CapnG
Devil's Advocate
Karma to you
Uh-huh.
I can't help but notice you didn't answer the question I posed. That's getting to be a habit for you lately.
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UFO in Montreal
- Thread starter Angel of Ioren
- Start date
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Uh-huh.
I can't help but notice you didn't answer the question I posed. That's getting to be a habit for you lately.
ALPHA ROMEO UNIFORM
Whittingham
CapnG
Devil's Advocate
Uh-huhGet a life buddy!
Dude, seriously when did you turn into such a complete and total dick? I remember having conversations with you in the past the were both civil and informative. WTF?
Oh and for future reference, telling someone on this board to "get a life"... kinda falls flat.
Angel of Ioren
Friendly Skeptic
Blowfish, I do think CapnG did pose a valid question. I think that if I did investigate it and found it to be mundane, no amount of evidence I could present would convince anyone that I wasn't trying to debunk it. Hence it not being worth my time to investigate it as has been suggested. The doctor saw something he couldn't explain - he explicitly states that he thinks it wasn't from this planet.
ALPHA ROMEO UNIFORM
Whittingham
Angel of loren ,
I happy for you
and the other member needs to use profanities is not worth a mentionI think over all, the back biting (or perceived ) is disappointing to say the least. This would have been a good time for people to pull together and interview - clearly this was seen by several people. So while it still fresh in people minds, others would prefer to snap, snipe and snip at others. Disappointing.
Had I lived closer, I would have been there trying to find out where ever I could find, Listening to so many of the past shows, provides people with a general idea of what to ask. IS there any way we can find out who else was involved, give me names and I would try talking to them.
Had I lived closer, I would have been there trying to find out where ever I could find, Listening to so many of the past shows, provides people with a general idea of what to ask. IS there any way we can find out who else was involved, give me names and I would try talking to them.
CapnG
Devil's Advocate
That's not quite what I meant but you gotta admit, to people in the "real world" those of us on this board would probably be pictured as a collection overweight, 40 year-old virgins, living in our parent's basements, squintilly typing away on the interwebs about things that don't exist and arguing about things that are really only taken seriously by idiots, lunatics and the snake-oil salesmen that prey on them.
That doesn't exactly leave a lot of high-ground to claim. Actually, it's kind of depressing.
Also, since personal and personnel have differently stressed accents they can't really be considered homophones either. Whoops... my bad.
Ron Collins
Curiously Confused
So I contacted the Quebec UFO Research guys. I'll let you know if I hear back. Basically, I have asked if they want to jump on the forum and talk about the case they are investigating. Apparently, Chris Rutkowski is the prominent researcher. He has been a guest on the Paracast. So hopefully we will hear back.
tyder001
Paranormal Adept
Here's my thing about this: Angel is right in that if he did find it was a balloon somebody would say 'no it wasn't your just a debunker." ON the other hand the reverse is also true. An astronaught or a pilot who says "it was a craft" is told it was Venus or a weather balloon or the sub conscious manifestation of the birth canal. 
I'm not a beleiever in u.f.o.' s but Leslie Keene (did i spell the rite?) has really gotten me to thinking more seroiusly about it lately.
As always scuse muh spillin but I ain't goin back over it and kerectin it.
I'm not a beleiever in u.f.o.' s but Leslie Keene (did i spell the rite?)
has really gotten me to thinking more seroiusly about it lately.As always scuse muh spillin but I ain't goin back over it and kerectin it.
stphrz
Stuffed Tiger
Radar? Nope. Landing traces? Nope. Video? Nope. Pictures? Nope. A few people who saw something that distressed them in the sky? Yep.
A terrific lead indeed!
I know! I Angelo, intrepid ufo investigator extrordinare, will, with the help of my special task force of professionals, track down these people and pester them with deep insightful questions! Never mind that I have not done this before. My supreme intelligence will see me through! I will, with my presumptiveness boldly announce that I am acting on behalf of The Paracast! Those witnesses will be so impressed with me they will spill their guts more completely and profoundly than in the entire history of spilling or guts!
Get real man. This is essentially what you are asking Angelo to do and the way you are asking him to think. Angelo is a smart guy. Why do you want him to act like a goof? Do you have that little respect for him?
Besides, if you really think that engaging in direct investigation is a prerequisite for discernment in a field that has no established investigative standards or prerequisites you are adrift in your own circular logic.
One more thing for you to think about. Are all the folks out there in the trenches doing the grunt work really helping? Or are quite a few seriously poisoning the pool with poor research? Or even worse, making a complete utter mockery of the field? You want more of that? Really? What you are advocating is going to lead to just that.
ALPHA ROMEO UNIFORM
Whittingham
Better than a armchair critic!
CapnG
Devil's Advocate
Better than a armchair critic!
Not really. Sloppy investigation would just give debunkers more ammo by allowing them to attack both the data and the investigator. The armchair critic has no such impact on the field.
