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Bail out fails
- Thread starter Kieran
- Start date
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valiens
Skilled Investigator
As if the news wasn't bad enough:
http://www.theonion.com/content/news_briefs/members_of_twisted_sister<o>
></o>>
Members Of Twisted Sister Now Willing To Take It
September 29, 2008 | Issue 44•40
NEW YORK—In a stunning reversal of their long-stated reluctance to take it, members of heavy-metal band Twisted Sister announced Monday that, after 24 years of fervent refusal, they are now willing to take it. "I acknowledge that we promised not to take it anymore, but things change. The world is a different place today, and with that in mind, we would like to go on record as saying that, starting right now, we are going to take it," read a statement released by the band's lead singer, Dee Snyder. "To clarify, we would still prefer not to take it, but as of now, taking it is an option that we would be open to. That is all." Bassist Mark "the Animal" Mendoza also stated that, in regards to what he wants to do with his life, he no longer solely wants to rock, but would instead prefer doing other things, such as raising a family and working as a claims adjuster in Rye, NY.
http://www.theonion.com/content/news_briefs/members_of_twisted_sister<o>
></o>>Members Of Twisted Sister Now Willing To Take It
September 29, 2008 | Issue 44•40
NEW YORK—In a stunning reversal of their long-stated reluctance to take it, members of heavy-metal band Twisted Sister announced Monday that, after 24 years of fervent refusal, they are now willing to take it. "I acknowledge that we promised not to take it anymore, but things change. The world is a different place today, and with that in mind, we would like to go on record as saying that, starting right now, we are going to take it," read a statement released by the band's lead singer, Dee Snyder. "To clarify, we would still prefer not to take it, but as of now, taking it is an option that we would be open to. That is all." Bassist Mark "the Animal" Mendoza also stated that, in regards to what he wants to do with his life, he no longer solely wants to rock, but would instead prefer doing other things, such as raising a family and working as a claims adjuster in Rye, NY.
cottonzway
I was saying boo-urns
I do love the Onion. 
It's at the point now where I'm just waiting for them to do something. Maybe they will just drop a neutron bomb on Congress to get what they want? Paulson and his fellow criminals are going around screaming "fire in a theater" so provoke economic chaos and usually those are the times when "false flag terrorism" happens. As upset as these people make me at destroying not only my country, but the free world, I usually don't get the feeling of dread but disgust. I have that "gut" feeling that all the signs point to a large, staged event happening prior to Nov. 5th.
It's at the point now where I'm just waiting for them to do something. Maybe they will just drop a neutron bomb on Congress to get what they want? Paulson and his fellow criminals are going around screaming "fire in a theater" so provoke economic chaos and usually those are the times when "false flag terrorism" happens. As upset as these people make me at destroying not only my country, but the free world, I usually don't get the feeling of dread but disgust. I have that "gut" feeling that all the signs point to a large, staged event happening prior to Nov. 5th.
This may have been the staged event by the Republicans to somehow get McCain elected, assuming he lives long enough to be elected, of course.I do love the Onion.
It's at the point now where I'm just waiting for them to do something. Maybe they will just drop a neutron bomb on Congress to get what they want? Paulson and his fellow criminals are going around screaming "fire in a theater" so provoke economic chaos and usually those are the times when "false flag terrorism" happens. As upset as these people make me at destroying not only my country, but the free world, I usually don't get the feeling of dread but disgust. I have that "gut" feeling that all the signs point to a large, staged event happening prior to Nov. 5th.
cottonzway
I was saying boo-urns
That is a consideration for sure. We live in strange and dangerous times.
Hoffmeister
There is no spoon
Erm..... was this post aimed at me? If it was, i dont think you quite read my email properly, or understood what i was on about
Nope, I pretty much agree with everything you said.
