Info on very weird story?

[Sean Elifritz]

On the latest episode of Paratopia Whitley Strieber talks about a very strange encounter at the end of the program that allegedly happened in Indonesia. I looked for information by googling but didn't find anything. The story he told was about a group of 5-6 hikers who disappeared. 3 months later after a search effort was initiated by one of the missing mens' family members one of them was found wondering aimlessly around the area. He told a story of being followed around by small, strange looking beings and that the landscape seemed to have changed and was populated by bizarre animals. None of the other hikers have been found. Well, that's a pretty far-out story. Sounds like the sort of thing that could be an urban legend but Strieber talked about it like he had no doubts about its authenticity. I was wondering if anyone around here knows anything about it.

 

[tyder001]

Not familar with it. Ya know I like Whitley and think it took guts for him to come out as a main stream writer and put himself out there for ridicule. Of course some will say ( I honestly don't know) that he has made more out of that than he did with his fiction. But, I digress. Even though I like Whitley and enjoy some of his stories I am afraid they are really, really far "out there." He seems to give credibitility to easily on simple hear say.

 

[Kieran]

I was listening to the half hour version they put up on site. It seems this event only came from correspondence with someone in that area. I not sure you will find evidence if it was not a major news story, i not sure if he mentioned a year even? I might try to see if i dig up something if I can to help you.

 

[Sean Elifritz]

Not familar with it. Ya know I like Whitley and think it took guts for him to come out as a main stream writer and put himself out there for ridicule. Of course some will say ( I honestly don't know) that he has made more out of that than he did with his fiction. But, I digress. Even though I like Whitley and enjoy some of his stories I am afraid they are really, really far "out there." He seems to give credibitility to easily on simple hear say.

I have all of the books Whitley has written about his alleged experiences. I found myself believing him for the first two books (Have read both of the first two twice, in fact.) but then I got to The Secret School and I've never gotten any further because I just can't believe that book. I've tried reading it three different times now and every time I find myself rolling my eyes and eventually shelving it unfinished. Haven't read anything after that either because I want to finish it first. I can't decide if I think he's lying or simply deluding himself or whatever but just about everything in The Secret School reads like new age googly-muck to me,...enigmatic, zen-like hippies in space that make Yoda seem casual and to the point. But hey, maybe it's truthful and I'm just not imaginative or receptive enough or whatever. After all, perhaps they've never come to visit me for a reason. But if so it's confirmed that throughout the cosmos it's 1969 forever and always.

---------- Post added at 10:40 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:38 AM ----------

I was listening to the half hour version they put up on site. It seems this event only came from correspondence with someone in that area. I not sure you will find evidence if it was not a major news story, i not sure if he mentioned a year even? I might try to see if i dig up something if I can to help you.

What, is there another version?

 

[tyder001]

But if so it's confirmed that throughout the cosmos it's 1969 forever and always.

Powa to da people! I didn't get through the Secret School either. Although, the abductions starting in child hood does seem to parrell some other accounts I've read.

 

[Sean Elifritz]

Oh brother, there is a longer version...for a fee. Who in the hell would pay money for a paranormal podcast when there are kzillions of free ones out there? Yet more evidence that the Paracast is vastly superior. Beyond lame. Well, they can say goodbye to much of the audience they had built up.

---------- Post added at 11:23 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:58 AM ----------

But if so it's confirmed that throughout the cosmos it's 1969 forever and always.

Powa to da people! I didn't get through the Secret School either. Although, the abductions starting in child hood does seem to parrell some other accounts I've read.

Well, now that I think about it I might have exaggerated the hippie part a bit. Strieber sometimes flirts with that line but to be fair he never really charges full bore into it. I guess that to be more precise I'd say that the Yoda thing is what bothered me more about The Secret School (Not to mention that he starts off the book by saying he had forgotten all of this and now all of a sudden he can write about it in stunning detail.). All kinds of symbolism and big, fancy talk that doesn't really say anything. His entities can go on for paragraphs and when ya' try to decipher it ya' realize it doesn't mean a damned thing, just a lot of double talk. Is it really worth their time to come here from outer space, another dimension, a parallel universe, or even from just across the street to play simple mind games?

