UFO best guesses, double takes, and what you have come to term, Myth or Reality

[marduk]

Anybody have anything thoughts on the Coyame UFO incident? I can't remember if the segment I saw was from Sightings or Unsolved Mysteries, but that one gave me chills.

Wasn't the object like 16 feet across or something? Prototype drone maybe?

An F-14 Tomcat is what, about 60 feet long and wide? At 16 feet, it's smaller across than a Cessna.

 

[Red]

Wasn't the object like 16 feet across or something? Prototype drone maybe?

An F-14 Tomcat is what, about 60 feet long and wide? At 16 feet, it's smaller across than a Cessna.

No, it was the 1974 Mexican incident in which a small private airplane allegedly collided with a UFO, causing both to crash.

 

[matthew1977]

I talked to a gentleman working at a local VFW (Veterans of Foreign Wars) and after asking if he heard any of his patrons talking about war ufo stories he told me he was a radar maintenance technician and he and another tech were working in a radar tower at Gulf Breeze and after a UFO was reported, both maintenance men were kicked out of the tower.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk

 

[marduk]

No, it was the 1974 Mexican incident in which a small private airplane allegedly collided with a UFO, causing both to crash.

ya, ya, that's the one I mean.

When American forces arrived on scene at about 4 p.m. on August 26, donning bio-hazard suits, they beheld a grizzly sight. All of the Mexican recovery team members were apparently dead and sitting on the back of one of the flatbed trucks was a metallic saucer craft the color of polished steel, about 16 feet across, with no markings.

Mid-Air Crash Leads to Legendary Mexican UFO Encounter

 

[Red]

ya, ya, that's the one I mean.



Mid-Air Crash Leads to Legendary Mexican UFO Encounter

Yep, that would be it. You were right.

 

[victimized]

ya, ya, that's the one I mean.



Mid-Air Crash Leads to Legendary Mexican UFO Encounter

Atucha I Nuclear Power Plant - Wikipedia
1974 activated in Argentina.

The rugged and isolated Hazara and Swat districts of northern Pakistan were subjected to a magnitude 6.2 earthquake at 12:11 UTC on December 28, 1974.

Human self combustion in 1974
Jack Angel (SHC) - Wikipedia

1974: A globe-shaped UFO exploded near the town of Donetsk in the
northern Rostov region of Russia. Debris from the explosion examined by
many people.

Alleged UFO Spaceship Spotted In Karachi, Pakistan [PHOTOS]

1974 gas eruptions - metal and hydrogen affected by Sun condition/unnatural interaction
List of pipeline accidents in the United States (1950–74) - Wikipedia


From the Archives, 1974: Climate Change Threatens Food Supply

1974 meningitis outbreak Brazil.

Forest flattened in Russia by "sun burst"....nuclear experiments.

Forest fires America 1974
Beaver County Times - Google News Archive Search

METALLIC UFO sighting
Looking Back At The Mysterious Betz Sphere Artifact • Latest UFO sightings

UFO condition, caused by and because of unnatural changes to Earth's metal nuclear condition in change of fusion.

 

[ALPHA ROMEO UNIFORM]

A change of pace not surprised about the NAZI Rockets and remember a Polish chap who was a slave labor worker in Poland and sent to occupied France he suggested they had unknown fly overs at night time not allied aircraft while digging the trenches for the rail tracks and launch pads.

American Scientists Took the First Photo of Earth From Space Using Nazi Rockets | Smart News | Smithsonian

The Hexagon on Saturn's North Pole Has Mysteriously Changed Color

 

[Burnt State]

Anybody have anything thoughts on the Coyame UFO incident? I can't remember if the segment I saw was from Sightings or Unsolved Mysteries, but that one gave me chills.