There just seems to be a lot of misguided anger in regards to the situation. Ironically the howls for "let them burn" is exactly the same position that hard core Republicans are calling for - that is, the market will correct itself and you don't need more regulation, that regulation is akin to socialism. You could also remove all the traffics lights and hope everyone regulates the intersections by themselves but this is not a good idea.
you know i was watching Mr Richard Dolan on YT just a few days ago
http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=SoWJuc_SJvM
and he was talking about how Govt has become "by the corporation, for the corporation" instead of the people. and of the top 100 economys one year govts were less than half, the majority were corporations.....
so it looks like some corps have over extended and done their dough, so now they get the govt to simply take the money out of the pockets of the people......
thats mad, thats like the govt going down to the racetrack and refunding all the losers on race 11.
everytime i hear about this matter i hear Dr Phil saying "you dont solve a money problem, with money"
its an interesting situation, what do you do, let the individual companys fail hurting their employees ,investors and customers in a significant manner, or bail them out by taking 1000 bucks out of everyones wallet.
the second option seems to be on the cards or at least before congress, but i wonder if thats not a bad precident to be setting , after all if the govt is simply going to reimburse the losers down at the race course then everyone will start backing the long odds because it pays better if you win and if you loose the govt will cough up the money you lost.
but if i recall 911 wiped 3 trillion of the exchange at the time, whats another trillion ?
last i heard the US was paying for capitol works etc with the "projected" tax earnings of ppl who arnt even born yet
i predict a press fuelled noisy reshuffling of the counters, and then business as usual
http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=SoWJuc_SJvM
and he was talking about how Govt has become "by the corporation, for the corporation" instead of the people. and of the top 100 economys one year govts were less than half, the majority were corporations.....
so it looks like some corps have over extended and done their dough, so now they get the govt to simply take the money out of the pockets of the people......
thats mad, thats like the govt going down to the racetrack and refunding all the losers on race 11.
everytime i hear about this matter i hear Dr Phil saying "you dont solve a money problem, with money"
its an interesting situation, what do you do, let the individual companys fail hurting their employees ,investors and customers in a significant manner, or bail them out by taking 1000 bucks out of everyones wallet.
the second option seems to be on the cards or at least before congress, but i wonder if thats not a bad precident to be setting , after all if the govt is simply going to reimburse the losers down at the race course then everyone will start backing the long odds because it pays better if you win and if you loose the govt will cough up the money you lost.
but if i recall 911 wiped 3 trillion of the exchange at the time, whats another trillion ?
last i heard the US was paying for capitol works etc with the "projected" tax earnings of ppl who arnt even born yet
i predict a press fuelled noisy reshuffling of the counters, and then business as usual
Hoffmeister
There is no spoon
The thing is, people are all shouting about how 'the evil greedy traders' have gambled all our money, and now the poor people are suffering.... and you know what, they're right. But the point is that nobody was stopping them, so of course they did it.
To use your racing analogy, its a little bit like a parent giving their 11 year old access to their credit card to take down the races. Despite the fact that its highly innapropriate, the parent lets the kid keep spending because they are making a few bucks to begin with, although in the back of their mind they know its going to go pear-shaped anytime soon.
Finally the parent checks their card and its at the limit. The parent gives the kid a ticking off, but its the parents fault for not taking the card away from the kid.
Its the same thing with this situation. Most people would have done what the traders did, they were just trying to make as much money as they could without facing the consequences. Its the governments fault (and not just in the US, every capitalist government is pretty much guilty of it) for not putting regulations in place to stop this sort of behaviour....
But of course what government wants to put a stop to a growing economy.... non of course, they just sit there and wait for the sh*t to hit the fan, and blame it on the bankers....
So who's to blame.... well nobody really, or everybody, it depends how you look at it. The point is that the system was flawed, and now we have to fix it, if we still can.
Yet I have still hardly heard a single politician utter a word about how we are going to fix it long term going forward, they are just using it to throw sh*t at the opposition, or talking about short term patch ups.
Rocketsauce
Haagen-Dazs Addict
The only way to solve this crisis is another 'Hands Across America", if we can get everyone in country to join hands and then........... send a strong current of electricity through, we'll have nothing more to worry about!
skunkape
Paranormal Maven
They'll probably hire Blackwater troops. There are plenty of sociopathic morons who are willing to fire on their fellow Americans here. I think if China tried to put their troops on our soil, you'd see an insurgency that would make those donkey-whippers in Iraq look like a bunch of amateurs.
