Angel of Ioren
Friendly Skeptic
Happy to make you smile.
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July 4, 2010 Episode - Walter Bosley
- Thread starter Angel of Ioren
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Happy to make you smile.
trainedobserver
Paranormally Disenchanted
You forgot goat entrails (ok ...you had divination through tea leaves), superstition, magical thinking, baseless assumptions, dreams, drug induced altered states, hearsay, and revealed knowledge. Those are apparently the accepted alternatives to the scientific method, reason, logic, and common sense and the favorites of witch doctors, religious hucksters, snake oil salesmen, confidence men, and politicians since we fell out of the trees.
Lauren Jones
Skilled Investigator
My favorite part of the episode other than Walter Bosley's lecturing was the following quote around 54:57 regarding his "beyond top secret" clearance...
walterbosleybeyondtopsecret - walter bosley on the paracast.
walterbosleybeyondtopsecret - walter bosley on the paracast.
Ron Collins
Curiously Confused
It's the biggest fallacy out there. Hell an electrician wiring a light switch in a sensitive area(say Groom Lake for instance) may have a top secret clearance. Doesn't mean they let him in on Presidential briefings. We need to all understand that possessing a clearance of any kind only means you have been vetted as trustworthy enough to do your job and not go blabbing about it all over town. The concept of compartmentalization of sensitive material seems to be lost on some people.
Lauren Jones
Skilled Investigator
I also agree that Gene's interviewing style in this episode really kept the show moving. Great job.
grannysmith
Skilled Investigator
In brief : I sympathised with Walter's views in the discussion on the forum about the uses and abuses of scientific method but the manner in which he 'addressed' the debate on the show made him come across as simply intolerant of disagreement and rational inquiry.
remember
Para-Realist
I can't express enough disappointment in 1. allowing this fraud and liar to speak on the show and 2. allowing this fraud and liar to speak on the show AGAIN!
I've been a listener of the Paracast since episode 1. In that time I think I've learned to detect BS pretty fast. A lot of that ability CAME in part from listening to the Paracast and it's approach to this subject.
So point blank - this guy is full of sh*t... and it's obvious.
And what's worse... he's a BAD liar.
It has been an insult to every discerning listener of the show BOTH times he has been on.
Good luck with your upcoming syndication of the show.
If you want to be taken seriously, please keep the focus on people who aren't full of sh*t.
If you want big ratings and you want to further pollute the pool, keep the liars coming!
Your call.
I've been a listener of the Paracast since episode 1. In that time I think I've learned to detect BS pretty fast. A lot of that ability CAME in part from listening to the Paracast and it's approach to this subject.
So point blank - this guy is full of sh*t... and it's obvious.
And what's worse... he's a BAD liar.
It has been an insult to every discerning listener of the show BOTH times he has been on.
Good luck with your upcoming syndication of the show.
If you want to be taken seriously, please keep the focus on people who aren't full of sh*t.
If you want big ratings and you want to further pollute the pool, keep the liars coming!
Your call.
I think you're going overboard here. We all have our BS detectors in place, and Greg Bishop has determined that Bosley has the professional credentials he claims to have. You can certainly look for other explanations to his experiences, if you wish. But saying he's full of it is going way too far.
As to the network. It's a distribution deal, period. We aren't changing the show's content. It'll be a tad more rigid in terms of the flow of discussion as we have fixed network commercial breaks. But that's normal.
As to the network. It's a distribution deal, period. We aren't changing the show's content. It'll be a tad more rigid in terms of the flow of discussion as we have fixed network commercial breaks. But that's normal.
trainedobserver
Paranormally Disenchanted
Not to cast doubt on anyone's claims here but funny you should say that. Over the years I have worked with numerous individuals with various different types of security clearances (something I have never had to have b.t.w.) Even after working side by side with the guys for years and becoming close friends with many all I ever got out of them when asked about the activities and projects those clearances covered were grunts and pained looks. They were even reluctant to even admit to having clearances most of the time. One fellow who served aboard a nuclear submarine made it clear to me (in the most polite and strained manner) that he could not and would not ever discuss anything whatsoever about it, even refusing to name the submarine. After a while I just got to where I'd grunt and looked pained back at them in sympathy because given what we were doing in the public sector, I knew they had to have worked on some damn interesting stuff that they would have loved to talk about (engineers and technicians being how they are). One of the closest friends I've had in my life finally took me aside and said, "Goddammit Rick, I still stand to be interviewed and questioned on a regular basis about that work, anything I say most definitely will come out in the interview, so cut me some slack will ya?" I stopped asking stupid questions ...or uh at least stupid questions about that sort of thing after that. In my experience, those boys don't talk about that business. Your mileage may vary.
Captain Bosley: By the way did I mention that since 1988 I've had a TOP SECRET Clearance......(Long pause).......... Beyond...... (Another long pause) top secret.
Civillian: Errr..... shouldn't that be secret???
Seriously though his "I hate agnostics" rant.... Errr.... except Greg Bishop, (coz he's different) was highly amusing.
trainedobserver
Paranormally Disenchanted
Now you guys are just being mean. That's not necessary ...
Angel of Ioren
Friendly Skeptic
Although I don't see eye to eye with Mr. Bosley, I would prefer if you guys didn't make fun of him because I do want him to respond. I don't want this thread to devolve into that.
It also means closed threads and bans. Can't you skeptics be civil and just ask your questions -- nicely?
