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Bail out fails
- Thread starter Kieran
- Start date
Free episodes:
DamnDirtyApe
Skilled Investigator
Nah.. ain't THAT bad. I don't think America is on the edge of some sort of cliff, perhaps staring into a wide, low valley is more a more accurate description.
Some sort of slowdown/correction/depresssion was a long time coming anyway. Can't have lenders giving shit loans to people with no jobs and no assets. Can't have mom and pop moving into a huge house simply becuase their bank is trying to give away money. When you see shows like "Flip This House" on TV aimed at joe public you have a situation ready and doomed to explode. Housing prices here in LA and many other areas went through the roof for no real reason other than bidding fever. No fundamentals behind it, so no amount of free money from the Feds can keep it afloat forever.
To make matters worse, hedge funds and the major lenders were running 40 to 1 margin accounts!!! How on Earth those cats could sleep at night knowing they were so over-leveraged is beyond me. I guess they figured "hey, we are too big and important for the feds to let us fail" Perhaps they might be wrong. When I trade at 4-1 I'm on pins and needles! Imagine putting up 1 dollar of tangible assets and getting 40 dollars back of free money to play with? Absurd!
Things will eventually correct themselves and the boom-bust cycle will continue. Growth and contraction is the natural cycle of things. In the meantime, if you aren't diversified and haven't been saving your pennies, things might get painful especially if you are looking for loans for any reason. People that got sucked into buying properties at inflated prices will be especially hit hard. I feel bad for folks that had to move to expensive areas and buy into the inflated market for career reasons. As credit dries up, employers who rely on it will feel the pain for sure. People that bought 3 houses at once thinking they were gonna flip em and make a million, well I don't feel so bad for them. Calculated risk!
Some sort of slowdown/correction/depresssion was a long time coming anyway. Can't have lenders giving shit loans to people with no jobs and no assets. Can't have mom and pop moving into a huge house simply becuase their bank is trying to give away money. When you see shows like "Flip This House" on TV aimed at joe public you have a situation ready and doomed to explode. Housing prices here in LA and many other areas went through the roof for no real reason other than bidding fever. No fundamentals behind it, so no amount of free money from the Feds can keep it afloat forever.
To make matters worse, hedge funds and the major lenders were running 40 to 1 margin accounts!!! How on Earth those cats could sleep at night knowing they were so over-leveraged is beyond me. I guess they figured "hey, we are too big and important for the feds to let us fail" Perhaps they might be wrong. When I trade at 4-1 I'm on pins and needles! Imagine putting up 1 dollar of tangible assets and getting 40 dollars back of free money to play with? Absurd!
Things will eventually correct themselves and the boom-bust cycle will continue. Growth and contraction is the natural cycle of things. In the meantime, if you aren't diversified and haven't been saving your pennies, things might get painful especially if you are looking for loans for any reason. People that got sucked into buying properties at inflated prices will be especially hit hard. I feel bad for folks that had to move to expensive areas and buy into the inflated market for career reasons. As credit dries up, employers who rely on it will feel the pain for sure. People that bought 3 houses at once thinking they were gonna flip em and make a million, well I don't feel so bad for them. Calculated risk!
cottonzway
I was saying boo-urns
If I shared what I really felt, I would be labeled a "Doom and Gloomer", so....
Fuck it...
People are entitled to think whatever they want.
That said we are seeing the end of the global financial system as we know it. Regardless if this bailout does not get pushed though or not. The only reason for this attempted “bailout” is to buy more time and to get specific legal pardons for the very criminals who have perpetuated this crime on what amounts to the entire world.
Even the global bankers who want to own and manipulate society have lost control. It’s a bankrupt system that has more debt attached to it then there is the ability to ever pay for them, thousands of times more then the worth of the world. It’s a large ponzi scheme that is finally coming to rest. All one needs to do is spend how much money we own from credit default swaps and the overbearing derivatives markets to see it. Those amounts of debt are numbers higher then can EVER be paid. Period.
This has been going on for a long time. This is why the FED limited the M-3 money index from the public eye in March of 2006. The FED (along with other central banks) have been printing money with no value assigned to it. Calling it “fiat” is pointless. It is counterfeit money.
