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Paul Kimball
Guest
Now folks, let's keep it civil... I would hate to have to use my new moderator powers.
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Mossad did 9/11. Period.
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pixelsmith
Guest
you get paid to be here don't you?
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pixelsmith
Guest
Popular Mechanics?!?! LMAO!!! a Hearst Corporation rag. nuff said there.
there is NO WAY a cold office fire can "sit and cook for weeks" and go from 700 degrees to 2800 degrees. AND btw- molten IRON is not HARDENED STRUCTURAL STEEL.
thanks anyway!
there is NO WAY a cold office fire can "sit and cook for weeks" and go from 700 degrees to 2800 degrees. AND btw- molten IRON is not HARDENED STRUCTURAL STEEL.
thanks anyway!
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Paul Kimball
Guest
And your peer reviewed scientific analysis that supports this statement can be found where?
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pixelsmith
Guest
I will have to go back and find that information. I will post it as soon as I find it.
---------- Post added at 06:36 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:32 PM ----------
yea... well most of the fuel exploded outside the towers. jet fuel burns up very quickly and it is not all that hot. ever see a camp stove melt? the fuel is basically the same.
building 7 was NOT hit by any aircraft yet molten metal was found in that basement also. when you guys have actually worked with heating various metals and forge welding steel you may understand the impossibility of the official story.
---------- Post added at 06:36 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:32 PM ----------
yea... well most of the fuel exploded outside the towers. jet fuel burns up very quickly and it is not all that hot. ever see a camp stove melt? the fuel is basically the same.
building 7 was NOT hit by any aircraft yet molten metal was found in that basement also. when you guys have actually worked with heating various metals and forge welding steel you may understand the impossibility of the official story.
Xylo
Paranormal Adept
Thank you.
Before we call it "molten steel" or even think that the molten metal was still molten when it was found we need to have evidence. There was ZERO credible evidence that the metal was still liquid when it was found, nor evidence as to the composition of the metal itself.
As far as temperatures in an office fire...or a structural fire go...I found an interesting page:
http://www.tcforensic.com.au/docs/article10.html#2.1.2
So yes, the temperature may have been only 700* F but at times it could have been as high as 1300* in some parts.
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pixelsmith
Guest
1300 is not hot enough to melt steel or keep it molten for a few weeks. there is plenty of video, photo and eye witness evidence of molten metal.
Xylo
Paranormal Adept
But no tests to prove conclusively what type of metal it was... Molten lead and molten steel look the same to the layman.
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pixelsmith
Guest
"I saw melting of girders in World Trade Center." -Structural Engineer Abolhassan Astaneh pbs.org audio_pbs.org
"I talked to many contractors and they said they actually saw molten metal trapped, beams had just totally had been melted because of the heat." -Chaplain Herb Trimpe recordonline.com audio
Peter Tully, president of Tully Construction of Flushing, N.Y., told AFP that he saw pools of “literally molten steel” at the World Trade Center. americanfreepress.net
Source publication date: 09/03/2002
Witness: Peter Tully
Date molten metal was observed: "more than a month after the collapse" up to 10/11/01
A NY firefighter described steel flowing at ground zero. "You'd get down below and you'd see molten steel — molten steel! — running down the channel rails. Like you're in a foundry... like lava... from a volcano. video source
A reporter with rare access to the debris at ground zero "descended deep below street level to areas where underground fires still burned and steel flowed in molten streams." theatlantic.com cached_copy
Source publication date: July/August 2002 Atlantic Monthly
The owner of Controlled Demolition Inc., Mark Loizeaux stated the molten steel was found “three, four, and five weeks later, when the rubble was being removed,”. He said molten steel was also found at 7 WTC, which collapsed mysteriously in the late afternoon. americanfreepress.net
Fires burned and molten steel flowed in the pile of ruins still settling beneath her feet. -Sarah Atlas of New Jersey’s Task Force One Urban Search and Rescue upenn.edu
"Fires are still actively burning and the smoke is very intense," reports Alison Geyh, PhD. "In some pockets now being uncovered, they are finding molten steel." jhsph.edu