 

[Red]

Found these via Tony Topper and Grant Lawrence. Caveat Emptor. On a side note these abductions are being attributed to jinn.

http://www.youtube.com/user/TONYOPSUFO#p/u/4/2XMHrWBMDP4

Grant Lawrence--Bodhi Thunder: An Abduction Wave in Indonesia--Demonic Jinns or Something Else?

 

[Ron Collins]

I have all of the books Whitley has written about his alleged experiences. I found myself believing him for the first two books (Have read both of the first two twice, in fact.) but then I got to The Secret School and I've never gotten any further because I just can't believe that book. I've tried reading it three different times now and every time I find myself rolling my eyes and eventually shelving it unfinished. Haven't read anything after that either because I want to finish it first. I can't decide if I think he's lying or simply deluding himself or whatever but just about everything in The Secret School reads like new age googly-muck to me,...enigmatic, zen-like hippies in space that make Yoda seem casual and to the point. But hey, maybe it's truthful and I'm just not imaginative or receptive enough or whatever. After all, perhaps they've never come to visit me for a reason. But if so it's confirmed that throughout the cosmos it's 1969 forever and always.

---------- Post added at 10:40 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:38 AM ----------



What, is there another version?

I am right there with you. After Communion I was sold on him. Then he began a systematic milking of the subject and kept writing books. Then I started reading his confirmed fiction. Very good stuff if you are interested. But, it made me doubt him even more.

In the end I think it was all a well researched and developed fiction and none of it ever happened. I think he deserves ire from the UFO community for his continued BS. In my opinion the guy is a con artist, charlaten, and a liar. Of course, I have been known to be a bit surly when it comes to people I have written off as hacks.

 

[Sean Elifritz]

I am right there with you. After Communion I was sold on him. Then he began a systematic milking of the subject and kept writing books. Then I started reading his confirmed fiction. Very good stuff if you are interested. But, it made me doubt him even more.

In the end I think it was all a well researched and developed fiction and none of it ever happened. I think he deserves ire from the UFO community for his continued BS. In my opinion the guy is a con artist, charlaten, and a liar. Of course, I have been known to be a bit surly when it comes to people I have written off as hacks.

If he is a con he's very good at it. When he talks he really does sound like he's groping for answers, like someone being truthful but confused and trying to figure it out. I just can't decide with him. He's a gray area for me. But if he is a fraud I think he's one of the more clever ones the subject has seen. I still intend on finishing his books...some day.

 

[Facius_Cardan]

The question with people who, like Whitley, make such amazing claims is that they reach a point where believing in them is utterly impossible. I don't deny that he actually had the experiences put to paper on "Communion". Who knows how any of us would react after such horrifying happenings. Would we even be able to keep our sanity? He certainly seems to have managed to brace himself, but somehow got lost in the process of trying to make sense of all that he experienced. Besides, when someone believes what he's saying (even if it seems outlandish to others) their words certainly sound sincere. That's where the facts become murky and increasingly difficult to verify.

 

[Ron Collins]

The question with people who, like Whitley, make such amazing claims is that they reach a point where believing in them is utterly impossible. I don't deny that he actually had the experiences put to paper on "Communion". Who knows how any of us would react after such horrifying happenings. Would we even be able to keep our sanity? He certainly seems to have managed to brace himself, but somehow got lost in the process of trying to make sense of all that he experienced. Besides, when someone believes what he's saying (even if it seems outlandish to others) their words certainly sound sincere. That's where the facts become murky and increasingly difficult to verify.

The thing with Streiber is that he had been shopping an alien themed manuscript for a year or two before the Communion stuff. Apparently the hooded aliens had read it and decided to pay him a visit. Listen, I have no doubt that there are experiencers. I do not believe that all of these things can be explained by sleep paralysis, lying, or some mental disease. BUT, a good majority of them can. I just do not believe that Streiber is one of them. I think he is a fiction writer that took to extreme measures to sell a story. He was skilled enough to make it sound good, talented enough to act like it happened, and driven enough to market it. Then he began to expound and sequelize the story. It's a proven formula.

