-
NEW! LOWEST RATES EVER -- SUPPORT THE SHOW AND ENJOY THE VERY BEST PREMIUM PARACAST EXPERIENCE! Welcome to The Paracast+, eight years young! For a low subscription fee, you can download the ad-free version of The Paracast and the exclusive, member-only, After The Paracast bonus podcast, featuring color commentary, exclusive interviews, the continuation of interviews that began on the main episode of The Paracast. We also offer lifetime memberships! Flash! Take advantage of our lowest rates ever! Act now! It's easier than ever to susbcribe! You can sign up right here!
Consciousness and the Paranormal — Part 10
- Thread starter Gene Steinberg
- Start date
Free episodes:
- Status
smcder
Paranormal Adept
Sure, it's a review of Philosophy Outside-In: A Critique of Academic Reason:
Philosophy Outside-In: A Critique of Academic Reason // Reviews // Notre Dame Philosophical Reviews // University of Notre Dame
Randall
J. Randall Murphy
When you read, do you always bypass in your imagination the sounds the words make when spoken? Just curious.
Randall
J. Randall Murphy
Not with poetry.
Read the papers I linked today for yourself.
AlanValiant
Paranormal Novice
The following is an excerpt from my book Why Believe, When You Can Know, which features a chapter written by the late Professor, Dr. Carl Jung through me, and elucidates the differences between the mind and the brain and the mind as the source of consciousness:
"Any form of applied psychiatry that fails to include a comprehensive understanding of man as a spiritual being is a false
psychiatry. The word is derived from the Greek "psyche", the personification of the soul, and "iatros", a physician. The modern definition of the psyche is "soul, spirit, mind". A practitioner of psychiatry should, by definition, be primarily concerned with the spiritual welfare of his patients so why is it that the psychiatry of today is almost entirely aligned along the materialistic, physical approach?
The answer lies in the fact that psychiatrists, in general, tend to eschew any reference to the soul because that to them has religious
connotations and, thinking themselves to be entirely practical, objective and down to earth practitioners of an established profession
they frequently adhere to the chemical medicine techniques that they inherited from their medical fraternity.
The human being is regarded by the psychiatric establishment as a physical body entirely controlled by a brain. This concept is totally
false and is responsible for great suffering endured by mental patients in the name of mental health.
Because of this limitation on the understanding of the true nature of man, psychiatry is almost entirely misapplied. Physical means are employed in a usually vain attempt to alleviate a mental disorder. A tiny minority of cases of abnormal behaviour have a physical cause. In nearly all of these, the origin of the aberration will be found in brain damage, however caused, or in the introduction of noxious substances to the body in whatever form.
When the psychiatric profession is prepared to jettison its Freudian concepts in favour of purely spiritual ones, great advances
will be made in the mental welfare establishments. The current overcrowding m mental hospitals is a direct indictment against
contemporary methods. The success rate in the profession is extremely low and this is not surprising.
When one considers that, in the twentieth century, doctors and psychiatrists are involved in applying electric currents to people's
brains often resulting in cellular brain damage, in order to attempt to ameliorate some purely emotional condition, then the true horror of the present approach may be discerned. The attitude seems to be, "If the treatment produces a change then it must be working. " How naive an approach this is! Electro-convulsive "therapy", along with many other techniques, is tantamount to a mediaeval style of torture that does nothing but harm to the trusting victim.
Criticism of psychiatry can be justified on more than one ground. Firstly, many of the modern methods are immoral and, secondly, they achieve few positive results. Thirdly, they are almost entirely based upon the completely false assumption that man is only body and brain. Has any doctor or psychiatrist ever discovered the location of the spirit, mind or soul? No! Yet they refer to the mind which they erroneously believe to be the brain.
Let us, now, revert to the very basic facts of existence that are unacceptable to western societies and, in particular, to most
psychiatrists. In the first place, man is a spiritual being and as such is immortal. He dwells for the length of a lifetime in a body
composed of meat. Before our births, we already existed. During our earthly lives, we exist and, after the death of our bodies, we cont-
inue to exist.