A veteran of disasters from the Mississippi floods Mt. St. Helens, Burger said it reminded him most of the volcano, if he forgot he was in downtown Manhattan. “Feeling the heat, seeing the molten steel, the layers upon layers of ash, like lava, it reminded me of Mt. St. Helen’s and the thousands who fled that disaster,” he said. Additionally he stated "Shards of steel lay upon shards of steel, shifting and unstable, uncovering red hot metal beams excavated from deep beneath layers of sub-floors, exposing further dark crevasses." neha.org
"They showed us many fascinating slides" he continued, "ranging from molten metal which was still red hot weeks after the event, to 4-inch thick steel plates sheared and bent in the disaster." -Dr Keith Eaton istructe.org.uk
"Smoke constantly poured from the peaks. One fireman told us that there was still molten steel at the heart of the towers' remains. Firemen sprayed water to cool the debris down but the heat remained intense enough at the surface to melt their boots." -Guy Lounsbury of New York Air National Guard's 109th Air Wing source
A NY Department of Sanitation spokeswoman said "for about two and a half months after the attacks, in addition to its regular duties, NYDS played a major role in debris removal - everything from molten steel beams to human remains...." wasteage.com
"the ominous groaning of weakened structures overhead, or, in the early days, the streams of molten metal that leaked from the hot cores and flowed down broken walls inside the foundation hole." -William Langewiesche source_p32 cached_copy
He remembers seeing in the darkness a distant, pinkish glow–molten metal dripping from a beam–but found no signs of life. -Lee Turner of The Boone County Firefighters usnews.com
“In the first few weeks, sometimes when a worker would pull a steel beam from the wreckage, the end of the beam would be dripping molten steel,” Fuchek said. gcn.com
As late as five months after the attacks, in February 2002, firefighter Joe O'Toole saw a steel beam being lifted from deep underground at Ground Zero, which, he says, "was dripping from the molten steel." fallenbrothers.comcached_copy
...numerous fires were still burning and smoldering. Underground it was still so hot that molten metal dripped down the sides of the wall from Building 6. 9-11commission.gov (2) (3)
Richard Garlock, a structural engineer for LERA said "Going below, it was smoky and really hot... The debris past the columns was red-hot, molten, running." pbs.org
Vance Deisingnore, OSHA Officer at WTC, reported the following to Jim McKay, Post-Gazette Staff Writer, on September 11, 2002 "a fire truck 10 feet below the ground that was still burning two weeks after the Tower collapsed, its metal so hot that it looked like a vat of molten steel." thenewliberator.com
Father Edward A. Malloy, on site 40 days after the disaster stated "Firefighters atop a number of ladder trucks were spraying in the areas of greatest smoke. The average temperature beneath the rubble is said to be 1500F so that when steel is brought up it is molten and takes two or three days to cool down." nd.edu
Ed Pfister, a veteran of three hurricanes and two flood relief efforts, and a member of the elite Disaster Medical Assistance Team, wrote in his diary "deep below ground a portion of the pile was still on fire and boiled with molten material. Sometimes, open flame would erupt as a crane pulled debris out and air rushed in. Fire hoses constantly poured streams of water causing huge billowing steam clouds to rise up over the site into the huge lights above." NIH.gov
Source publication date: 10/30/2001
Interviewer: Rich McManus
Guy Lounsbury with the 109th Air Wing of the New York Air National Guard wrote "The men who work on this must constantly change their boots as the heat melts them. Two weeks after the attack, one fireman told us that there was still molten steel at the heart of the towers’ remains." nycap.rr.com
A group of veteran ironworkers eating lunch while staring at the steel skeleton of a new building going up on West Third Street when one commented on "how much easier it was to eat a sandwich in front of steel that was strong and straight and new, not molten and mangled and laden with debris." nytimes.com