Kieran
Paranormal Adept
A military war between China and America seems improbable at this stage. I dont believe David was talking in reference to war of conflict "more likely a economic war of sorts!.... Maybe David could clarify?
If they really wanted to stabilize the market with confidence, they would eliminate all capital gains taxes and eliminate negative investment practices like shorting and speculation. Make the market profitable for the long-term investor and you would see all kinds of money pour in. Additionally, the government could order the banks to loosen the purse strings some or face increased taxes on their revenues. The government could then use the recouped taxes to make loans themselves, and the profits of which would offset the tax cuts they gave the investor.
There is a lot they could do before picking a dollar value out of a hat to throw at a problem they haven't even defined with any specifics yet.
It does affect the average American. However, throwing away taxpayers' money like a drunken sailor will create far worse problems than it will ever solve. This is a band-aid solution to an alleged crisis that has been exaggerated in the press due to it being an election year. IMO, the high cost of the war in Iraq is far worse than this so called "financial meltdown".
Unfortunately, with the current North American interest rates, there is very little one can invest in outside the "bad market". While bonds are slowly climbing, they interest they pay right now is pathetic. This has created an increased market for speculation, shorting and short-term investing, which in turn has resulted in the ridiculous volitility we see right now. When you short on a margin and lose your shirt, you have to sell holdings that are worth something to pay off your creditors. Usually, the first holdings to go are gold, oil and solid blue-chips. This kinds of scenario goes a long way to explain why gold hasn't hit $2000 an ounce in the face of this "economic crisis".
A recession is defined as two or more consecutive quarters of negative GDP growth. In the second quarter of 2008, the United States GDP grew by 3.3%. If this kind of panic is how people react to economic slowdown, I would hate to see how many would be jumping out of windows if the economy went into an actual recession. However, I guess this is to be expected when you live in the modern "culture of doom" that the media has created. Good news doesn't sell papers, after all.
Kieran
Paranormal Adept
If they really wanted to stabilize the market with confidence, they would eliminate all capital gains taxes and eliminate negative investment practices like shorting and speculation. Make the market profitable for the long-term investor and you would see all kinds of money pour in. Additionally, the government could order the banks to loosen the purse strings some or face increased taxes on their revenues. The government could then use the recouped taxes to make loans themselves, and the profits of which would offset the tax cuts they gave the investor.
There is a lot they could do before picking a dollar value out of a hat to throw at a problem they haven't even defined with any specifics yet.
It does affect the average American. However, throwing away taxpayers' money like a drunken sailor will create far worse problems than it will ever solve. This is a band-aid solution to an alleged crisis that has been exaggerated in the press due to it being an election year. IMO, the high cost of the war in Iraq is far worse than this so called "financial meltdown".
Unfortunately, with the current North American interest rates, there is very little one can invest in outside the "bad market". While bonds are slowly climbing, they interest they pay right now is pathetic. This has created an increased market for speculation, shorting and short-term investing, which in turn has resulted in the ridiculous volitility we see right now. When you short on a margin and lose your shirt, you have to sell holdings that are worth something to pay off your creditors. Usually, the first holdings to go are gold, oil and solid blue-chips. This kinds of scenario goes a long way to explain why gold hasn't hit $2000 an ounce in the face of this "economic crisis".
A recession is defined as two or more consecutive quarters of negative GDP growth. In the second quarter of 2008, the United States GDP grew by 3.3%. If this kind of panic is how people react to economic slowdown, I would hate to see how many would be jumping out of windows if the economy went into an actual recession. However, I guess this is to be expected when you live in the modern "culture of doom" that the media has created. Good news doesn't sell papers, after all.
I am confused about your post. Are you haveing a argument with my points are you just giveing your analyse on the situation.
I dont disagree with your analyse the credit crunch is a new phenomen to me and to others.But a crisis was going to happen eventually.
