know what my eyes have seen, and I'm laughing at no one here. You have legitimate questions, fine, shoot away, otherwise you can stuff it.
dB
I've always wondered what it would be like for Beidny to interview Biedny. How might this interview go and what kind of questions might be asked??
Sometimes we seem unable to get at any truth because the materialistic evidence is missing. Doesn't make it untrue. This may seem like a stretch, but perhaps that is the way it is supposed to be, ... at least for now.
Sometimes we seem unable to get at any truth because the materialistic evidence is missing. Doesn't make it untrue. This may seem like a stretch, but perhaps that is the way it is supposed to be, ... at least for now.
Stillborn
Skilled Investigator
We only have testimony for most of what we experience in life. To assume ghosts or ufos drop cameras down for people might be asking a bit much. If that is what you're getting at. Even if David had photos or vid, some people would claim he faked it. After all he's done special effects and knows a lot about photo-shop.
AnnetteMarie
Skilled Investigator
fencejumper
Paranormal Novice
If you listen to what David has said on past shows, I can take a guess what he's thinking as he reads this thread... "why do you think you have a right to this information". It's the same as when he talks about Disclosure. Think of this as Biedny Disclosure. Because listeners *want* the information they make up reasons why he has to give it to them. He has no obligation to do so. If I were in his shoes, some of the comments in this thread would make up my mind about being too open. Information has a way of getting twisted into ammo. David is certainly not short on critics (crazy ones that would relish a vulnerable spot). Maybe it's not just his reputation at stake. Perhaps he's protecting other people or the experience had very personal or unpleasant aspects. Whatever the reason, I think you should respect what he's doing and let him share at his own pace. My guess is you could hold a Biedny Disclosure Y Conference and you'll get the same results as the X Conference 
Just my 2 cents.
Just my 2 cents.
T
Tommy Allison
Guest
Telling people you've seen a flying saucer, is a lot like telling them you were in an asylum for the criminally insane.
When I was in 6th grade, I saw something I could not explain. It was indeed a saucer. I remember how I was treated after I spoke out about it.
My life was a living hell for the remainder of the time I lived in that podunk town.
When you've seen something unusual, or out of this world, your life becomes something much less ordinary. Most people will shun you not so much because they think you're nuts, but because they wonder why these things never happen to them?
By virtue of seeing something beyond the veil, you are always going to be less ordinary, and to think that we are on this planet thinking that the world should be completely mundane is ridiculous. There are layers upon layers to this reality. The things you see and believe, and the things you don't see, and don't believe in. We all have things we've seen we cannot explain, and it doesn't make them any less real if we don't have proof.
There are legions of people who believe in God, and have NOTHING in the way of proof. How do you know that God loves you? How do you know anyone in this world loves you? How can you prove you love someone? You can't. There is no proof. Why should UFO's or that sort of thing be any less valued or relevant?
Because when you see a UFO, or claim to have met beings from another world, the first reaction someone will have, isn't rational, it's irrational. It's emotional, rather than logical. The fear response is significant when you tell someone you've seen a UFO, or been abducted by aliens.
When I dream about UFO's, or aliens, my fear response is through the fricking roof. I had a dream about seeing UFO's coming down out of the sky and I was terrified. Irrationally terrified. Why should I be terrified of something in a dream? More importantly why would I be terrified of a round saucer shaped craft? If I'd never encountered one, or had no basis to fear them, why would I be terrified of a dream?
On two occasions, I had gotten up to use the rest room, and each of these occasions my then girlfriend, and later on my wife were standing in the dark, backlit by a streetlamp, and my first reaction was complete and total terror, because I thought they were an alien.
A completely and totally irrational fear. Someone would probably jump and maybe yell, but I was so terrified I screamed like a little girl, and I'm not a little sissy of a man either.
If I were to say that I'd seen a UFO, or been abducted by aliens, what proof would I be able to offer? Nothing. Even if you have an implant, and a doctor removes it, it's not proof. It ceases to work once it is removed, and is almost always destroyed in the processes of finding out what it is made of.
Which brings me to why David is less apt to discuss his own beliefs and or experiences.
David like everyone else has to make a living doing something. If you develop a reputation for being a little unusual, you will not be wanted by anyone in any field. Not because you're unusual, but because you're an individual, and corporations are not interested in individuals, they want team players AKA Sheep.
Being stupid has its own rewards. Being silent on your experiences also has its own rewards. Unless you're making a buck off of it, then those rewards seem to be pretty good if you have the right agent.
When I was in 6th grade, I saw something I could not explain. It was indeed a saucer. I remember how I was treated after I spoke out about it.