Fire Department Chief Mike Donoho of Texas Task Force 1 Urban Search and Rescue described the scope of the destruction, "Everything had its own look. In the area surrounding what was the two twin towers, there were several buildings still standing that were burned from top to bottom, and some of them were damaged by the collapse. But the two towers — they were 110-story buildings. And there was nothing that you could put your hands on that resembled anything that would tell you this once was two 110-story office buildings. What you had were large columns of steel that were just stuck into massive amounts of molten steel and other metals, that had just fused together from the heat and bonded together from the strength of the collapse. We dug and we dug and we dug, and we cut and we cut and we cut, and we did not see anything that resembled any type of furniture, any type of personal belongings. We found some pieces of things like a telephone, things like that. I think we found credit cards a few times, and we found a couple of stuffed animals. But you would expect to see, like, a bunch of desks, a bunch of chairs. The only way I can explain it is, if you take a car and put it in one of those machines where they crush it and make it look like a cube, and you can’t recognize what it is, that’s what the whole area looked like. It looked like a massive, molten mess that had been fused together, like a car that had been cubed and crushed. With all that heavy, heavy stuff, there were wires, rebar, concrete. Most of it was just steel. A lot of what we were walking on was just molten steel. theeagle.com
The workers go through three pairs of rubber boots a day because they melt in the three-week-old fire of molten metal and jet fuel. The health hazards are everywhere: the fire, molten metal, the lack of breathable air and 3000+ decomposing bodies. illusiongenius.com
Each story has its differences. Some told of 10-hour car drives and arriving in the black of night, the same calendar day as the towers were hit. Others remembered taking military transport - a C- 141 in Deeds' case - a few days later. Others remember molten metal still dripping under the Pile more than a week after the attack. source
"In mid-October, in the evening," said Thomas A. Cahill, a retired professor of physics and atmospheric science at the University of California, Davis, "when they would pull out a steel beam, the lower part would be glowing dull red, which indicates a temperature on the order of 500 to 600 °C. And we know that people were turning over pieces of concrete in December that would flash into fire - which requires about 300 °C. So the surface of the pile cooled rather rapidly, but the bulk of the pile stayed hot all the way to December." acs.org
Some beams pulled from the wreckage are still red hot more than 7 weeks after the attack, and it is suspected that temperatures beneath the debris pile are well in excess of 1,000°F. liro.com
Ferer was one of several people in a visiting United Services Organization (USO)-Tribeca group who had lost family members. As they visited troops, they carried Port Authority pins, baseball caps, and a piece of molten steel from the WTC. wiley.com
No matter when they went, the odor of molten steel, pulverized concrete and charred flesh burned their throats, lingering in their lungs. ecnext.com
etc etc etc... http://0x1a.com/#%5B%5BWorld%20Trade%20Center%20Hot%20Spots%5D%5D
"I talked to many contractors and they said they actually saw molten metal trapped, beams had just totally had been melted because of the heat." -Chaplain Herb Trimpe recordonline.com audio
Peter Tully, president of Tully Construction of Flushing, N.Y., told AFP that he saw pools of “literally molten steel” at the World Trade Center. americanfreepress.net
Source publication date: 09/03/2002
Witness: Peter Tully
Date molten metal was observed: "more than a month after the collapse" up to 10/11/01
A NY firefighter described steel flowing at ground zero. "You'd get down below and you'd see molten steel — molten steel! — running down the channel rails. Like you're in a foundry... like lava... from a volcano. video source
A reporter with rare access to the debris at ground zero "descended deep below street level to areas where underground fires still burned and steel flowed in molten streams." theatlantic.com cached_copy
Source publication date: July/August 2002 Atlantic Monthly
The owner of Controlled Demolition Inc., Mark Loizeaux stated the molten steel was found “three, four, and five weeks later, when the rubble was being removed,”. He said molten steel was also found at 7 WTC, which collapsed mysteriously in the late afternoon. americanfreepress.net
Fires burned and molten steel flowed in the pile of ruins still settling beneath her feet. -Sarah Atlas of New Jersey’s Task Force One Urban Search and Rescue upenn.edu
"Fires are still actively burning and the smoke is very intense," reports Alison Geyh, PhD. "In some pockets now being uncovered, they are finding molten steel." jhsph.edu
A veteran of disasters from the Mississippi floods Mt. St. Helens, Burger said it reminded him most of the volcano, if he forgot he was in downtown Manhattan. “Feeling the heat, seeing the molten steel, the layers upon layers of ash, like lava, it reminded me of Mt. St. Helen’s and the thousands who fled that disaster,” he said. Additionally he stated "Shards of steel lay upon shards of steel, shifting and unstable, uncovering red hot metal beams excavated from deep beneath layers of sub-floors, exposing further dark crevasses." neha.org