What is it then that continues to exist, since the physical body can be seen to have decayed along with its brain? It is the mind and
spirit that constitute a spiritual being that persist after the corporeal remains have been disposed of. There follows a definition of
the mind that I wrote through the author on 15th September, 1979.
CARL JUNG'S DEFINITION OF THE MIND
1. The mind is the spiritual repository of memory.
2. The mind is the centre of intelligence of the spiritual entity.
3. The mind is the motivator.
4. The mind is the sensory centre.
5. The mind is the centre of emotion.
6. The mind is capable of evaluating and of calculating mathematically.
7. Postulates created by the mind determine action.
8. The mind is non-physical.
9. The contents of the human mind determine spiritual status.
10. The mind is the centre of will.
11. The state of the mind influences the physical condition of the body.
12. The mind is capable of being influenced by external physical factors.
13. The mind may be influenced by other minds.
14. The mind survives the death of the body.
15. While incarnate, memories of previous lives are suppressed but
remain, usually inaccessibly, in the subconscious part of the mind.
16. It is the content of the subconscious mind that is responsible for the
great majority of psychiatric disorders.
17. The condition of every human being, whether incarnate or discarnate, is the direct end result of his or her experiences,
abilities, mental processes and attitudes acquired and accumulated during his or her total existence of many
incarnations and immeasurable periods of earth time in heaven.
Any biological experiments that appear to indicate that memories are being stored in living cells are being misinterpreted. Because
such experiments are carried out by psychiatrists or psychologists, the results and findings are interpreted only through materialist-
ically prejudiced eyes. The concept of a spiritual mind is usually beyond the practitioner's ability to grasp, therefore he firmly
believes that the seat of memory, senses and emotions is in the brain. It is not! The brain is a vital organ and among its functions are the servo-control of the locomotor muscles in the body, the control of the endocrine secretions, the maintenance of equilibrium of the oxygen and carbon dioxide content of the blood and the conversion of neurological signals into a computerised form of information, e. g. visual, auditory, tactile, olfactory and gustatory. The brain is also responsible for the control of the routine functions of the body such as metabolism, cell regeneration, the heartbeat, thermostatic control and the provision of suitable physical conditions to enable a wound, for example, to be healed but, and it is a very big but, we sense nothing with the brain, only with the mind and it is the mind, linked to the brain for the duration of incarnate life, that monitors the signals in the brain.
By these means the body is influenced for good or bad by the mental state of the person. Animals are no different from humans in their basic form, for mind is always present in every living animate form no matter whether it be an amoeba or an advanced primate.
Psycho-analysis, when properly carried out, can be very effective and is usually only limited in its therapeutic effect by the measure
of the practitioner's understanding of the true nature of his patient.
As stated in article seventeen of my previously given definition of the mind, we are the end result of our experiences, abilities, mental
processes and attitudes acquired and accumulated during our total existence of many incarnations. Thus, it can be seen that what we did or what happened to us in earlier lives can affect us in the present."
"Any form of applied psychiatry that fails to include a comprehensive understanding of man as a spiritual being is a false
psychiatry. The word is derived from the Greek "psyche", the personification of the soul, and "iatros", a physician. The modern definition of the psyche is "soul, spirit, mind". A practitioner of psychiatry should, by definition, be primarily concerned with the spiritual welfare of his patients so why is it that the psychiatry of today is almost entirely aligned along the materialistic, physical approach?
The answer lies in the fact that psychiatrists, in general, tend to eschew any reference to the soul because that to them has religious
connotations and, thinking themselves to be entirely practical, objective and down to earth practitioners of an established profession
they frequently adhere to the chemical medicine techniques that they inherited from their medical fraternity.
The human being is regarded by the psychiatric establishment as a physical body entirely controlled by a brain. This concept is totally
false and is responsible for great suffering endured by mental patients in the name of mental health.
Because of this limitation on the understanding of the true nature of man, psychiatry is almost entirely misapplied. Physical means are employed in a usually vain attempt to alleviate a mental disorder. A tiny minority of cases of abnormal behaviour have a physical cause. In nearly all of these, the origin of the aberration will be found in brain damage, however caused, or in the introduction of noxious substances to the body in whatever form.
