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Banned From The UFO Collective Google Group

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BoyintheMachine said:
I'm not here to debate you on the merits of the ETH.
Click to expand...

I understand. I wasn't trying to debate you as much as understand where you are coming from. Do you take the ETH on basic principle or do you champion a particular case, for example. To be honest, I don't think there is anything to be said in any "ETH debate" that hasn't already been said elsewhere.
 
trainedobserver said:
That is a good example. There is a lot of controversy surrounding the star-map and whether it was actually matched to real stars or not though.
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Yeah, That "Map" has held an interest since I first read about the case. However, if the occupants were non-human and resided somewhere in our own planet, what better way to throw off ufo think tanks than presenting a "star map" and/or give the impression during abduction as ET.

Boyinthemachine,
As mentioned earlier, perhaps it wasn't the ETH, but your own interpretation, and how you presented it, that caused a ruckus and eventaul banning?
 
stanton friedman tells a good yarn about barny and betty, betty says under hypnosis they took her false teeth out, while barney says the alien was trying to take his teeth out, but he didnt have false teeth, and it perplexed the lil fella, that his teeth wouldnt come out.

or vice-versa/\
 
Jeff Davis said:
Of course, on the other hand: "As for myself, the ETH is the only theory that I would ever pursue. The rest are a waste of time, in my opinion." :rolleyes:
Click to expand...

You do realize that by definition that the supernatural and paranormal can never be proven scientifically? If you can understand that and why this is the case, then you will understand my comment. If you fail to understand why the supernatural and paranormal can never be scientifically proven then you will continue to act as if the supernatural/paranormal is a legitimate alternative.

So yes, my comment is quite clear in that I'm only pursuing the ETH because, ghosts, spirits, ectoplasmic entities, etc., can never be scientifically proven. The ETH can theoretically be proven.

But you see, here's problem. The majority of people in the UFO community today are paranormal people first with only a passing interest in UFOs as connected to the paranormal, in their opinion. The "UFO folk for specifically UFOs" are dying out. This is reflected with the rise of the "mystery pimps", those authors and speakers in the UFO community who only pimp out mystery and never even aim at any potential solution. Most people interested int the paranormal don't want a solution and many don't want ETH and would prefer something more exotic and nebulous.
 
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Stagger Lee said:
Boyinthemachine,
As mentioned earlier, perhaps it wasn't the ETH, but your own interpretation, and how you presented it, that caused a ruckus and eventaul banning?
Click to expand...

No. I was tipped off it was coming. And the person who tipped me of warned me that Isaac Koi was a debunker pretending to be a skeptic. It was my friend Micah who told me that Koi had The Skeptical Inquirer (CSICOP) and other skeptical groups on his facebook and that all of his buddies were also debunkers pretending to be skeptics. I talk about this, about how debunkers have infiltrated the UFO community and how most people are clueless and can't recognize them. This new generation of UFO people think it's ever so hipster and trendy to embrace things like CSICOP, meanwhile the adults and older folk know fully well that CSICOP is not a "skeptic" organization. It's a debunking organization. They refuse to even accept the possibility of UFOs being extraterrestrial or anything else other than misinterpretations or hallucinations/delusions, if not outright hoaxes and frauds.

Debunkers don't care about people in the UFO community talking about paranormal stuff. They don't care when people say that alien abduction is NDEs, that aliens can be channeled, etc. They don't care about that because they know the people who push this are discrediting themselves. They just sit back and laugh at them. However, if you try to put the ETH back on the table as a possibility they have to attack it because it's a threat to them. The ETH can be theoretically proven. All this paranormal stuff can never be proven and the people who push it will never be viewed as credible in science.
 
manxman said:
stanton friedman tells a good yarn about barny and betty, betty says under hypnosis they took her false teeth out, while barney says the alien was trying to take his teeth out, but he didnt have false teeth, and it perplexed the lil fella, that his teeth wouldnt come out.

or vice-versa/\
Click to expand...

There is another absurdity, something that often turns up in UFO and close encounter reports. There you have allegedly technically advanced and telepathic beings performing primitive medical procedures and asking the subjects questions.
 
trainedobserver said:
There is another absurdity, something that often turns up in UFO and close encounter reports. There you have allegedly technically advanced and telepathic beings performing primitive medical procedures and asking the subjects questions.
Click to expand...

This is an incredibly important observation. A key perspective. What does it tell you TO?
 
