Dr Greer´s core team leaves him

[Frank Stalter]

I stand corrected, Mr. Stalter! Thanks for that. (My sentiments remain the same. Cheers to you.)

Haha, well I didn't think you were wrong. Greer gets under a lot of people's skin, mine too to a point. He throws a lot of crap at the wall, although some of it isn't crap, they are good ideas. He knows his stuff too. A friend who went to one of his seminars said it was pretty intense, classroom work, and Greer is the instructor and he's solid and my friend is a practicing professional and I trust his judgment on that.

I am not a Greer fan, just trying to call it like I see it.

 

[Jeff Davis]

Goggs, thanks for the comments on Ingo Swann. "Penetration" is a very, very curious book which I find hard to believe was intended to be taken seriously by the author himself. His autobiography (unfinished?) on his webpage, on the other hand, is fascinating and the work of a first-rate, if argumentative and somewhat plaintive mind. He saw a lot of curious sh*t go down, and named names. I also found a great early study of RV, "Thoughts Through Space", via Swann's autobiography, the former was a tome he allegedly found on a skimpy shelf of books deep in the Library of Congress which purported to be the only paranormal books the Powers that Be took seriously. I don't doubt it; it's from 1948 or so, and is the best scientific documentation of a long-term RV experiment that I've ever read. Very interesting stuff, Swann leads to more interesting avenues than Greer does, any old day! Greer is, at (?) best, kid's stuff!

Sorry to hijack, back to the (ugh) task at hand...
Muadib, great f-in post! LMAO.


I study that list well and commit to memory...

There is absolutely zero question in my mind that Swann was the real deal. That's my belief anyway. I base that on his achievements which were the product of lab specific scientific documentation that has since bared up remarkably well under extreme scrutiny.

Greer however, is an absolute insult to the intelligence of anyone considering the matter of UFOs. Disclosure? As if we are in control of any of it.

Greer is an absolute proved fraud, albeit I have no doubt whatsoever that the man is both an intelligent and cunning operator.

 

[Bulk]

Ufology wrote:

On a related note. Greer isn't the first person I've heard of who used flashlights to try to communicate with aliens. Back when I first started USI, a couple of older fellows from BC said that they knew someone out on Vancouver Island who was doing it and suggested that we setup something similar here in Alberta. That was back around 1990. Does anyone know of people using flashlights prior to then for attempted contact?

Yes, In Haines' CE-5 book there a chapter on various types of responses to lights from pilots and others.

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[Lou_Sheehan]

I don't think it is quite what you are looking for, but there is a suggestion that the use of a flashlight attracted the UFO in the Allagash abduction.

On 4/2/14 I came across this (another flashlight case) on-line:

A Philadelphia taxi cab driver reported an incident with a UFO sighted along Route 76 east between the Conshohocken and Belmont exits where the object communicated in Morse Code, according to April 2, 2014, testimony in Case 55170 from the Mutual UFO Network (MUFON) witness reporting database.

The witness is recalling the event from memory and places it in either October or November of either 1981 or 1982 at about 3:25 a.m. He was operating a taxi cab business at the time. At 3 a.m., he was hired to drive someone to the Sheraton Hotel in Valley Forge, about a 25-mile trip. After making that trip and stopping to pick up a cup of coffee, he was returning to the city along Route 76 east, the Schuylkill Expressway.

The event took place somewhere between the Conshohocken and Belmont exits.

"I noticed a very bright light in the northeastern sky that seemed to be floating in one spot," the witness stated. "I thought, why is a traffic helicopter out this early in the morning? Maybe a bad accident in front of me? I called on the CB radio and asked if a traffic jam was down the road. A truck driver answered me and said he didn't hear of any. I then found out he was behind me about quarter mile."

The witness described the object.

"As I got closer to the light I slowed down to get a better look at it - about 45 mph). Now I could see smaller lights around the bottom of this craft, flashing green, blue, red. I asked the truck driver if he saw the bright light out his left hand window. Then he told me he was looking at a very bright disk with little lights flashing on the bottom."

The witness pulled over just below and south of the object.

"I was just above the Spring Garden Street exit. My position was south and across from the Philadelphia Art Museum almost under a stone railroad bridge. Just then a truck passed me, and asked me on the CB if I was OK. I told him, yes, and asked if he would report what we were seeing. 'No way' was his answer."

The witness checked for sound coming from the object.

"When I rolled down my window to hear the whirl of the rotor blades, it then hit me that there wasn't any noise coming from this object."