UFO mythology thanks to the Deneb team. Pure invention gains notoriety because of the power of the story - an ongoing theme of its own right in Ufology just as the theme of the Contactee (Strieber) is a well woven thread that generates compelling responses from the audience. Like Gulf Breeze or Guardian they become flash points for belief. And as Chariots of the Gods & Donald Trump proves if you say something often enough, no matter how ludicrous and irrational it might be, you will get the attention of an audience and they will want your autograph and to buy your t-shirt. Things make sense in the way that they are said and in how wild the tale is. We love audacious stories, hence Greer and Adamski and Leir and Lear and one armed Swiss Farmers and on it goes (& I cozied up to some of those initially). Besides, doesn't everyone have buried in their hearts a desire to sleep with Aura Rhanes or at least make contact with space brother?

 

[Red]

UFO mythology thanks to the Deneb team. Pure invention gains notoriety because of the power of the story - an ongoing theme of its own right in Ufology just as the theme of the Contactee (Strieber) is a well woven thread that generates compelling responses from the audience. Like Gulf Breeze or Guardian they become flash points for belief. And as Chariots of the Gods & Donald Trump proves if you say something often enough, no matter how ludicrous and irrational it might be, you will get the attention of an audience and they will want your autograph and to buy your t-shirt. Things make sense in the way that they are said and in how wild the tale is. We love audacious stories, hence Greer and Adamski and Leir and Lear and one armed Swiss Farmers and on it goes (& I cozied up to some of those initially).

It figures that it's probably a hoax, but I can't help it, it's still one of the stories I like best right now.

 

[Red]

Besides, doesn't everyone have buried in their hearts a desire to sleep with Aura Rhanes or at least make contact with space brother?

I just got home a little while ago and hit the wrong button posting my response too soon. I don't know that I care one whit whether or not the space brothers exist, Aura Rhanes and/or the space brothers just being another facet of the hero's journey or some sort of space age faery story. It's the sense of wonder and the need to ponder the imponderable mysteries of the universe that keeps me rapt.

 

[Burnt State]

I just got home a little while ago and hit the wrong button posting my response too soon. I don't know that I care one whit whether or not the space brothers exist, Aura Rhanes and/or the space brothers just being another facet of the hero's journey or some sort of space age faery story. It's the sense of wonder and the need to ponder the imponderable mysteries of the universe that keeps me rapt.

So if you had the chance to get real time proof and/or insight into those imponderable mysteries would not the culmination of that be actual contact with what or whoever might be the pilot of those "ships"?

In a rather infamous and often quoted interview with Jaques Vallée by Jerome Clark, Vallée suggests the researcher somehow interrupt the control system by involving themselves with the phenomenon in a more direct manner. This could be interpreted a number of ways, but ultimately, to know the nature of the mystery is it not about making contact with the unknown other?

So while I speak humorously about Aura and the brothers from space, would you not, if you had the chance, in order to know the mystery more clearly, want to make actual contact with those real "pilots" to see the truth for yourself, or is it just about the pondering for you. I guess the other way of considering this question is, how far would you go to know the truth of it all?

 

[Red]

So if you had the chance to get real time proof and/or insight into those imponderable mysteries would not the culmination of that be actual contact with what or whoever might be the pilot of those "ships"?

In a rather infamous and often quoted interview with Jaques Vallée by Jerome Clark, Vallée suggests the researcher somehow interrupt the control system by involving themselves with the phenomenon in a more direct manner. This could be interpreted a number of ways, but ultimately, to know the nature of the mystery is it not about making contact with the unknown other?

So while I speak humorously about Aura and the brothers from space, would you not, if you had the chance, in order to know the mystery more clearly, want to make actual contact with those real "pilots" to see the truth for yourself, or is it just about the pondering for you. I guess the other way of considering this question is, how far would you go to know the truth of it all?

Short answer, I don't know, but I don't think so. Even if I were given proof, who would believe said proof absent anything resembling an "act of God?"

I've thought for a very long about my own brief experiences in the frame of understanding that perhaps we are supposed to know that there is mystery. But recently I've begun to think about why the mystery.

