Banned From The UFO Collective Google Group

[nameless]

its definitely aliens. 95.5% certain.

 

[nameless]

 

[mike]

I agree with you the ETH is the most logical explanation, or at least it is to me.
I'm also a strong proponent of the post biological hypothesis as part of that picture.

For me joining these two possibilitys explains an awful lot about the phenomena.

As for this group, I know its painful when something youve invested in gets taken away, been there done that, more than once.

But just move on, one door shuts another one opens.

 

[Burnt State]

You can see how Betty got very confused. I mean you look at the guy and think to yourself, 'alien' right? He was also a bit of a perv in some of his early movies so you can also see where the whole probing thing comes into play.

 

[BoyintheMachine]

We have supposedly technological and biologically advanced telepathic non-humans inserting needles into Betty's abdomen and extracting sperm from Barney through mechanical means. I think it indicates that the experience isn't what it appears to be.

Are you suggesting that teleportation of the sperm from Barney's body is the preferred method for a superior race? Look, just because a race is advanced doesn't mean they are going to forgo the classics, such as wheels for example. In this case the mechanical extraction may be the preferred method. Not to mention that it was kept secret from the public meanwhile other male abductees reported the same process done on them. Going further, anal probes are what is called "electroejaculation", where a device inserted into a rectum and an electric shock is given to the prostate to cause an immediate ejaculation. Interestingly, this procedure is usually performed on older male abductees. Younger male abductees report the standard cup with hose that is placed over their junk and/or the "old fashioned" method of manipulationn and/or sex.

 

[BoyintheMachine]

I agree with you the ETH is the most logical explanation, or at least it is to me.
I'm also a strong proponent of the post biological hypothesis as part of that picture.

For me joining these two possibilitys explains an awful lot about the phenomena.

As for this group, I know its painful when something youve invested in gets taken away, been there done that, more than once.

But just move on, one door shuts another one opens.

Yes. I agree and have been saying the same since circa 2004. We need to look to our future, what is coming for us to determine what we could be dealing with. In the future we will merge with our technology, create advanced cyborgs, upload our minds into machines, create A.I. with god-like level intelligence and be able to genetically modify to such an extent that we would not only be immortal but spawn countless life. We will spread out and colonize the Universe. If this is what our future holds then some other race far older than us has already gone through this process.

 

[nameless]

..or aliens races have evolved to such an extent that they have become incorporeal but exist as pure thought form travelling the universe and time as ideas in a collective mind space that we can not conceptualise or fathom let alone connect with and so we have to subconsciously collude with their help in constructing a fake proxy material interface that gives us a physical sense and actuality that we can place meaning on in order to experience that which does not exist as we know it and for these alien thought forms to step into our world they require a genetic hybrid carcass to occupy on our physical plane so these dimensional travellers or "demons" steal our sperm and eggs to create these meat units or inhabit dead bodies briefly to collect soil samples and make us pancakes. just sayin'..

 

[nameless]

its an option. not that popular I confess but we could give it a go.

 

[mike]

Yes. I agree and have been saying the same since circa 2004. We need to look to our future, what is coming for us to determine what we could be dealing with. In the future we will merge with our technology, create advanced cyborgs, upload our minds into machines, create A.I. with god-like level intelligence and be able to genetically modify to such an extent that we would not only be immortal but spawn countless life. We will spread out and colonize the Universe. If this is what our future holds then some other race far older than us has already gone through this process.

During an epoch of dramatic climate change 200,000 years ago, Homo sapiens (modern humans) evolved in Africa. Several leading scientists are asking: Is the human species entering a new evolutionary, post-biological inflection point? Paul Davies, a British-born theoretical physicist, cosmologist, astrobiologist and Director of the Beyond Center for Fundamental Concepts in Science and Co-Director of the Cosmology Initiative at Arizona State University, says that any aliens exploring the universe will be AI-empowered machines. Not only are machines better able to endure extended exposure to the conditions of space, but they have the potential to develop intelligence far beyond the capacity of the human brain.

"I think it very likely – in fact inevitable – that biological intelligence is only a transitory phenomenon, a fleeting phase in the evolution of the universe," Davies writes in The Eerie Silence. "If we ever encounter extraterrestrial intelligence, I believe it is overwhelmingly likely to be post-biological in nature."

