Alexander - UFO's are real

[Goggs Mackay]

softbeard:

Given the level of resources available to the military on a global scale, I would say it is more reasonable to assume that they still have the best stuff, the stuff the skeptics couldn't deny. At the same time, I agree with the spirit of your post in that I think many civilians already know the truth from their evidence of their own senses. They don't need the government or the military to tell them what they already know. We have that on our side of the fence.

The real trick for us outside the vault is to convince those on the inside to share. They can get at what we have without any effort at all, but to get anything from them is another matter. Trying to drag it out of them via the FOIA isn't going to get us anyplace. It was a great effort, but now we know where that road leads.

So what is the answer? How do we convince them to let us in on some of the action? The only way I can think to do it is to get something they don't already have and offer up a trade. But how do we do that? My idea was to try to establish a worldwide network of civilians free of the issues that plagued other groups. So I started USI. I figured that with a combined effort we could probably come up with something. But the politics of ufology have not facilitated that effort. USI is still viable in spirit and we keep attracting new members, but the effort of the ufology community as a whole remains fragmented, each faction hoping for some unbelievable stroke of luck to give their group leverage.

So where does that leave us? Waiting for Godot ... or Everyman? Well I'm still doing my bit part, and there's my 2 cents worth for the day.

How about this for an idea to help the study of UFOs?

An app for the Iphone or similar which gives an audible alert and text to tell the user that a UFO has been sighted in their vicinity. There would be coordinates and integration with googlemaps etc. Users would only have to text in basic details of their sighting and the system notifies anyone else with the app who is near enough to maybe record the UFO.

An example would be for instance, Gene has often said that if something did happen in Phoenix '97, he would have missed it anyway despite living in the same city. With this UFO-reporting app, Gene would have been notified by the app that a UFO has been spotted in his vicinity, giving coordinates if supplied. He can then at least go outside and look in the direction of the report. This app could at least increase the chances of those with an interest in ufology to participate in a sighting in their area, and hopefully be able to capture some images or footage - all of which can really help an investigation.

We know how vital things like multiple witnesses and vantage points are. They can back eachother up (or rule it out) and if there are pics or vids from different angles it can make it easier to calculate height, object size and speed.

Of course, just increasing the numbers of people to witness a UFO makes a good report even more credible.

More data can only help the study of UFOs.

 

[Randall]

How about this for an idea to help the study of UFOs?

An app for the Iphone or similar which gives an audible alert and text to tell the user that a UFO has been sighted in their vicinity. There would be coordinates and integration with googlemaps etc. Users would only have to text in basic details of their sighting and the system notifies anyone else with the app who is near enough to maybe record the UFO.

An example would be for instance, Gene has often said that if something did happen in Phoenix '97, he would have missed it anyway despite living in the same city. With this UFO-reporting app, Gene would have been notified by the app that a UFO has been spotted in his vicinity, giving coordinates if supplied. He can then at least go outside and look in the direction of the report. This app could at least increase the chances of those with an interest in ufology to participate in a sighting in their area, and hopefully be able to capture some images or footage - all of which can really help an investigation.

We know how vital things like multiple witnesses and vantage points are. They can back eachother up (or rule it out) and if there are pics or vids from different angles it can make it easier to calculate height, object size and speed.

Of course, just increasing the numbers of people to witness a UFO makes a good report even more credible.

More data can only help the study of UFOs.

That sounds like a great idea. But it also has a lot of abuse potential. To be really effective it would be advisable to have some sort of membership requirement beyond a simple app download. Otherwise we'd have all kinds of practical jokers, inexperienced observers and advertisers using it to get our attention and eat up data, and that would reduce its usefulness dramatically. In the meantime, have you checked out UFO Stalker?

 

[Goggs Mackay]

Yes, I suppose the potential for abuse is there. Some kind of register is sensible - would only want people genuinely interested in seeing and recording unusual objects in the sky.

I shall check out ufo stalker thanks.

 

[Trajanus]

I found it interesting that Alexander was probably part of the so-called Aviary. His book does come across as exactly the kind of disinformation we would expect from that group.

Of course. A book which concludes there's no coverup, and no proof of ET in government hands--exactly what you'd expect.

 

[boomerang]

I thought Alexander's book held valid and interesting info regarding how our government works at the nuts and bolts level. But he still fails to account for certain well documented and vital aspects of the whole thing--such as where recorded data goes and who shows up on people's doorsteps to collect it.

