Kelly Johnson

[Michael Allen]

Thanks Lance--now I don't have to squint

 

[Michael Allen]

So Lance, I am curious to know how this transcription assignment affected your view of the case. Perhaps I should take on the assignment myself

 

[Michael Allen]

Let me print out your transcriptions and have another look (refresher--I've had my head deep in number theory in the last few days) at what inferences can be determined from the text alone. Ron and I have already discussed using a mathematical model (I think he cc'd you on the message if I recall) that would allow us to create a 3-d boundary region. You've already given some thought on the limits imposed by an elevated horizon at certain azimuth/position configurations--we discussed the formulas earlier in this thread. Once Ron provides the sketch (I have an idea of how I would do it, but i would like to see if Ron comes up with something more economical), then we'll plug in the variables to the model.

 

[Ron Collins]

Let me print out your transcriptions and have another look (refresher--I've had my head deep in number theory in the last few days) at what inferences can be determined from the text alone. Ron and I have already discussed using a mathematical model (I think he cc'd you on the message if I recall) that would allow us to create a 3-d boundary region. You've already given some thought on the limits imposed by an elevated horizon at certain azimuth/position configurations--we discussed the formulas earlier in this thread. Once Ron provides the sketch (I have an idea of how I would do it, but i would like to see if Ron comes up with something more economical), then we'll plug in the variables to the model.

I will try and get this to you by Thursday. I have a soft deadline on a project at work that is taking up most of my time and all of my brain power.

 

[Kieran]

I also continue to work on my potential prosaic explanation of the case and will mention that here when it is ready.

Thanks,

Lance

Lance has disappeared off the radar for a while now, and I am aware he has posted a number of opinions at Paul kimball site, as a side note it's a pity Paul got tired of posting here, he has issues, and I happen to agree with lot of them. Moving on Lance promised an explanation and the date of this posting it the 1 of September. Check the Original full uncut post for the date.

Well over a month and number of days no word. He might well be busy, but Lance if your out there, you should post the explanation you have come up with, I think we all have given you enough time and that time has run out frankly. I must contact Paul and see if he has heard anything back from Lance?

Lance caused a fuss here and he was correct to do so, but now it is time for him to step up and provide the goods.

 

[Frank Stalter]

Lance has disappeared off the radar for a while now, and I am aware he has posted a number of opinions at Paul kimball site, as a side note it's a pity Paul got tired of posting here, he has issues, and I happen to agree with lot of them. Moving on Lance promised an explanation and the date of this posting it the 1 of September. Check the Original full uncut post for the date.

Well over a month and number of days no word. He might well be busy, but Lance if your out there, you should post the explanation you have come up with, I think we all have given you enough time and that time has run out frankly. I must contact Paul and see if he has heard anything back from Lance?

Lance caused a fuss here and he was correct to do so, but now it is time for him to step up and provide the goods.

We'll never know for sure what Johnson saw. I don't think it was a weather balloon though.

http://ufopartisan.blogspot.com/2010/08/area-51-founders-ufo-sightings.html

 

[Angel of Ioren]

Lance has disappeared off the radar for a while now, and I am aware he has posted a number of opinions at Paul kimball site, as a side note it's a pity Paul got tired of posting here, he has issues, and I happen to agree with lot of them. Moving on Lance promised an explanation and the date of this posting it the 1 of September. Check the Original full uncut post for the date.

Well over a month and number of days no word. He might well be busy, but Lance if your out there, you should post the explanation you have come up with, I think we all have given you enough time and that time has run out frankly. I must contact Paul and see if he has heard anything back from Lance?

Lance caused a fuss here and he was correct to do so, but now it is time for him to step up and provide the goods.

I also think it's a pity that Paul and Lance are no longer posting here, but I understand their reasons as well.

 

[tyder001]

I also think it's a pity that Paul and Lance are no longer posting here, but I understand their reasons as well.