My life was a living hell for the remainder of the time I lived in that podunk town.
When you've seen something unusual, or out of this world, your life becomes something much less ordinary. Most people will shun you not so much because they think you're nuts, but because they wonder why these things never happen to them?
By virtue of seeing something beyond the veil, you are always going to be less ordinary, and to think that we are on this planet thinking that the world should be completely mundane is ridiculous. There are layers upon layers to this reality. The things you see and believe, and the things you don't see, and don't believe in. We all have things we've seen we cannot explain, and it doesn't make them any less real if we don't have proof.
There are legions of people who believe in God, and have NOTHING in the way of proof. How do you know that God loves you? How do you know anyone in this world loves you? How can you prove you love someone? You can't. There is no proof. Why should UFO's or that sort of thing be any less valued or relevant?
Because when you see a UFO, or claim to have met beings from another world, the first reaction someone will have, isn't rational, it's irrational. It's emotional, rather than logical. The fear response is significant when you tell someone you've seen a UFO, or been abducted by aliens.
When I dream about UFO's, or aliens, my fear response is through the fricking roof. I had a dream about seeing UFO's coming down out of the sky and I was terrified. Irrationally terrified. Why should I be terrified of something in a dream? More importantly why would I be terrified of a round saucer shaped craft? If I'd never encountered one, or had no basis to fear them, why would I be terrified of a dream?
On two occasions, I had gotten up to use the rest room, and each of these occasions my then girlfriend, and later on my wife were standing in the dark, backlit by a streetlamp, and my first reaction was complete and total terror, because I thought they were an alien.
A completely and totally irrational fear. Someone would probably jump and maybe yell, but I was so terrified I screamed like a little girl, and I'm not a little sissy of a man either.
If I were to say that I'd seen a UFO, or been abducted by aliens, what proof would I be able to offer? Nothing. Even if you have an implant, and a doctor removes it, it's not proof. It ceases to work once it is removed, and is almost always destroyed in the processes of finding out what it is made of.
Which brings me to why David is less apt to discuss his own beliefs and or experiences.
David like everyone else has to make a living doing something. If you develop a reputation for being a little unusual, you will not be wanted by anyone in any field. Not because you're unusual, but because you're an individual, and corporations are not interested in individuals, they want team players AKA Sheep.
Being stupid has its own rewards. Being silent on your experiences also has its own rewards. Unless you're making a buck off of it, then those rewards seem to be pretty good if you have the right agent.
skunkape
Paranormal Maven
I gravitated towards this show because it seemed like the most legit show on this topic. I have so much shit on my mind dealing with these experiences that I thought sharing some of it would ease some psychological stress. I was totally wrong. Talking about this stuff after years of silence brought on either
a: Severe harrassment by a mostly invisible intelligence.
or
b: A schizophrenic break down.
I am beginning to lean more back towards keeping my fucking mouth shut.
a: Severe harrassment by a mostly invisible intelligence.
or
b: A schizophrenic break down.
I am beginning to lean more back towards keeping my fucking mouth shut.
Schuyler
Misanthrope
You know, that just pisses me off no end. I know the Alien Guys (tm) are apt to have different values and you know we can't possibly be ethnocentric here because it just ain't PC, but damn it, I've got values, too, and I'm tired of being treated like shit. No more excuses. I don't care if their values are different, we're going by mine from now on. I say let's fight back. Really. One of the things these guys are said to be able to do is instill fear into you as a controlling mechanism. Fear is nothing more than an adrenaline dump, physically. It's the 'fight or flight' reflex. The thing is, you can condition yourself to handle it. Oxygen gets sent to your legs and arms and away from your brain (not such a hot thing to have happen) I've had some tactical firearms training, and they intentionally force you into an adrenalin dump so you will experience it and tell you you are only half as good a shot as you are on your best day on the range.
The way around this is to have a battle plan in your head, memorized, BEFORE the event happens so you don't have to think about it when it does. Just as an example: I'm out walking my dog. He's just a little cocker spaniel--not aggressive, not terribly macho (unless you get in the way of his dishwasher, which, if you're another dog, really gets him going like a freight train and he will attack.) Other dogs will always bark, but once in awhile one won't understand where his territory ends and will go after us. First time this happened to us I was seriously frightened and with no plan. So I got a can of 10% pepper gel mace and formulated a plan if it happened again. It did. I reeled in my dog with my left hand, pulled the mace out with my right, aimed carefully, and fired. I had to work through my fear, which hit me like a ton of bricks, but since I knew what it felt like and had my plan memorized, I was able to respond despite the adrenalin. You can't let that fear disable you and you can't be wondering what to do when you're under stress; you have to know in advance. You also have to condition yourself to stay on yellow alert at all times. If you're paying attention to your surroundings, it's a lot harder to take you by surprise.
