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The Roswell Slides Have Been Leaked Online

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Hi George, Richard Dolan was asked* about whether he thought the images he was initially shown, were different than the ones presented at the Bewitness event, his response was no, they were the same.
I understand that he knows schmidt and carey, and when he (Dolan) was asked the same question regarding them (as in the slides they saw) he stated that they had not mentioned any differences to him.

This leads me to suspect that there was no need for photo manipulation or even a "dummy/sfx" model.

I am convinced it was a deliberate hoax/fraud, but I don't know enough about the UFO field or the characters in it to make a list of "suspects".
However the fact that the slides are still being discussed to this day, clearly demonstrates who ever was behind the whole deception was an ace hoaxer, with a lot of experience and knowledge about the UFO field and the people in it. I think it is worth mentioning that before this slidegate saga, I had never heard of Mr Dew** and as I mentioned before this was an extremely sophisticated hoax, which suggests to me that Dew would not be able to pull it off, let alone come up with it in the first place.
The metaphor that springs to mind is: that it is like someone who can not read music, sing or play any instruments being asked to conduct a symphony orchestra and doing a better job than a veteran conductor.


From my own personal standpoint I do not wish to make any allegations without evidence, but I feel that I have to say that: I find it interesting that Mr Lundberg had contact with LMH (in the Mirage men film) and now she is very much involved in the slidegate saga, I am sure its just coincidence, and I repeat that I don't think there is evidence that Mr Lundberg is involved.


*On the most recent episode of the Paracast 28/6/15

*I admit I am not familiar with all the names in the UFO field, but I have listened to the Paracast for a number of years and I am sure I would have remembered if Dew's name had come up (especially given that he is from England).

Hi, Harry

What is clear is that there were low resolution and higher resolution versions of the two digital images that were supplied by Adam Dew. It seems that Carey, Schmitt and Maussan were supplied with higher resolution versions than the ones that the rest of us got to see. The question remains what persuaded them this apparent dead creature was an alien rather than just the body of a mummified child which everyone was told later. Maussan's experts --quite apart from Carey and Schmitt-- listed a number of "non-human features" which evidently convinced them it was an alien rather than a mummy. What was it that made them so certain that the image was of a Roswell Alien -- which we know it wasn't--?

I suggested previously that the higher resolution image they were given might have shown a SFX dummy alien specially constructed for this hoax. Alternatively a digital image of a mummified child could have been subtly modified using Photoshop to show distinct non-human features. With Photoshop an image of a mummy could be stretched or compressed to make it more resemble an "alien" or its head could be somewhat enlarged in proportion to its thorax. All these things are a possibility and we will probably never know unless those experts and Maussan himself tell us exactly what images they were initially shown. Another factor may well be that Maussan was so taken in by what "Anthony Bragalia" was telling him that he accepted this was an alien body without seeking any further independent opinion. In any case it's very hard to believe the assertion by the RSRG and Bragalia that this was merely a mummified child all along and the digital image was always the same from start to finish without any modification. If the blurred message "MUMMIFIED BODY...." was added to the blurred blank placard at some point after May 5th the two versions of that digital image would be indistinguishable to the naked eye.

I had never heard of Mr Dew before all this and I'd never heard of Anthony Bragalia either. I guess they both popped up at roughly the same time about three years ago. As I've said I'm extremely suspicious that Bragalia is not a real person at all and he is one of Lundberg & Irving's fake identities. Please prove otherwise, Mr Bragalia! (That probably means various other fake identities will pop up and say "I've known Tony for 20 years", "I went to school with him" or I'm a friend of his sister, Janice". You revealed that Adam Dew is from England (which I didn't know) and of course the other three hoaxers are too.

If you want further proof of Lundberg and Irving's involvement, Harry, let me know your e-mail address (via a Paracast Private Conversation) and I'll send you that proof which I put in a report I wrote back in May. Come to think of it, let me know your phone number and I'll call you. I have no doubt that Lundberg, Irving and Mantle are the three principal hoaxers.

George
 
You revealed that Adam Dew is from England (which I didn't know) and of course the other three hoaxers are too.
Hi George, Harry/Han was mistaken about Dew being from the UK. I'm not sure why he thought that initially, but that is misinformation. I'm sure Han can/will confirm this too. Just to be clear: No one that I know of believes Dew is from the UK.
 
