Pentagon Disclosure or Disinformation?

[Elendil]

It's a complex thesis and I couldn't begin to do it justice here (you can "look inside" not that the cost is prohibitively expensive btw). But the work opines that the ultimate goal is Earth-alien unity, and they're currently conditioning humanity in anticipation of their endgame, so to speak.

Earth-alien unity in what sense? Hostile invasion or takeover in the style of Jacobs or space brotherly help and union? Or something else?

You are likely right about China, but we know so little about what truly goes on there. It's a big question mark, in my mind. There are days when I lean toward alien or off-world sources. When I lean toward it being ours it is because the more I learn about disinformation, the more complex and likely it seems.

Again, it's hard to explain the whole of the phenomenon like that - some cases are likely sightings of experimental Earth tech or maybe part of some disinfo, but the real interesting stuff with capabilities far beyond anything made so far by the human civilization is hard to envision as being at full disposal of either Americans, Russians or the Chinese.

Not to mention that it gets even harder to go back in time to late forties or early fifties and explain stuff e.g. Ruppelt was writing about, when jet engines were just being established and the sound barrier had just been breached, while on the other side the Soviet Union had been recovering from an absolutely devastating war on it's own territory and trying to catch up in the nuclear weapons game, while China suffered from an equally devastating Japanese occupation and not recovering since it was still engulfed in a civil war, or that very war had ended recently.

Let's also think that at the time transistors were also at their infancy and computers were filling rooms. I'd imagine it would be really hard for a human pilot to control a super-maneuvering air-frame without any digital assistance, especially if we think of modern fighters and how much computer tech they really contain.

If it's disinfo - why do that and establish say a functioning disinfo campaign where everyone is talking of aliens but then completely turn that around with the Robertson panel? If you're say a US disinfo agent - how do you contol so many witnesses from different countries all over the world and from different walks of life?

Just that sheer complexity of the phenomenon makes me lean towards the external source explanation. For cases that can't be mundanely explained, that is...

 

[Celeste]

Earth-alien unity in what sense? Hostile invasion or takeover in the style of Jacobs or space brotherly help and union? Or something else?


Again, it's hard to explain the whole of the phenomenon like that - some cases are likely sightings of experimental Earth tech or maybe part of some disinfo, but the real interesting stuff with capabilities far beyond anything made so far by the human civilization is hard to envision as being at full disposal of either Americans, Russians or the Chinese.

Not to mention that it gets even harder to go back in time to late forties or early fifties and explain stuff e.g. Ruppelt was writing about, when jet engines were just being established and the sound barrier had just been breached, while on the other side the Soviet Union had been recovering from an absolutely devastating war on it's own territory and trying to catch up in the nuclear weapons game, while China suffered from an equally devastating Japanese occupation and not recovering since it was still engulfed in a civil war, or that very war had ended recently.

Let's also think that at the time transistors were also at their infancy and computers were filling rooms. I'd imagine it would be really hard for a human pilot to control a super-maneuvering air-frame without any digital assistance, especially if we think of modern fighters and how much computer tech they really contain.

If it's disinfo - why do that and establish say a functioning disinfo campaign where everyone is talking of aliens but then completely turn that around with the Robertson panel? If you're say a US disinfo agent - how do you contol so many witnesses from different countries all over the world and from different walks of life?

Just that sheer complexity of the phenomenon makes me lean towards the external source explanation. For cases that can't be mundanely explained, that is...

All good and valid points, which make this whole thing difficult to sort out. The technology is indeed incredible and likely not of this earth. I can see several possibilities and I hope we are just scratching the surface with the disclosure issue. I would like to see far more transparency, which the Pentagon and MIC are never inclined to cooperate with. Frustrating that disclosure has to rely on rouge enlisted personnel or civilians to slip secrets to investigators. We shall see what they do next.

 

[Trajanus]

I would like to see far more transparency, which the Pentagon and MIC are never inclined to cooperate with. Frustrating that disclosure has to rely on rouge enlisted personnel or civilians to slip secrets to investigators.

? Unfortunately, "rogue enlisted personnel" who "slip secrets" are just disinformation agents. Really, everyone in this field should get a copy of The Alien Grand Design. As the work shows, various documents and vids leaked out (so called mj12 etc) are intended to promote the same misleading views as various sightings and reports. Disinfo in fact so pervades the field that even the late Stan Friedman was in on it. This doesn't mean we can never have a clue until there's disclosure. By puzzling out the purpose of disinfo, the work discerns the truth.