I had to take a class on Protestantism in college, it was a required course. The institution was originally founded on Kierkegaard's ideas; and the class was a throwback to the early days when religion had a larger role in curiculum, and students were required to attend church services. There is the idea that what God has revealed to us through scripture has the capacity for imperfection as we are imperfect creatures, our institutions and edicts can just as easily subvert the will of God as follow that will. This came from a couple of Lutheran pastors, I realize this isn't always the stance taken by many Christians, but these guys weren't afraid of the thornier philosophical side of things.

Perhaps we have a capacity for misunderstanding that is hardwired into us. Our very human-ness keeps us from seeing the universe as it truly it. Perhaps something pokes us periodically to see if have evolved past our inability to see beyond the limits of our own physical perception.

Judaism believes that only a small part of God is revealed to us, the rest is unknowable.
Perhaps this mystery is the creative engine for the universe, having no form or coherence that we could recognize or acknowledge without trying to form it to some kind of order, comprised of cold facts thereby destroying it's very nature in our attempts to define it.

 

[Burnt State]

Short answer, I don't know, but I don't think so. Even if I were given proof, who would believe said proof absent anything resembling an "act of God?"

I've thought for a very long about my own brief experiences in the frame of understanding that perhaps we are supposed to know that there is mystery. But recently I've begun to think about why the mystery.

So you're saying that it's the idea of the mystery thst engages you...

I wasn't asking if you would be able to prove anything to anyone, but whether or not you'd really want to meet and know what's behind the UFO mystery. Is the 'I don't think so' part about not being able to share the proof or because of the impact of such a meeting or...?

Just curious....as I'm curious about why people double take The UFO and keep coming back for more and to what extent people are open to finding the answer.

To encounter the alien other i would think is up there pretty high with all time shocks to the system.

 

[Red]

So you're saying that it's the idea of the mystery thst engages you...

Yep.

I wasn't asking if you would be able to prove anything to anyone, but whether or not you'd really want to meet and know what's behind the UFO mystery. Is the 'I don't think so' part about not being able to share the proof or because of the impact of such a meeting or...?

Just curious....as I'm curious about why people double take The UFO and keep coming back for more and to what extent people are open to finding the answer.

To encounter the alien other i would think is up there pretty high with all time shocks to the system.

Still, I don't know. I'm thinking right now if the answer to life, the universe and everything were offered up to me how I would respond. I know some people would jump at the chance (I would have 10-20 years ago) and others would say no. I might be one of the few who would respond with an "I have to think about it first." I don't know that the disclosure of an "other' would be so jarring, it might be. But then where do you go from there?

It's the "knowing" that might be a lot less fun than any speculations and what if's. As soon as something becomes known, it starts to become mundane.

 

[Burnt State]

I don't know that the disclosure of an "other' would be so jarring, it might be. But then where do you go from there?

It's the "knowing" that might be a lot less fun than any speculations and what if's. As soon as something becomes known, it starts to become mundane.

From all accounts of people who have close contact with saucers and/or their occupants the experience is life altering to a degree and far from mundane. Take your favourite story where, for the Mexican Retrieval team, the narrative makes it life ending. But for those who do report close contact the story seems to be rather persistent, and perhaps even haunting.

But maybe to take it further into the territory of knowing, as all the double takes speak to a desire to know more clearly can I ask one more piece? If, as queried once upon a time with Bruce Duensing on Radio Misterioso, you could ask the alien one thing that would be answered, telepathically of course, what would it be?

 

[Red]

From all accounts of people who have close contact with saucers and/or their occupants the experience is life altering to a degree and far from mundane. Take your favourite story where, for the Mexican Retrieval team, the narrative makes it life ending. But for those who do report close contact the story seems to be rather persistent, and perhaps even haunting.

But maybe to take it further into the territory of knowing, as all the double takes speak to a desire to know more clearly can I ask one more piece? If, as queried once upon a time with Bruce Duensing on Radio Misterioso, you could ask the alien one thing that would be answered, telepathically of course, what would it be?

Burnt, I want to take a quick moment to say I am really enjoying the conversation.