In the current search for advanced extraterrestrial life SETI experts say the odds favor detecting alien AI rather than biological life because the time between aliens developing radio technology and artificial intelligence would be brief.

“If we build a machine with the intellectual capability of one human, then within 5 years, its successor is more intelligent than all humanity combined,” says Seth Shostak, SETI chief astronomer. “Once any society invents the technology that could put them in touch with the cosmos, they are at most only a few hundred years away from changing their own paradigm of sentience to artificial intelligence,” he says.

"Biological Intelligence is a Fleeting Phase in the Evolution of the Universe" (Holiday Weekend Feature)

He makes imo a very good point,
"If we ever encounter extraterrestrial intelligence, I believe it is overwhelmingly likely to be post-biological in nature."


We are using SETI to try and find biological intelligence, like us. But we may be a rarity, the overwhelmingly larger proportion of ET's may be post biological, that being the inevitable end of sentient evolution.

SETI may be looking for the wrong thing in the wrong places

 

[Burnt State]

He makes imo a very good point,
"If we ever encounter extraterrestrial intelligence, I believe it is overwhelmingly likely to be post-biological in nature."

Why would anything post-biological have any interest in anachronistic sentient life forms like us? Why not reports of the post-bio recon team abducting apes, dogs, dolphins, camels etc.?

 

[mike]

Why would anything post-biological have any interest in anachronistic sentient life forms like us? Why not reports of the post-bio recon team abducting apes, dogs, dolphins, camels etc.?

Perhaps sentience, Or from their hypothetical pov pre sentience.

We seem to be "on the path", on the way to joining their club.

To me that seems a good reason to be interested, but not directly engaged with us.

In Star Trek the "test" was warp drive capability

The Prime Directive, used in 4 out of five star trek based series, prohibits Starfleet personnel from interfering with the internal development of alien civilizations. This conceptual law applies particularly to civilizations which are below a certain threshold of development

But for a trans biological species the test may be moving our intellect to a non biological substrate, any potentially emergant species like ours would be of an interest, especially given their hypothetical perspective of having seen this happen before many times.

Sentient Biological systems might also hold the same sort of fascination as does neolithic archaeology does to us, we would represent "history" not dissimilar to their own.

 

[Burnt State]

But for a trans biological species the test may be moving our intellect to a non biological substrate, any potentially emergant species like ours would be of an interest, especially given their hypothetical perspective of having seen this happen before many times.

Sentient Biological systems might also hold the same sort of fascination as does neolithic archaeology does to us, we would represent "history" not dissimilar to their own.

The archeological theory has some appeal in that we've become entirely objectified in the same way we objectify our own past and other animals today. It also has a nice parallel to Fort's "someone else's property" meme. That phrase just does not die. I'm not sure if it's a self-fulfilling prophecy, because of our species' low self-esteem, but it keeps popping up in discussion, writings and audio.

The archeological alien visitation theory leaves us as a simple footnote in someone else's encyclopedia. And in the plentiful life of our local galaxy are we a well known pit-stop, where some species jump out and scare the locals, some shoot at us with light beams and others are collecting our vitals like we're the independent study unit for their version of grade 12?

And then what's with the greys. Are there really that many greys graduating that we're the perennial project year over year, especially during the 80's but not so much now? I'll be honest, I know people believe in their experiences, but I count alien abduction to be one the most rare of alien contacts and most likely improbable as an event.

But it does fit the narrative, as do the sensations that the creatures are robotic and are fascinated with our emotions. Our pain, fear and terror while strapped to the table is ultimately replaced by the feeling of supreme love, as benign alien places hand over our foreheads. All this talk of god-head has some heavy psycho-social narrative patterning attached to them. As Vallée categorized it, these narratives are reflective of cult initiation ceremonies and other historical rituals involving us and the faerie folk etc....again, someone else's property. I wonder how self-imposed this narrative is?

 

[mike]

To throw in a real world example lets look at chimpanzee's.

To Sue Rumbaugh they are something to study

To others they are just bush meat

Chimpanzees & Bushmeat: 101 | the Jane Goodall Institute


And thats two polarised extreems coming from humanity a single species

But either way for the most part most humans consider them lesser creatures than us, regardless of their potential, we view them via their limitations.