I think these little fuckers are scared of us. I think they turn on the 'fear switch' as a way to control us. But if we are prepared, that little trick won't work as well. We are bigger than they are, stronger than they are, and I believe we are certainly as smart as they are. And I think we can turn the tables on them if we are prepared. Don't let them push us around. Fight back for your own personal freedom and your own rights as you see fit to define them. Show some backbone and resolve here and they just might think twice before messing with you.
Gareth
Nothin' to see here
Jesus christ man. Could you be any more of a douche bag?
What do you want? A photo? Piece of metal? Sworn affidavit from the universe?
All we have with any of this stuff is anecdotal. People tell their stories and we choose to believe them based on how much we trust the source. David has given us no reason not to trust him, therefore Ill surmise that everyone here trusts him. So we trust the guy. On top of that he is careful to have a witness on hand to verify and present their side of the story.
So yeah, based on what we have heard in the past, when David says he had an up close encounter of something most people are going to find it interesting.
Again, we have a situation where someone just doesnt get it. Like that Helix dude, Rob is trying to give us solution to a problem that doesnt exist.
T
Tommy Allison
Guest
Just to let you know.
If you're worried you're going crazy, or feel like you're losing your grip, you're not crazy.
Crazy people tell everyone they're NOT crazy. Sane people having issues dealing with things, feel like they are, and caveat their behavior in many ways.
Do not worry. When you have a psychotic break, you'll be completely non-functional. I've seen it when it happens. My mother had one when I was about 11 years old. She was never the same, and became the most evil person in the world, for the next 17 years, her life, and the lives of the people around her were a maelstrom of never knowing what was going to set her off.
I'd come over to visit her, and she'd be bawling her eyes out because Michael Landon had died, and was on TV. Her father died when she was 19, and it literally broke her heart. Some hurts never go away. If you've ever seen someone have a break, you'll know in your mind that You're not crazy.
Skunk, I promise you you're not going crazy. The fact that you care, and are concerned about your own wellbeing, and those around you, is proof.
Be well brother.
Stillborn
Skilled Investigator
David Biedny
Paranormal Adept
Thanks to those forum members who seem to understand my predicament.
With a couple of exceptions, the only experiences I've chosen to talk about on the show are those in which I have someone else to verify what we've seen and experienced. My brother, my buddies Bill and Jaime have been generous and kind in coming forward and talking about our experiences. The only reason that they decided to come forward, under their real names, is that they agree that what we witnessed/experienced was highly unusual, and they wanted to be supportive of my desire to talk about this stuff.
In reference to the issue brought up by this thread, I was thinking of two specific experiences, one which I've spoken about on the show (The UFO hovering over my house in Somerset, New Jersey in the early seventies), the other which I've not mentioned on the show, nor am I likely to, as it remains the single most terrifying event of my entire life. I appreciate that folks are interested in details of my experiences, and when possible, I'm happy to share them, but some things are just too weird and painful to talk about. I hope you all understand.
dB
With a couple of exceptions, the only experiences I've chosen to talk about on the show are those in which I have someone else to verify what we've seen and experienced. My brother, my buddies Bill and Jaime have been generous and kind in coming forward and talking about our experiences. The only reason that they decided to come forward, under their real names, is that they agree that what we witnessed/experienced was highly unusual, and they wanted to be supportive of my desire to talk about this stuff.
In reference to the issue brought up by this thread, I was thinking of two specific experiences, one which I've spoken about on the show (The UFO hovering over my house in Somerset, New Jersey in the early seventies), the other which I've not mentioned on the show, nor am I likely to, as it remains the single most terrifying event of my entire life. I appreciate that folks are interested in details of my experiences, and when possible, I'm happy to share them, but some things are just too weird and painful to talk about. I hope you all understand.
dB
im very sure most people here understand and appreciate that.
this is your journey and you will take each step in your own time, as is how it should be, your recent comments re this matter indicate a small incremental step, and that in iteslf should be good enough for anyone
fahrusha
Skilled Investigator
The terror that accompanies some sightings and some encounters is a very interesting element to study. Why do we have the terror? I'm not sure. As an experiencer, my remembered experiences are mostly not that terrifying, but I feel I must be blocking parts of them, because I experience the most incredible raw terror when I read some accounts in the literature. I also am victim of horrible nightmares.