 

[Trajanus]

Earth-alien unity in what sense? Hostile invasion or takeover in the style of Jacobs or space brotherly help and union? Or something else?

Invasion yes but certainly not what Jacobs seems to think. The idea will be to shore up a new global regime. Earth will retain its independence as regards local affairs but it can't or won't threaten the aliens as it reaches full spacefaring status.

…. but the real interesting stuff with capabilities far beyond anything made so far by the human civilization is hard to envision as being at full disposal of either Americans, Russians or the Chinese.

Of course.

 

[Elendil]

Invasion yes but certainly not what Jacobs seems to think. The idea will be to shore up a new global regime. Earth will retain its independence as regards local affairs but it can't or won't threaten the aliens as it reaches full spacefaring status.

So, it's kind of a pre-emptive damage control? Well, I have a hard time believing that the human civilization could pose any threat to anyone handling the kind of tech the UFOs seem to demonstrate. Not to mention the abduction accounts and that kind of technological supremacy.
Even if humanity survives the incoming climate changes and likely climate catastrophe caused by humans sawing off the branch we're all sitting on in regard to the environment AND doesn't destroy itself in wars over depleting resources AND manages to reach a point where space-faring becomes possible - I'd reckon it would still be far away from challenging species with tech mentioned above...

Plus, even if that was the case - why take so long - like 70+ years? Why not influence the biggest players in say 80-ies or 90-ies and have stuff ready in 20-30 years?

 

[marduk]

If laymen like Friedman can get enough info to reach a conclusion, the government probably did, secretly, a long time ago.

I love Stanton, but he really didn't have evidence of much of anything there. His MJ-12 stuff is kinda laughable.

Not spontaneously, but after certain requisite conditions exist.

That may be. But simple math tells you that if they've been here hundreds of years without openly disclosing themselves, the odds of them openly disclosing themselves within our lifetime is quite low.

There may be influences on their behaviour, but we really have zero evidence of them responding to anything... except maybe getting shot at. Which usually elicits a "run away quick" response, occasionally with a side order of "I'll shut your stuff down before I run away".

Roswell certainly happened. In his recent tome, Randle may be bothered by lack of definitive, layman-accessible evidence for ET after all these years. But that's only to be expected given a coverup, and it's noteworthy that NO prosaic explanation has ever been found, as Randle indicates clearly.

Something happened at Roswell. What that is, I don't think anyone will ever be able to say.

Right, in fact The Alien Grand Design labels him a disinfo agent--one of many--and shows the purpose of his nonsense--his and many others.

Honestly, he sounds more like a dude on his deathbed wanting to give some kind of inheritance away to his family. He just seemed to throw total BS out there for book sales.

Probably the latter.

Could be. In which case... it might be hard to even prove it was ET.

I mean, if these things are Bracewell Probes (which I think is as likely as anything), they could be produced using local resources. Which would then show up as terrestrial. Maybe odd alloys with odd behaviour... but terrestrial.

 

[marduk]

Some insight on that one: Rutkowski and I, and I think @marduk too seem to be all on the same page with this one. I admire Sagan, but forget his whole flatland analogy. Secondly, people constantly conflate spatial dimensions with the variable of time. People who try to explain this shouldn't be saying time is the "fourth dimension". More accurately they should be saying it's the fourth variable together with the first three variables, which are the spatial dimensions ( for 3 spatial variables and one temporal variable ).

The next is to grasp that spatial dimensions have a hierarchical dependency, which is a fancy way of saying that there cannot be a second dimension without a preceding first, and there can be no third without a preceding first and second, and when you get to 3D, it extends infinitely in all directions, so there can be no "fourth" or "fifth" or "sixth" spatial dimension. Even if we imagine that there could be, because of hierarchical dependency, any 4D skyscraper would still be fully visible in all the preceding 3D spatial coordinates.

When you get how that works, you can extrapolate that all possible spatial dimensions must exist simultaneously everywhere, because you just can't leave one out or the whole thing collapses. So there can be no 3D beings that magically appear out of the "Fifth Dimension" ( unless maybe you're talking about the band members ).

Every single example I've looked into where dimensions above 3 are being used to describe some theoretical situation, they are in-fact using the term "dimension" as another convenience term for theoretically micro or macro separate 3D spaces within the same larger infinite 3D realm we're in, but located or configured in a way that their 3D borders don't intersect with ours. For example, other universe like the one formed by our Big Bang may exist at some distant location beyond our ability to detect it. But it's all still in the same "space".

