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Roswell Again?

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DaveM

Paranormal Adept
After months of having discussions over slides, the topic of the week is Roswell? I guess there were no other dead horses that needed flogged. I just recall Gene saying he was sick of the subject. I know I can live without ever hearing the 'R' word mentioned again in my lifetime.

I'm sure Roswell will finally be solved with the addition of this book...not. Note to UFO authors - find another subject to write about please.
 
After months of having discussions over slides, the topic of the week is Roswell? I guess there were no other dead horses that needed flogged. I just recall Gene saying he was sick of the subject. I know I can live without ever hearing the 'R' word mentioned again in my lifetime.

I'm sure Roswell will finally be solved with the addition of this book...not. Note to UFO authors - find another subject to write about please.

What about The Chinese Roswell? :P


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 
After months of having discussions over slides, the topic of the week is Roswell? I guess there were no other dead horses that needed flogged. I just recall Gene saying he was sick of the subject. I know I can live without ever hearing the 'R' word mentioned again in my lifetime.

I'm sure Roswell will finally be solved with the addition of this book...not. Note to UFO authors - find another subject to write about please.

The (behind the scenes) perpetrators of the scam have achieved their objective.
 
Exactly. Let's get off Roswell. It's a dead horse that some just love to keep on flogging.


I suspect that was the objective of those behind this latest scam, to further taint Roswell until people lose interest in one of the pivotal cases of UFOlogy. Besieged with nonsense associated with the case, KDR understood those who gave up on it in the '90s but didn't himself.
 
I'm not sure which is more outrageous- the '97 Air Force announcement of project mogul crash test dummies being mistaken as humanoid creatures- or these dummy slides being passed off as crash test humanoid mummy. Or something like that.
 
I am starting to realise there are some big holes in my understanding of roswell, I thought that Mogul Balloons were unmanned! Why would you send a crash test dummy up in a Balloon that was never intended to be manned? sandbags make much cheaper ballast.
Unless Mogul was much more than a listening device......
 
I am starting to realise there are some big holes in my understanding of roswell, I thought that Mogul Balloons were unmanned!

Of course they were unmanned!

Why would you send a crash test dummy up in a Balloon that was never intended to be manned? sandbags make much cheaper ballast.
Unless Mogul was much more than a listening device......

MOGUL was meant as an explanation for the debris field not the other site where bodies were reported. Even ignoring the lack of test dummies in '47 how they supposedly wound up near Roswell is not at all clear.
 
according to wikipedia

"In May 1946, the Army Air Forces gave the newly formed SAC the responsibility of delivering the atomic bomb"

the SAC was based at Roswell Army Air Field.

I maybe putting 2 and 2 together and coming up with 5 but, I am now more convinced than ever that there was some kind of A-bomb connection, possibly a Nuclear armed balloon, or Zeppelin (Airship)

I think there is more chance that someone could mistake a Chimp or similar primate for a "strange being" rather than a dummy, and I know that Chimps were used in Military High altitude/space equipment testing, e.g the chimp name HAM*


I knew the Airforce had addressed the issue of the "balloon" but I had not realised that they even mentioned the "bodies".

I am starting to really get the idea of our own personal rabbit holes, maybe I will lay off the coolaid and do some reading instead.

Thank you for the information.


*Ham (chimpanzee) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 
50 years later- cold war ended- why not just come out and say chimps, blimps, atom bomb, etc. or whatever secret 1947 technology fell from the sky. Considering it was 50 yrs later ('97) whatever project it may have been would certainly be obsolete.
 
I suspect that was the objective of those behind this latest scam, to further taint Roswell until people lose interest in one of the pivotal cases of UFOlogy.

An interesting thought and a question we should try to answer. I think it's unreasonable to suppose that Carey, Schmitt, Bragalia, or Mausson would want, much less seek, to further ‘taint’ the Roswell case. The first three, especially, have devoted too much time and energy to investigating that case to willingly undermine it. But we know nothing of the motives and intentions of Adam Dew or the silent co-owner of the slides.

My impression of Dew is that he lacked motivation to undermine the credibility of the alien theory concerning Roswell and personally saw the slides as a means rather than an end for himself – a means by which to gain income [and visibility for himself and his business] primarily through the production of a documentary about the Roswell slides and the public reaction to them. It’s hard to believe, but not impossible, that he didn’t find out about the recently released and improved deblurring software earlier and use it to clarify the writing on the placard during the last year or two. There is evidence that he both obscured the placard further by whiting it out in what he released pre-May 5th and also withheld the fully digitalized and clarified slides not only from the public but from the four ufologists involved. The error made by Carey and Schmitt seems to have been to accept Dew’s conditions of non-disclosure to other ufo researchers and the apparent compartmentalization of the ensuing investigation in which Dew and the co-owner of the slides maintained control of what was shared from the digital processing of the slides.

