We are arguing over nonsense.
I'm not cool with calling someone worthless.
I'm not cool with calling someone worthless.
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October 18, 2015 — Dr. David Jacobs
- Thread starter Gene Steinberg
- Start date
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Creepy Green Light
Paranormal Adept
Would you say the same for Billy Meier or Stan Romanek?
Apocalypto
Paranormal Maven
Well, Gene that's interesting but you don't pipe up and say anything! Instead you go after me for making what I found to be a rather softball comment about Jacobs' doctorate.
Okay then, that's it. Done. I'm cancelling my subscription to the Paracast Plus.
Mr. Fibuli
Paranormal Adept
I think Gene is one seriously cool dude. If he chopped people off for one throwaway comment it wouldn't help. The guys from the show do so much for the Paracasr community, I think they deserve a little slack. I am mostly a cheerleader/morale builder for the community rather than an investigator.
I have made it my goal to smooth the forums in an unofficial capacity to help a show that's brought a lot of enjoyment to me.
So, everyone please be good I'm stepping out of the thread.
Mr. Fibuli
Paranormal Adept
Good grief!
I wouldn't want to miss After the Paracast.
Ravensfee
Paranormal Maven
Ok, here's a theory...
People reporting abductions have experienced *something* and they found it, whatever "it" was, highly traumatic.
Whether due to the trauma, or the nature of the experience the memories of the events are not wholly clear in the experiencers mind.
They engage with a researcher, with strong pre-existing beliefs in alien abduction, to try to figure out exactly what happened.
During their sessions a narrative is formed, helped by subtle and almost subconscious guiding by the researcher, and perhaps also by exploratory external reading of literature on abduction phenomena.
A therapist/patient bond is formed. Trained therapists will know to look for this, abduction researchers less so.
The patient, knowingly or not, starts to seek the approval of the therapist.
During their sessions, descriptions and events that don't fit the researchers theoretical template are ignored, those that do fit are followed up excitedly.
Over time, and Dr Jacobs does spend time with the abduction experiencers who approach him, a feedback loop is established, bolstered by the underlying therapist/patient dynamic.
That feedback loop helps create a narrative, the seed of which was a *genuine traumatic event*, but has, overtime, become a mythic story created by a small community of people, with Dr Jacobs at its hub, that exists *solely* in the imagination of those who created it.
Obviously this is just a theory, but one that I think might have a degree of validity. And as I have as much formal training in psychology, psychiatry, mental health etc as Dr Jacobs it's a theory I'm happy to place in the same arena as those where his theories are currently playing out.
Mr. Fibuli
Paranormal Adept
On topic, I personally like to hear guests like David Jacobs on the Paracast in the future. It adds to the salad.
I don't buy Jacobs' method or conclusions, but I am inclined to believe that he believes in his story.
I don't buy Jacobs' method or conclusions, but I am inclined to believe that he believes in his story.
Apocalypto
Paranormal Maven
Yeah well, money talks Fibuli. And right about now I'm focusing on that.
In re to the Paracast, I'm a looong time listener and Gene and I have had our discussions/disputes in the past, usually with full respect on both sides.
Now if you look back at the opening post of this thread by Gene, you will see he wrote:
"I won't mince words. The claims from Dr. David Jacobs about possible hybrid aliens infiltrating Earth society are controversial, and his research methods are hotly disputed."
Right, so there's an acknowledgement by Gene from the get-go that this topic will be hotly disputed, yet as soon as that "hot dispute" starts up, the shtf. Makes no sense.
Burnt State
Paranormal Adept
And just how many of those cases have anything at all to do with alien abduction? From what I saw on that site - none. And yes - clinical care, and compassion are needed in retrieving such things so healing can being. Jacobs expressed none of that on this episode whatsoever. So this is what is up for grabs here, not a critique of a man providing valuable service to the planet in his warnings of the imminent planetary takeover but whether or not he is exploiting his clients and potentially re-victimizing them given his lack of credentials and his own admissions that he has no real clue with regards to what he is up to in terms of hypnosis - or relaxation talk. Yet, in the same breath he claims that other researchers are not following proper procedures. His lack of training in these areas still leaves him comfortable to work with people who have in fact experienced some kind of sexual trauma. He's saying it's all about aliens and yet there is no real corroboration of this at all.
What is corroborated on the site you point out are primarily recovered memories of child sexual abuse, quite often by family members. This kind of trauma has to be the worst possible trauma for a young mind to integrate, which is why it still brings people down to their faltering core. We have evidence of this in his very first case where the subject does not want to talk about recent memories, but she feels the need to recount a sexual assault when she is seven years old. More than likely the majority, if not all, of Jacobs' cases have to do specifically with sexual abuse and the clients have spent a lot of time stumbling over this inexplicable memory in their lives. It is often a major block in the memories of those who have lived through such trauma and all manner of inventions will be used as a placeholder for the actual event. If he had any care or concern for the trauma his clients have experienced he would know that 1 in 5 women have experienced child sexual abuse and so the number of his own clients that have lived through this far exceed his own reported stats. It demonstrates his callousness, his lack of care and concern for the real lived experiences that he is self-admittedly not qualified to treat. It all serves his theory and certainly does not serve the client who is now wandering down alleyways of alien spaceships instead of getting proper therapy to deal with the trauma evident in their lives.
"The U.S. Department of Health and Human Services’ Children’s Bureau report Child Maltreatment 2010 found that 9.2% of victimized children were sexually assaulted (page 24).