The witness then tried to communicate with the object.

"For some reason I picked up the spotlight I used to locate house numbers, flashing it at the UFO. The craft flashed back from a smaller light in the very bottom center. It was mimicking me. Okay, let's try something here - and I flashed in Morse Code the word 'Hi' it flashed back 'Hi.' It must be a program to repeat back to the sender."

Then the witness attempted something more complicated.

"So then I flashed, 'My name is Charlie.' What I expected to receive and didn't is why I'll remember this for the rest of my life. They transmitted back to me, 'My name is Zon.'"

The witness looked back at the object, and it was gone.

"I scanned the sky and never saw it again. Stunned and shaking, I used the mobile phone to report what just happened. Three days later two men from the government, (their words) interviewed me and told me someone would be calling me to check on my sighting. To this day no one has ever called or asked about it."

The above quotes were edited for clarity.

 

[Bulk]

Rizla wrote:

I also found a great early study of RV, "Thoughts Through Space", via Swann's autobiography, the former was a tome he allegedly found on a skimpy shelf of books deep in the Library of Congress which purported to be the only paranormal books the Powers that Be took seriously. I don't doubt it; it's from 1948 or so, and is the best scientific documentation of a long-term RV experiment that I've ever read.

--

Correction: Wilkins and Sherman used psychic functioning at preset times for their months-long experiment. [I have the book.]

RV requires that the viewer knows nothing about the target whatsoever.

The viewer is simply shown an envelope on a table with the target written on a piece of paper inside the envelope. Then he is asked to answer whatever questions about the target that are written on the paper.

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[Rizla]

Cool to hear from someone else who's read "Thoughts Through Space." It _is_, different from the RV experiments you mentioned, totally.
I hadn't thought about that. I suppose that book and Wilkins/Sherman's experiment is unique. I still find it the most convincing RV evidence yet.

 

[Bulk]

Ufology wrote:

On a related note. Greer isn't the first person I've heard of who used flashlights to try to communicate with aliens. Back when I first started USI, a couple of older fellows from BC said that they knew someone out on Vancouver Island who was doing it and suggested that we setup something similar here in Alberta. That was back around 1990. Does anyone know of people using flashlights prior to then for attempted contact?

Yes, In Haines' CE-5 book there a chapter on various types of responses to lights from pilots and others.

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Addendum:

Excerpt of James E. McDonald from:

HEARINGS BEFORE THE COMMITTEE ON SCIENCE AND ASTRONAUTICS U.S. HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES
NINETIETH CONGRESS

SECOND SESSION
JULY 29, 1968



Dr. McDonald. Yes; the problem of contact is very important. There is one category of contact, not in the sense of shaking hands, but rather light response. I have a file on several of these, and I'm looking for more. For instance, in Shamokin, Pa., Kerstetter is the name of the witness, he works for a bank in Shamokin. I talked to the president of the bank as to his reliability and got very good recommendations. Last year, he and his wife and family were in a car near a mountain ridge in Shamokin, saw a thing hovering over the mountain, like the flashing lights of a theater marquee. He had a flashlight. He didn't know Morse code, but it really didn't matter. He sent light flashes in various orders and he got lights back from the thing. That same thing happened in Newton, N.H., in August of last year, where several persons saw an object coming overhead. The same thought occurred to them and they signaled with a flashlight. It wasn't Morse, it was dot dash dot, then dash dash dash, and it came back with no failure, replicated light signals. The same thing happened in West Virginia, where a pharmacist, named Sommers, did it with his headlights. When I was in Australia, I talked about some hunters out hunting kangaroo. A disk came over, one said "give them Morse"; the flash came back faithfully, and they left in a hurry. Is that contact? I don't know. Nobody got any intelligence out of it either way, if you will pardon the whimsy. It would be terrible if in fact this was surveillance and our technology was represented by the Eveready flashlight. [Laughter.]

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[brewers_rule]

I recently heard Greer on another paranormal podcast (the name of which I just gave you) and was wondering if he's been on The Paracast before or where I can see a true examination of his supposed evidence the likes of which a Gene or Chris would give. Just listening to his rambling answers that have absolutely no evidence offered than "I have recordings" or "I have Rumsfeld on video" made me think he was wandering into 9/11 Truther territory fairly quickly and became laughable to listen to even with my limited experience scrutinizing this field's experts. I've been listening to The Paracast for a year or so now and have heard him mentioned but never interviewed in that time.