BoyintheMachine said:
No. I was tipped off it was coming. And the person who tipped me of warned me that Isaac Koi was a debunker pretending to be a skeptic. It was my friend Micah who told me that Koi had The Skeptical Inquirer (CSICOP) and other skeptical groups on his facebook and that all of his buddies were also debunkers pretending to be skeptics. I talk about this, about how debunkers have infiltrated the UFO community and how most people are clueless and can't recognize them. This new generation of UFO people think it's ever so hipster and trendy to embrace things like CSICOP, meanwhile the adults and older folk know fully well that CSICOP is not a "skeptic" organization. It's a debunking organization. They refuse to even accept the possibility of UFOs being extraterrestrial or anything else other than misinterpretations or hallucinations/delusions, if not outright hoaxes and frauds.

Debunkers don't care about people in the UFO community talking about paranormal stuff. They don't care when people say that alien abduction is NDEs, that aliens can be channeled, etc. They don't care about that because they know the people who push this are discrediting themselves. They just sit back and laugh at them. However, if you try to put the ETH back on the table as a possibility they have to attack it because it's a threat to them. The ETH can be theoretically proven. All this paranormal stuff can never be proven and the people who push it will never be viewed as credible in science.
Click to expand...

Do tell.
 
trainedobserver said:
There is another absurdity, something that often turns up in UFO and close encounter reports. There you have allegedly technically advanced and telepathic beings performing primitive medical procedures and asking the subjects questions.
Click to expand...

Primitive? How much research have you done on alien abduction? I would think little to none. Abductees do not report "primitive" medical procedures. In fact, the aliens openly display advanced technology. However, the abductee don't seem to put much emphasis on the technology and instead focuses on the beings or what they communicate to them.

As far as the aliens asking why Barney's teeth could be removed and why Betty's could not, use that as a jumping board to ask questions on. Sure, you can just debunk it and say it indicates it's nonsense. However, ask some questions and it might take you to a different place. Have they seen human beings before? Where they (the aliens) newborns or newly created? Do beings on board craft communicate with other beings on other craft? How intelligent are these beings? Are they just "workers" that aren't that smart while the "brains" who created them are elsewhere?
 
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BoyintheMachine said:
You do realize that by definition that the supernatural and paranormal can never be proven scientifically? If you can understand that and why this is the case, then you will understand my comment. If you fail to understand why the supernatural and paranormal can never be scientifically proven then you will continue to act as if the supernatural/paranormal is a legitimate alternative.

So yes, my comment is quite clear in that I'm only pursuing the ETH because, ghosts, spirits, ectoplasmic entities, etc., can never be scientifically proven. The ETH can theoretically be proven.

But you see, here's problem. The majority of people in the UFO community today are paranormal people first with only a passing interest in UFOs as connected to the paranormal, in their opinion. The "UFO folk for specifically UFOs" are dying out. This is reflected with the rise of the "mystery pimps", those authors and speakers in the UFO community who only pimp out mystery and never even aim at any potential solution. Most people interested int the paranormal don't want a solution and many don't want ETH and would prefer something more exotic and nebulous.
Click to expand...

So, let me get this straight. Every perspective other than an ET origin for UFOs is an absurd waste of time because we can prove the ETH and be home on time for dinner to boot. Interesting.
 
Jeff Davis said:
So, let me get this straight. Every perspective other than an ET origin for UFOs is an absurd waste of time because we can prove the ETH and be home on time for dinner to boot. Interesting.
Click to expand...

1. Yes.

2. ETH can be theoreticlaly proven.

3. The establishing of UFOs as scientifically proven will take a great deal of time and work. It's so much more easier and fun to just sit in one's computer chair and blame it on spirits, goblins and Keel's demons.
 
Jeff Davis said:
This is an incredibly important observation. A key perspective. What does it tell you TO?
Click to expand...

We have supposedly technological and biologically advanced telepathic non-humans inserting needles into Betty's abdomen and extracting sperm from Barney through mechanical means. I think it indicates that the experience isn't what it appears to be.
 
BoyintheMachine said:
Primitive? How much research have you done on alien abduction?
Click to expand...
so, inwardly I'm still laughing at the nature of this comment.

Perhaps reading around this forum a little more thoroughly might give you a better sense of the breadth and knowledge of some of the participants, or why your assumption that Koi is a debunker because you were tipped off about his Facebook site is a little simplistic.
 
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trainedobserver said:
We have supposedly technological and biologically advanced telepathic non-humans inserting needles into Betty's abdomen and extracting sperm from Barney through mechanical means. I think it indicates that the experience isn't what it appears to be.
Click to expand...
It really only confirms that most of what gets "remembered" from supposed abduction reports is mostly a confabulation of interpretation on behalf of the witness. Unfortunately, when you have limited cultural front loading you end up with something half way between Jimmy Durante and the latest Outer Limits episode.
 
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