 

[Sean Elifritz]

The thing with Streiber is that he had been shopping an alien themed manuscript for a year or two before the Communion stuff. Apparently the hooded aliens had read it and decided to pay him a visit. Listen, I have no doubt that there are experiencers. I do not believe that all of these things can be explained by sleep paralysis, lying, or some mental disease. BUT, a good majority of them can. I just do not believe that Streiber is one of them. I think he is a fiction writer that took to extreme measures to sell a story. He was skilled enough to make it sound good, talented enough to act like it happened, and driven enough to market it. Then he began to expound and sequelize the story. It's a proven formula.

That true or are you just joking around? I hadn't heard that before. Undoubtedly suspicious if accurate.

---------- Post added at 12:39 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:28 PM ----------

If memory serves me correctly there is a part in The Secret School where he claims to have seen a screaming face appear before him. Apparently this happened when he was a kid and was his own terrified face from an abduction event he would later experience as an adult. So in other words this image flowed back in time to him. I don't know about the rest of ya' but that part sent my skeptical bone into overdrive. If he saw that as a kid why was he reporting it now rather than then? The whole thing with The Secret School with all these memories being nowhere in grasp and then suddenly emerging in a way where he could write an entire book in vivid detail was and remains difficult for me to accept to say the least.

 

[icculus]

I have mixed feelings about Whitley. I appreciated communion, however most of his books after really stretch credibility, and his website with all the nutters on Dreamland really stretch his credibility with me. I'm sorry but that's just the way I feel.

I would really enjoy an objective interview with Whitley by Gene & Chris, however, given his pre-madonna nature of public interviews I imagine this scenario is close to zero.

As many of you know Paratopia had Whitley on recently, however it's my opinion that Jeff & Jeremy give him some slack for whatever reason. I don't get it, you could compile a list of 50+ things Whitley has stated or closely associated himself with that are so obviously fake, insane, self-promoting or just plain silly. He might claim he wants answers but his actions and associations tell another story. How he remains a credible source of information in this area confuses me. He adds more confusion than clarity. Maybe I'm wrong, who knows.

FWIW, I really, really, enjoy Paratopia and appreciate what they bring to the table, like I said it's just confusing. I think their approach to many of the whacky "celebrities" in this field is right-on. I've posted similar questions on their forums

 

[Ron Collins]

That true or are you just joking around? I hadn't heard that before. Undoubtedly suspicious if accurate.

Yes I am serious. I will try and find the supporting data and let you know.

If memory serves me correctly there is a part in The Secret School where he claims to have seen a screaming face appear before him. Apparently this happened when he was a kid and was his own terrified face from an abduction event he would later experience as an adult. So in other words this image flowed back in time to him. I don't know about the rest of ya' but that part sent my skeptical bone into overdrive. If he saw that as a kid why was he reporting it now rather than then? The whole thing with The Secret School with all these memories being nowhere in grasp and then suddenly emerging in a way where he could write an entire book in vivid detail was and remains difficult for me to accept to say the least.

Thats the thing, his story has evolved over time. The timeline for contact has changed. His level of information has changed.Now there is some sort of WooWoo new agey spirituality to the whole thing. It is part of the reason his credibility is in question. If you think of it from a character development angle its precisely what you would expect. Reengage the audience when the old schtick starts to loose interest.

---------- Post added at 06:03 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:00 PM ----------

I have mixed feelings about Whitley. I appreciated communion, however most of his books after really stretch credibility, and his website with all the nutters on Dreamland really stretch his credibility with me. I'm sorry but that's just the way I feel.

I would really enjoy an objective interview with Whitley by Gene & Chris, however, given his pre-madonna nature of public interviews I imagine this scenario is close to zero.