 

[Double Nought Spy]

They could do a whole series! Next could be "Dr. Reed," then Michael Salla. Sean David Morton? Maybe, if we're lucky, via pay phone from prison.

Seriously, this doofus gets far more attention than he deserves. Gene and Chris have about nine million better things to be doing than wasting resources on such flakes.

One thing I need to do though, is find out when he's going to be fleecing people up in Crestone so I don't have to worry about running into him. Man, talk about harshing the mellow.

On the other hand, anybody can play the flashlight game. Hmmmm.....

 

[Jeff Davis]

They could do a whole series! Next could be "Dr. Reed," then Michael Salla. Sean David Morton? Maybe, if we're lucky, via pay phone from prison.

Seriously, this doofus gets far more attention than he deserves. Gene and Chris have about nine million better things to be doing than wasting resources on such flakes.

One thing I need to do though, is find out when he's going to be fleecing people up in Crestone so I don't have to worry about running into him. Man, talk about harshing the mellow.

On the other hand, anybody can play the flashlight game. Hmmmm.....

"Vectoring in UFOs for fun and profit." I just LOVE that. UFO Watchdog is to be praised.

 

[Wade]

Lots of folks said they liked listening to J.C. Johnson because his (ridiculous) stories were entertaining. If any of those folks happen to read this, I was wondering if you also like to listen to Greer for the same reason. If not, why not?

Thanks,

Lance

A very, very, fair point Lance but I don't think Greer is the best example. Not many Greerophiles here. I wonder if someone like Brad Steiger might not be a better example. Very entertaining and interesting stories but kind of dodgy and vague on details (at least in his last appearance here.)

 

[Jeff Davis]

A very, very, fair point Lance but I don't think Greer is the best example. Not many Greerophiles here. I wonder if someone like Brad Steiger might not be a better example. Very entertaining and interesting stories but kind of dodgy and vague on details (at least in his last appearance here.)

The problem with Greer is that he feigns science. He is a fraud. If this JC guy were to collect scat, turn it in, get the results back as a racoon, and then attempt to pass it off as a giant snake's or lizard's, he would be in league with Greer.

How many of you guys and gals here are roughly 50-60 years old? Remember all those COOL looking paper backs in the school library that had either giant snakes attacking people in rafts going down a river, or giant gila monsters with babes in bikinis saddled atop? That's this guy. He just spent too much time at the library.

Greer on the other hand, he's a professional that pockets hundreds of thousands each year taking advantage of people. Unsubstantiated tall tales are one thing, fraud in which monitary spoils are the reward for such criminally unethical BS as Greer attempts to pass off is another. JMO.

 

[Wade]

I'm not really arguing that point but I suppose then that begs the question where's the line of demarcation ?

Obviously with Greer it's money and ego, and therefore is worthy of whatever condescension I can come up with.

Last year we all had great fun (me included) picking on blake cousins and his faux ufo site. Now I think I spent all of ten minutes looking at the site and have yet to go back but I didn't really sense a hard-sell pay to play subscription based site. Some people here posted links to the site of amatuerish production value that seemed to be free. So if that was/is this case. What is the diff between jc and Blake ? The only distinction I could come up with is that JC is interesting, could easily defend himself and is, above all, a likable fellow Blake is about as interesting as cottage cheese and withered under the scrutiny like a hot house flower. I wonder if he Ever did get into a flying saucer. If the cousins episode was branded a campfire episode would the forum thread have read any different ? I'm Not pointing fingers here, because I always question my own motives or beliefs as well whenever I seem to carry two conflicting thoughts. I think many of us do carry unknowingly and it's not that we are hypocrites, it sometimes just takes another person to see the flaw in our thought processes.

 

[Jeff Davis]

You make an exceptional point. We do willfully choose what we find favor with, and what we don't. What we dismiss, and what we call out, and as much could definitely be percieved as hypocritical on behalf of those like myself. How could any of us deny as much? I certainly cannot. Whereas it might be second nature for someone like myself to fully realize, "hey, this requires just a grain or two, but I certainly won't be adding any more salt than that", there may in fact be people that are done a great disservice by those like JC. Decieved.

I slightly recant here, especially if there is an actual detriment to some individual via JCs reporting, albeit I never felt like calling that young man (Blake) a fraud like I do Greer. There are a lot of people that serve to dilute the potential interest that the UFO phenomenon represents by treating it like a holiday parade. The space brothers are coming to save us type thing. That's where I see people like Blake muddying up the waters and making it all appear to be one big joke to researchers. Then you get Dolan and Friedman into the picture and it really looks like this whole Ufology thing is for the mentally ill.