When the psychiatric profession is prepared to jettison its Freudian concepts in favour of purely spiritual ones, great advances
will be made in the mental welfare establishments. The current overcrowding m mental hospitals is a direct indictment against
contemporary methods. The success rate in the profession is extremely low and this is not surprising.
When one considers that, in the twentieth century, doctors and psychiatrists are involved in applying electric currents to people's
brains often resulting in cellular brain damage, in order to attempt to ameliorate some purely emotional condition, then the true horror of the present approach may be discerned. The attitude seems to be, "If the treatment produces a change then it must be working. " How naive an approach this is! Electro-convulsive "therapy", along with many other techniques, is tantamount to a mediaeval style of torture that does nothing but harm to the trusting victim.
Criticism of psychiatry can be justified on more than one ground. Firstly, many of the modern methods are immoral and, secondly, they achieve few positive results. Thirdly, they are almost entirely based upon the completely false assumption that man is only body and brain. Has any doctor or psychiatrist ever discovered the location of the spirit, mind or soul? No! Yet they refer to the mind which they erroneously believe to be the brain.
Let us, now, revert to the very basic facts of existence that are unacceptable to western societies and, in particular, to most
psychiatrists. In the first place, man is a spiritual being and as such is immortal. He dwells for the length of a lifetime in a body
composed of meat. Before our births, we already existed. During our earthly lives, we exist and, after the death of our bodies, we cont-
inue to exist.
What is it then that continues to exist, since the physical body can be seen to have decayed along with its brain? It is the mind and
spirit that constitute a spiritual being that persist after the corporeal remains have been disposed of. There follows a definition of
the mind that I wrote through the author on 15th September, 1979.
CARL JUNG'S DEFINITION OF THE MIND
1. The mind is the spiritual repository of memory.
2. The mind is the centre of intelligence of the spiritual entity.
3. The mind is the motivator.
4. The mind is the sensory centre.
5. The mind is the centre of emotion.
6. The mind is capable of evaluating and of calculating mathematically.
7. Postulates created by the mind determine action.
8. The mind is non-physical.
9. The contents of the human mind determine spiritual status.
10. The mind is the centre of will.
11. The state of the mind influences the physical condition of the body.
12. The mind is capable of being influenced by external physical factors.
13. The mind may be influenced by other minds.
14. The mind survives the death of the body.
15. While incarnate, memories of previous lives are suppressed but
remain, usually inaccessibly, in the subconscious part of the mind.
16. It is the content of the subconscious mind that is responsible for the
great majority of psychiatric disorders.
17. The condition of every human being, whether incarnate or discarnate, is the direct end result of his or her experiences,
abilities, mental processes and attitudes acquired and accumulated during his or her total existence of many
incarnations and immeasurable periods of earth time in heaven.
Any biological experiments that appear to indicate that memories are being stored in living cells are being misinterpreted. Because
such experiments are carried out by psychiatrists or psychologists, the results and findings are interpreted only through materialist-
ically prejudiced eyes. The concept of a spiritual mind is usually beyond the practitioner's ability to grasp, therefore he firmly
believes that the seat of memory, senses and emotions is in the brain. It is not! The brain is a vital organ and among its functions are the servo-control of the locomotor muscles in the body, the control of the endocrine secretions, the maintenance of equilibrium of the oxygen and carbon dioxide content of the blood and the conversion of neurological signals into a computerised form of information, e. g. visual, auditory, tactile, olfactory and gustatory. The brain is also responsible for the control of the routine functions of the body such as metabolism, cell regeneration, the heartbeat, thermostatic control and the provision of suitable physical conditions to enable a wound, for example, to be healed but, and it is a very big but, we sense nothing with the brain, only with the mind and it is the mind, linked to the brain for the duration of incarnate life, that monitors the signals in the brain.
By these means the body is influenced for good or bad by the mental state of the person. Animals are no different from humans in their basic form, for mind is always present in every living animate form no matter whether it be an amoeba or an advanced primate.