ALPHA ROMEO UNIFORM
Whittingham
How do you know?
tyder001
Paranormal Adept
To say or insinuate that "going out and investigating" isn't better than not investigtating is kind of silly. Not getting into the whole thing between Christ and Angel. I'm talking in general. Yeah, there is a lot of bad investigation but the alternative (common sense here guys) is not to "not" investigate. If nobody had ever researched and investigated going to the moon we would still be reading sci fi and talking about it. Nothing wrong with that but it's not the same as actually going there. I'm not an investigator. Angel isn't an investigator. It's o.k. we both have our places. But, don't knock Chris because he's "out there investigating" it make you look silly and petty. By the way I don't think Chris hates Angel and I don't think Angel is a close minded person . I just think they are coming from two different mindsets and both have strong opinions. But, the investigation part? Don't knock that or at least in my opinion you shouldn't knock that.
---------- Post added at 12:08 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:07 PM ----------
OMG! I said Christ and Angel. The Fruedian implications are mind boggling. LOL! I'm gonna leave it.
---------- Post added at 12:08 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:07 PM ----------
OMG! I said Christ and Angel. The Fruedian implications are mind boggling. LOL! I'm gonna leave it.
Ron Collins
Curiously Confused
Expecting the average Joe to engage in investigations of sightings with no training is pointless and counterproductive. Any conclusions they make could be ripped apart by the opposition. It's just not a good idea. I see nothing wrong with people being interested in the subject matter but not wanting to engage it. That is precisely why the Paracast and other outlets exist. This is not a private inestigator/researcher forum. It is a public forum that discusses the paranormal. I think it rediculous that anyone would expect the forum to be 'represented' in an investigation. That is not the stated purpose. What it shows is the willingness of some to snip at every minor detail from those with whom they disagree.
This sort of stuff is a huge reason that real progress and compromise has not and likely will not be made. For me it is frustrating. Its like looking at ta chess board and seeing that stalemate is the best option and that winning is impossible. Yet neither side is willing to concede and work towads the compromise. Very frustrating.
Also, I doubt Gene wants forum members running around claiming to be representatives of his show and company brand while pestering the shit out of people that have sightings. I sure that can't have any possible legal repercussions.
The whole idea that the forum needs to be represented in an investigation needs to really end here in my opinion. Before this gets out of hand.
This sort of stuff is a huge reason that real progress and compromise has not and likely will not be made. For me it is frustrating. Its like looking at ta chess board and seeing that stalemate is the best option and that winning is impossible. Yet neither side is willing to concede and work towads the compromise. Very frustrating.
Also, I doubt Gene wants forum members running around claiming to be representatives of his show and company brand while pestering the shit out of people that have sightings. I sure that can't have any possible legal repercussions.
The whole idea that the forum needs to be represented in an investigation needs to really end here in my opinion. Before this gets out of hand.
tyder001
Paranormal Adept
Uhhh, I must have missed something Ron. Or you are addressing another concern. I have absolutely no intention of saying somebody should "represent" the Paracast. My point was that 'experienced" field research by people with the resources and time to do it is a good thing. I'm afraid that the paranormal until/unless it gets private funds for research or the military does it will always be a fringe investigation/scientific endeavor. That said I still think investigation is a good thing and I salute folks like Chris and Jim Marrs and scientist such as Taarg and Sheldrake. Other than that I didn't mean to go where this has headed.
stphrz
Stuffed Tiger
You missed something. It was Christopher who said that.Uhhh, I must have missed something Ron. Or you are addressing another concern. I have absolutely no intention of saying somebody should "represent" the Paracast. My point was that 'experienced" field research by people with the resources and time to do it is a good thing. I'm afraid that the paranormal until/unless it gets private funds for research or the military does it will always be a fringe investigation/scientific endeavor. That said I still think investigation is a good thing and I salute folks like Chris and Jim Marrs and scientist such as Taarg and Sheldrake. Other than that I didn't mean to go where this has headed.
Of course investigation is a good thing tyder. But the age old attitude "If you ain't doing it you have no basis or place to speak of it" is not only wrong but in some cases dangerous. Think about the cases where the it is being done to you." Like, corruption in politics, ripoff consumer products, police brutality, medical malpractice and bad media reporting.
Bad UFO investigation is just a small subset of bad media reporting. There are potential victims involved and those potential victims certainly have every place and basis in the world to speak of it.
CapnG
Devil's Advocate
Because we see it all the time. Guys like McGaha and Schermer always like to bring up cases were self-styled Ufologists declare they have "irrifutable proof" of whatever that upon further professional scrutiny turns out to be something mundane. Then they hold that up like a standard bearer and declare all paranormal investigations worthless.
That's infinitely more damaging to the subject matter than some random, anonymous critical comment on page X of a thread buried in the back of an internet message board.
Angel of Ioren
Friendly Skeptic
I really appreciate what you said and you succinctly put into words exactly what I was thinking.