I thank David for revealing what he is willing to. I appreciate his work in this field. I'd like to believe there is a day coming when all of our experiences can be revealed without any negative outcomes for us in the public eye.
Perhaps that is why we'd like to believe that there disclosure coming; because it would give experiencers vindication.
Best,
Fahrusha
I thank David for revealing what he is willing to. I appreciate his work in this field. I'd like to believe there is a day coming when all of our experiences can be revealed without any negative outcomes for us in the public eye.
Perhaps that is why we'd like to believe that there disclosure coming; because it would give experiencers vindication.
Best,
Fahrusha
Blacknight
Seeker
i understand. I wouldn't tell these guys here either. How about you just tell me?
What I've come to from long, sometimes painful, experience is that you share private information of any sort only at your own peril, and certainly you only share it with persons in whom you have explicit trust and confidence. Sharing it publicly, especially when your instinct tells you not to, is an act of near-insanity and certain regret. As they say...Bury it! Bury it deep! Then bury the shovel you used to bury it with! You can always dig it up later.
Rob
No UFOs
What I'm essentially say is this.
Inherent and inescapable to the human mind is it's limitations in perception. We cannot think the unthinkable. Emprically, we have no way of being absolutely certain that the whole of existence as it appears to us isn't, for example, some kind of simulation created last week, with all our experiences and indeed all of history built into the program. Our individual and collective subjective conscious can never observe an objective reality, since our perceptions are of a limited and finite nature. This is a well known and understood part of the human condition, and points to various underlying truths about ourselves, our consciousness and what we can say about existence.
Why am I saying this? Well, this understanding of ourselves is used to intentionally exploit an awful lot of people. Religion and a belief in a loving and caring God is an example. As we all know, there is no proof or evidence for the biblical God's existence, but we have to believe anyway, we have to have faith. Whether we're consciously aware of it or not, at best we pretend to ourselves something to be real about our perception of reality in an attempt to satisfy our insatiable egos, and at worst we use this belief to justify truly dispicable acts, also in an attempt to satiate the ego. We all know the story.
UFO Disclosure is another example. Why UFO Disclosure? Well, at bottom, it's pretty much the same thing as religion. No proof, and evidence that's either lacking, or of a nature that can be explained without evoking the paranormal. What of personal experiences of the type Biedny and others talk about? Well, sure they can be real experiences to them, that doesn't mean that what they're experiencing is real and, again, can't be explained without insisting on the paranormal. All that's needed is to take a distanced view, look upon the 'phenomenon' from a logical and non-emotive outside perspective and you'll see how easy it is to realise the potential for exploitation of the unconscious and the innocent with a few compelling and wonderful stories about flying discs, captured aliens, back-engineering suppressed extravagant technologies...
The beautiful and tragic thing about us humans is that even if you assume that all the Disclosure claims are real and that it would lead to a revolutionary change to our existence and understanding of reality, bringing possible benefits and/or dangers, we still can't escape our own conscious minds and the inherent limits on our perceptions, and will be forever at risk of being again at the mercy of manipulation by others. With this in mind, and assuming the reality of Disclosure, how could we be certain that we aren't willing victims ourselves, i.e. being manipulated by something we'll never be conscious of?
This is why I have fundamental problems with the claims of Disclosure, and paranormal claims in general, whoever makes them.
Inherent and inescapable to the human mind is it's limitations in perception. We cannot think the unthinkable. Emprically, we have no way of being absolutely certain that the whole of existence as it appears to us isn't, for example, some kind of simulation created last week, with all our experiences and indeed all of history built into the program. Our individual and collective subjective conscious can never observe an objective reality, since our perceptions are of a limited and finite nature. This is a well known and understood part of the human condition, and points to various underlying truths about ourselves, our consciousness and what we can say about existence.
Why am I saying this? Well, this understanding of ourselves is used to intentionally exploit an awful lot of people. Religion and a belief in a loving and caring God is an example. As we all know, there is no proof or evidence for the biblical God's existence, but we have to believe anyway, we have to have faith. Whether we're consciously aware of it or not, at best we pretend to ourselves something to be real about our perception of reality in an attempt to satisfy our insatiable egos, and at worst we use this belief to justify truly dispicable acts, also in an attempt to satiate the ego. We all know the story.
UFO Disclosure is another example. Why UFO Disclosure? Well, at bottom, it's pretty much the same thing as religion. No proof, and evidence that's either lacking, or of a nature that can be explained without evoking the paranormal. What of personal experiences of the type Biedny and others talk about? Well, sure they can be real experiences to them, that doesn't mean that what they're experiencing is real and, again, can't be explained without insisting on the paranormal. All that's needed is to take a distanced view, look upon the 'phenomenon' from a logical and non-emotive outside perspective and you'll see how easy it is to realise the potential for exploitation of the unconscious and the innocent with a few compelling and wonderful stories about flying discs, captured aliens, back-engineering suppressed extravagant technologies...