I think there a huge difference between interaction and/or exposure to whatever it is versus being handed incontrovertable proof on the proverbial silver platter. I also get stuck on whether it's really a great spiritual awakening or only just a percception of one.

You've indicated (and so has Greg Bishop if I recall correctly) that there seems to be an act of co-creation at play. Art, as a fictional representation of the world, still has the capacity to say great truths about beauty and ugliness in the world. I had a another professor who encouraged me to read Castaneda while acknowledging the rollicking amount of fraud inherent in his works. Again this was another instance of acknowledging the truth that can be found in the most fictional of settings. And this was long before there were discussions regarding cultural appropriation.

The universe seems to poke me in the other direction when I venture too far to one side or the other of belief and disbelief. To oblige the universe, I am currently sitting on the fence with no intention of moving right now.

 

[victimized]

Burnt, I want to take a quick moment to say I am really enjoying the conversation.

I think there a huge difference between interaction and/or exposure to whatever it is versus being handed incontrovertable proof on the proverbial silver platter. I also get stuck on whether it's really a great spiritual awakening or only just a percception of one.

You've indicated (and so has Greg Bishop if I recall correctly) that there seems to be an act of co-creation at play. Art, as a fictional representation of the world, still has the capacity to say great truths about beauty and ugliness in the world. I had a another professor who encouraged me to read Castaneda while acknowledging the rollicking amount of fraud inherent in his works. Again this was another instance of acknowledging the truth that can be found in the most fictional of settings. And this was long before there were discussions regarding cultural appropriation.

The universe seems to poke me in the other direction when I venture too far to one side or the other of belief and disbelief. To oblige the universe, I am currently sitting on the fence with no intention of moving right now.

Human life has always been advised of new information by change.

If we review conscious awareness, the ancients advise us by literature that they changed the atmospheric to Earth body fusion and interaction.

Since converting was outlawed as a human practice, the atmospheric body remassed......modern science once again applied conversion, so life changed again in an attack.

All of the information recorded therefore becomes new self advice for conscious awareness in the conditions of being advised.

This is how the alien became new atmospheric advice and was considered to be a Deity (conjured presence).....when the same information (attacked by conversion) was being advised as a human status before.....by the human mind reviewing the information. Therefore the human self is self advised, the owner and causer of all changes by choice and application of machinery/inventions. Converting of fusion previously happened before, the human was advised and called the condition Satanic.....now they call the condition Alien.

Previous converSION as an ancient practice....the crystal fusion that affected the nuclear of dust.
Modern converSION.......the nuclear of dust. Therefore the science has given the information a new Deity description, yet the information is about change through SION....conversion.

AI = artificial
Machines = artificial as an invention

Intelligence became artificially affected due to the applications of the machines.

Deity......fake presence in atmosphere

The owners of life on Earth in the natural condition of the atmosphere......Nature. Nature can only be changed by a human life who causes the changes.

A review of Nature........Nature exists in a destroyed Earth condition as archaeological evidence. Nature re-evolved. Nature once again is being attacked.

Value...already owned by each body in Nature valued as the description. Nature was not given a value of alien ownership.....alien = alien.

The review of spirit stated Earth was the Mother, the atmosphere was the Mother, the Nature was the Mother, and the human male created by the human Mother. The human male, the reviewer and valuer of what he considered was the holy life condition on Earth.

M given a holy spiritual value of 1000. The Mother of Christ given a holy value of 1000.
Alpha to M = AM, the Holy review for considering spiritual holiness as 1000.

The End given a value of 2000 as Z, as a reviewed status of ending the holiness of the Mother.

ConverSION therefore became known as ZION........destruction of the Law of the Mountain....fusion of stone Law broken
Zion (Hebrew: צִיּוֹן‎‎ Tsiyyon)Tsiyyon: a mountain in Jer., also a name for Jer.

The spiritual attack therefore advised that life was attacked before, and previously had been attacked by data verification in historical evidence.
www.accuweather.com/en/weather-news/disappearing-dead-sea...photos/45183381

http://www.bibleplaces.com/deadsea/
Run a current through water and its molecules will split up at the electrodes forming Hydrogen and Oxygen (H20 => H2 + O2 requiring 854KJ/Mol)[1]. In fact, a high enough current will heat a small water bath to the point of boiling during a very brief period of electrolysis.