I don't think there is anyway for the average bloke to know where the Colonel really stands in the scheme of things. We simply don't have enough info.

 

[Sentry]

Earlier, I was asking about if the new material in the paperback edition of Alexander's book. I finally ran actos a copy and got to see for myself. It amounts to a 12 page section at the end that covers topics that arose since the original edition. The two things that stuck in my mind were the Area 51-Stalin story and the faking of the Belgian UFO photo. Its not worth buying again for the new stuff, but it makes the paperback the top choice if you are just getting it. (I don't know if the new chapter is included in the e-book, but it should be.)

My take on the book is that Alexander is pretty realistic about the government's inept involvement in UFOs. Based on what he said,(and what I've read elsewhere) I think Alexander's thoughts about UFO mystery is that they are more along the paranormal phenomena vein.

 

[Goggs Mackay]

I wonder if the 'Belgian UFO photo hoax' is some attempt at muddying the waters. I remember seeing someone trying to recreate the 'hoax' and feeling he could not. Whether the famous photo is a hoax or not is utterly irrelevant to the truth of the flap. Multiple police and civilian witnesses, Air Force F-16's scrambled with the HUD data recorded on tape. The Wilfred de Brower chap is hardly going to go public with his F-16 video etc because of that photo!

It's just something that really annoys me when I hear that 'oh, the Belgian thing was a hoax' - cos somone read that the photo was hoaxed. So what? The photo has nothing to do with the other witnesses but try telling some people!
Disinformation really does work! Of course it does, I was in Naval Intelligence and I remember at one of my training bases there was a whole building (quite small) devoted to PsyOps.

 

[Sentry]

My understanding is that it is documented that the man claiming to have faked the Belgian photo is the same one that originally provided it. Maybe the photo itself was used as disinformation of some kind, since after it was released people pretty much stopped talking about UFO sightings there that weren't triangles.

 

[Goggs Mackay]

Thanks Sentry and that is my point, if it is indeed the case that the guy who took the photo then later claimed it was hoaxed, then that alone seems to be enough for many people to dismiss the whole flap - which lasted months. Why anyone would think the one thing affects the reality of the other is beyond me.

 

[Trajanus]

I don't think there is anyway for the average bloke to know where the Colonel really stands in the scheme of things. We simply don't have enough info.

The government has always sought to downplay, debunk and dismiss UFOs. It would be parsimonious to see Alexander as just another way to attain the same ends.

 

[Randall]

The government has always sought to downplay, debunk and dismiss UFOs. It would be parsimonious to see Alexander as just another way to attain the same ends.

Can you expand on this a bit?

 

[Trajanus]

Can you expand on this a bit?

Assuming the government has good evidence of UFOs, and seeks to conceal it, it has resorted to various tactics besides just denial, to do so. I suspect phony reports of various kinds (e.g. Brandon and his Roswell box) are intended to get people to dismiss the whole field. Alexander seems to represent another approach. He comes across as highly respectable, and sympathetic to UFOlogy--to gain the trust of those into it--but claims there's no evidence of a secret UFO group. The bottom line here is the same--people are induced to conclude nothing is really concealed.

 

[Randall]

Assuming the government has good evidence of UFOs, and seeks to conceal it, it has resorted to various tactics besides just denial, to do so. I suspect phony reports of various kinds (e.g. Brandon and his Roswell box) are intended to get people to dismiss the whole field. Alexander seems to represent another approach. He comes across as highly respectable, and sympathetic to UFOlogy--to gain the trust of those into it--but claims there's no evidence of a secret UFO group. The bottom line here is the same--people are induced to conclude nothing is really concealed.

OK, but why would that make it "parsimonious to see Alexander as just another way to attain the same ends"? I don't see how it relates.

 

[Trajanus]

OK, but why would that make it "parsimonious to see Alexander as just another way to attain the same ends"? I don't see how it relates.

Given the number and variety of claims apparently intended to undermine the idea of a coverup, I think Alexander is best interpreted the same way.

 

[Randall]

Given the number and variety of claims apparently intended to undermine the idea of a coverup, I think Alexander is best interpreted the same way.

Agreed ... at least to some extent, and of course that is the nature of disinformation ... a carefully balanced mix of truth and deception.