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USA Decline

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we are in a system based on debt. this system has been designed to fail. and it is. the powers that be will facilitate this and help usher in a world government and new monetary system. the american dream is over.
without oil based on dollars, and with china ready to call in our debt, we are in seriously deep doodoo.
i suspect this thread is now in danger of being locked.
 
Anyone interested in this overall topic should immediately go and watch Michael Moore's new documentary, "Capitalism: A Love Story". It presents an excellent case for the reality of the economic overthrow of the US government, and closely mirrors much of what I've been saying on my Angry Human show.

i do plan on seeing this movie. it sounds great. i am particularly interested in the closing credits. i want to see who he is sharing his wealth with.
 
i do plan on seeing this movie. it sounds great. i am particularly interested in the closing credits. i want to see who he is sharing his wealth with.

That Michael Moore makes the kind of movies he does, is reason enough for me to be comfortable with the fact that he does well financially. He busted his balls for his money, no one handed it to him, he's fought for the poor and disadvantaged, and he's putting his money to work fighting the forces of darkness. I've paid to see every doc he's made, and I've bought every DVD that he's released, and will continue to support him any way I can.

dB
 
That Michael Moore makes the kind of movies he does, is reason enough for me to be comfortable with the fact that he does well financially. He busted his balls for his money, no one handed it to him, he's fought for the poor and disadvantaged, and he's putting his money to work fighting the forces of darkness. I've paid to see every doc he's made, and I've bought every DVD that he's released, and will continue to support him any way I can.

dB
i have also seen most of his movies.
so are you in favor of a revised capitalist society or a more socialist style?
i like his movies too. but i have to think he is a bit hypocritical. he made millions off the events and deaths of 9/11, and the subsequent wars. also I understand in his personal financial portfolio he has had Haliburton, Tyco and WorldCom... he seems to be pure capitalist.
 
So if someone wrote a bestselling book about a crime, trying to uncover the perps, you would find fault with their success? Pixelsmith, this is why I can't engage in any sort of dialog with you - there's no point to it. You've reached your conclusions, enjoy them.

dB
 
The people who talks more about the marvels of Socialism never experience a Gulag, or run for his live when the Montoneros try to create the workers paradise a any cost, or have to support the torture of the Special Section of the Peronist police because he was labelled as enemy of the people:D
 
So if someone wrote a bestselling book about a crime, trying to uncover the perps, you would find fault with their success? Pixelsmith, this is why I can't engage in any sort of dialog with you - there's no point to it. You've reached your conclusions, enjoy them.

dB

Your reply has nothing to do with the thread or my simple observation.

I do like his films, I am glad he can make lots of money, I do believe he deserves it. I hope he makes more. that said, he IS a bit hypocritical but i do not care as i believe his subject matter is VERY important at this very moment in time.

it seems as tho you made the conclusion that i dislike moore. i do not.
 
i do plan on seeing this movie. it sounds great. i am particularly interested in the closing credits. i want to see who he is sharing his wealth with.
I find that a bit disengenious Pixelsmith. It's like saying "ok, if you don't want to make money, stay at home and do nothing." But in order to stay alive you have to make money. That's just the way it is. What else is there? Roll over and die? If Michael Moore doesn't make money, he can never point out the flaws in our society. He can never make a new film or get his message across.
Look, my criticism is not directed at you personally. I just want to say: look at what kind of arguments you're using. Ok?
 
this system has been designed to fail. and it is. the powers that be will facilitate this and help usher in a world government and new monetary system.

Why? Who would benefit from this "world government" that isn't already benefiting hugely from the current system?

By "new monetary system" I presume you mean a single global currency. Do the financial elite really desire this? Will the people who make billions from currency arbitrage just roll over for this?

How about the defense industry -- are they on board with a "world government"? Or would pieces of this "world government" still be allowed to go to war each other?

I actually have the opposite hypothesis -- whether by design or by accident, the USA decline means that there will NO single dominant political/military power "running the world". The global financial elite may remain and grow more powerful but their power will be exercised exactly the way it is now -- through manipulation of credit & equity markets.

By the way, Rolling Stone's Taibbi doing some great articles on this.
 
Check out this interview with the late Aaron Russo (filmmaker and politician) who befriended one of the Rockefellers.
Another peculiar thing I noticed about the Rockefellers, is that they are not on the Forbes 400 list. John D. Rockefeller was already a billionaire in 1916 and in 2008 his net worth was estimated at 318 billion dollars. (Source wikipedia.) These people simply hold their assets secret.
 
For those interested, there is an interesting editorial by Martin Wolf in the Financial Times today entitled "The Rumours of the Dollar's Death are Much Exaggerated".
 
For those interested, there is an interesting editorial by Martin Wolf in the Financial Times today entitled "The Rumours of the Dollar's Death are Much Exaggerated".
Could you expand on that a bit? I don't read the Financial Times and I presume others don't as well.
 