It gets really interesting when you start thinking about the possibility of generated constructs like in The Matrix where we're looking at virtual dimensions. But that's a whole other conversation. Basically. You can write the IDH ( Interdimensional Hypothesis ) off as pure sci-fi.

Right.

'Dimensions' technically are the minimum number of reference points/coordinates to identify an object within it's space. And 'space' here can be any abstract volume of space. Mathematical spaces can have infinite dimensions, but they do not represent how space/time works - they are abstract problem spaces used to solve or describe certain problems. This is easily demonstrable in software - one can abstractly define an n-dimensional array quite simply. These can describe n-dimensional mathematical spaces, that of course could never actually exist in space/time. There are many such interesting abstract 'spaces' such as manifolds and Hilbert spaces: Dimension - Wikipedia

We seem to require four dimensions to identify objects in space/time. This is clear. How would a 'fifth dimensional' object appear to us? As a fourth dimensional object, because there appears to only be four dimensions in space/time. Therefore, the 'extra' coordinate wouldn't actually describe anything.

There is the potential for other spacial dimensions in String Theory (which is probably bunk TBH and is fundamentally unprovable)... but even if they do exist, we can't get at them (because they're curled up inside subatomic particles) and even if we could get at them... what would happen? If we went into an 11-dimensional space, we'd still only have four dimensions. Whatever was there probably wouldn't even realize it any more than we'd realize a 1 dimensional being drifting through the room, because it would exist as a point.

Dimension - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

When people talk about 'dimensions' I think what they're really trying to say is "universes." And there might indeed be a multiverse filled with all kinds of things with all kinds of different laws of physics. However if any of it entered into our universe, our laws of physics would still be in effect, because, well... they'd be in our universe.

So invisible levitating unicorns from universe 9 would suddenly become visible and go splat on the ground should they traverse into our universe. Boundary conditions may exist, but then the laws of physics there would become really weird, and you might as well be standing in the middle of a black hole. And at any rate, we've been looking for them... and haven't found any: Multiverse - Wikipedia

But multiverse ideas are way, way more rational than 'dimensions'.

 

[Trajanus]

So, it's kind of a pre-emptive damage control? Well, I have a hard time believing that the human civilization could pose any threat to anyone handling the kind of tech the UFOs seem to demonstrate.

The book opines that progress peaks at a certain point, which we're rapidly approaching, so we may begin to pose a threat to ET, in theory, in coming centuries. Being intelligent and proactive they've taken steps to "tie" us to them, in a sense, to obviate the potential longterm threat.

Even if humanity survives the incoming climate changes and likely climate catastrophe caused by humans sawing off the branch we're all sitting on in regard to the environment AND doesn't destroy itself in wars over depleting resources

According to the scenario, crises won't destroy civilization just the less efficacious forms of government which can neither prevent nor adequately deal with them.

AND manages to reach a point where space-faring becomes possible - I'd reckon it would still be far away from challenging species with tech mentioned above...

If you read the book, the denouement of the ET plan won't be until about 2100 or later, by which time, given our exponential rate of progress, we may have the fundamental knowledge to replicate their achievement. The book envisages lasting peace, not a real star wars.

Plus, even if that was the case - why take so long - like 70+ years? Why not influence the biggest players in say 80-ies or 90-ies and have stuff ready in 20-30 years?

For ET civilization, around for millennia if not eons, a little extra time is no big deal. We can advance at our own pace--which is rapid enough--and be ready soon enough.

 

[Trajanus]

I love Stanton, but he really didn't have evidence of much of anything there. His MJ-12 stuff is kinda laughable.

Dubious certainly. But as The Alien Grand Design shows, Friedman's misinformation fits the same broad pattern as so many others, and has a role in the great plan.

That may be. But simple math tells you that if they've been here hundreds of years without openly disclosing themselves, the odds of them openly disclosing themselves within our lifetime is quite low.

I didn't say within our lifetimes, but fairly soon with respect to historical time. The key difference is we're now entering the final stage of progress leading up to a civilization comparable to theirs--and they'll guide and influence it.

Something happened at Roswell. What that is, I don't think anyone will ever be able to say.

Too pessimistic. As Randle notes, no prosaic explanation has been found even after 3/4 of a century. There have been reports of unusual beings and strange material. We may not have proof but that's only to be expected given the coverup--and so is misinformation intended to sully the case.