Psycho-analysis, when properly carried out, can be very effective and is usually only limited in its therapeutic effect by the measure
of the practitioner's understanding of the true nature of his patient.
As stated in article seventeen of my previously given definition of the mind, we are the end result of our experiences, abilities, mental
processes and attitudes acquired and accumulated during our total existence of many incarnations. Thus, it can be seen that what we did or what happened to us in earlier lives can affect us in the present."
William Strathmann
Paranormal Adept
Apart from your Dr. Carl Jung channeled info, according to this link, the world's human population in 1927 was 2 billion, while today it is about 7.5 billion. Your idea of continuous reincarnation must take into account actual facts like these. As far as I can see, there is no consistent way for your reincarnation view to account for this difference, other than to say that many more than 5.5 billion people since 1927 had been only previously incarnated as animals. I'm not really curious to know if psychic channelers actually channel such past lives of dogs and cats, pigs, cows, crows and goldfish. But that seems to be the logical trajectory of your claims. Until you can clarify things like this I don't see how any people here on the Paracast forums are going to find your posts compelling in any way.
Randall
J. Randall Murphy
I already know what the papers say. I was asking what you think that is. Or is cutting and pasting other people's stuff the extent of your thought process?
smcder
Paranormal Adept
"Pooh?" asked Piglet one summer's eve ...
"Ah ... yes?"
"Well, Pooh ... why do you suppose Owl says mean things ... calls people "nitwits" and insults their intelligence and ... and ... "
"Tries to provoke them?" Pooh answered, a bit absent-minded ... he was kindly and concerned about his friend, but he was also a bear after all ... and so always looking for that next bit of honey.
"Yes!" cried Piglet excitedly. "That's the thing!"
"Oh, well, I don't know ... really ... perhaps he doesn't have enough ... ahm ... honey in his life." Pooh answered, licking his lips. "Or ... "
"Yes? Yes?" - Piglet really wanted to know.
"Well, I suppose ... like all of us ... Owl really wants other people's attention and wants to be recognized and respected ... but it takes years of hard work for example to know just where to look for honey and when. And how to distract the bees once you've found it. To get the necessary skills to be successful at getting honey!" Pooh was quite proud of this analysis for he was a bear of very little brain but he did know his honey.
"Oh, Pooh! We're not talking about honey!"
Pooh appeared quite startled - "Aren't we??" For he had been sure they were talking about honey, after all.
AlanValiant
Paranormal Novice
William, I'm familiar with this argument against reincarnation. The problem is the limited perspective we have here on Earth. The argument is based on the idea that the humans that have incarnated on this planet are the only ones in existence, but there are other inhabited planets and also, before incarnating as human, a spiritual being will experience different forms of insect, bird and animal life as part of the process of spiritual evolution which occurs over millions of years. There are countless spiritual beings in existence either incarnate or in the spiritual world, and there is never a shortage who are preparing to reincarnate, or incarnate for the first time as human in a minority of cases. The time between lives can vary greatly, from a few years to thousands in some cases. Of course, the amount that can incarnate at any one time is dependent on the process of human procreation. For those with an open mind, I would refer you to the work of Dr. Ian Stevenson for scientific evidence of reincarnation.
The Well Dressed Man With A Beard
After the final no there comes a yes
And on that yes the future world depends.
No was the night. Yes is this present sun.
If the rejected things, the things denied,
Slid over the western cataract, yet one,
One only, one thing that was firm, even
No greater than a cricket's horn, no more
Than a thought to be rehearsed all day, a speech
Of the self that must sustain itself on speech,
One thing remaining, infallible, would be
Enough. Ah! douce campagna of that thing!
Ah! douce campagna, honey in the heart,
Green in the body, out of a petty phrase,
Out of a thing believed, a thing affirmed:
The form on the pillow humming while one sleeps,
The aureole above the humming house...
It can never be satisfied, the mind, never.