It's here, read it yourself. Basically it's Wolff's take on what movements in the relative value of the US dollar mean for the big picture (trade deficits, inflation/deflation, etc). Pretty interesting to a layman like myself, especially this part about the risks of having a single dominant global reserve currency:

But a global monetary system that rests on the currency of a single country is problematic, for both issuer and users. The risks are also growing, particularly since the emergence of "Bretton Woods II" - the practice of managing exchange rates against the dollar [...] the global role of the dollar is not in the interests of the US. The case for moving to a different system is very strong. This is not because the dollar's role is now endangered. It is rather because it impairs domestic and global stability.

This in a nutshell is what I've been pondering in my "what if USA decline was planned" musings. If this whole trainwreck is happening on purpose, its because someone somewhere has decided it is too risky to have one dominant superpower on this planet.

Risky for what, I don't know. Maybe they ran a computer model of the "single hyperpower" scenario and it resulted in complete global holocaust.
 
I don't know if a USA decline was planned. My gut tells me it wasn't. Strangely enough (from what I learned) economic downfalls are inherent to the system. When too many people jump on an economic structure in order to get profit, sooner or later the bottom will gave way. It's just too chaotic at times to be controlled. I'm not saying that it can be controlled but you have to be in a position of power, knowledge and influence to make that happen.

Economics are all about self interest. Actually you can call that a human law - looking out for number one. As an employee you work for company not because you really like it but because you have to make money in order to survive. A company basically does the same thing. It's a constant struggle for survival and accumalating wealth.

Once you're in a position power the game changes somewhat. You're still looking out for number one but the means at your disposal make that much easier. Now you can influence the surroundings in your favor. This is the point where politics and the corporate world blend together town-state-federal wise. It becomes a network based on the self interest of its parts.

Networks again look out for number one. Networks might work together when it suits their interest but they can also compete. Can a network seriously influence an economic structure? Of course they can, but they wont do it up to the point where it's self damaging because that's not in their self interest.

Did someone plan a USA decline? That's pretty hard to tell. One way to confirm that hypothesis is to look at who gains from such a situation because it's all about profit. . . and looking out for number one.
 
Some interesting reading.
The Coming Stock Market "Wipe Out"!
Some things are preventable, others are just another part of the plan. If you remember nothing else, remember this: Poor people have pitchforks, rich people have laser guided missiles.

The stock market is not that difficult to understand. It is a place where people can buy shares of ownership in someone else's business. Buy enough shares and you end up owning the company yourself. As an Investment, stocks only make sense:

1. When a business is making money.

2. When someone else wants to pay more for your stock in the future.


It is important to understand this concept for numerous reasons. Among them are:

* Mutual funds, Pension Plans and Insurance Companies have traditionally been the biggest investors in the stock market. They all get their money from you.

* Real Unemployment is almost 20%. That means that 20% of the population is cashing in their stocks, retirement, insurance and pensions just to survive. They are taking money out of the market, not putting it back in.

* Derivatives Contracts, which are naked put options against a pool of money have already cost big investors like AIG trillions of dollars. It is estimated that 1000 trillion dollars in derivative contracts are still outstanding. The global economy is only 56 trillion dollars. They have taken the big pools of money and shipped them overseas or converted them to hard assets like gold. Just ask General Motors.

* Corporate Profits are down, so why would you pay more for their stocks?

The big money has left the stock market. So why is the Dow climbing back up like a crazy Zombie buried under a concrete slab? It should be dead, right? The answer lies in the "Plan" or the "Agenda" of those that rule over us. These people are at worst Satanists and at best Luciferians. Would you buy a used car from these folks?

* Poor people do what they are told without asking too many questions. They embrace change. They want more government and more wars. After all, somebody did this to us! (Must have been the Muslims).

* Money is power. They have stripped us of our homes and our businesses. They have stripped us of our jobs and careers. They want all the money, because they want all of the power. It makes it easier slaughter the sheep after you steal their wool. Just tell the flock, "Its nice and warm in the barn."

* Their motto is "From Chaos, Order". They will create the chaos and then they will create the "New World Order". Hungry people can get pretty chaotic. I believe that 25-30% unemployment is "critical mass" for riots and looters. All social service and safety nets will be overwhelmed and bad things will start to happen.

So, what does this have to do with the stock market?

* Some rightfully blame the narcotics trade for washing their money through the stock market. The fact that we are at 20% real unemployment leads me to believe that now,even the drug Lords are "downsizing".

* The easiest way to steal all of the money is to have people bring it to you. Large numbers of people. The Federal Reserve is unabashedly pumping up the market right now to make it look like a good bet.

* Once they have corralled all of the "suckers", then they will start buying "Put Options" against the Stock Indexes (like the S&P 500). These put options allow them to transfer all of the disappearing money in a falling market into their pockets. To get the process going, they will start dumping large amounts of stocks. Enough to create a "Panic" and in a matter of a few days, or weeks, all of your hard earned savings will be gone.