Michael Allen
Paranormal Adept
Walter Bosley seems to lump all paranormal into one bucket. Also, he exhibited a Lazar-ian cavalier attitude about credibility and evidence--inserting some ontological foundation statements regarding subjective experience. I could almost hear Gene "chomping at the bit" when Bosley brushed off a challenge to Hoagland's credibility by stating, in effect, that one "kook" is as "good as the next" (paraphrase)--as if all claims concerning the "paranormal" were by nature born "kooky." At the end of the interview he became more or less agreeable to other alternatives while (quite elegantly) holding on to his own view.
I do agree with Bosley on the importance of personal identification transparency--and I also liked the "soccer game" analogy applied to those who hated the topic and yet continued to engage others in open forum.
Which is why Bosley will forgive me for drawing parallels between his presentation style and that of Lazar's
I do agree with Bosley on the importance of personal identification transparency--and I also liked the "soccer game" analogy applied to those who hated the topic and yet continued to engage others in open forum.
Which is why Bosley will forgive me for drawing parallels between his presentation style and that of Lazar's
trainedobserver
Paranormally Disenchanted
Like Gene has pointed out, Greg B. vouches for him. I don't have any reason to doubt his background.
Look I really don't see any problem with this. It's all in jest and should to be taken too seriously. If Walter is offended then I apologise.
I see it like this
Everyone is entitled to their own BS detector system, whether that involves logic or not. Walter (As ex FBI, Air Force) should understand this as he even said he stopped questioning events and started taking things for how they appear to him. Which infers he used to question occurences.
This is a paranormal chat show, listeners include believers, sceptics and agnostics whether Walter likes it or not we are his audience, when he writes his next (paranormal) book people from each camp will buy it for a read and ask questions and discuss... Thats what this industry is based on.
I see it like this
- Walter came on the Show May 30th, made some pretty wild statements.
- On the show Walter claimed he "didn't care" if people believed him or not.
- Understandably there was a reaction to his claims in the forums which created a discussion
- Walter kindly visited the forums and people asked questions
- It was promply made clear if you want to question Walter with logic, then he's not interested.
- Watler appears on the show July 4th alludes to a few more wild claims and then on air takes a shot at "logic lovers", Agnostics and any one else who wanted to explore his claims. (Except Greg)
Everyone is entitled to their own BS detector system, whether that involves logic or not. Walter (As ex FBI, Air Force) should understand this as he even said he stopped questioning events and started taking things for how they appear to him. Which infers he used to question occurences.
This is a paranormal chat show, listeners include believers, sceptics and agnostics whether Walter likes it or not we are his audience, when he writes his next (paranormal) book people from each camp will buy it for a read and ask questions and discuss... Thats what this industry is based on.
Ron Collins
Curiously Confused
All we have to do is be civil and it wont come to that. However you feel about his story, he should be treated with a measure of respect. It is too easy to be rude on the internet. This forum should and does hold its members to a higher standard.
While scrolling thru this msg. base I saw some very nasty ad hominem type attacks with a forum member that for just a second made me think Phil Klass was back from the dead. What bull shit.
For what it is worth I have had Walter Bosley on DMR and have spent some time with him. He showed me his credentials. Ask me if I think he was counter intel. with the FBI. Okay, he was. As me if he was AFOSI. Yes again. Now having had Walter on my show much of what Walter spoke about was his reaction to things that have happened in his life. One thing I saw was someone here calling him a liar. Well, had that happened in the Dark Matters Radio forum I would have given the user in question one day to either show ME how Walter Bosley lied or for the user to tell Walter and the forum he was sorry or I would have tossed the guy. This is The Paracast damn it, not the Open Minds Forum. If you disagree with his conclusions .. fine. If not debate the guy using your logic. But this ad hominem shit is just that ... shit.
As far as Walter's comments about using names... well you all know my name, you know Gene's name, you know Paul Kimball's name and Chris O'Briens name ... and Walter Bosley's name. If some anonymous clown using only a screen name called me a liar on a public forum ... my gut reaction would be to want to have him tell me to my face. Then I would handle it there. Wouldn't you?
Decker
Don Ecker
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For what it is worth I have had Walter Bosley on DMR and have spent some time with him. He showed me his credentials. Ask me if I think he was counter intel. with the FBI. Okay, he was. As me if he was AFOSI. Yes again. Now having had Walter on my show much of what Walter spoke about was his reaction to things that have happened in his life. One thing I saw was someone here calling him a liar. Well, had that happened in the Dark Matters Radio forum I would have given the user in question one day to either show ME how Walter Bosley lied or for the user to tell Walter and the forum he was sorry or I would have tossed the guy. This is The Paracast damn it, not the Open Minds Forum. If you disagree with his conclusions .. fine. If not debate the guy using your logic. But this ad hominem shit is just that ... shit.
As far as Walter's comments about using names... well you all know my name, you know Gene's name, you know Paul Kimball's name and Chris O'Briens name ... and Walter Bosley's name. If some anonymous clown using only a screen name called me a liar on a public forum ... my gut reaction would be to want to have him tell me to my face. Then I would handle it there. Wouldn't you?
Decker
Don Ecker
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Okay Pal, lets ask Greg Bishop .... Greg! Do You Think Walter Bosley is Lying?? Come on Greg, Inquiring Minds Want to Know!
Decker
PS So Lance, when Greg Bishop answers ... And IF he says No, he doesn't think Walter is Lying, are you going to give apologies to Walter Bishop? If not, CAN YOU PROVE HE LIED?
Decker
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