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Why people care about UFO's

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Don't get me wrong, the Paracast has been open to flirting with these new concepts and ideas.

BUT, when I look at the guest roster, most of the guests on this or any paranormal show, always go back to the Alien conclusion as being worth more thought than any other possible solution.

Where is the guests talking about how mass delusions, and crowd consciousness might be effecting, or even creating this phenomena. Which is potentially the best explanation for all the assorted weirdness.

Or how Spiritual phenomena and UFO sightings might all be part of the same thing, "Ghosts of the Air" basically, which again, is as valid as any other explanation.

Even the odd timing of black magic rituals and occultist behavior with the onslaught of "foo fighter" sightings and the rise of UFOs etc.

I find all these kind of topics fresh, fun and WAY more interesting than another rehash of how interstellar travel is possible, or why the government hides Roswell alien bodies etc.

What if the Government is covering up nothing more than their own ignorance on the topic, or even more interesting, what if those Joseph Ferrell occultists are in our government and this is all just the repercussions of their continued actions?

Now those would be cool topics to discuss and hear come to the foreground.
 
UBERDOINK said:
Where is the guests talking about how mass delusions, and crowd consciousness might be effecting, or even creating this phenomena. Which is potentially the best explanation for all the assorted weirdness.
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Um, WHAT? You can't get five people who witnessed a car crash to give you the same report but a massive crowd of people are going to be universally delusional? Total bullshit. In any case, the majority of sightings are limited to a few individuals, often just one person.

UBERDOINK said:
Even the odd timing of black magic rituals and occultist behavior with the onslaught of "foo fighter" sightings and the rise of UFOs etc.
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So lemme see if I have this straight: the possibility of visitation by intelligently guided craft from other planets is laughable, despite the mounting mathematical probability (at this point, near certainty) of extra-terrestrial life. But magic... that's legit. Okay Copperfield, if you say so...
 
I don't really care what other shows guests believe or say. I don't listen to them. When you look at a list of the Paracast shows any number of them deal with alternative theories, including ones you mentioned. And, as I stated before, our hosts are definitely NOT in the 'Nuts & Bolts Aliens from Mars' camp at all.

I say again: If you want something discussed, discuss it. And now I'll tell you one of MY pet peeves, and that is the scatter-gun approach to putting forth a topic. For example:

Where is the guests talking about how mass delusions, and crowd consciousness might be effecting, or even creating this phenomena. Which is potentially the best explanation for all the assorted weirdness.
Click to expand...

My reaction: Oh, really? Who says? Where's the evidence? Who thinks this? Where is this in the literature? Can you cite your sources? How is it done? What are the theories surrounding it?

In fairness to you :), I know you were just using this as an example and not intending to write a thesis about it, but that's all I'm doing, too--using it as an example. If somene wanted to REALLY discuss this in depth, then I'd like a couple paragraphs of introduction, some sources, and a 'Whaddya think?' and see where we go from there. If this really is 'potentialy the best explanation' then there must be some reasons and evidence that this is so. I don't know what they are; and the onus is not upon me to provide them. That's the claimant's job.

I encourage you and anyone else to broaden the discussion, but I would prefer a bit of thought went into a new thread rather than have to endure the old "Let's throw everything I can think of on the wall and see what sticks" approach. (Now THAT'S boring!) I suspect that the more time and effort you put into trying to get a discussion started, the more you (and everyone else) will get out of it.
 
Now I see the true believers response(Cap) and the objective response. I only want to address the objective response, as true believers will always be zealots for their cause (looking at you Cap).

Mass delusion has been chronicled over and over again, look at Carl Jung's theories on collective consciousness and UFOs, very interesting. Charles Fort also touches on the potential ability for crowds to "think" some things into existence based on the stories he collected.

You have modern physicists talking about the illusionary constructs of reality and the potential of human beings to think the world around them into creation. (If you want, I'll link you some amazing videos regarding this topic, but Youtube is down for me right now)

I think there is a VERY valid argument, once you have a chance to read the literature (first Cap, you need to learn to read) that this is all just a human mind game.

If you are open minded, then it is definitely worth exploring, and a option that could cover all the oddness of UFO behavior, abductions etc. Not just using lame, "the numbers say..." type arguments that you could use to substantiate any lame idea. (yeah Cap, you have Lame ideas. But we still like you! ;-)
 
UBERDOINK said:
Now I see the true believers response(Cap) and the objective response. I only want to address the objective response, as true believers will always be zealots for their cause (looking at you Cap).
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Pot and kettle. YOU are the true believer in the case Uber, preaching from the pulpit of collective conciousness. I'm not declaring ET is all there is, I'm saying it's not to be ruled out. Big difference.

UBERDOINK said:
Mass delusion has been chronicled over and over again, look at Carl Jung's theories on collective consciousness and UFOs, very interesting. Charles Fort also touches on the potential ability for crowds to "think" some things into existence based on the stories he collected.
Click to expand...

*Insert Jung versus Freud debate that goes on for ten pages and resolves nothing here*

Short version: tulpas are bullshit. Everyone pictures themselves being rich yet very few people actually are. You can't think solid things into existence. If YOU hallucinate, that's just you.

UBERDOINK said:
I think there is a VERY valid argument, once you have a chance to read the literature (first Cap, you need to learn to read) that this is all just a human mind game.
Click to expand...

Durrr, den how is me reed dis?

UBERDOINK said:
If you are open minded, then it is definitely worth exploring, and a option that could cover all the oddness of UFO behavior, abductions etc.
Click to expand...

Gotcha: agree with you = open minded, disagree = idiot. Umbrella arguments are the lazy thinker's solution.