Hi, DS...[sic]EbikeSRC, Since you are one of the few real people who can see what's been going on I'd be happy to discuss it with you directly by phone or on Skype. That's probably best done by asking Gene to pass me your phone number or Skype name so that I can get call you.
--George
Jesus H. :p

:D:D:D
 
*yawn* I suppose me 'n Clifford should head over to the Yavapai Cultural Center and fast talk our way into the storage area and take some pics of the little dessicated whipper-snapper. It's less than a mile from my house and Clifford thinks he can convince them to let us confirm that it's the same "mummy." Then, I'll submit an invoice to Maussan to collect our"$10,000" reward. :rolleyes:
Yawn? Really? I think not. Lol.

You seemed most interested to make it the initial featured announcement on the Paracast with Alajandro Rojas recorded on June 4th. Then you discussed it in detail with AJ later in the show. So, you said there is no record it was ever at Mesa Verde. Hmmm....

Please give us an update. It's been a month now...

Where is it? What more have you learned?

Put it to rest! You know this is one of the greatest threads EVER at the Paracast, whether you like it or not. It will NEVER die unless more closure is given with its true history and location.

Anyone can make $15, 000 with the right pic and docs. Click link just below:

Earn $15,000 with Mummy/Alien photo & paper trail. | The Paracast Community Forums

Chris, I don't think that's chump-change to you and many other people reading this. Aren't you wanting to buy some fancy camera equipment that 8mm film would have NO chance or possibility of ever capturing that ET "pilot" or Mothership??? :D

Where is the Press Release you said you obtained from your local museum? It's a dead end?
 
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Yawn? Really? I think not. Lol...
I'm working on it. I have an in w/ a Tribal Council member and another track w/the head of security. We're dealing w/ Native Americans here, you can't hurry the process w/ Indians. There appears to be a way around the taboos of gaining access to the remains, but you should understand, this is a delicate process that may need to be done on the sly/through the back door, so to speak. If you get my drift. As to the Press release, I gave it to Ron Regehr... BTW: Many of your posts seem so demanding. No one here has to answer to you (or anyone else) I suggest you work on softening your strident insistence. Often times it turns me off, and I'm fairly tolerant. Just a suggestion from a forum moderator, etc
 
BTW: Many of your posts seem so demanding. No one here has to answer to you (or anyone else) I suggest you work on softening your strident insistence. Often times it turns me off, and I'm fairly tolerant. Just a suggestion from a forum moderator, etc
Chris, I was being polite, and asking about a month later is hardly "demanding" since other people are probably looking to get that money too! Why do you think I'm being so demanding? The reward money and that museum's location was already announced publicly by May 20th. I'm sure you've known about this probably since then if not before. So, that's not even being impatient, imo. You even said you have a Press Release from several weeks ago. I guess you indicate now that Ron plans to release it for you at the Roswell festival?

I wrote:

"Please give us an update. It's been a month now..."

I'll have to add please and thanks too?

Ok then, thanks too!

No, I disagree, I'm not being "demanding" or "strident". I am being excited, and I'm full of questions.
 
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As to the Press release, I gave it to Ron Regehr...
So, Ron has released it at the Roswell Festival this weekend? Can we see what it says?

Please and thank you.

Now that you've also mentioned you need help from tribal contacts that will delay this process we can all understand this will take more time.

I guess that also means the mummified remains are still not known where they were or are now?
 
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I think you're too late to collect all the money Chris. This guy deserves the "photo match" cash having already done the work it seems. If the docs already clearly show the records of transference to the last location, then there has to be a record there how it was turned over to the tribal council for burial. So, Johnson has really found the chain of custody that has the photo match proof too.

But knowing the final resting place would still be very interesting. You are relying on tribal contacts to find the final resting place, so it doesn't seem possible you can personally find it anyway. Someone else will find it that you are relying on, so share the money IF there is any.

Shepherd Johnson already did most of the work for everyone, so he deserves most of the money, imo. You must already know about this.


Everyone should read this article at the link below:

This is from Sentry's blog...

Blue Blurry Lines: Shepherd Johnson finds documents that finish the Roswell Slides

Shepherd Johnson finds documents that finish the Roswell Slides

Shepherd Johnson contacted me on May 12, and the conversation centered on finding documentation on the mummified child's body depicted in the "Roswell Slides." After finding that National Park Service had both documents and photographs, Shepherd decided to file a Freedom of Information Act request for the records.