"They showed us many fascinating slides" he continued, "ranging from molten metal which was still red hot weeks after the event, to 4-inch thick steel plates sheared and bent in the disaster." -Dr Keith Eaton istructe.org.uk
"Smoke constantly poured from the peaks. One fireman told us that there was still molten steel at the heart of the towers' remains. Firemen sprayed water to cool the debris down but the heat remained intense enough at the surface to melt their boots." -Guy Lounsbury of New York Air National Guard's 109th Air Wing source
A NY Department of Sanitation spokeswoman said "for about two and a half months after the attacks, in addition to its regular duties, NYDS played a major role in debris removal - everything from molten steel beams to human remains...." wasteage.com
"the ominous groaning of weakened structures overhead, or, in the early days, the streams of molten metal that leaked from the hot cores and flowed down broken walls inside the foundation hole." -William Langewiesche source_p32 cached_copy
He remembers seeing in the darkness a distant, pinkish glow–molten metal dripping from a beam–but found no signs of life. -Lee Turner of The Boone County Firefighters usnews.com
“In the first few weeks, sometimes when a worker would pull a steel beam from the wreckage, the end of the beam would be dripping molten steel,” Fuchek said. gcn.com
As late as five months after the attacks, in February 2002, firefighter Joe O'Toole saw a steel beam being lifted from deep underground at Ground Zero, which, he says, "was dripping from the molten steel." fallenbrothers.comcached_copy
...numerous fires were still burning and smoldering. Underground it was still so hot that molten metal dripped down the sides of the wall from Building 6. 9-11commission.gov (2) (3)
Richard Garlock, a structural engineer for LERA said "Going below, it was smoky and really hot... The debris past the columns was red-hot, molten, running." pbs.org
Vance Deisingnore, OSHA Officer at WTC, reported the following to Jim McKay, Post-Gazette Staff Writer, on September 11, 2002 "a fire truck 10 feet below the ground that was still burning two weeks after the Tower collapsed, its metal so hot that it looked like a vat of molten steel." thenewliberator.com
Father Edward A. Malloy, on site 40 days after the disaster stated "Firefighters atop a number of ladder trucks were spraying in the areas of greatest smoke. The average temperature beneath the rubble is said to be 1500F so that when steel is brought up it is molten and takes two or three days to cool down." nd.edu
Ed Pfister, a veteran of three hurricanes and two flood relief efforts, and a member of the elite Disaster Medical Assistance Team, wrote in his diary "deep below ground a portion of the pile was still on fire and boiled with molten material. Sometimes, open flame would erupt as a crane pulled debris out and air rushed in. Fire hoses constantly poured streams of water causing huge billowing steam clouds to rise up over the site into the huge lights above." NIH.gov
Source publication date: 10/30/2001
Interviewer: Rich McManus
Guy Lounsbury with the 109th Air Wing of the New York Air National Guard wrote "The men who work on this must constantly change their boots as the heat melts them. Two weeks after the attack, one fireman told us that there was still molten steel at the heart of the towers’ remains." nycap.rr.com
A group of veteran ironworkers eating lunch while staring at the steel skeleton of a new building going up on West Third Street when one commented on "how much easier it was to eat a sandwich in front of steel that was strong and straight and new, not molten and mangled and laden with debris." nytimes.com
Fire Department Chief Mike Donoho of Texas Task Force 1 Urban Search and Rescue described the scope of the destruction, "Everything had its own look. In the area surrounding what was the two twin towers, there were several buildings still standing that were burned from top to bottom, and some of them were damaged by the collapse. But the two towers — they were 110-story buildings. And there was nothing that you could put your hands on that resembled anything that would tell you this once was two 110-story office buildings. What you had were large columns of steel that were just stuck into massive amounts of molten steel and other metals, that had just fused together from the heat and bonded together from the strength of the collapse. We dug and we dug and we dug, and we cut and we cut and we cut, and we did not see anything that resembled any type of furniture, any type of personal belongings. We found some pieces of things like a telephone, things like that. I think we found credit cards a few times, and we found a couple of stuffed animals. But you would expect to see, like, a bunch of desks, a bunch of chairs. The only way I can explain it is, if you take a car and put it in one of those machines where they crush it and make it look like a cube, and you can’t recognize what it is, that’s what the whole area looked like. It looked like a massive, molten mess that had been fused together, like a car that had been cubed and crushed. With all that heavy, heavy stuff, there were wires, rebar, concrete. Most of it was just steel. A lot of what we were walking on was just molten steel. theeagle.com