Electrolysis of water - Wikipedia

Unexplained Lights at the shores of the Dead Sea in Israel |UFO Sightings Hotspot

Are the oceans getting saltier?

Warmer water temperatures can result in coral bleaching. When water is too warm, corals will expel the algae (zooxanthellae) living in their tissues causing the coral to turn completely white. ... In 2005, the U.S. lost half of its coral reefs in the Caribbean in one year due to a massive bleaching event.
What is coral bleaching? - NOAA's National Ocean Service
oceanservice.noaa.gov/facts/coral_bleach.html

Aliens Under The Sea - UFO Evidence

The human mind aware status knew by self evidence...pyramid relay/temples that the Dead Sea outcome had been caused by a UFO attack/conversion and the holy CHRIST water body died and was salted. Water and its spiritual status considered to be holy as a spiritual state, the only reason why life continues on Planet Earth.

The ancients therefore advised themselves that they had caused the UFO condition as an unexplained act and it attacked life and converted the spirit holiness of water on Earth. They began to notice the life attack was connected through the "salting" condition.

 

[Sue]

I don't know that I care one whit whether or not the space brothers exist, Aura Rhanes and/or the space brothers just being another facet of the hero's journey or some sort of space age faery story. It's the sense of wonder and the need to ponder the imponderable mysteries of the universe that keeps me rapt.

I second that emotion. All the more heartily because as life goes on I have less and less faith in even the idea of final answers.

So if you had the chance to get real time proof and/or insight into those imponderable mysteries would not the culmination of that be actual contact with what or whoever might be the pilot of those "ships"?

In a rather infamous and often quoted interview with Jaques Vallée by Jerome Clark, Vallée suggests the researcher somehow interrupt the control system by involving themselves with the phenomenon in a more direct manner. This could be interpreted a number of ways, but ultimately, to know the nature of the mystery is it not about making contact with the unknown other?

I think Vallee also writes about that in Forbidden Science (cuz I never heard the interview). It's an interesting approach. Ritual magic? Chaos magic? Incipient psychosis? For a while I kept coming across pieces of soft fabric discarded in unusual settings and I was like, what would Jacques Vallee do? Could this be the trail to faerie? Do I want to go there?

But my take home message from Vallee's approach in that regard is that we're not talking about doing science here. We're A) talking about a personally meaningful quest for knowledge that can't be standardized or measured or rendered objective, at least in the America-in-the-50s sense of objectivity. That doesn't mean it's not real or important or true in its own temporary way; and/or B) dealing with alternatively incarnated Others with which we apparently have some limited communication abilities. In which case I would suggest good manners and a circumspect attitude. That's leaving aside C) wanting to get knowledge and control over UFOs and other manifestations of weirdness in order to possess and exercise power in the human world, which probably accounts for 86 percent of people's interest in such matters.

Also, I don't think of co-creation so much as a conscious process as errors building on errors leading to nearly failed or terminally ambiguous communication attempts. In other words, similar to how humans co-create their reality.

If I could ask an alien one thing, I'd want to hear it tell a joke.

 

[Burnt State]

I think Vallee also writes about that in Forbidden Science (cuz I never heard the interview). It's an interesting approach. Ritual magic? Chaos magic? Incipient psychosis? For a while I kept coming across pieces of soft fabric discarded in unusual settings and I was like, what would Jacques Vallee do? Could this be the trail to faerie? Do I want to go there?

When a path suddenly opens in forest you have a choice to follow the yellow brick road or go back the way you came. I would go to faerie myself. ...the way must be tried, Tentanda Via and all that jazz. Who knows what awaits round the bend...