He filed his FOIA May 13, and there's a record of it online. Shepherd Johnson's request for this is on the NPS FOIA log on page 47. There's no listing for another such request.
http://www.nps.gov/aboutus/foia/upload/MAY-2015.pdf
 
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You revealed that Adam Dew is from England (which I didn't know)

I have been away for the weekend, so sorry for my late response.
I was mistaken and I now understand that Mr Dew is not from England after all. I don't know why I thought he was in the first place.
My focus in the beginning was on what was shown in the slides, rather than the characters involved in the deception.
I will try to reread this thread and some of the others, to see if I can establish why I jumped to that conclusion.
I would be very interested to read your report, so I will will send you my personal email address via PM now.
Thank you and best wishes. Harry.
 
At the risk of boring contributors to this forum with further explanation of the Roswell Slides Hoax there is obviously still a need to point out one key factor in the whole deception. This is the inescapable conclusion that “Anthony Bragalia” –billed somewhere (by himself?) as the “World’s Greatest UFO Researcher”— is one of the principal hoaxers and this is a false identity that he has been using for over three years. I suggest that his true identity is almost certainly John Lundberg who was creator of the whole charade and who was also one of the principal creators of Ray Santilli’s Alien Autopsy Scam twenty years ago.

One reason that Kevin Randle --and others-- has been deceived into believing that “Anthony Bragalia” was a real person whose claims should be trusted is that Philip Mantle (real name) has all along given the impression that his friend “Anthony Bragalia” was a genuine person. Mantle has supplied pictures of Santilli’s SFX dummy alien HILDA which were featured on Kevin Randle’s blogsite and Mantle has insisted all along that Lundberg and Irving were not involved in producing the 1995 Alien Autopsy footage. That assertion –as Mantle knows full well—is simply not true. No one should be surprised by fakery and hoaxing when it comes to claims of UFO/alien contact (and UFO crash/recovery) since it has been that way all along. Remember George Adamski, Billy Meier, Bob Lazar, Ed Walters, and Ray Santilli to name just a few? Remember too “Dr Jonathan Reid” (a.k.a. John Bradley Rutter) and his rubber alien dummy plus his faked UFO pictures from about 15 years ago? The “Roswell Slides” caper has been a similar, though rather more sophisticated, sort of deception.

The fiction that a certain Spyros Melaris was solely responsible for Ray Santilli’s Alien Autopsy production has been published over the years in Fortean Times to which Lundberg, Irving and Mantle used to be contributors. Naïve acceptance of this untruth has meant that most Roswell Skeptics have failed to realize that the “Roswell Slides” was a further carefully prepared hoax by John Lundberg and Rob Irving who were centrally involved with Santilli’s Alien Autopsy back in 1995. Consequently many Roswell Skeptics have been unable to see that the slides saga was a hoax too and they reserved all their contempt for Tom Carey, Don Schmitt and Jaime Maussan for supposed misidentification of what is now assumed to be merely an image of a mummified child. It is abundantly clear now that these three were victims of the slides hoax rather than its perpetrators. If members of the RSRG chose to accept all they were told by Bragalia (and by Adam Dew) they too have been duped by these hoaxers in the same way that Jaime Maussan was.

The root cause of this naivety is that most interested parties seem to have swallowed the “Roswell Slides” background story hook, line and sinker. There is not one scrap of evidence to support the ludicrous background story with its tale of “Hilda Ray”, her alleged friendship with Mamie Eisenhower, a private viewing of the alleged alien/mummy corpse, the alleged box of 1940s/1950s slides found in an alleged house clearance and alleged overheard conversations in Midland, TX, etc. Every bit of this background story –accepted by Roswell Believers and Roswell Skeptics alike-- was contrived by the hoaxers to link the supposed slides to the supposed Roswell flying saucer crash of 1947 and it is FALSE. Moreover, the two alleged 1947/1948 Kodachrome slides that were said to show the dead creature --held to be either an alien (or now a mummy)-- never in fact existed as slides. It seems nothing except for digital images has ever been presented to any independent photographic expert for any sort of confirmation.

Who then supplied this utterly bogus background story? Although it was served up by Adam Dew (who claimed some part in the supposed discovery of “Hilda Ray’s Box of Slides”) it is quite evident that most of the false detail was contrived and supplied by Mr “Anthony Bragalia”. One should then look at some of the other extraordinary claims about Roswell that this person was making on the internet in the months before the May 5th “Be Witness” event in Mexico City.

OPENING THE DOOR TO THE BLUE ROOM WHERE UFO DEBRIS IS HIDDEN by Anthony Bragalia is one such article which attempts to extend the Roswell Myth by creating a new icon for Roswell Believers – the alleged notorious “Blue Room” at Wright Patterson Air Force Base. This can be found at: index

Didn’t John Lundberg speak of creating icons for UFO True Believers, and of following --and even extending-- the Roswell “narrative?” We already have enough Roswell icons such as the EBE (Extraterrestrial Biological Entity), the strange Roswell crash metal, the Majestic 12 committee, the Eisenhower Briefing Memo, etc. Here comes a new icon from Lundberg posing as Bragalia: the Blue Room at Wright Patterson AFB.