It just came sooner than expected.Greedy individuals will always exploit the vulnerable for there own greedy needs. It is the darkside of humanity!
David Biedny
Paranormal Adept
Here's the short version of what I mean:
US owes China a huge sum of money - I've heard anywhere between half a trillion and a trillion and a half dollars. Who do you think is now lending us yet more money? The Chinese. Henry Paulson, the guy who architected the rape of the treasury, is completely in the pockets of the Chinese. A large amount of that 700 billion will be transfered into Chinese bank accounts. At some point, we're gonna owe them so much, they're going to own some large amount of the residential and commercial real estate, they're going to want to protect their investments. That means coming over here and doing the job themselves, and they're got the forces to do it - the Chinese army completely overwhelms ours - 2.3 million members of the People's Liberation Army, 1.5 million reserve militia, and 1 million armed police. They could easily drop half a million soldiers on US soil, and there's not much we could do about it. Does anyone seriously think that a bunch of alcoholic, uneducated rednecks with guns would pose any kind of serious threat to the disciplined, indoctrinated Chinese soldiers? Wake up, folks. All the silly patriotic drivel spewed by airheads like Palin aside, the state of our troops right now is dismal - kids worn down by a pointless, grueling occupation in the middle east, and you better believe that they know they're expendable in the eyes of their "leaders". Our military is in no shape to protect us here at home, and they're not here anyway, so forget about being able to repel a Chinese "security" force. The whores in Congress would chop their own children into chum if they could make a profit, so forget about them doing the right thing by us, the American people. They just sold you out for pennies on the dollar last week, they'll all be watching from their Swiss chalets (or 100,000 acre Paraguayan compounds, in the case of the Bush family), as the empire burns.
Yeah, I know, sounds kind of extreme. Well, those of us in the US better realize that we're squarely in the time of the collapse of the American empire, and it's going to get weirder than any of us can imagine. Seriously. Take a look at the last 25, 30 years, then focus in on the last 8, and tell me that we're not in a surreal, disturbing part of our history. And that's the part that the media will convey - the actual truth of what's going on is just far too fucked up for most people to contemplate. That's why we're a nation devoted to fantasy and escapism. Denial is the American Way™. The rise of fundamentalist religion is the clearest sign of this mental malady.
For the first time in my adult life, I'm really scared about the future.
dB
mikec
Skilled Investigator
David B wrote:
For the first time in my adult life, I'm really scared about the future.
________
There is an oppressive sinking feeling deep in my gut. I mean - seriously - What just happened?
Looking forward into he future is impossible, who knows if China will invade, or if they'll just take over through some paper shuffling economic deal. Or corporations will run america like a central american dictatorship. Or if some US city will blow up, and martial law will clamp everything down. Or if "undesirable" people (like me) will get that knock on the door in the middle of the night and be disappeared.
Or if...
Or if...
I can only guess, and it all looks bad. I trust my gut, and it seems like real trouble is brewing.
I can't help but think this is unfolding as an orchestrated plan, and the chess pieces are all lining up for something REALLY scary.
I've had some really strange life experiences that - somehow - makes me feel like an "abductee" (contactee? Experiencer? No good word here...)
I have spent the last couple of years seeking out and talking to other "abductees" and they will share stories about feeling more intuitive, like they have a heightened sense of ESP. And one question I always ask is this: "What do you foresee happening in the near future."
And all of 'em will reply: "I'm not sure, but I really sense that it's gunna be BAD."
I feel it too. And I wish I didn't. But why? The 2012 thing is an easy sort of "catch phrase" for all of this, but what is that, really? Why the consistent bleak impression of the future in the minds of abdutees? I know this smacks of David Icke conspiracy weirdness - But LOOK AROUND!
I have no answers, but It makes me feel sick.
For the first time in my adult life, I'm really scared about the future.
________
There is an oppressive sinking feeling deep in my gut. I mean - seriously - What just happened?