Its not unlikely when dealing with an array of hypothetical ET species, we would see similar polarised treatment, directed at us.

I still think for a species who had not been biological for millions of years, our biological sentience would be fascinating, but their degree of empathy for us may be no greater than that we give our local cousins the chimps and bonobos, even as we too are fascinated by them

 

[trainedobserver]

Here is something else to consider when evaluating the nature of these types of reports and the Betty and Barney Hill case in particular.

Contamination.

Here we have highly advanced space travelers conducting what is presented as a biological survey or medical examination of two beings on an alien planet. Do they appear concerned with biological contamination of themselves or their subjects? We cannot travel between continents without exposing ourselves to numerous diseases and toxic substances. Can you imagine the protocols necessary to safely scoop up two unknown life forms, bring them into your ship, and then stick your hands in their mouths?

 

[trainedobserver]

Are you suggesting that teleportation of the sperm from Barney's body is the preferred method for a superior race? Look, just because a race is advanced doesn't mean they are going to forgo the classics, such as wheels for example. In this case the mechanical extraction may be the preferred method. Not to mention that it was kept secret from the public meanwhile other male abductees reported the same process done on them. Going further, anal probes are what is called "electroejaculation", where a device inserted into a rectum and an electric shock is given to the prostate to cause an immediate ejaculation. Interestingly, this procedure is usually performed on older male abductees. Younger male abductees report the standard cup with hose that is placed over their junk and/or the "old fashioned" method of manipulationn and/or sex.

No, I'm not suggesting anything of the sort. I'm just saying it all sounds very terrestrial, in particular as you have described it above. It sounds more like animal husbandry than anything else and seems more indicative of locals tending their herd than travelers from distant worlds exploring the universe.

 

[trainedobserver]

Mike,

Is there a particular case that you feel provides evidence that an alien machine intelligence has visited the Earth?

 

[trainedobserver]

I agree with you the ETH is the most logical explanation, or at least it is to me.
I'm also a strong proponent of the post biological hypothesis as part of that picture.

What are the specific behaviors described or characteristics of reported activity that say "Extra-terrestrial" to you?

 

[manxman]

also yall forgetting, we king's of apes, may one day become non biological, but the rest of earths species will not, the ET kings of apes will only be the most advanced species in their worlds, they will still be apart of their home eco-system, besides i dont think theres a snowball's chance of uploading sentience to a machine, i personally believe we get to see all of creation, in one form or another, and experience all there is to experience, otherwise creation was pointless.

one time you are the cat, another time you are the mouse.

we will experience all there ever has been, and all there ever will be.
i think that's what people who experience NDE's, are experiencing when they say they see everything they have ever done, and everyone/thing they have ever interacted with, and the effect that interaction had.
a summation of their existence, and on to the next.

time doesnt exist, just nature, there was no beginning, and there will be no end.
we are all apart of the same thing.

or maybe the euphoria at the point of death is natures way of saying thanks for your input, that's yer lot, lights out, you cease to exist, accept in peoples memories.

 

[marduk]

Isaac Koi censored my voice. He took my voice my from me. I have no choice but to go public. I have posted his email where he banned me. I clearly said that I would not engage the UFO debunker in a flame war. I advised the UFO debunker that perhaps he should go to a UFO debunking group. Isaac Koi responded by taking the side of the UFO debunker, banned me, and complimented the knowledge and experience of the UFO debunker. Now combine this with his interest with CSICOP and other skeptical groups and it is evidence that we may have had a debunker in our midst for a very long time. Why are we acting like a debunker wouldn't try try to infiltrate a UFO group?

A while back I was temporarily banned from a board that I really believed in. I've since walked away from what it was and what I wanted it to be because it became random emoting and whining - with the support of the forum mods and owner.

It wasn't mine and it became something I could no longer support. So I walked away.

And I've been nothing but better off for it.

 

[manxman]

sleepers are all part of the dis-info game, a game that's been in-play longer than all of us have been alive, [apart from gene] you are going to see many so called converts to skepticism [debunkers], its all a mind game, its the Hyneks that are the important characters in ufology, a true conversion against the establishment, and all that treasonable act brings with it, intellectual integrity is rare in science and government, funding is god..