My personal opinion the main reason why this happened back in 1971 when we saw at the hands of Paul Volcker and George Shultz the Bretton-Woods system being dismantled. Now there are thousands of factors after that point of cycles that can be looked at this, but this allowed for the predatory system based on currency based on nothing. Seriously, nothing.
I have clue where this is heading. The bailout would have gave protection to the criminals and their criminal system, but would have hurt the people much worst. Not doing a bailout means rouge criminals are going to be looking for a means to get what they want.
What means will criminals involved of every form of crime and treason go to ensure their own survival? We have US troops starting tours on October 1<SUP>st</SUP>, destroying Posse Comitatus, and we have some real dangerous geo-political relations going on in the world right now. All bets are off and IMO these bastards are going to do something to protect themselves from jail.
What’s going to happen? I don’t know and I don’t even want to know. Folks should be on alert though and be paying attention to what is going on more then usual because IMO “something” will happen in an attempt to get the “order” these criminals want. I would put NOTHING past them as the world is ran by a lot of evil people who are trapped for their crimes.
Fuck it...
People are entitled to think whatever they want.
That said we are seeing the end of the global financial system as we know it. Regardless if this bailout does not get pushed though or not. The only reason for this attempted “bailout” is to buy more time and to get specific legal pardons for the very criminals who have perpetuated this crime on what amounts to the entire world.
Even the global bankers who want to own and manipulate society have lost control. It’s a bankrupt system that has more debt attached to it then there is the ability to ever pay for them, thousands of times more then the worth of the world. It’s a large ponzi scheme that is finally coming to rest. All one needs to do is spend how much money we own from credit default swaps and the overbearing derivatives markets to see it. Those amounts of debt are numbers higher then can EVER be paid. Period.
This has been going on for a long time. This is why the FED limited the M-3 money index from the public eye in March of 2006. The FED (along with other central banks) have been printing money with no value assigned to it. Calling it “fiat” is pointless. It is counterfeit money.
My personal opinion the main reason why this happened back in 1971 when we saw at the hands of Paul Volcker and George Shultz the Bretton-Woods system being dismantled. Now there are thousands of factors after that point of cycles that can be looked at this, but this allowed for the predatory system based on currency based on nothing. Seriously, nothing.
I have clue where this is heading. The bailout would have gave protection to the criminals and their criminal system, but would have hurt the people much worst. Not doing a bailout means rouge criminals are going to be looking for a means to get what they want.
What means will criminals involved of every form of crime and treason go to ensure their own survival? We have US troops starting tours on October 1<SUP>st</SUP>, destroying Posse Comitatus, and we have some real dangerous geo-political relations going on in the world right now. All bets are off and IMO these bastards are going to do something to protect themselves from jail.
What’s going to happen? I don’t know and I don’t even want to know. Folks should be on alert though and be paying attention to what is going on more then usual because IMO “something” will happen in an attempt to get the “order” these criminals want. I would put NOTHING past them as the world is ran by a lot of evil people who are trapped for their crimes.
DamnDirtyApe
Skilled Investigator
Perhaps they are planning to unleash the zombie apocalypse? If so, I hope I am prepared.
Everyone has to ask themsleves, what will YOU do when the undead begin to roam the Earth, hungry for human flesh?
CapnG
Devil's Advocate
Hang on... looks like W told the fed to do an end run:
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=a9MTZEgukPLY&refer=home
Democracy? Never heard of it...
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=a9MTZEgukPLY&refer=home
Democracy? Never heard of it...
cottonzway
I was saying boo-urns
Most likely be eaten by zombies. Though zombies have a lot in common with Neo-Cons and Obama's Cult so you never know.
8)
DamnDirtyApe
Skilled Investigator
Most likely be eaten by zombies. Though zombies have a lot in common with Neo-Cons and Obama's Cult so you never know.
8)
But will they be the old style shambling zombies, or those new frenetic spazzy zombies? I much prefer the former to latter.
Either way I will prepare as best I can - looting gun shops and supermarkets, might steal a humvees and whatever else is needed along the way. Gotta make it to an island or other well defended location. Perhaps a military base?
cottonzway
I was saying boo-urns
The point is, the zombies will win. We should all be fearful of the zombies.
All kidding aside (and yes humor is probably needed at times because these are stressful times) we are in serious trouble, zombies aside.