If there had been no evidence dating the exposure of the slides to the late 1940s, their possible connection to Roswell would have been moot. We might, for example, have been more likely to credit hypotheses such as George Wingfield's that the slides themselves were the product of hoaxers such as John Lundberg. The slides would not have been referred to as 'the Roswell slides’ were they not linked to the Roswell region and people living there in the late 1940s. Once that connection became viable, it was inevitable that Carey, Schmitt, Bragalia, and Mausson would be motivated to seek educated opinions about and possible identification of the nature of the body in the glass case, difficult as that would be on the basis of only two blurred and aged kodachrome slides. It was also inevitable that ufo researchers on both sides of the long debate over what happened at Roswell in 1947 would become intensely interested in following this research, and also seek to become involved in it. The involvement of other researchers was, however, prohibited by the NDAs Carey and Schmitt had to sign to participate in research into the slides. It’s unknown what the agreement was concerning the compartmentalization of the research and whether a clearly defined agreement existed concerning the obligations of all parties to disclose details of their individual investigations to one another. There is an unanswered question whether Dew advised Carey and Schmitt of everything he learned in his own investigations, technologically and otherwise. Yet to be disclosed are the specifics of the NDAs themselves, and they might only be disclosed in a court of law.

In the circumstances as I understand them, I think it’s likely that Dew knew at some point in the last year what the placard states and that he lived on hope that no one else would discover it. That seems to be why he continued to hold back the clearest digitalizations of the slides through the week following May 5. I would not be surprised if Carey and Schmitt were to consider suing Dew and perhaps the unnamed co-owner of the slides, and if they decide to do that I think they could win the suit depending on the conditions and guarantees made in the NDA or other writings.

There is also a possibility that Dew was approached by other parties interested in the Roswell slides and the effect of their presentation on public perceptions of the Roswell case. That possibility opens other avenues for discovery. Eventually something or someone will likely give, especially if a suit is filed by Carey and Schmitt.
 
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Unfortunately, Roswell brings more groans these days than I ever remember, but I think that's moreso a manifestation of the communities frustration than an attack on the legitimacy of the event itself. The Roswell Slides incident didn't help things, but at least it got the community talking.

Hopefully by identifying what's wrong with ufology we can start to correct things and make it right. Instead of looking at both Roswell and the Roswell Slides with frustration, use it as motivation to conduct some real research. I don't think it's too late to start over with that.
 
50 years later- cold war ended- why not just come out and say chimps, blimps, atom bomb, etc. or whatever secret 1947 technology fell from the sky. Considering it was 50 yrs later ('97) whatever project it may have been would certainly be obsolete.


Right and furthermore, every conceivable prosaic possibility--flying wing, Japanese balloon bomb, V1 rocket etc-- has been exhaustively researched by KDR and others. None of those were present at the relevant time and place which is why the best-informed skeptics have focused on MOGUL which as research has shown doesn't work either.
 
Right and furthermore, every conceivable prosaic possibility--flying wing, Japanese balloon bomb, V1 rocket etc-- has been exhaustively researched by KDR and others. None of those were present at the relevant time and place which is why the best-informed skeptics have focused on MOGUL which as research has shown doesn't work either.

I don't think it was a Japanese Balloon as has been suggested, rather an American one based on German and Japanese designs, with major upgrades.
Maybe the reason they talk about Mogul is because it is now declassified.

I probably sound paranoid, but in the interests of our security I am dropping this subject.
 
I would not be surprised if Carey and Schmitt were to consider suing Dew and perhaps the unnamed co-owner of the slides,

There is also a possibility that Dew was approached by other parties interested in the Roswell slides and the effect of their presentation on public perceptions of the Roswell case.

I wouldn't be surprised if the "unnamed co-owner" had government connections. Of course a government "handler" would've stayed anonymous and inaccessible.


@Han; MOGUL wasn't classified just its mission at the time. As others have pointed out ANY '47 technology would've been declassified some time ago.
 
I agree that the "technology" is most likely declassified, but I am not convinced that all the applications of said technology have been declassified.
maybe it is a case of people not looking in the right areas yet, and the information is sitting there waiting to be discovered.

In terms of obsolete technology, consider that the Ghurka's still carry a Kukri, and bayonets are still standard issue in most Armies.
 
maybe it is a case of people not looking in the right areas yet, and the information is sitting there waiting to be discovered.

Almost seven decades have passed since Roswell. I very much doubt there's some mysterious but prosaic explanation awaiting discovery. It's been ages since they've looked into everything. Already twenty years ago, by 1995, researchers were convinced they had it narrowed down to just two possibilities--MOGUL or ET--and the former doesn't work.
 
Roswell has obviously been beaten to a formless pulp. But don't expect it to vanish into thin air. Regardless of what may or may not have happened in 1947, Roswell has passed from esoteric curiosity into the realm of traditional American folklore. As years and decades pass, its veracity becomes increasingly irrelevant.
 
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