Studies by David Finkelhor, Director of the Crimes Against Children Research Center, show that:
- 1 in 5 girls and 1 in 20 boys is a victim of child sexual abuse;
- Self-report studies show that 20% of adult females and 5-10% of adult males recall a childhood sexual assault or sexual abuse incident;
- During a one-year period in the U.S., 16% of youth ages 14 to 17 had been sexually victimized;
- Over the course of their lifetime, 28% of U.S. youth ages 14 to 17 had been sexually victimized;
- Children are most vulnerable to CSA between the ages of 7 and 13.
A Bureau of Justice Statistics report shows 1.6 % (sixteen out of one thousand) of children between the ages of 12-17 were victims of rape/sexual assault (page 18).
A study conducted in 1986 found that 63% of women who had suffered sexual abuse by a family member also reported a rape or attempted rape after the age of 14. Recent studies in 2000, 2002, and 2005 have all concluded similar results (page 8).
Children who had an experience of rape or attempted rape in their adolescent years were 13.7 times more likely to experience rape or attempted rape in their first year of college (page 9)."
Child Sexual Abuse Statistics
What is important to note is that for those women who have lived through this trauma 63% will have to relive it. If that doesn't raise your hackles and make you want to look a little more critically at the sexual traumas that Jacobs is talking about then I don't know what will. So from these statistics and from the memory retrieval dude we can conclude that what people need great help with is dealing with a human to human trauma and that the screen of aliens has almost everything to do with who the investigator is as that produces the exact same patient as described on the show. And if that is true and what we know about the nature of retrieval through hypnosis or relaxation techniques is bogus then just how despicable is this field of alien abduction research when it uses such ill informed, and unscientific techniques?
Chris O'Brien always asks why do the aliens use such medieval torture methods with their subjects when again, these characters are the science magicians and would certainly not need to engage in such sadistic and depraved methodologies. But they certainly do work as a strong representation of the incredible pain experienced by a victim of sexual abuse. If we have to consider what is more likely, statistically, and purely based on the science fiction woo-hoo Jacobs presented on the show, right down to his advocation of the use of the proverbial tin foil hat, you have to ask yourself is it aliens, or are people processing memories of sexual abuse...well it doesn't take a genius to make an informed and credible opinion on the matter.
As for the comparison between Jacobs and Galileo and the forum dissidents and the Catholic church, I'm not too sure who should feel more insulted, the ghost of Galileo or the good sensible people who are calling Jacobs on what are scientifically unfounded practices and almost certainly abuses of his position of power while talking with women about their past sexual traumas. In fact a bigger question is what gives him the right to do such things?
Mr. Fibuli
Paranormal Adept
Nobody's been banned. Threads haven't been cut.
(Why am I still saying this?)
Apocalypto
Paranormal Maven
No idea, it's not relevant.
Apocalypto
Paranormal Maven
Thanks. You post excellent stuff on a constant basis.
Chuckleberryfinn
Paranormal Maven
Dudes,
David Jacobs is not lying about his PhD. He was a freaking history professor at Temple for a long time. The tiniest amount of research is required to verify that. When I read his books years ago, I also looked him up at Temple. He had an office number, office hours, course catalog, and the rest.
CBF
David Jacobs is not lying about his PhD. He was a freaking history professor at Temple for a long time. The tiniest amount of research is required to verify that. When I read his books years ago, I also looked him up at Temple. He had an office number, office hours, course catalog, and the rest.
CBF
Mr. Fibuli
Paranormal Adept
Last word the fan never got hit by shi-
Gene isn't flipping out.
If I were your mother I'd slap your head and tell you to play nice.
Ron Away
Paranormal Adept
Though I understand your frustration it would be sad to know you've cancelled as you bring a lot to the table and I for one agree with most of what you've said.I don't always agree with our hosts and sometimes I've felt like cancelling but I truly believe this is a great forum and our contributions 're our subscriptions help keep the show going.I'm sure you'll agree it's never dull in the paracast universe.
Ron Away
Paranormal Adept
Mr Fibuli never change you are a diamond!.
Apocalypto
Paranormal Maven
That's great, so you fantasize about hitting children, too?
Apocalypto
Paranormal Maven
Thanks Ron. It's a good forum. I agree. And the Paracast is a good show (for the most part).
I listen to every show, and every ATPC. I don't post often in the forums, certainly not as much as I used to many years ago, but I felt strongly about this guest and wanted to make some comments.
In the final analysis, there is a pretense here. We need to be more vigilant in terms of who we give attention and respect to in this field, otherwise we're just destined to endure a continuous stream of "Roswell Slides" fiascos cropping up in the future.
Nice chatting with you folks, though. Even the ones who don't agree with me.
We are vigilant. We gave Jacobs a far tougher than he got anywhere else. He's been on lots and lots of shows, but only one show led him to feel he was being "badgered."
Burnt State
Paranormal Adept
If it helps I thought the ATP episode was much more critical of Jacobs' methods with both hosts critiquing him in a more deserving fashion. Without that it might appear like there's a lack of balance or a promotion of Jacobs' work. I thought that was self-evident from the show especially towards the end where the interview got a little more loose. But judging by his support here there does seem to be some dispute. Should Jacobs get any airtime at all? Should he be defended or vilified? Should we hear more facts from the Emma Woods saga? Do some alien abduction researchers exploit their clients? All questions deserving of better answers IMHO.
I can tell there's a lot of restraint from those who would really like to air their unadulterated opinion, or whose disgust keeps them off this thread. The most insulting commentary here has come from the pro - Jacobs camp. There is a question regarding inconsistency in terms of who gets dammed on the show and whose name or story can't be spoken. Given the evidence presented and made available I just don't understand why Jacobs gets a defence but Woods and her story gets silenced. Given the discussion on ATP regarding sexual abuse you'd think there'd be more compassion and support for the exploited.
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