All kidding aside (and yes humor is probably needed at times because these are stressful times) we are in serious trouble, zombies aside.
valiens
Skilled Investigator
There was already a guy who had to be talked out of jumping at Merrill Lynch.
I'll probably lose my job in the next couple of weeks which is not the best news considering I'm funding a festival. But then if it means knocking fascists down a few pegs maybe it's worth it. Then again they always have an exit plan so...probably nothing will be learned and I'll still be broke.
I'll probably lose my job in the next couple of weeks which is not the best news considering I'm funding a festival. But then if it means knocking fascists down a few pegs maybe it's worth it. Then again they always have an exit plan so...probably nothing will be learned and I'll still be broke.
Aaron LeClair
Paranormal Maven
America is out the verge of a cliff about to commit suicide!
What is going to happen?
I see darker days ahead than the previous one's gone . Maybe everything will be ok in time , time does heal many wounds!
I thought America died long ago. Actually, it never was born, only a mockery version of it. Time to bury the body and hope something better rises from the ashes.
I need to admit. I don't know the specifics on what this thread is dealing with. Bail out? Is this dealing with the billions of bucks being spent to keep the stockmarket from crashing, due to banks? I just heard about it the other day from my father.
America is out the verge of a cliff about to commit suicide!
What is going to happen?
I see darker days ahead than the previous one's gone . Maybe everything will be ok in time , time does heal many wounds!
This proposed "solution" would do far more harm than good. First of all, this solution has been slammed by most leading economists as being a knee-jerk reaction. The people that have come up with it have no clue if $700 billion is enough to resolve this crisis, or way too much. Additionally, if the Fed eats the $700 billion cost, what is that going to do to the long-term health of the U.S.? This is more money than has been blown on the entire Iraq war thus far, and there is not one ounce of proof it will rectify anything. Maybe I am a little niave, but after the constant "doom and gloom" of the modern media over the last 2 years, I am not buying the "little boy cried wolf" routine any further. I have been bashed over the head with every doomsday scenario the media could possibly dream up from the W2K bug to environmental holocaust to bird flu pandemic. It is funny how not one of them as brought upon the end of the world as promised. Now it is the financial implosion of an industry that amounts to 3% of the U.S. GDP. Sorry, but I don't buy these "end of the world" scenarios anymore. If this problem was anywhere near as bad as the media is portraying it, they would have every leading economist working on a solution, and the bunch of unqualified politicians who are responsible for this mess in the first place.
Jeremy,
I am sorry to hear about your job.
Invite Horn to your conference I mean festival, hire a few huge body guards, and charge extra when you show Billy Liar. Throw in a fake Korf if that doesn't work.
Kieran
Paranormal Adept
This proposed "solution" would do far more harm than good. First of all, this solution has been slammed by most leading economists as being a knee-jerk reaction. The people that have come up with it have no clue if $700 billion is enough to resolve this crisis, or way too much. Additionally, if the Fed eats the $700 billion cost, what is that going to do to the long-term health of the U.S.? This is more money than has been blown on the entire Iraq war thus far, and there is not one ounce of proof it will rectify anything. Maybe I am a little niave, but after the constant "doom and gloom" of the modern media over the last 2 years, I am not buying the "little boy cried wolf" routine any further. I have been bashed over the head with every doomsday scenario the media could possibly dream up from the W2K bug to environmental holocaust to bird flu pandemic. It is funny how not one of them as brought upon the end of the world as promised. Now it is the financial implosion of an industry that amounts to 3% of the U.S. GDP. Sorry, but I don't buy these "end of the world" scenarios anymore. If this problem was anywhere near as bad as the media is portraying it, they would have every leading economist working on a solution, and the bunch of unqualified politicians who are responsible for this mess in the first place.
Well you could be right, and you could be wrong!
The bail out "is a bail out for wall street there is no doubt about that!
The bail out is a measure designed to stablise the markets with confidence!
Ok people will say! How does it effect me. I am part of a ordinary American family, well how does it. Simple, It doesnt, in the short term, But in the long term it could.
If Banks lose confidence ,credit doesnt flow, So people do not invest, rather they move there money out from the bad market they are within.If industry and services arent able to invest by getting loans to help them do such planning for there future. Then the net result is unemployment and reduced tax levels for the goverment.
America probably does need some type of bail out. The market will stablise in time by such a measure all going well?