To me this sounds very much like Roswell UFO/alien fiction based on all the 1947 flying saucer crash folklore plus a few real characters from that era like Barry Goldwater, General Exon, General Spaatz, General Le May, etc., who supposedly knew the “truth” about the Roswell UFO Crash. The writing is rather like the fictional Project SERPO hoax that appeared on the internet back in 2005 though it’s clearly not from the same source.

Then we also get Bragalia’s “confirmation” of the existence of the alleged Roswell Crash metal:-
<font color="red">ROSWELL DEBRIS CONFIRMED AS EXTRATERRESTRIAL: <br/>Lab Located, Scientists Named!</font>

Should one really believe any of what one is told by someone like “Anthony Bragalia?” I suggest that would be very foolish yet the RSRG and other Roswell Skeptics immediately accepted as true what Bragalia said when he made his amazing volte-face on the Roswell Slides on May 10th just a few days after the deblurring of the message on the placard by Nab Lator of the RSRG.

I don’t doubt that Nab Lator’s finding of the hidden message was genuine but one really has to ask whether the “MUMMIFIED BODY …” message was always on those versions of the digital images (which supposedly originated from the alleged slides) that were made available to Jaime Maussan & Co as higher resolution images than those the public were allowed to see. It seems very likely that the placard message was added to the (publicly available) image(s) on the internet soon after the Mexico City event on May 5th by the hoaxers who knew full well that it would be discovered --by use of deblurring software-- soon enough. The hoaxers must have been fully aware of David Rudiak’s work in deblurring the Ramey memo and no doubt decided this was the right time to supply their own message.

Soon afterwards “Anthony Bragalia”, well aware of the change, wrote on May 10th as follows:-

"A CASE OF MISTAKEN IDENTITY …. The word “hoax” has been used to describe the “Roswell Slides” saga. It was not. At least, the principal investigators, Tom Carey, Don Schmitt, and I did not knowingly fake or obfuscate anything. No matter, it is a serious case of mistaken identity, the consequences of which I fully accept”.

So the images merely showed a mummy! This was all too convenient and it all sounded too good to be true. The Roswell Skeptics were handed just what they wanted to hear on a plate and Bragalia was allowed to step aside with his reputation as “the World’s Greatest UFO Researcher” almost untarnished.

The unprecedented U-turn by Bragalia who went from claiming a discovery of earth-shattering scientific importance --proof of the alien presence-- one moment to conceding it was a mistaken identity the next simply did not ring true. Was this U-turn part of the hoaxers’ original plan or had Bragalia just used this excuse as an exit strategy when the BeWitness event showed that few gave the alleged Roswell Slides any further credence? We shall probably never know since the hoaxers are most unlikely to admit their role in this deception.

Even if one accepts that “Anthony Bragalia” was the master hoaxer, his original plan may have been much more ambitious than simply deceiving and discrediting Roswell Believers --and Jaime Maussan in particular. Maussan now realizes of course that Bragalia tricked him and he has accused this fake ufologist of deliberately deceiving him which he did.

The admission that the supposed “alien” images were fake immediately concentrated everyone’s attention on what the pictures actually showed rather than producing speculation on whether the “World’s Greatest UFO Researcher” himself was a fake. It was certainly a clever move by Bragalia if he was, as I suggest, the principal hoaxer in all this. I’ve already said that John Lundberg has been cropcircle-faking, ufo-faking, and alien-faking for at least 23 years and now we seem to have a case of him ufologist-faking!

What the original pictures actually showed was now immaterial since the RSRG and others whose focus had been solely on Jaime Maussan were eager to accept Bragalia's word that this was merely the mummified body of a Native American two-year-old child. Bragalia later claimed that this was a particular mummy from a particular cliff dwelling in AZ which at one time had been displayed in a particular museum. Few challenged that, but he never gave proof of it and most people have lost interest. One really has to wonder why anyone should accept his word now in view of all the unbelievable claims that he was making before May 5th.