However, in JC's case, hogwash is hogwash I suppose.

 

[trainedobserver]

Lots of folks said they liked listening to J.C. Johnson because his (ridiculous) stories were entertaining. If any of those folks happen to read this, I was wondering if you also like to listen to Greer for the same reason. If not, why not?

Thanks,

Lance

I just enjoy listening to weird stories myself.

I have listened to Greer's and I have to say I watched his latest attempt, Sirius, three times. Why? The comedy. The human drama inherent in a train wreak.

At some point I realized that my interests in the paranormal, whether that is UFOs or what have you, is really about an interest in the people telling the stories and the stories themselves rather than fantastic creatures and events they describe. Does that make sense?

The difference between J.C. and Greer probably isn't that much. Both undoubtedly feel they are champions of truth fighting the good fight. The reality probably doesn't measure up so well to that though. J.C. is essentially reporting the discovery of a homicidal death cult operating in the United States. The fact that the main focus on "furry people" seems to take priority over what would have to be considered a much more interesting and important aspect of his stories.

 

[Goggs Mackay]

I just enjoy listening to weird stories myself.

I have listened to Greer's and I have to say I watched his latest attempt, Sirius, three times. Why? The comedy. The human drama inherent in a train wreak.

At some point I realized that my interests in the paranormal, whether that is UFOs or what have you, is really about an interest in the people telling the stories and the stories themselves rather than fantastic creatures and events they describe. Does that make sense?

The difference between J.C. and Greer probably isn't that much. Both undoubtedly feel they are champions of truth fighting the good fight. The reality probably doesn't measure up so well to that though. J.C. is essentially reporting the discovery of a homicidal death cult operating in the United States. The fact that the main focus on "furry people" seems to take priority over what would have to be considered a much more interesting and important aspect of his stories.

And of course as far as I know, J.C isn't conning people out of large sums of money, nor is he setting himself up as any 'Galactic Ambassador'.
I'll take J.C over Greer any day!

 

[trainedobserver]

And of course as far as I know, J.C isn't conning people out of large sums of money, nor is he setting himself up as any 'Galactic Ambassador'.
I'll take J.C over Greer any day!

What would you do if you had evidence or even suspicion that this skinwalker death cult is engaging in intimidation, murder, human sacrifice, and who knows what else? Would you come on a paranormal radio show and talk about it along side stories about horny bigfeet? Just say'n.

 

[Goggs Mackay]

What would you do if you had evidence or even suspicion that this skinwalker death cult is engaging in intimidation, murder, human sacrifice, and who knows what else? Would you come on a paranormal radio show and talk about it along side stories about horny bigfeet? Just say'n.

I honestly don't know. The whole skinwalker thing is strange in that as far as I know, First Nation police officer's also believe in Skinwalkers and because it is such a hush-hush topic, you have to wonder if such a thing was going on, it probably won't be reported to outside forces and because of that I suppose anyone on the outside can say what they like because no-one takes it seriously in the non-native American world?

 

[Wade]

Dr. Steven Greed has a certain ring to it does it not ?

 

[RealLife7]

Hi there... I have had an indirect contact to Mr. Steven Greer, but this had an massive impact on my life so far and it's not over yet.
I haven't heard from him before March 2016. But then my girl friend decided to attend a seminar in Tucson with her Mum. When she came back, she was brainwashed and it took a while to get her back on track. But she was in constantly contact with him (just mention that her family is very wealthy..), talking about it and even financing him and his projects. A lot of: if and maybes.. free energy and conspiracy theories.. I also believe in some stories about the banks, governments and what the drive behind it is.. but the same with him. 2300$ for 5 nights á 6 hours whatever.. 25-30 attendes..
i was interested to get more information but got blocked more and more. And she was always praying the loving energy there, the magical athomsphere. But ok, we made it through and life became awesome again. Making future plans etc
But then they went to another "meeting" again just a few weeks ago to California, Joshua Tree. While she was there, I got a feeling of she now sees the things more realistic. She came back and things went worse. She was not just brainwashed, she couldn't even communicate properly. Just struggling finding words and everything just doesn't makes sense. I was shattered and now, without any bad manner from my side, she is aggressive, lying and just changed. People haveing contact with her struggling to follow her. I guessed she got some mescaline and a lot of wrong input..
i Know, it might sound just like a bad love story, but it's obvious that this group and his leader can't be a peaceful and harmless society.
It's dangerous. And I am very concerned about her!
Kind regards