 

[marduk]

Dubious certainly. But as The Alien Grand Design shows, Friedman's misinformation fits the same broad pattern as so many others, and has a role in the great plan.

And that misinformation - if at all true - could as much be chalked up to "we don't know what it is and don't want to look stupid" as anything.
Personally I think it falls into the "not my problem" category, and then was laughed off simply so they didn't have to deal with it. No Military/Industrial careers are made off of UFOs that we know of, but plenty are made off of conventional warfare.

I didn't say within our lifetimes, but fairly soon with respect to historical time. The key difference is we're now entering the final stage of progress leading up to a civilization comparable to theirs--and they'll guide and influence it.

Maybe, maybe not. Remember that historically whatever this is, it seems to present itself as technology just slightly in advance of our own. Remember the flying airship phenomena...

Too pessimistic. As Randle notes, no prosaic explanation has been found even after 3/4 of a century. There have been reports of unusual beings and strange material. We may not have proof but that's only to be expected given the coverup--and so is misinformation intended to sully the case.

That's my point. No explanation for Roswell has ever occurred. Which makes it dubious at best. Personally, I think it's a colossal waste of time to pursue it further.

As the newly released report demonstrates, we're in a flap right now. Which means that if these things do crash, well they're gonna crash now. And our ability to gather real evidence without needing the Military/Industrial complex is at an all time high.

Which makes it a really interesting time for Elizondo and company to shift focus back to the Military/Industrial complex as the sole source of truth.

And that is what I think this is all really about. When I heard Lou say they had HD footage 30 yards away from the plane or something, then it was all mysteriously "deleted" I just laughed.

While I think admissions from the US gov't is good, I think this is more about portraying the human powers as in control of the information to distract from the readily apparent ability we all have to gather our own, without viewing this whole thing through a hierarchical military lens.

 

[marduk]

But the government has clearly and long discouraged belief in aliens. It doesn't make sense to attribute sightings of alleged government technology to something whose existence hasn't even been definitively established in the minds of most people. Many in fact dismiss it outright. Covering up technology can be achieved a lot more easily and without controversy by either keeping it in restricted areas (whereas UFOs buzz even urban areas at times!) or attributing sightings to meteors, stars or other prosaic things.

All power structures are based on who's "us" and who's not... and what thoughts are acceptable and what are not. It's not just governments that discourage this stuff.

It's also religions and most other human power structures. Hell, go look at that ET Channelling thread. Even though it's pro-ET, it's clearly pushing a human power structure and set of ideas, and there's no talking that guy out of his worldview.

If there's one thing I'm reasonably certain of, it's that they don't give a damn about our human power structures. They don't land on the White House lawn and kiss the president's ring. They do seem to sneak into average people's bedrooms in the middle of the night instead. They seem to be interested in individuals, not hierarchies.

 

[Trajanus]

And that misinformation - if at all true - could as much be chalked up to "we don't know what it is and don't want to look stupid" as anything.

Friedman was sure what it was and (according to the aforementioned book) the purpose of MJ12 was to spread false ideas about ET, not deny he was real.

No Military/Industrial careers are made off of UFOs that we know of..

Yep that we know of.

Remember that historically whatever this is, it seems to present itself as technology just slightly in advance of our own.

The Alien Grand Design doesn't consider that genuine but one of many alien shows, for reasons it explains. But our own progress appears rapid enough to reach the real ET level relatively soon with respect to historical time.

That's my point. No explanation for Roswell has ever occurred.

Considering the lack of any real earthly explanation and much testimony which clearly points to ET it's reasonable to consider the latter the explanation.

Which makes it dubious at best. Personally, I think it's a colossal waste of time to pursue it further.

True we may not learn anything further pending disclosure. But that doesn't mean we should act or think like it never happened. Other cases have been mucked up by disinfo agents.

As the newly released report demonstrates, we're in a flap right now. Which means that if these things do crash, well they're gonna crash now. And our ability to gather real evidence without needing the Military/Industrial complex is at an all time high.

? Don't hold your breath waiting for that to happen. If only more people would read The Alien Grand Design….No doubt the author would say there's ZERO chance of that happening. Maybe he's wrong, but wait and see….

And that is what I think this is all really about. When I heard Lou say they had HD footage 30 yards away from the plane or something, then it was all mysteriously "deleted" I just laughed.

Yeah sounds laughable but the phenomenon does appear to have an ability to muck up or prevent photography and doesn't want evidence to be too good yet.