As many of you know Paratopia had Whitley on recently, however it's my opinion that Jeff & Jeremy give him some slack for whatever reason. I don't get it, you could compile a list of 50+ things Whitley has stated or closely associated himself with that are so obviously fake, insane, self-promoting or just plain silly. He might claim he wants answers but his actions and associations tell another story. How he remains a credible source of information in this area confuses me. He adds more confusion than clarity. Maybe I'm wrong, who knows.

FWIW, I really, really, enjoy Paratopia and appreciate what they bring to the table, like I said it's just confusing. I think their approach to many of the whacky "celebrities" in this field is right-on. I've posted similar questions on their forums

I think Jeremy has a man crush on him. Seriously though, much of his message and theories mesh with their thinking.

 

[Kandinsky]

I have mixed feelings about Whitley. I appreciated communion, however most of his books after really stretch credibility, and his website with all the nutters on Dreamland really stretch his credibility with me. I'm sorry but that's just the way I feel.

I would really enjoy an objective interview with Whitley by Gene & Chris, however, given his pre-madonna nature of public interviews I imagine this scenario is close to zero.

As many of you know Paratopia had Whitley on recently, however it's my opinion that Jeff & Jeremy give him some slack for whatever reason. I don't get it, you could compile a list of 50+ things Whitley has stated or closely associated himself with that are so obviously fake, insane, self-promoting or just plain silly. He might claim he wants answers but his actions and associations tell another story. How he remains a credible source of information in this area confuses me. He adds more confusion than clarity. Maybe I'm wrong, who knows.

FWIW, I really, really, enjoy Paratopia and appreciate what they bring to the table, like I said it's just confusing. I think their approach to many of the whacky "celebrities" in this field is right-on. I've posted similar questions on their forums

I'm a fan of Paratopia too and like their style. I've enjoyed friendly disagreements with Jeff and Jer over on ATS and that kind of thing matters to me. Decent guys in my experience.

From listening to 'topia, it's pretty clear they hold Strieber in high esteem and because of that take his stories seriously. They all share a similar outlook as far as a I can make out. I probably shouldn't voice an opinion on Strieber as I only read Communion and that was years ago. From what little I've heard and the articles I've read by him, he isn't a credible guy by my way of thinking. I see him as an author who's style and stories just don't appeal to my tastes. Even moreso, with a few exceptions, the choir who support his every interview and utterance don't tend to fall within the scope of people who are credible or interest me.

It's kinda like some band that people can't understand why you don't like them. They insist that you haven't listened 'properly' or 'long enough' and try to get you into their music. Some music is just crap to me and whether they've had hits, released ten albums or do cool T-shirts doesn't take away the perception that they're off-beat, out of tune and can't write a lyric without the rhyming dictionary.

One of my abiding impressions of Strieber's 'truthiness' is claiming to have seen the 'drone' UFO before it was accepted as a hoax. Big red flag! To his supporters, this 'caught red-handed claim' is further evidence that the UFO phenomena is a tricky bastard.

 

[Sean Elifritz]

Yes I am serious. I will try and find the supporting data and let you know.



Thats the thing, his story has evolved over time. The timeline for contact has changed. His level of information has changed.Now there is some sort of WooWoo new agey spirituality to the whole thing. It is part of the reason his credibility is in question. If you think of it from a character development angle its precisely what you would expect. Reengage the audience when the old schtick starts to loose interest.

---------- Post added at 06:03 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:00 PM ----------



I think Jeremy has a man crush on him. Seriously though, much of his message and theories mesh with their thinking.

And it's because of all these problems we seem to get with cases where people describe aliens with new agey messages that I remain skeptical of them. Where are the really, really good cases where the beings say things like this? Of all the abduction stories I've read only 3 of them have demonstrated to me sufficient evidence to believe they are definitely true: The Hills, Allagash, and Kelly Cahill. Then I've got 2 others where I feel mostly certain they are true: Pascagoula, Travis Walton (Although I have more doubts about Walton than I do any of these others.). Everything else is pretty much up in the air with me. In none of those good cases do we get the new agey messages. If I've said it once I've said it a million times: Why can't we get a good, multiple witness abduction case where the beings are talking about the science of the soul, everything being one, save the trees...save the whales...save those snails, and other spiritual, new agey sort of things? With the good cases we have so far they rarely say much of anything beyond "Don't be afraid" and "We won't harm you." I think the new agey stories sound great (Of course I'd rather believe in space hippies than cold, indifferent doctors.) but c'mon, give me a case like this on par with the Hills or even Travis Walton.