I’ve no doubt the “Roswell Slides” has been a hoax all along and that “Anthony Bragalia” was the main perpetrator. I rather doubt that he will ever step forward and tell us exactly who he is or, say, accept an offer to appear on The Paracast to answer questions about this whole charade. It has been a very modern hoax which was almost entirely played out on the internet. Initial rumors of the “Roswell Slides” on various UFO websites drew the inevitable interest of Roswell Believers and Roswell Skeptics alike. The former were eventually supplied with versions of the images which were supposed to be scans of original 1947/48 Kodachrome slides. These, in fact, never existed and there is only the word of the hoaxers that they did. Once the interested parties had been firmly hooked the bogus UFO/alien pantomime could begin with these hoaxers (on the internet) pulling the strings at every turn.

As with other internet UFO frauds the digital images showing the supposed object(s) of interest were of uncertain date and uncertain origin. There could be no certainty whether such an object was a real alien corpse or a SFX dummy alien or, indeed, a small mummy. There were low resolution and high resolution versions of these digital images that were fed to selected parties. Whether or not some of the images had been photoshopped to display subtle non-human features on the “alien” --such as 4 fingers rather than 5—we shall probably never know. (The last time Lundberg and Irving did this with Alien HILDA one version showed the corpse with 6 fingers on each hand which some interpreted as definite signs the creature was non-human!) Different versions of the “Roswell Slides” image(s) must have superficially looked the same and it seems certain there was one version with nothing written on the blurry placard and another seemingly identical one which could be deblurred to show that “MUMMIFIED BODY…” message.

A cast of characters consisting mostly of the hoaxers and the hoaxed then debated the “Roswell Slides” on various websites and forums dealing with the UFO/alien subject. Although there were many sincere Roswell Believers and sincere Roswell Skeptics taking part in this performance the hoaxers themselves were equally vocal using a number of false identities, especially on Kevin Randle’s ‘A Different Perspective’. And, of course, there were quite a few honest folk out there too who strongly felt they should add their own opinions.

I feel sure that, by now, most of the participants in this hugely popular alien soap opera must have realized that the whole thing was a highly elaborate hoax even if they still struggle to see who was behind it. And, knowing the principal hoaxers as I do, I’m sure there’s no chance they will ever admit to it. More likely they –using their false identities on ‘A Different Perspective’ or on The Paracast forum-- will attack me and they will also try to lay the blame for this hoax on others such as Jaime Maussan. Any of you who may have expected to find UFO/alien truth one way or another in the “Roswell Slides” soap opera will have found --once again-- that it has all turned out to be more in the realm of ET, Comic-Con, reality TV, the X-Files, and ‘Paul’ (the movie) which is hardly very surprising given who the hoaxers were.

George Wingfield
 
I'm not nearly so heavily immersed (entrenched?) in the field and its players like Mr. Wingfield appears to be and though I appreciate and am truly fascinated by his detailed and comprehensive insight and contributions to this particular forum thread, I might have to respectfully disagree with what appears to be his position of giving a pass to Maussan, Carey and Schmitt with regard to their culpability in this epic hoax. Bragalia, and who he might "really" be aside, the public face of this charade, the clear ringleaders and the loudest cheerleaders have been Maussan, Carey and Schmitt which, in my opinion, makes them as culpable as anyone else for this shameful fraud. However, to bottom line it, if we want to know who the "real" mastermind(s) were behind the Mexico City Shakedown, if that's really in question, one would simply have to "follow the money." Whoever profited the most from the gate receipts and the streaming revenue would be the party, or parties, directly responsible for conceiving, arranging and foisting this ridiculousness on the world. Not that we'll ever be able to get a clear forensic accounting of the event and its proceeds, as that would require a level of cooperation and financial transparency that the perpetrators would never agree to, as it would hardly be in their best interests. The money, and who got the lion's share(s) of it, would be the true indication of who was behind it all. Alas, like the field of ufology itself, what we're sadly left with are speculations, assumptions and varying degrees of informed (and uninformed) opinions, without the benefit of any real "hard evidence."
 
George, thanks for your post. I'll be studying it over the next week or so.

Everyone! You will not believe it, but I've found another RAT relating to the Roswell pictures. Please note I did not say slides. That is a huge clue to anyone that may be on this trail too! It's just UNBELIEVABLE what people will do to commit outright FRAUD. Yup, I predict HERE and NOW, there is another FRAUD ALREADY working NOW.

Roswell is INSANE.
 
DS, It is indeed UNBELIEVABLE what some people will do to commit outright FRAUD as you say --can't wait to hear what you have found. Santilli, according to some estimates, made several million dollars from selling his fake autopsy footage to TV channels, other news media, researchers and ordinary individuals back in 1995. That was certainly fraud despite the disclaimer clauses which he attached to the VCR tapes he sold. If anyone attaches the magic name ROSWELL to such merchandise they will probably be laughing all the way to the bank. Then someone like Jaime Maussan merely has to pick up some hoax like the Alien Autopsy or these "Roswell Pictures", put on some huge alien/UFO extravaganza to attract the UFO crowd and suchlike punters, and he too will often make enormous profits. Some cynic once remarked honesty never got anyone anywhere!
 