The workers go through three pairs of rubber boots a day because they melt in the three-week-old fire of molten metal and jet fuel. The health hazards are everywhere: the fire, molten metal, the lack of breathable air and 3000+ decomposing bodies. illusiongenius.com
Each story has its differences. Some told of 10-hour car drives and arriving in the black of night, the same calendar day as the towers were hit. Others remembered taking military transport - a C- 141 in Deeds' case - a few days later. Others remember molten metal still dripping under the Pile more than a week after the attack. source
"In mid-October, in the evening," said Thomas A. Cahill, a retired professor of physics and atmospheric science at the University of California, Davis, "when they would pull out a steel beam, the lower part would be glowing dull red, which indicates a temperature on the order of 500 to 600 °C. And we know that people were turning over pieces of concrete in December that would flash into fire - which requires about 300 °C. So the surface of the pile cooled rather rapidly, but the bulk of the pile stayed hot all the way to December." acs.org
Some beams pulled from the wreckage are still red hot more than 7 weeks after the attack, and it is suspected that temperatures beneath the debris pile are well in excess of 1,000°F. liro.com
Ferer was one of several people in a visiting United Services Organization (USO)-Tribeca group who had lost family members. As they visited troops, they carried Port Authority pins, baseball caps, and a piece of molten steel from the WTC. wiley.com
No matter when they went, the odor of molten steel, pulverized concrete and charred flesh burned their throats, lingering in their lungs. ecnext.com
etc etc etc... http://0x1a.com/#%5B%5BWorld%20Trade%20Center%20Hot%20Spots%5D%5D
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pixelsmith
Guest
you would have to prove it to me. again.. Nat Geo?!?
Xylo
Paranormal Adept
All of that and not a single scientist took a sample to see what the metal was? Now that's laughable. I would think that you'd provide a link to that test as well. Like I said, molten lead looks the same to the average layman as molten steel does.
(And I'm one of the ones that thinks the official story is fishy...)
(And I'm one of the ones that thinks the official story is fishy...)
Jose Collado
Skilled Investigator
I guess I don't get paid enough to put up with so much conspiracy bile.
Here's an example of something that can melt steel at 2500°C
Aluminium powder (found in Etch-A-Sketches) + Iron Oxide (available pretty much anywhere) + a flame = thermite
Fe2O3 + 2Al → 2Fe + Al2O3 + heat
Now I'm not saying this is what happened. In fact, it's unlikely...but I'm just giving you an example of what can melt steel at 2500°C. So, maybe the planes were carrying crate loads of Etch-A-Sketch boxes? That's just me speculating and making assumptions. See, when you speculate and make assumptions, it's always nice to let people know.
The truthers are anything but. They should change the name of their movement to "The Speculators" or the PIA (Paranoid Ignorant Alarmists).
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pixelsmith
Guest
anecdotal video and photos... interesting.
Jose Collado
Skilled Investigator
The conspiracy nuts continue crawling out of the woodwork.
Kuzza
Paranormal Novice
Jose there is nothing wrong with seeking the truth.
What is wrong is criticizing people who want answers to things they don't feel make sense.
I think we still have to ask the question of how these buildings came down at free fall speed as we all saw. It is impossible for a 110 story building to come down and end up in a neat pile of rubble unless some sort of controlled demolition was used.
Even if the heat did reach temps that could melt steel, these temps would have only been reached at the point of impact. What about the other 100 floors?
If they came down because of the pancake theory like we are told in the official story, they don't come down at free fall speed.
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pixelsmith
Guest
and if you go by Popular Mechanics "pancake theory" the central core columns would be standing in the middle. a huge core column can NOT collapse within itself.
