A question for UFO skeptics.

[exo_doc]

I don't recall if the article I posted has the results of the metallurgy test, but I do recall reading someplace that a test was done and it determined that the object was composed of known elements, but that the distribution and ratios did not match any known alloy. This makes sense because the grinders were used on several different materials over a long period of time. As the stalagmites slowly built up, it would be normal to accumulate odd concentrations of elements that don't correspond to the ratios of any single alloy. I agree this doesn't prove the object isn't alien, but in my view it's a more reasonable explanation. For us to believe otherwise requires more than a "you can't prove it's not alien" approach.

As mentioned before, very few things in life apart from pure logic are 100% certain, so it isn't reasonable to take a hard line approach that all issues must be proven with absolute certainty one way or the other. We can't even prove with absolute certainty that our material universe is real, let alone every single item in it. To demand that we do so is moving the goalposts way out of bounds and that is a typical tactic of the rabid skeptics. For us to do the same would make us no better. We need to realize when it is appropriate to admit that the scales are tipped one way or the other in favor of a particular explanation. If something comes along to tip the scales back the other way later, fine, but I've seen no such evidence for this particular case. If anything comes along, by all means post it up.

Some good points. And I am trying not to deal in absolutes, or 100%'s. What I am trying to deal with here is to throw away something based on non-specifics and generalities, when further testing could reveal something much more extraordinary,...or not.

So your point is what? It's not worth testing any further because of what it most probably, most likely, is? I'm not sating it's alien...I'm not saying it's terrestrial.........I'm saying lets find out for sure.

The main point I am trying to get across is...don't relegate a potentialy valuable piece of evidence to the hoax/mistaken ID pile until exhaustive testing is completed. That's not being rabid, or true beleiver, or super skeptic. That's just being a rational investigator.
In all honesty Ufology, without meaning to be condescending, I'm kinda surprised you aren't pushing for all the tests to be done too. Even with the reasons you've given above.
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[exo_doc]

I wasn't a big fan of UFO Hunters, but some episodes did have it's moments.

Here for whatever it's worth is the UFO Hunters appraisal of the Bob White Object. Trustworthy or not? Up to you to make that call.

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[Randall]

Some good points. And I am trying not to deal in absolutes, or 100%'s. What I am trying to deal with here is to throw away something based on non-specifics and generalities, when further testing could reveal something much more extraordinary,...or not.

So your point is what? It's not worth testing any further because of what it most probably, most likely, is? I'm not sating it's alien...I'm not saying it's terrestrial.........I'm saying lets find out for sure.

The main point I am trying to get across is...don't relegate a potentialy valuable piece of evidence to the hoax/mistaken ID pile until exhaustive testing is completed. That's not being rabid, or true beleiver, or super skeptic. That's just being a rational investigator.
In all honesty Ufology, without meaning to be condescending, I'm kinda surprised you aren't pushing for all the tests to be done too. Even with the reasons you've given above.
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One thing I did do is ask around on the skeptics forums to see if anyone had any idea what manufacturing plant might have produced it based on proximity to various places mentioned in the object's historical background, but I've had no responses, and unfortunately I don't have the time or resources to do that kind of in-depth research. I barely have time to engage in this forum. But you obviously have a passion for the subject and that is really great to see. Perhaps you might want to try digging up a little more info yourself. I would suggest cataloging the places and dates mentioned in the object's background history and cross reference them with respect to the proximity of milling shops that had the kind of machine mentioned in the sSkeptic article. There can't be all that many. Then see if you can interview the various operators from around that time period. Who knows? It's a long shot, but it's the only strategy I've come up with to take the investigation any further without having direct access to the artifact and doing more metallurgical testing.

Even if we did have access to the object I doubt we'd find out anything new about its composition, at least not from the standpoint of finding any unknown materials. What we would be able to do is take thin slice samples and examine them one at a time to build up a history of the objects composition. It may be possible, if it formed as a stalagmite, to create a history of the object analogous to the way one might examine a trees rings, and from that determine if there was any pattern over time for the grinding of certain materials. That information could then be compared to work records ( if they were available ) to determine if they match. The object would not need to be destroyed to do this. It should be possible to take a core sample straight down the center of the object ( like an ice core sample ) from top to bottom and slice those for analysis.

 

[Randall]

I wasn't a big fan of UFO Hunters, but some episodes did have it's moments. Here for whatever it's worth is the UFO Hunters appraisal of the Bob White Object ( see actual post above ). Trustworthy or not? Up to you to make that call.

By excluding the evidence I've presented here, UFO Hunters either failed to do adequate investigation or intentionally left it out for the purpose of sensationalizing the story. I don't know which, but considering the amount of resources they have compared to me, you'd think they would have done a better job. The industrial grinding process explains the odd concentrations of elements in the alloys and all the other properties mentioned by the analysis. The behavior of the wall safe cannot be substantiated as having anything to do with the object and during my reading on the object's history, I became dubious about any of the claims made. One thing I'll give UFO Hunters credit for though is making a splash in the ufology community and entertaining a few people along the way. I've enjoyed their shows, but I always make sure to do some of my own digging too. It would be irresponsible not to.

 

[starise]

I believe that die hard skeptics are selective in what they decide isn't real. I should say some skeptics. It would be unfair to put all skeptics in that category.

The Japan airlines case is a good one. Multiple evidence to back up what the pilot reported. Good large and well documented radar hits. The ship was huge but still very small compared to what has been seen around the sun.

Oh, and that Bob White object looks like something I found in my food at the diner once

 

[exo_doc]

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Oh, and that Bob White object looks like something I found in my food at the diner once

Oh you eat at McDonalds too?

 

[Randall]

I believe that die hard skeptics are selective in what they decide isn't real. I should say some skeptics. It would be unfair to put all skeptics in that category. The Japan airlines case is a good one. Multiple evidence to back up what the pilot reported. Good large and well documented radar hits. The ship was huge but still very small compared to what has been seen around the sun. Oh, and that Bob White object looks like something I found in my food at the diner once

The JAL case is a pretty good one. The ship allegedly seen around the sun ( if it's the same one I'm thinking of ) was debunked as the result of composite exposures that are typical of the imaging process. As for what to call certain skeptics; I like to use the word "rabid" because they attack like dogs with their mouths foaming and there is nothing you can do to talk sense into them or fend them off ( save putting them on your ignore list ).