Angel, your hearts in the right place but I have to disagree. It's an internet forum and if your gonna post and ponificate then you have to take the feedback pro and con. Being so self rightous that you take your ball and go home in a huff doesn't make you right. (not right or wrong actually.) I come on here and I say "I beleive in God." TrainedObserver and you will (rightfully) take me to task and in Trained's case he will challenge me to articulate it. It's hard and it causes me to have to really "think" about why I believe what I do. If my beleif stands up to somebody who makes an intelligent counter argument then I'm good. (in my mind, mine does) If it doesn't then I have to re-evalute and either come up with a better theory or consider the alternative. In my "opinion" Paul made and makes some good points but he's a little to "self rightous" or maybe that's the wrong word but a little to sure of his own "rightness" to really be objective. Lance makes some really good points but he seems (imo) to have an objective which is more to "debunk" than to acutally look at a paranormal possibility. Both are missed to some degree but both can be (as can I and the rest of us) a little touchy when our assumptions are challenged.

Believe me it is much, much easier for me to find a good "new agey feel good" forum and talk about my beleif in reincarnation or the paranormal than to come on here and subject it to intelligent dissent by folks like you and Trained and even Lance. But, Iron sharpens Iron and if I'm right then I have nothing to fear. If I'm wrong then I have to reevaluate. If it's still in debate (and it is as far as the paranormal is concerned) then I have to keep looking.

 

[The Pair of Cats]

I agree with Tyder. Both will be missed, if only slightly by me. While Lance, when he chose could be fair minded and brought up some interesting and valid points, was nonetheless an unabashed debunker and his snide and uncalled for comments will not be lamented.
Paul just seemed to get bitter and twisted for some reason. Maybe because he was challenged one too many times. He ended up criticizing everyone here. Fellow forumites, co-hosts even attempting to scold Gene for hosts having friends on the show and not being tough on them, when he clearly could be accused of the same.

 

[trainedobserver]

I think the forum is diminished each time we loose someone's unique perspective. It's a shame really.

I come on here and I say "I beleive in God." TrainedObserver and you will (rightfully) take me to task and in Trained's case he will challenge me to articulate it. It's hard and it causes me to have to really "think" about why I believe what I do. If my beleif stands up to somebody who makes an intelligent counter argument then I'm good. (in my mind, mine does)

Not to pick on you here my friend but I have to admit to you tyder I have yet to understand what you actually mean when you use the word "God" or why you believe in it (whatever it is). I think it would be a mistake on my part to superimpose my past beliefs about the subject or what I may understand about what others think a "god" is on you.

My stance is that no one should express any dismay at "disbelief" in the undefined or unexplained. Theists, deists, and paranormal enthusiasts who have beliefs about things that they themselves find difficulty articulating should not be surprised, dismayed, or offended at any "unbelief" in those things they encounter in others.

I think this extends to other discussions that occur in this forum about UFOs, Aliens, Bigfoot, and what have you. Things begin to degenerate and people get their feelings hurt when the discussion turns from the "ideas" to the personalities and people expressing them.

 

[tyder001]

I couldn't agree more. I absolutely understand "how" somebody can be an atheist. I'm not! I have my own reasons for it. One day (if the spirit moves me) I might even post the reasons I have for "not" being an atheist. But, even then it would in no way refute or change or even be an attempt to "change" your belife system. One reason I (even though it challenges me) come on here and read your and others perspective is that it cause me to "think" That is never a bad thing. We (you and I) give different "credibiltiy" to intuition and life expereince. That's o.k. because in the end we all "die" and "birth" alone. Nobody can take your hand coming or going. I have been "convinced" although I'm still agnostic about reincarnation. This is due to "memories" I've had since I was a child. Proof? No, of course not. But, "inside" and from what I've read on studies and from my own "mind" it seems very likely to me. Still, the knowledge of conscinuss (scuse my spelling) is in it's infancy. There is a new book out by Chris Carter that I am going to peruse one of these days. The thing is with religion or ufo's or belief or politics or anything really worth while in life there will always be arguments and room for change. Anyway, I don't think the forum is "less" becasue of the coming and going but I do think the two posters mentioned are intelligent although (to me) a little to self assured. I bet your "story" is an interesting one. But, please don't think I don't understand your athesim. I've been close and I certainly don't think it's "unresonible" I just don't think it's true.

 

[Martina]

Not to pick on you here my friend but I have to admit to you tyder I have yet to understand what you actually mean when you use the word "God" or why you believe in it (whatever it is). I think it would be a mistake on my part to superimpose my past beliefs about the subject or what I may understand about what others think a "god" is on you.

My stance is that no one should express any dismay at "disbelief" in the undefined or unexplained. Theists, deists, and paranormal enthusiasts who have beliefs about things that they themselves find difficulty articulating should not be surprised, dismayed, or offended at any "unbelief" in those things they encounter in others.