Kieran
Paranormal Adept
I've little time for believing in a wider conspiracy, because millions upon millions of people saw the events unfold live on TV after the initial attacks. The evidence is conclusive, Four planes were hijacked. There was a large number of passengers on board each plane and everyone of them died on that faithful day. The existence of these planes and passengers can not be refuted. There families for most part verified later that they were passengers.
And before anyway can fly; you'd have to check in at your particular Airline desk before boarding, therefore, the names and addresses of the people who lost there lives, would've have been on computer/ contained within a file as having checked in. Unless people are of the believe the FAA doctored the records. There is no doubt in my mind based on the evidence that three planes crashed into the three buildings.
There is a conspiracy, that is doing the rounds, that the Twin Towers were brought down by Demolition charges. I can't see, how that would work considering both Towers Fell from top to Bottom. There is no known explosive anywhere in the World, that would be able to resist such a fire, the heat and burning that was happening inside the top floors of the Twin towers.
These Demolition charges just for argument sake; Ok, they were somehow planted before the attacks. In my mind, if this happened, the planted Demolition charges would have gone of prematurely or become useless once this fire took hold and reached a certain temperature. The wiring or any electronic items that was used to trigger the explosives wouldn't last long once the fire got near it.
Everyone saw how engulfed those top floors of the towers were with fire and smoke, and for people, to even entertain such a believe that someone could trigger off Demolitions in that kind of environment. Well i got to say your potty.
I don't want to continue writing all day about what i think happened and why i differ to people like Pixel. But last point is to do with the Pentagon attacks. A plane crashed into the Pentagon that is what happened based on the evidence that i have seen
There was several eyewitnesses who saw an American Airlines plane crash into the Pentagon. How do i know this? Because, i watched archived TV news videos of September 11 2001, that can be watched on the Internet. There was several people, who were eyewitnesses, and they were live on air telling what they saw.
Five said they saw a American Airlines fly over the heads, and they'll all were wondering, why was this plane flying so low. Not long, a minute or so later, a large puff of smoke was seen rising into the air a short distance away Two of the other eyewitnesses who were closer to the Pentagon, saw the plane pick up speed and aim straight for the Pentagon. All of these eyewitnesses went on air with there real names and two of the eyewitnesses, gave their professional background.
A Missile having crashed into the pentagon doesn't hold water for me. There is no evidence other then a plane having hit the Pentagon. Metal pieces that were marked with the the colours of an American Airlines plane were strewn all over the lawn at the pentagon. There is evidence/photographs which clearly show's this and these are genuine photos taken by reporters or eyewitnesses. Evidence of a Airplane having crashed into the Pentagon was further established when parts from a Boeing engine were found within the debris.
Why is there only a small hole and were is the rest of the plane?
Well Guys and Girls; has everyone forgotten what happened to the planes when they crashed into the Twin towers. The plane went in one end and never came out the other end. The second plane that i saw when it hit the second tower only created a small hole, but the fire eventually engulfed other floors and it appeared to be large impact then it actually was. The Pentagon walls were made of stronger stuff so the fire didn't take a hold as did with the Twin towers.
If there is a larger conspiracy here. And i guess it is plausible. That certain intelligence agencies knew what the terrorists were up and were keeping track and watching these individuals up to the time of the hijackings. But were told by whomever to let it happen. I haven't seen any evidence for this having happened or any other scenario like it. So what is the point in discussing it really?
And before anyway can fly; you'd have to check in at your particular Airline desk before boarding, therefore, the names and addresses of the people who lost there lives, would've have been on computer/ contained within a file as having checked in. Unless people are of the believe the FAA doctored the records. There is no doubt in my mind based on the evidence that three planes crashed into the three buildings.
There is a conspiracy, that is doing the rounds, that the Twin Towers were brought down by Demolition charges. I can't see, how that would work considering both Towers Fell from top to Bottom. There is no known explosive anywhere in the World, that would be able to resist such a fire, the heat and burning that was happening inside the top floors of the Twin towers.
These Demolition charges just for argument sake; Ok, they were somehow planted before the attacks. In my mind, if this happened, the planted Demolition charges would have gone of prematurely or become useless once this fire took hold and reached a certain temperature. The wiring or any electronic items that was used to trigger the explosives wouldn't last long once the fire got near it.