* They will clean out the Mutual Funds. They will clean out the 401Ks. They will clean out company treasuries, cities and counties. Like the Grinch, they will steal your Christmas. Unlike the Grinch, they will have no "change of heart".

They did it in 1929:

1. They knew how to inflate stock prices to lure in the "suckers":

" New securities, from rising merger activity and the formation of holding companies, were issued to take advantage of the rising stock prices.—Stock pools, which were not illegal until the 1934 Securities and Exchange Act, took advantage of the boom to temporarily drive up the price of selected stocks and reap large gains for the members of the pool. In stock pools a group of speculators would pool large amounts of their funds and then begin purchasing large amounts of shares of a stock. This increased demand led to rising prices for that stock. Frequently pool insiders would "churn" the stock by repeatedly buying and selling the same shares among themselves, but at rising prices. Outsiders, seeing the price rising, would decide to purchase the stock whose price was rising. At a predetermined higher price the pool members would, within a short period, sell their shares and pull out of the market for that stock. Without the additional demand from the pool, the stock's price usually fell quickly bringing large losses for the unsuspecting outside investors while reaping large gains for the pool insiders." (Source)

Mutual Funds, Insurance Companies, Institutional Investors and Fortune 500 companies are our new "stock pools". They control what stock goes up and which one goes down.

2. Banks would "finance" up to 90% of the stock price. This means your $10, plus the banks $90, could buy $100 in stock.

"Another factor commonly used to explain both the speculative boom and the October crash was the purchase of stocks on small margins. However, contrary to popular perception, margin requirements through most of the twenties were essentially the same as in previous decades. Brokers, recognizing the problems with margin lending in the rapidly changing market, began raising margin requirements in late 1928, and by the fall of 1929, margin requirements were the highest in the history of the New York Stock Exchange." (Source)

Margin requirements started at 10% down and increased to 50% by 1929. The question remains, whose assets were at risk when banks loaned money to buy stock? The answer is the little guy with his savings or checking account. Stock Margin investments was a way to transfer your savings into the hands of the money powers.

I believe that this is one of the main reason that banks failed (along with the real-estate decline). The bankers had literally put much of their assets at risk by investing in stocks through "margin".

3. The Federal Reserve was a Direct Investor in the stock market and manipulated interest rates to make "margin" more attractive:

The recovery from the 1920-1921 depression had proceeded smoothly with moderate price increases. In early 1923 the Fed sold some securities and increased the discount rate from 4 percent as they believed the recovery was too rapid. However, by the fall of 1923 there were some signs of a business slump. By October of 1923 Benjamin Strong was advocating securities purchases to counter this. Between then and September 1924 the Federal Reserve System increased its securities holdings by over $500 million. Between April and August of 1924 the Fed reduced the discount rate to 3 percent in a series of three separate steps. (Source)

Yes, the Federal Reserve itself was a direct investor in the stock market. It increased or decreased its holdings to directly influence market direction.

4. All of this effected the gold holdings in France, England and the United States:

"In early 1927 the Fed reduced discount rates and made large securities purchases. One result of this was that the gold stock fell from $4.3 billion in mid-1927 to $3.8 billion in mid-1928. Some of the gold exports went to France and France returned to the gold standard with its undervalued currency. The loss of gold from Britain eased allowing it to maintain the gold standard." (Source)

Gold is the only real wealth in this world. In order to buy stocks, the Private Bankers sold off their gold. All of it went overseas. The "disappearance" of the huge gold stash in the World Trade Center basement vaults in 2001 correlates with the plunge in the Nasdaq and later the S&P 500.

I believe that this gold was sold and secretly transferred to foreign banks in order to raise capital to prop up our Stock Markets. Now that the gold is gone, the Fed is just printing money to dump into the market and lure everyone back into stocks. Thus we have a 10,000 Dow and still climbing.

Next comes the raid and every last investment dollar in the market will be stolen, leaving us with nothing more than 22 inch headlines that will make 1929 a far distant memory.

Buy Gold, Buy Silver, Buy Food, guns and ammunition. Just get the heck out of the stock market before its too late!
http://deadmanmusings.blogspot.com/2009/10/coming-stock-market-wipe-out.html
 
Pixelsmith, thanks for copying the opinion piece above, but unfortunately there are a number of wrong facts interspersed with true statements, in my view. There are also a number of leaps of logic.

As an American, and as someone familiar with the global financial markets, I worry first and foremost about the Industrial Military complex and its political influence (again, see the documentary "Why We Fight"), as the most prominent medium & long term threat to American well being. It will be the creativity, entrepreneurial spirit and capital coming out of China and India, combined with the bifurcation of American society as well as certain cultural characteristics (e.g., savings rates, upward mobility, global perspectives and knowledge base), which get the U.S. before any underground cabal.
 
Fall of the Republic is out. Everyone should consider watching this important documentary.
 
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