Looking forward into he future is impossible, who knows if China will invade, or if they'll just take over through some paper shuffling economic deal. Or corporations will run america like a central american dictatorship. Or if some US city will blow up, and martial law will clamp everything down. Or if "undesirable" people (like me) will get that knock on the door in the middle of the night and be disappeared.
Or if...
Or if...
I can only guess, and it all looks bad. I trust my gut, and it seems like real trouble is brewing.
I can't help but think this is unfolding as an orchestrated plan, and the chess pieces are all lining up for something REALLY scary.
I've had some really strange life experiences that - somehow - makes me feel like an "abductee" (contactee? Experiencer? No good word here...)
I have spent the last couple of years seeking out and talking to other "abductees" and they will share stories about feeling more intuitive, like they have a heightened sense of ESP. And one question I always ask is this: "What do you foresee happening in the near future."
And all of 'em will reply: "I'm not sure, but I really sense that it's gunna be BAD."
I feel it too. And I wish I didn't. But why? The 2012 thing is an easy sort of "catch phrase" for all of this, but what is that, really? Why the consistent bleak impression of the future in the minds of abdutees? I know this smacks of David Icke conspiracy weirdness - But LOOK AROUND!
I have no answers, but It makes me feel sick.
Drew UK
.
I don't want to steel dB's thunder but it's quite reassuring that theres someone more pessimistic than me:
Remember the trinity of power -
1. Hard Power (Military) Chessboard
2. Economic Power (Trade) Chessboard
3. Soft Power (Propaganda) Chessboard
Is the glass half full or is the glass half empty:
The fact remains that the US occupies a very peculiar position in world history (since 1945) - it has massive military muscle on that chessboard, it has significantly lowered the amount of capacity to influence the rest of the world to do what it wants in terms of trade and economics. And it has lost terrific advantage it did have on the 3rd chessboard.
Go get 3 pie charts -
One with the world population with the american slice in it.
One with the share of world GDP with the american slice in it.
One with the share of total defense spending with the american slice in it.
When you look at them you think, SHIT!!
Theres 4.5% of the worlds population, (not even one twentieth)
with 20% of the world product.
and 52% of the worlds defense expenditure.
My next question is how long into the 21st century do you think that this can go on? - somewhere along that timeline theres going to have to come a massive convergence - and I don't think it's going to be a massive increase in population!
Remember the trinity of power -
1. Hard Power (Military) Chessboard
2. Economic Power (Trade) Chessboard
3. Soft Power (Propaganda) Chessboard
Is the glass half full or is the glass half empty:
The fact remains that the US occupies a very peculiar position in world history (since 1945) - it has massive military muscle on that chessboard, it has significantly lowered the amount of capacity to influence the rest of the world to do what it wants in terms of trade and economics. And it has lost terrific advantage it did have on the 3rd chessboard.
Go get 3 pie charts -
One with the world population with the american slice in it.
One with the share of world GDP with the american slice in it.
One with the share of total defense spending with the american slice in it.
When you look at them you think, SHIT!!
Theres 4.5% of the worlds population, (not even one twentieth)
with 20% of the world product.
and 52% of the worlds defense expenditure.
My next question is how long into the 21st century do you think that this can go on? - somewhere along that timeline theres going to have to come a massive convergence - and I don't think it's going to be a massive increase in population!
Chuckleberryfinn
Paranormal Maven
If China ever tries to land five hundred thousand or less troops on American soil, they better have huge naval carriers with invisibility cloaks, otherwise they'll be shark food before making landfall.
Hoffmeister
There is no spoon
lol, i just speant nearly 30 minutes typing a big long post here, and as I went to press submit I slipped on the keyboard and my whole pc rebooted, throwing away the message.
Anyway, i cant be arsed to write it again, but i really dont think china will invade, i gave 5 different reasons in my post but the main one was Nukes... No-one will invade America due to Nukes..
Anyway, i cant be arsed to write it again, but i really dont think china will invade, i gave 5 different reasons in my post but the main one was Nukes... No-one will invade America due to Nukes..
Aaron LeClair
Paranormal Maven
The best thing would be for the US to be invaded, that's why it won't happen.