UBERDOINK said:
Not just using lame, "the numbers say..." type arguments that you could use to substantiate any lame idea. (yeah Cap, you have Lame ideas. But we still like you! ;-)
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You gotta funny way of showing it. Besides, numbers don't hallucinate.
 
UBERDOINK said:
Now I see the true believers response(Cap) and the objective response. I only want to address the objective response, as true believers will always be zealots for their cause (looking at you Cap).
.....
type arguments that you could use to substantiate any lame idea. (yeah Cap, you have Lame ideas. But we still like you! ;-)
....
first, Cap. you need to learn to read.
Click to expand...

What's the point of personal attacks here, particularly the last one, which is just plain insulting and stupid? Cap has a good point. You don't like the ET Hypothesis, yet you are willing to entertain the idea that black magic caused the foo fighters to appear.

Mass delusion has been chronicled over and over again, look at Carl Jung's theories on collective consciousness and UFOs, very interesting. Charles Fort also touches on the potential ability for crowds to "think" some things into existence based on the stories he collected.
Click to expand...

What are they. What book did you read authored by Jung? What is its title? Did you actually read it or did you read what someone else has to say about it? And Charles Fort? What is the citation, please?

You have modern physicists talking about the illusionary constructs of reality and the potential of human beings to think the world around them into creation.
Click to expand...

We've heard that since the seventies. Seth says it, too. What physicists did you have in mind? Please show where they say humans can think the world into creation. How does this relate to the UFO Phenomenon?

Look, Uberdoink. You're not making your case very well. First you came on here and told us how bored you were. Then you changed your complaint to not liking the ET Hypothesis and threw around some really bizarre alternatives that you failed to explain at all, including magic. Now you're resorting to insulting people. You appear to have a superior attitude and obviously think your 'open mind' makes you a superior thinker.

But you really haven't offered us anything of substance. Mentioning a theory promulgated by someone else, mostly unnamed, in one or two sentences does not constitute an argument nor prove anything. If you want to discuss Jungian theory, start a thread, present your evidence, and those who are interested will discuss it. (Bear in mind that there may be people who frequent this forum who actually know Jungian Theory and have actually read his books, so you may not be able to fake it.) In other words, you have a long way to go before you can convince anyone else here you know what you are talking about or why they should pay attention to you at all.

Shit or get off the pot and stop bothering us with this superiority crap.
 
Wow, those responses are very typical. Sorry to offend you guys by saying maybe we can talk about different things.

I love that everyone on this forum are experts in everything, but me of course. Interesting that if you read Fort of Jung yourself maybe you wouldn't be asking me for the citations ;-)

anyway, what always happens is that the only thing that gets proven is whenever someone thinks you are attacking their religion they get all pissy.

So, circular reasoning full speed ahead!

lets talk more about Roswell, alien brothers and intergalactic propulsion systems! because you guys are right, that IS the only path to finding out the truth!
 
UBERDOINK said:
anyway, what always happens is that the only thing that gets proven is whenever someone thinks you are attacking their religion they get all pissy.
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You mean like you're getting now because we're calling you on your earlier statements? Yeah, ain't it a shame?

See, we're actually giving you all the chances you need to make a case Uber, you're just not taking them. Your attitude of superiority and then feigned apologetic retraction underlies a distinct lack of introspection vis-a-vis your particular slant on this topic (to add a little fried Freud to go with your Jung).

If you have a case to make, make it and defend it. So far your case consists of you basically announcing "It's all in your heads, dumbasses!" and then waving your fingers at us and going "Nyah-nyah-nyah". And evidently I'm not the only one who seems to see it that way.

So here's your chance! Make your case... and....GO! Oh and be sure to dumb it down for us because we are, after all idiots, religiously married to the ETH in perpetuity and exclusively.
 
There is a quote at the end of Uberdoink's posts...

open minds are a hard thing to find.

may I point out they are much easier to locate when you ask politely? or perhaps open your ears to the directions others are trying to share with you?
 
Uber,
I liked where you were going until you started getting just rude IMO. Calling CapG a true believer is just silly. You might like episode 5 on the paratopia. That is Jeff's and Jeremy's new podcast.
 
When I first started listening to the paracast and participating in this forum, I was a die hard ETH guy. I had an attitude about it and considered other theories to be BS. 30% from the show and 70% from this forum opened my mind to other possibilites.

I still put a good deal of stock in the ETH and I should. It is a good theory. But I now recognize that it is not the only theory. I try to look at all the thoeries and try to make sense of them.

I personally put very little stock in the time travel theory but I still read the posts and supporting material. It is about making an informed opinion. The best part of that is that you can and should change that opinion with the collection of new data. As soon as you wall off a given avenue forever, your mind starts to narrow with it.
 
I like that others can leave snide remarks but mine are considered offensive.

Basically though I do agree, game over, not worth talking about.

I also love that people that believe in UFOs can laugh so quickly at the idea of spiritual powers, i.e. the occult connection I brought up in passing that seems to be getting a lot of jabs.

I understand better, paranormal CANNOT involve oculistists or rituals that have bearing on spiritual phenomena. Even thinking of "magic" is absurd!

Glad you guys have all read up on the thousands of books dealing with occult topics. I now know that the theory is totally un-tenable, and completely beyond belief!

Thank you :D
 
i have had in my day access to some of the finest private occult book collections in the country.
ive spent years researching the subject

from my pov any "link" is a nuts and bolts one
 
UBERDOINK said:
I understand better, paranormal CANNOT involve oculistists or rituals that have bearing on spiritual phenomena. Even thinking of "magic" is absurd!
Click to expand...

Discussions of the paranormal can and should involve those things. But to automatically leap like a Thompson's Gazelle to the conclusion that that must be the ULTIMATE explanation for all things paranormal, including UFOs... that is absurd.
 
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