Everyone saw how engulfed those top floors of the towers were with fire and smoke, and for people, to even entertain such a believe that someone could trigger off Demolitions in that kind of environment. Well i got to say your potty.
I don't want to continue writing all day about what i think happened and why i differ to people like Pixel. But last point is to do with the Pentagon attacks. A plane crashed into the Pentagon that is what happened based on the evidence that i have seen
There was several eyewitnesses who saw an American Airlines plane crash into the Pentagon. How do i know this? Because, i watched archived TV news videos of September 11 2001, that can be watched on the Internet. There was several people, who were eyewitnesses, and they were live on air telling what they saw.
Five said they saw a American Airlines fly over the heads, and they'll all were wondering, why was this plane flying so low. Not long, a minute or so later, a large puff of smoke was seen rising into the air a short distance away Two of the other eyewitnesses who were closer to the Pentagon, saw the plane pick up speed and aim straight for the Pentagon. All of these eyewitnesses went on air with there real names and two of the eyewitnesses, gave their professional background.
A Missile having crashed into the pentagon doesn't hold water for me. There is no evidence other then a plane having hit the Pentagon. Metal pieces that were marked with the the colours of an American Airlines plane were strewn all over the lawn at the pentagon. There is evidence/photographs which clearly show's this and these are genuine photos taken by reporters or eyewitnesses. Evidence of a Airplane having crashed into the Pentagon was further established when parts from a Boeing engine were found within the debris.
Why is there only a small hole and were is the rest of the plane?
Well Guys and Girls; has everyone forgotten what happened to the planes when they crashed into the Twin towers. The plane went in one end and never came out the other end. The second plane that i saw when it hit the second tower only created a small hole, but the fire eventually engulfed other floors and it appeared to be large impact then it actually was. The Pentagon walls were made of stronger stuff so the fire didn't take a hold as did with the Twin towers.
If there is a larger conspiracy here. And i guess it is plausible. That certain intelligence agencies knew what the terrorists were up and were keeping track and watching these individuals up to the time of the hijackings. But were told by whomever to let it happen. I haven't seen any evidence for this having happened or any other scenario like it. So what is the point in discussing it really?
paraschtick
Paragilmorian guy
Well like I said you can't tell people the truth even when it is staring them in the face. And those who really did 9/11 will continue to get away with what they have until these people finally wake up.
[Tell me how a passport can emerge unscathed from plane fuel fires, and the annihilation of two very large iron and concrete structures in which everything else was turned to dust ... and I may think that the government (run by GEORGE W BUSH) was right.]
[Tell me how a passport can emerge unscathed from plane fuel fires, and the annihilation of two very large iron and concrete structures in which everything else was turned to dust ... and I may think that the government (run by GEORGE W BUSH) was right.]
Jose Collado
Skilled Investigator
Yes, the truth. Truth is a very gray area it seems. Truth varies on opinion and vantage point. I just wonder if those in search of the "truth" are actually going to accept it if it doesn't meet their standards. Those who are indeed seeking the "truth" should be willing to accept it regardless of what the "truth" is. Problem is, conspiracy theorists have already made up their minds. So, I highly doubt "truth" is what they're after.
That's your opinion and it's based on an assumption. Do you have some substantial, credible references to back that assumption? As far as I'm concerned, considering no airliner has ever hit a building of that scale, you have nothing to use as a reference.
Another assumption. The point of impact is the trigger. That's all. I light a BBQ full of coals and the trigger temperature is quite mild in comparison to the temperature 4 hours later.
Keyword "theory".
Now having said that, I rarely participate in conversations revolving around 9/11 for many reasons. The main reason is no one knows exactly why this happened or the specifics surrounding the events. It's speculation. Nothing more, nothing less. There is no one on here who can honestly say they know for a fact what happened and why.
There are way too many people who sit dorment awaiting a thread about 9/11 so they can exercise their ability to participate in conversations negatively. I suggest these people, namely the truthers, just shut the fuck up. Their activity in these conversations soils the memory of the victims.
It's frustrating to see the truthers are also the very same idiots that believe in FEMA death camps. NWO, Illuminati, Chemtrails, the dangers of fluoridation in our water etc etc etc. These people are a fine example of failure in logic.
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