I'm not nearly so heavily immersed (entrenched?) in the field and its players like Mr. Wingfield appears to be and though I appreciate and am truly fascinated by his detailed and comprehensive insight and contributions to this particular forum thread, I might have to respectfully disagree with what appears to be his position of giving a pass to Maussan, Carey and Schmitt with regard to their culpability in this epic hoax. Bragalia, and who he might "really" be aside, the public face of this charade, the clear ringleaders and the loudest cheerleaders have been Maussan, Carey and Schmitt which, in my opinion, makes them as culpable as anyone else for this shameful fraud. However, to bottom line it, if we want to know who the "real" mastermind(s) were behind the Mexico City Shakedown, if that's really in question, one would simply have to "follow the money." Whoever profited the most from the gate receipts and the streaming revenue would be the party, or parties, directly responsible for conceiving, arranging and foisting this ridiculousness on the world. Not that we'll ever be able to get a clear forensic accounting of the event and its proceeds, as that would require a level of cooperation and financial transparency that the perpetrators would never agree to, as it would hardly be in their best interests. The money, and who got the lion's share(s) of it, would be the true indication of who was behind it all. Alas, like the field of ufology itself, what we're sadly left with are speculations, assumptions and varying degrees of informed (and uninformed) opinions, without the benefit of any real "hard evidence."

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Hi, Chris

I am very much in agreement with you as regards Jaime Maussan and what I see as his UFO “religion” that is based in Mexico. Through his large band of faithful followers both in Mexico and the US he has turned UFO/alien belief into a profitable business over the last thirty years. It wasn't my intention to give him a pass because he has been the victim of this hoax and that was certainly something he brought on himself.

I don’t hold with very much of what he says and I’ve sometimes been staggered by the outlandish claims that I’ve heard him make at UFO conferences. I’m staggered too how gullible many audiences appear to be at such conferences (and, equally, most of those who listen to Coast-to-Coast). Whether Jaime Maussan should be banned from such conferences in the US is a difficult question. Where would conference organizers draw the line since there are many UFO celebrities who support the Roswell story and other claims of alien contact and abduction? For example, I’d say Stanton Friedman is completely sincere as regards his Roswell beliefs but IMO he is seriously mistaken. Like Maussan in some respects, he has made a career and a business out of this.

There are also quite a few sincere UFO researchers who support the stories of dubious contactees and abductees but we can’t ban them just because we believe they are wrong. The ones who really should be marginalized are hoaxers and fraudsters who have made up stories and false claims about their own supposed contact with UFOs and aliens. I haven’t a shred of doubt that Whitley Strieber’s Communion –A True Story is pure fiction but even so he will always remain a draw at UFO conferences.

The fact is that it’s almost impossible to root out fraud in this field. The more outrageous a story of alien contact or, say, UFO crash/retrieval, the more anxious UFO conference organizers seem to be to get such people as speakers. That is what swells the coffers by attracting large audiences. However if we started banning people who we deem to be UFO/alien fraudsters from being conference speakers there probably wouldn’t be any more UFO conferences at all. It's people like me who don't get asked to speak at UFO conferences any more because they voice skeptical opinions or they diss their fellow speakers!
 
********************************************************************************************************************

Hi, Chris

... It wasn't my intention to give him a pass because he has been the victim of this hoax and that was certainly something he brought on himself.

Hi George,

I appreciate your thoughtful reply to my recent post. I agree with almost everything you said with the exception of the bit I've quoted above and emphasized where we differ in perspective. Jaime Maussan, in my opinion, was not the victim of a hoax, as you assert above. He was one of the perpetrators of this lucrative hoax. We, the open-minded people genuinely interested in the UFO phenomenon (whatever it is) were the victims of this hoax. Especially the ones who paid money to be subsequently defrauded. I'd also be willing to bet Maussan is one of the primary benefactors of the sizable revenue generated by this hoax.