Wallace Stevens
We could talk about how to interpret this poem if anyone wants to. If not, I'll just say that I think the reference to the "cricket's horn" opens up Stevens's meaning in the poem, and that the significance of the cricket's horn is also expressed in this poem of Stevens:
Tattoo
The light is like a spider.
It crawls over the water.
It crawls over the edges of the snow.
It crawls under your eyelids
And spreads its webs there—
Its two webs.
The webs of your eyes
Are fastened
To the flesh and bones of you
As to rafters or grass.
There are filaments of your eyes
On the surface of the water
And in the edges of the snow.
{So what, then, is the referent of "the thing affirmed" -- even for the cricket -- in the first poem and the meaning of "the two webs" interconnected in lived experience in the second poem? What grounds and sustains us as we watch our failed concepts "slide over the western cataract" again and again and still reawaken to a world worth living and speaking in, speaking about -- a world we are reluctant to leave?}
William Strathmann
Paranormal Adept
There are alternative possibilities to explain the "scientific evidence" for the phenomenon you describe as "reincarnation." For example, that all these "spirits" that you and your friends channel, were, and will always remain, non-human intelligent beings who deceptively pose as dead, post-incarnate humans precisely to lead you to believe the flawed reincarnation worldview that you hold. Such entities, being well-familiar with humans on earth, could deceptively impersonate humans of the past. You and your channeling friends willingly invite these entities to partial incarnation during your channeling sessions. Other people who make claims of past lives may actually be unwittingly enticed by these non-human entities to accept them as previously carnate humans. Even among humans on earth there is such a thing as deception. With regret, I think, Mr. Valiant, that you and your friends are being deceived by these non-human entities that you channel. The worst part is that the longer you willingly open yourself to these non-human entities, the more deeply infested they become in you, and you become, essentially, enslaved to them. I do believe there is a way to find relief, but that would first require you to acknowledge that you may be mistaken about your views on reincarnation. And that's your business.
An interesting book. Here's the link to available text at amazon:
Don't know why the link won't set. But it's easy to find.
Last edited:
Randall
J. Randall Murphy
Once upon a time when I was relatively young and naïve I thought reincarnation made a lot of sense, and people were really "spirits" in bodies, and that other non-corporeal beings exist in some other "dimension", and so on until I worked most of that out and determined it's largely wishy-washy quasi-religious nonsense better left in the ancient past.
smcder
Paranormal Adept
Nah ... that's just because in a previous life you were an ancient Greek skeptic.
William Strathmann
Paranormal Adept
Here is a link to an article by a Fermi Lab physicist, Don Lincoln, who lays out the evidence for a smaller realm of physics than is currently known in the Standard Model.
The question I ask is if such a sub-level of physics actually exists, could it have its own smaller version of a Standard Model "particle zoo" of particles that we cannot detect, but that could support the existence of intelligent entities?
If that is possible, or if it is actually real, then that could be part of the explanation for "spirit" beings that have been reported for millenia. As I mentioned in a post a few pages ago, such a level of physics might be crucial for our own consciousness as well, and could be the basis for a part of each person's reality beyond the usual physical particles of the Standard Model.
Something along these lines would explain several experiences I've had, and it's also why I sometimes engage assertions that are essentially unprovable from a typical empirical point of view.
The question I ask is if such a sub-level of physics actually exists, could it have its own smaller version of a Standard Model "particle zoo" of particles that we cannot detect, but that could support the existence of intelligent entities?
If that is possible, or if it is actually real, then that could be part of the explanation for "spirit" beings that have been reported for millenia. As I mentioned in a post a few pages ago, such a level of physics might be crucial for our own consciousness as well, and could be the basis for a part of each person's reality beyond the usual physical particles of the Standard Model.
Something along these lines would explain several experiences I've had, and it's also why I sometimes engage assertions that are essentially unprovable from a typical empirical point of view.
smcder
Paranormal Adept
I haven't read the article yet, but at first blush it sounds like the shadow physics we discussed a while back ... I'll see if I can find the posts.
smcder
Paranormal Adept
but just be aware that you may get some interference from the forum's Quantum Woo Police:
- Status