 

[Kandinsky]

And it's because of all these problems we seem to get with cases where people describe aliens with new agey messages that I remain skeptical of them. Where are the really, really good cases where the beings say things like this? Of all the abduction stories I've read only 3 of them have demonstrated to me sufficient evidence to believe they are definitely true: The Hills, Allagash, and Kelly Cahill. Then I've got 2 others where I feel mostly certain they are true: Pascagoula, Travis Walton (Although I have more doubts about Walton than I do any of these others.).

Same here, but Pascagoula is right up there for me. The Dechmont Woods case from Scotland ( http://ufos.about.com/od/aliensalienabduction/a/1979dechmont.htm) is another that remains very interesting. The only one I can think of that contains a 'New-Age' message is the Ilkley Moors abduction case ( http://www.ufocasebook.com/ilkleymoor.html ). The Ilkley Moor case is frustrating after Jenny Randles left the scene with an off the cuff remark that implied doubt in the account. As far as I can find out, she left it at that and hasn't since expanded on the idea.

 

[Sean Elifritz]

Same here, but Pascagoula is right up there for me. The Dechmont Woods case from Scotland ( http://ufos.about.com/od/aliensalienabduction/a/1979dechmont.htm) is another that remains very interesting. The only one I can think of that contains a 'New-Age' message is the Ilkley Moors abduction case ( http://www.ufocasebook.com/ilkleymoor.html ). The Ilkley Moor case is frustrating after Jenny Randles left the scene with an off the cuff remark that implied doubt in the account. As far as I can find out, she left it at that and hasn't since expanded on the idea.

I believe that the Ilkley Moor photo is a hoax so that one doesn't do it for me. Also, isn't that just a single witness affair (Going strictly off of memory here.)? We've got hundreds and hundreds of single witness stories. I'm looking for cases where there is corroborative testimony from multiple witnesses.

 

[Trajanus]

And it's because of all these problems we seem to get with cases where people describe aliens with new agey messages that I remain skeptical of them. Where are the really, really good cases where the beings say things like this? Of all the abduction stories I've read only 3 of them have demonstrated to me sufficient evidence to believe they are definitely true: The Hills, Allagash, and Kelly Cahill. Then I've got 2 others where I feel mostly certain they are true: Pascagoula, Travis Walton (Although I have more doubts about Walton than I do any of these others.).

Randle was skeptical.

Everything else is pretty much up in the air with me. In none of those good cases do we get the new agey messages. If I've said it once I've said it a million times: Why can't we get a good, multiple witness abduction case where the beings are talking about the science of the soul, everything being one, save the trees...save the whales...save those snails, and other spiritual, new agey sort of things? With the good cases we have so far they rarely say much of anything beyond "Don't be afraid" and "We won't harm you." I think the new agey stories sound great (Of course I'd rather believe in space hippies than cold, indifferent doctors.) but c'mon, give me a case like this on par with the Hills or even Travis Walton.

Maybe not an abduction, but look at the 1990s case with zimbabwe kids. Dozens saw ETs and their message concerned the environment.

 

[Sean Elifritz]

Randle was skeptical.



Maybe not an abduction, but look at the 1990s case with zimbabwe kids. Dozens saw ETs and their message concerned the environment.

I've read Randle's critiques as well as others and I'm personally more convinced by Clark's argument than I am by theirs. But although I lean in the direction of belief with Walton I am not completely convinced.

OK, Zimbabwe was a good point. That is a great case. But it's incomplete as far as what I was asking for. There were some environmental concerns, that was it as far as I know. Even the very dark abductions that Hopkins and Jacobs talk about have the environmental elements. There's none of the soul stuff there, ya' know,...man is dual, man needs to study the science of the soul, etc.