While I think admissions from the US gov't is good, I think this is more about portraying the human powers as in control of the information to distract from the readily apparent ability we all have to gather our own, without viewing this whole thing through a hierarchical military lens.

I very much doubt lay people will get conclusive evidence on their own. Even if it happened it would only get confiscated.

 

[Trajanus]

It's not just governments that discourage this stuff…its also religions

Very true--and for good reason…That book pulls no punches when describing how the phenomenon could--or ultimately will--bury religion completely.

If there's one thing I'm reasonably certain of, it's that they don't give a damn about our human power structures. They don't land on the White House lawn and kiss the president's ring. They do seem to sneak into average people's bedrooms in the middle of the night instead. They seem to be interested in individuals, not hierarchies.

It may seem that way, but I beg to differ. I think ET has interacted with governments at considerable length behind the scenes, or even more openly, albeit in deceptive ways.

 

[marduk]

But our own progress appears rapid enough to reach the real ET level relatively soon with respect to historical time.

I don't think so, actually. I'm not saying we won't go down lines of thought to give us insights into new propulsion mechanisms, etc - I mean, that has already apparently occurred... I remember Strieber talking about an aeronautics engineer electrifying the leading or trailing edges of a wing (I forget) to dramatically reduce drag - an idea he apparently got from observing UFOs.

But if you recall, the airship flap happened right before we had airships in general use.

Arnold didn't observe disc-shaped objects. He observed objects that had a disturbingly similar profile to the B2 Bomber... only a couple of decades before that was on the drawing board.

Then we got the flying discs. I've seen some of those. They seem to be somewhat retro now. Wonder why.

Now we're getting the tic-tacs. All these craft morphologies can be explainable by thinking about multiple species, or even my pet theory that these things are produced as somewhat single-use vehicles by a post-scarcity, post-singularity civilization capable of nanotech and with AI embedded within the craft itself. They would then be highly mission-specific, and discarded or destroyed after use. Perhaps even malleable during use.

And of course, before all this, we got 'flying sheilds' and such. I think as soon as we're capable of approaching the level of tech we're seeing today, we'll suddenly start to observe even weirder stuff.

 

[marduk]

Very true--and for good reason…That book pulls no punches when describing how the phenomenon could--or ultimately will--bury religion completely.



It may seem that way, but I beg to differ. I think ET has interacted with governments at considerable length behind the scenes, or even more openly, albeit in deceptive ways.

I highly doubt it for many reasons.

The first reason is that there is zero evidence of this happening. None at all. Just rumours and innuendo and speculation. Not from any government on earth. And that's a whole lot of people to keep this secret, and they're not at all good at keeping them.

The second reason is that governments have a vested interest in spinning these tales to keep them as the centre of attention and to yield a perception of power when they likely don't have any power here at all. That I think is 'the big secret' that is in plain sight.

The third is that even in my limited interaction with whatever it is... they didn't give a damn about my opinion about anything. They didn't give me any messages. They didn't approach me when awake or in a group. They only approached me alone, defenceless, and unaware.

The fourth is that if they actually cared about our power structures, they'd be influencing them by interacting with them. And if they're trying to influence our power structures, well then they're doing a pretty shitty job of it. All these messages about environmental destruction aren't working - we're worse now than we ever have been. We're closer to nuclear brinksmanship than we have been in decades. Yanks had Trump in office while they seem to rail against that kind of narcissistic capitalism. Etc. The point here is that with their level of capability, they could effectively tell our governments what to do... and they're either not doing that, or they suck at it. They tell individuals to do that stuff instead, when those same individuals can do jack squat about it. Which demonstrates a profound inability to understand how human society actually works.

There are thousands or millions of accounts of 1:1 or small group interactions that have actual evidence behind them. There are zero accounts of an official meet 'n greet with any evidence behind them. So Occam's razor here cuts quite strongly and I say somewhat confidently that they don't care about our power structures as much as they do individuals, or things like dangerous technology.

 

[Trajanus]

But if you recall, the airship flap happened right before we had airships in general use.

Couldn't be genuine in the sense of being the ET's real method of travel. Many times the phenomenon has shown us strangely antiquated things; it's deceptive like so much else.

Now we're getting the tic-tacs. All these craft morphologies can be explainable by thinking about multiple species, or even my pet theory that these things are produced as somewhat single-use vehicles by a post-scarcity, post-singularity civilization capable of nanotech and with AI embedded within the craft itself. They would then be highly mission-specific, and discarded or destroyed after use. Perhaps even malleable during use.

The latter is true but the missions are to fool us in some ways.