Credibility is paramount in this field of research (any field of research, really) and I think it's widely accepted that Maussan sold/traded his years ago to be the successful UFO charlatan entertainer he is in Mexico. That's his right. The world is full of P.T. Barnums. Nowhere in my post did I mention anyone being banned. I think it rather a silly concept because, as you intimate, where do we draw the line? Who becomes the credibility police? Is Streiber credible? Travis Walton? Friedman? Jacobs? Greer? O'Brien? We all have to draw our own conclusions and make our own judgements, including conference organizers. Frauds, hoaxers, liars, scammers need to be marginalized and ostracized by the community as a whole. Frankly, there are too many shows that will put these people on, give them a platform, and not apply any skepticism, tough questioning or critical thinking to what they actually have to say. Clearly, The Paracast being one of the exceptions. Shows that abdicate the responsibility of carefully vetting their guests and the claims they make are a huge part of the problem, though I won't name any names as I do not pretend to know them all. However, there are many, with C2C being the largest and one of the most guilty of the lot. (OK, I named one)

From what I can see, the field of "UFO research," if you can really call it that, is actually one big circus tent filled mostly with clowns looking to get over and make a buck. The sincere, curious, serious-minded people trying to find some answers (I'm looking at you Christopher O'Brien) are merely dots in a crowd of face paint. The longer I listen to The Paracast, the more I find this realization reinforced (because of the insight, not because of the quality of guests), to the point where I sometimes want to have a Biedny-like meltdown and get as far away from all of this as possible because it's so exhausting, frustrating and disappointing. Yet my insatiable curiosity and belief that there is really something to this phenomenon keeps me returning. "Just when I thought I was out, they pull me back in..."

I've said it numerous posts before, thanks Gene and Chris for what you do. It's why I'm a Paracast+ subscriber. It's why everyone who participates in this forum should sign up to be one too. You've got to put your money where your mouth is and support the events, organizations, radio shows and podcasts that are trying to do it the right way.
 
Hi George,

I appreciate your thoughtful reply to my recent post. I agree with almost everything you said with the exception of the bit I've quoted above and emphasized where we differ in perspective. Jaime Maussan, in my opinion, was not the victim of a hoax, as you assert above. He was one of the perpetrators of this lucrative hoax. We, the open-minded people genuinely interested in the UFO phenomenon (whatever it is) were the victims of this hoax. Especially the ones who paid money to be subsequently defrauded. I'd also be willing to bet Maussan is one of the primary benefactors of the sizable revenue generated by this hoax.

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Hi, Chris

Nearly ten days have gone by (during which I’ve been away on vacation in Cornwall) without any further comments on this forum so I guess people have either accepted that this was all an elaborate hoax/deception/fraud or else they’ve just got totally bored with the “Roswell Slides” fiasco. I am delighted that we are in such agreement on this and I must concede that “victim” is hardly the right word to describe Jaime Maussan. I don’t know whether he paid any money to Adam Dew for these fake digital images but he certainly might have done so since he obviously planned to make a vastly greater profit by using them as the main attraction to his May 5th ‘Be Witness’ event in Mexico City. About ten years ago Maussan spent 300,000 pesos ($23,000 then) on a skinned squirrel-monkey from Metepec that was sold to him by hoaxer Urso Ruiz as a dead alien. He is certainly a willing victim of such alien hoaxes but also perhaps a cynical one who thinks solely of the potential profits.

Nevertheless I think one should distinguish between the primary hoaxers who concoct such deceptions and the secondary ones who promote these claims of alien contact, photos of alleged aliens or else flying saucer crash/retrievals plus recovery of alleged aliens (dead or alive), etc. Here is a list of a few primary hoaxers who have made just such claims:-

(1) George Adamski
(2) Billy Meier
(3) Ed Walters
(4) Richard Doty
(5) “Dr Jonathan Reed”
(6) “Anthony Bragalia” + Adam Dew

Note that the first three produced faked photos of UFOs to support their claims and the last two produced photos of what they suggested were alien bodies. I consider that the 1975 Travis Walton UFO abduction story was a hoax too and there are many other false tales of alien contact or abduction.

The secondary deceivers, if you like, are people like Jaime Maussan and Linda Howe who support many such false claims and promote them --producing what I'd call “UFO-tainment” though that’s not a term they would allow. Whether or not they actually believe the UFO/alien claims which they are supporting is neither here nor there. They are hardly "victims" of those primary hoaxers who they claim to support –that’s a more appropriate description of their audiences who have paid to hear this sort of thing from them.

As you say the field of “UFO research” has become more like a big circus tent filled with clowns who are out to make a buck from their gullible audiences. Some of us despair, throw out all our UFO literature, and go away trying to erase all thoughts of this seemingly ridiculous subject. However escape is often impossible since, like you, I still think there is some substance to the mysterious UFO phenomenon --if not necessarily in terms of extraterrestrial spaceships piloted by aliens. Perhaps we should be described as skeptical agnostics as regards UFOs rather than complete atheists like the late Phil Klass or hoaxer John Lundberg?
 