The beautiful and tragic thing about us humans is that even if you assume that all the Disclosure claims are real and that it would lead to a revolutionary change to our existence and understanding of reality, bringing possible benefits and/or dangers, we still can't escape our own conscious minds and the inherent limits on our perceptions, and will be forever at risk of being again at the mercy of manipulation by others. With this in mind, and assuming the reality of Disclosure, how could we be certain that we aren't willing victims ourselves, i.e. being manipulated by something we'll never be conscious of?
This is why I have fundamental problems with the claims of Disclosure, and paranormal claims in general, whoever makes them.
Chuckleberryfinn
Paranormal Maven
How well he encapsulates the whole of existence, with special attention to the human condition, in a few shoddy paragraphs on an internet message forum. You, sir, are the great philosopher of our era.
Still, perhaps you should take some time away from writing in that general, state-of-the-union type of way. Why not evidence your claims by focusing on specific cases? Here, I'll give you some cases to use for your analysis.
1) The Allagash Abductions. Here is a good personal experiences case. I am sure you can explain in a logical and non-emotive manner how these men deluded their experience out of their own minds.
2) The 1976 Iran military sighting
3) The 1986 Japan Airlines sighting
This short list should keep your analysis focused, Mr. Genius. Also, I notice that you already use fantastic big words. How about this time trying to use at least 5 big words per sentence with at least 9 letters each? This will help make your argument stronger. Also, start your first paragraph with something big, general, and epic, like "throughout the history of known human civilization," or "several hundred centuries before the dawn of prehistory." Take care to use the phrase "diametrically opposed" as often as possible, also supplement "inherent and inescapable to the human mind" (a handsome phrase) with other extravagant things like "the fundamental and foundational paradox of the human experience." Also, throw in some bastard step child ideas that most people here don't believe in, such as the supression of back engineered ET technology and the like. This is a good scare crow and it will hit home with other genius skeptics like Penn Jilette and Bill Nye.
Still, perhaps you should take some time away from writing in that general, state-of-the-union type of way. Why not evidence your claims by focusing on specific cases? Here, I'll give you some cases to use for your analysis.
1) The Allagash Abductions. Here is a good personal experiences case. I am sure you can explain in a logical and non-emotive manner how these men deluded their experience out of their own minds.
2) The 1976 Iran military sighting
3) The 1986 Japan Airlines sighting
This short list should keep your analysis focused, Mr. Genius. Also, I notice that you already use fantastic big words. How about this time trying to use at least 5 big words per sentence with at least 9 letters each? This will help make your argument stronger. Also, start your first paragraph with something big, general, and epic, like "throughout the history of known human civilization," or "several hundred centuries before the dawn of prehistory." Take care to use the phrase "diametrically opposed" as often as possible, also supplement "inherent and inescapable to the human mind" (a handsome phrase) with other extravagant things like "the fundamental and foundational paradox of the human experience." Also, throw in some bastard step child ideas that most people here don't believe in, such as the supression of back engineered ET technology and the like. This is a good scare crow and it will hit home with other genius skeptics like Penn Jilette and Bill Nye.
Blacknight
Seeker
Chuckleberryfinn, is there some personal animosity between you and Rob? I was really put off by the tone of your note and definitely by the content. And why did David Biedny "thank you"?
I never understood why message boards almost always seem to sooner or later lapse into attacks on persons and personalities. On the face of it Rob simply articulated an opinion, pretty well, it seems, and you took him to task in a very personal and nasty manner. What am I missing here? Since when did expressing a different opinion become a free pass to attack? And then we'll hear more dogma about the need to consider alternative possibilities to ever find "an answer". I guess that's only true when the alternatives pass through some process of prior acceptability. And why on earth would David ever endorse, even implicitly, such a posting, and likely encourage more of the same?
I never understood why message boards almost always seem to sooner or later lapse into attacks on persons and personalities. On the face of it Rob simply articulated an opinion, pretty well, it seems, and you took him to task in a very personal and nasty manner. What am I missing here? Since when did expressing a different opinion become a free pass to attack? And then we'll hear more dogma about the need to consider alternative possibilities to ever find "an answer". I guess that's only true when the alternatives pass through some process of prior acceptability. And why on earth would David ever endorse, even implicitly, such a posting, and likely encourage more of the same?