And of course, before all this, we got 'flying sheilds' and such. I think as soon as we're capable of approaching the level of tech we're seeing today, we'll suddenly start to observe even weirder stuff.

I don't think so, at least not in the sense of being truly more advanced.

 

[Trajanus]

I highly doubt it for many reasons.

The first reason is that there is zero evidence of this happening. None at all. Just rumours and innuendo and speculation. Not from any government on earth. And that's a whole lot of people to keep this secret, and they're not at all good at keeping them.

They kept ULTRA for decades after the war had ended.

The third is that even in my limited interaction with whatever it is... they didn't give a damn about my opinion about anything. They didn't give me any messages.

But you're not in the government and many contactees have reported aliens asking questions or imparting messages.

The fourth is that if they actually cared about our power structures, they'd be influencing them by interacting with them. And if they're trying to influence our power structures, well then they're doing a pretty shitty job of it. All these messages about environmental destruction aren't working - we're worse now than we ever have been. We're closer to nuclear brinksmanship than we have been in decades. Yanks had Trump in office while they seem to rail against that kind of narcissistic capitalism. Etc. The point here is that with their level of capability, they could effectively tell our governments what to do... and they're either not doing that, or they suck at it.

Warnings about the environment or nukes are just another form of deception, to hide their actual association with the government.

They tell individuals to do that stuff instead, when those same individuals can do jack squat about it. Which demonstrates a profound inability to understand how human society actually works.

Lol they understand full well, but often just try to fool us.

There are thousands or millions of accounts of 1:1 or small group interactions that have actual evidence behind them. There are zero accounts of an official meet 'n greet with any evidence behind them.

Sure and not surprising, for as the book says, nearly everything about the phenomenon is intended in part to hide the number one secret. If only people would see the AGD's take….

 

[marduk]

They kept ULTRA for decades after the war had ended.

sure they did. But it did come out. With evidence.

and you’re talking about many governments, worldwide. Not just one program in one of them. There’s no American hegemony with this phenomena. Even though Americans often like to pretend or project there is.

But you're not in the government and many contactees have reported aliens asking questions or imparting messages.

but that’s my point. They’ve given many messages. Prophecies that all didn’t come true. Environmental messages that didn’t help. Nuclear proliferation warnings that didn’t help.
If they actually care about this stuff, they suck at influencing us about it. Or it’s all distraction.

Lol they understand full well, but often just try to fool us.

maybe. Or maybe they’re as foolish and inept and have as many blinders as we do. Just higher tech. That doesn’t necessarily make them superior to us or more knowledgeable about us in most ways. They’re at least as complex as we are as beings. And we‘re all kinds of brilliant and stupid all wrapped up together.

One of the things I said when I was on the Paracast years ago is “what if they’re stupid?“ We have access to plenty of tech today, and most people don’t know how it works, and we seem to have gotten stupider as a society.

I mean, we’re in a post-truth society today, where anybody can invent their own alternative facts and run with it. All fueled by technology.

What if they’re a living example of post-singularity idiocracy?

 

[Randall]

What if they’re a living example of post-singularity idiocracy?

That still cracks me up on one level. And as they say, every element of humor ( or at least good humor ) has an element of truth.

 

[marduk]

That still cracks me up on one level. And as they say, every element of humor ( or at least good humor ) has an element of truth.

I say that jokingly... but only half jokingly.

Look... we've been hearing from these 'Ufonauts' for 70 years to be nicer to people, better to the environment, stop threatening each other with nukes and exploding them... and that these 'hybrid babies' will somehow make our society better and move us to an enlightened age.

None of that has happened. The opposite of that has happened, to be honest about it.

And that 'theatre in the sky' that was thought by many to make us all go "whoa" and take a more cosmic view of things... well, that hasn't happened either.

Sure, disclosure is really here. But it's mostly 'so what' to those of us that know it's true. Nothing has changed. Nothing is better. Most things are worse.

If ET was all love and light and gradual human improvement... well, they suck at it and are going about it in a stupid way.

Maybe they're Zeta Reticulan versions of dudbro's going out in daddy's tic-tac to go beep beep at the natives and occasionally try to get laid and that's all there really is to it. Maybe they're just trying to look wise and enlightened and are really as stupid - or more stupid than we are. They just have tech we don't, and maybe they don't even know how it works anymore than Joe average guy knows how to use silicon and germanium in interesting ways to make ICs... but he knows how to use a computer to go on Facebook and yell stupid things at people.