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Hi, Chris

Nearly ten days have gone by (during which I’ve been away on vacation in Cornwall) without any further comments on this forum so I guess people have either accepted that this was all an elaborate hoax/deception/fraud or else they’ve just got totally bored with the “Roswell Slides” fiasco. I am delighted that we are in such agreement on this and I must concede that “victim” is hardly the right word to describe Jaime Maussan. I don’t know whether he paid any money to Adam Dew for these fake digital images but he certainly might have done so since he obviously planned to make a vastly greater profit by using them as the main attraction to his May 5th ‘Be Witness’ event in Mexico City. About ten years ago Maussan spent 300,000 pesos ($23,000 then) on a skinned squirrel-monkey from Metepec that was sold to him by hoaxer Urso Ruiz as a dead alien. He is certainly a willing victim of such alien hoaxes but also perhaps a cynical one who thinks solely of the potential profits.

Nevertheless I think one should distinguish between the primary hoaxers who concoct such deceptions and the secondary ones who promote these claims of alien contact, photos of alleged aliens or else flying saucer crash/retrievals plus recovery of alleged aliens (dead or alive), etc. Here is a list of a few primary hoaxers who have made just such claims:-

(1) George Adamski
(2) Billy Meier
(3) Ed Walters
(4) Richard Doty
(5) “Dr Jonathan Reed”
(6) “Anthony Bragalia” + Adam Dew

Note that the first three produced faked photos of UFOs to support their claims and the last two produced photos of what they suggested were alien bodies. I consider that the 1975 Travis Walton UFO abduction story was a hoax too and there are many other false tales of alien contact or abduction.

The secondary deceivers, if you like, are people like Jaime Maussan and Linda Howe who support many such false claims and promote them --producing what I'd call “UFO-tainment” though that’s not a term they would allow. Whether or not they actually believe the UFO/alien claims which they are supporting is neither here nor there. They are hardly "victims" of those primary hoaxers who they claim to support –that’s a more appropriate description of their audiences who have paid to hear this sort of thing from them.

As you say the field of “UFO research” has become more like a big circus tent filled with clowns who are out to make a buck from their gullible audiences. Some of us despair, throw out all our UFO literature, and go away trying to erase all thoughts of this seemingly ridiculous subject. However escape is often impossible since, like you, I still think there is some substance to the mysterious UFO phenomenon --if not necessarily in terms of extraterrestrial spaceships piloted by aliens. Perhaps we should be described as skeptical agnostics as regards UFOs rather than complete atheists like the late Phil Klass or hoaxer John Lundberg?
Hi George,

Great reply and certainly worth the wait! I believe you and I are on the same page. Not to get "off topic" in this thread but one part of your response piqued my curiosity. I think your hoaxers list is spot-on but I've always thought that the Travis Walton experience was, for lack of a better term, the "real deal" based on what I've read and interviews I've heard/watched. He seemed like someone who has had a definitive high strange experience involving non-human entities of some kind, though not necessarily "extra-terrestrial" in nature. The number of witnesses and the fact that most all of them, including Walton, ultimately passed lie detector tests, or so I've read, seem to lend an element of credibility to his account not usually found in most "alien abduction" claims. I'm interested in what your dissenting opinion is regarding his claims and the facts you've uncovered to arrive at your conclusion. If you are amenable to sharing your thoughts with me (and the forum), or share a link to a post (or posts) you feel demonstrate a rigorous case against his claims, I'd appreciate it, as I've yet to come across a cogent argument that comprehensively debunks his story. If not appropriate to answer here in the thread, since it's unrelated to the Roswell slides, then perhaps via a direct message? If it's too complex to explain or too time consuming I completely understand that as well. I've appreciated and enjoyed our dialog in this forum thread. Thank you.

Cheers,
Chris
 
Here is a thread regarding Mr Walton:
Travis Walton | The Paracast Community Forums

RE the slides does anyone know if all the testimony of all of Maussan's "experts" has been translated into English yet?
Thanks Han! I had reviewed that thread before but I went back after your post an re-read all of the posts to refresh my memory. I still come away as one of the "believers" in Walton's story, to be honest, despite some compelling and valid points made by Ufology and yourself. I find myself sharing similar opinions as expressed by Goggs and Burnt in that thread. It's why I was interested in George's take to see if he had more to share than what was outlined in that Walton thread and the links shared.
 
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