But my take home message from Vallee's approach in that regard is that we're not talking about doing science here. We're A) talking about a personally meaningful quest for knowledge that can't be standardized or measured or rendered objective, at least in the America-in-the-50s sense of objectivity. That doesn't mean it's not real or important or true in its own temporary way; and/or B) dealing with alternatively incarnated Others with which we apparently have some limited communication abilities. In which case I would suggest good manners and a circumspect attitude. That's leaving aside C) wanting to get knowledge and control over UFOs and other manifestations of weirdness in order to possess and exercise power in the human world, which probably accounts for 86 percent of people's interest in such matters.

Well Vallee himself engaged in some ritualistic antics to see if he could stimulate a response from the alien other - nothing happened. It was his personally meaningful approach after a long life of studying the phenomenon from as many angles as he could craft.

I can appreciate option B whatever it is that you might make contact with something outside yourself that may originate from inside self. Who knows what one may see after a night of scrying?

Option C I have no time for.

Also, I don't think of co-creation so much as a conscious process as errors building on errors leading to nearly failed or terminally ambiguous communication attempts. In other words, similar to how humans co-create their reality.

If I could ask an alien one thing, I'd want to hear it tell a joke.

How conscious are we of constructing reality as we construct it? Some interesting things go down in the abandoned graveyard at witch's midnight. Lovecraftian creatures abound and our interpretation of such horrors produces horror as the mind tries to assimilate impossible denizens from the outer reaches of our imagination. It all strikes me as entirely collaborative and yeah, the joke's probably on us.

 

[victimized]

When a path suddenly opens in forest you have a choice to follow the yellow brick road or go back the way you came. I would go to faerie myself. ...the way must be tried, Tentanda Via and all that jazz. Who knows what awaits round the bend...


Well Vallee himself engaged in some ritualistic antics to see if he could stimulate a response from the alien other - nothing happened. It was his personally meaningful approach after a long life of studying the phenomenon from as many angles as he could craft.

I can appreciate option B whatever it is that you might make contact with something outside yourself that may originate from inside self. Who knows what one may see after a night of scrying?

Option C I have no time for.


How conscious are we of constructing reality as we construct it? Some interesting things go down in the abandoned graveyard at witch's midnight. Lovecraftian creatures abound and our interpretation of such horrors produces horror as the mind tries to assimilate impossible denizens from the outer reaches of our imagination. It all strikes me as entirely collaborative and yeah, the joke's probably on us.

Re ----source. A human male reviews information that he states is a source. He advises his own person the source is nuclear dust and then considered how he could source the power of the dust. He called the condition fusion. He then went about thinking/inventing a machine to convert the fusion and to cause conversion is to attack the natural fusion to make it release its powers. So he learnt how to re source the source, that he already named a resource.

Therefore he should advise his own mind that if he called dust a resource then it was already created by an act of converting higher matter....because it was re sourced.

As the occultist believes that Satan is the Creator of the Universe, then obviously Satan was converted into an alien. The occultist review of the burning angels states that the burning angels protected the stone of Earth.

He then tells himself that he can resource the resource up until the resource is gone....so then he tries to theorize a new model for resourcing a source that he does not own on Earth.....space plasma.

How is he going to get plasma to come to Earth, as he reviews out of space? Oh, he says the UFO brings the plasma to Earth, for he believes that aliens are just like human beings (organic matter) and tries to convince us all that we have aliens inside of our bodies as our Creator....and instead he causes metallic implants to begin to form beneath our cellular layer as proof that we are not aliens.

Our occult science brother thinks that he is not destroying the source....yet nuclear dust is disappearing. Therefore he is losing the source, not gaining it.

He tells himself that the alien is artificial and also fake and it is unidentifiable as the resource is destroyed, causing the manifestation of a fake spirit that never existed in life on Earth.

The alien, released out of converted uranium that supported life then began to attack our natural cell life.

The only unnatural act that he is applying as an occultist-scientist (removing what was hidden) is the destruction of the resource...nuclear dust and the spirit of nuclear dust that had been hidden inside of its own fusion.

We all therefore got to witness the spirit inside of nuclear dust as it was destroyed...so we have seen a lot of alien images.