I dont believe myself America will go into meltdown, because there is certain fundamentals of the American economy that are extremely strong and robust.
David Biedny
Paranormal Adept
I'm pressed for time just this moment, but...
There ARE no fundamentals - the U.S. makes very little product, we're a consumer society that has shipped our manufacturing overseas. There's little to rebuild. The Public Debt is at over $32,000 for every man, woman and child. We're deeply in the hole, with no way out. Education is in the toilet, as a society, we're dumber than we've ever been. We're morphing into a Theocracy. Logic is out the window.
In a nutshell, we're fucked. The next 20 years ain't gonna be pretty. I suspect that, in that timeframe, we will become a colony of China, with chinese troops on our streets, "protecting their investment." Heaven help us all...
dB
There ARE no fundamentals - the U.S. makes very little product, we're a consumer society that has shipped our manufacturing overseas. There's little to rebuild. The Public Debt is at over $32,000 for every man, woman and child. We're deeply in the hole, with no way out. Education is in the toilet, as a society, we're dumber than we've ever been. We're morphing into a Theocracy. Logic is out the window.
In a nutshell, we're fucked. The next 20 years ain't gonna be pretty. I suspect that, in that timeframe, we will become a colony of China, with chinese troops on our streets, "protecting their investment." Heaven help us all...
dB
Kieran
Paranormal Adept
Ok i could turn around and disagree with you. But your thoughts are valid! I have already posted about China and it economic policies towards the America economy. People thought i was talking rubbish!. However people were naive. China is a major player in the world society, people need to realise that.
You are very right the fundamentals of economy are bad and that is no'understatement.But the structures of the American state is so vast and widespread. A total meltdown seem's improbable in my view?
TIME WILL TELL
JUDGEMENT WILL FALL ON THE EVIL PEOPLE
WHO ROBBED US OF OUR DIGNITY????
Hoffmeister
There is no spoon
Whilst the US aren't in the best state... i'm not entirely convinced that the end is near. Basically they will just have to overhaul the whole system and put stringent procedures in place much like they did with Sarbanes-Oxley after the Enron debacle.
But 'Jo Public' is just going to have to stop spending money they dont have... which shouldnt be too hard as those cash rich traders who made all their money from people within the subprime market won't be lending it to them anymore.
People go on about China taking over the world but China have got a lot of their own problems as well, they are growing too fast for the country to cope.
I know hindsight is a great thing... but basically this whole mess has come around by having very little regulation for lending and people have been warning about it for years.... literally the last 5 years
Still not to worry though, if Steven Greer is right, we won't need money soon, we will be able to make it out of thin air using zero point energy.
All of our lives are in Dr Greer's hands....
But 'Jo Public' is just going to have to stop spending money they dont have... which shouldnt be too hard as those cash rich traders who made all their money from people within the subprime market won't be lending it to them anymore.
People go on about China taking over the world but China have got a lot of their own problems as well, they are growing too fast for the country to cope.
I know hindsight is a great thing... but basically this whole mess has come around by having very little regulation for lending and people have been warning about it for years.... literally the last 5 years
Still not to worry though, if Steven Greer is right, we won't need money soon, we will be able to make it out of thin air using zero point energy.
All of our lives are in Dr Greer's hands....
skunkape
Paranormal Maven
The bail-out plan is a joke...it's just the pirates trying to nab as much booty as possible before the ship sinks. I've seen the inevitable collapse of our faith-based fiat money system coming for a decade. The Federal Reserve needs to be run out of town on rail. It is neither federal, nor is it a reserve. A lot of Americans are gonna be really pissed when they see through the smoke and mirrors and realize how thoroughly, and for how long this organization has been robbing our country blind.
It may seem like great fun to cheer while the crack house burns but unfortunately that house is in a row house neighborhood and your house is likely to burn down too.
Have you checked your 401k today? You've most likey lost more money in one day than if they had distributed the $700B to every American by several fold. What happens on Wall Street effects everyone not just fat cats.
I'm not sure the "bail out" is the best solution but someones got to put the fire out instead just watching it spread.
Have you checked your 401k today? You've most likey lost more money in one day than if they had distributed the $700B to every American by several fold. What happens on Wall Street effects everyone not just fat cats.
I'm not sure the "bail out" is the best solution but someones got to put the fire out instead just watching it spread.