That's why I keep my religious beliefs to myself, especially online. I'm not out to convince anyone else of what I believe in that area, it's enough for me that I believe, and that is because of personal spiritual experience. To those not having had such personal experience no argument will ever be convincing, and until they do it's really quite pointless to talk to them about it, so I keep my relationship with God to myself.

I think this extends to other discussions that occur in this forum about UFOs, Aliens, Bigfoot, and what have you. Things begin to degenerate and people get their feelings hurt when the discussion turns from the "ideas" to the personalities and people expressing them.

Agree with you completely there! And by the way, in no way do I connect any aspect of my spiritual life with UFO's or aliens. I have never seen any reason to do so, and regard the two as entirely separate matters.

 

[tyder001]

Maritna, unless of course I'm still on "ignore" in which case you won't see this. Don't want to shock you but you make "good" points. I don't agree that you should keep it all seperate because I think it may "intersect" at some point. Allthough I''m not convinced there is "life out there." Still, you make a good argument for your point and I can appreciate your point of view.

 

[Angel of Ioren]

Maritna, unless of course I'm still on "ignore" in which case you won't see this. Don't want to shock you but you make "good" points. I don't agree that you should keep it all seperate because I think it may "intersect" at some point. Allthough I''m not convinced there is "life out there." Still, you make a good argument for your point and I can appreciate your point of view.

I think Martina got off on the wrong foot with you (and a few others as well) and hopefully she does not have you on her ignore list. We need to understand that people will have different opinions and we shouldn't ignore them.

If that were the case many people here would be "ignoring" each other and that would make for a really boring forum. Unless anyone is abusive, I wouldn't put them on my ignore list. Also, the rules in this forum would prevent any abusive members from lasting very long anyway.

With regards to Kelly Johnson, hopefully Lance has a look at the forum and posts his thoughts.

 

[tyder001]

Thanks Angel,

It really doesn't bother me cause I've been on somebody's "chit" list most of my life. But, I do agree that the poster simply got off on the wrong foot with some of us who have been ponificating for a while here. This forum is not place for the timid or the thin skinned cause people will challenge you here. But, I do try to be respectful and I try to treat people with dignity. However, I must not have gotten my point across very well. Because I honestly wasn't trying to be a smart aleck. I don't think I was but I do let by gones be by gone.

 

[Martina]

Maritna, unless of course I'm still on "ignore" in which case you won't see this. Don't want to shock you but you make "good" points. I don't agree that you should keep it all seperate because I think it may "intersect" at some point. Allthough I''m not convinced there is "life out there." Still, you make a good argument for your point and I can appreciate your point of view.

Tyder I have seen no reason whatsoever to connect my spiritual life and experiences with UFO's, aliens, or anything of the sort. I believe I made this clear in my post on UFO's and the Spiritual Angle, but thank you for your comments, and I'm glad to see that you have a spiritual life and religious beliefs.

I myself don't care to go into my religious beliefs here in any depth at all as that would almost certainly generate unsavory responses.

 

[tyder001]

Tyder I have seen no reason whatsoever to connect my spiritual life and experiences with UFO's, aliens, or anything of the sort. I believe I made this clear in my post on UFO's and the Spiritual Angle, but thank you for your comments, and I'm glad to see that you have a spiritual life and religious beliefs.

I myself don't care to go into my religious beliefs here in any depth at all as that would almost certainly generate unsavory responses.

No problem. I completely understand and agree that "spritual beliefs" are (at least to me) very personal. However, I do think it's o.k. to discuss spirit or any other topic civily. However, it's also o.k.l to decline to do so.

Peace.

 

[Martina]

No problem. I completely understand and agree that "spritual beliefs" are (at least to me) very personal. However, I do think it's o.k. to discuss spirit or any other topic civily.

Yes, however the problem with that is that discussing it at all online tends to quickly degenerate into a flame-war with accusations of blasphemy, heresy, and doctrinal differences, which I'm just not up for having already had that experience in other forums. In my experience it just doesn't stay civil for long, and my relationship with God is a personal and private one that I'm not willing to parade for anyone, or be taken to task about.

 

[Angel of Ioren]

Yes, however the problem with that is that discussing it at all online tends to quickly degenerate into a flame-war with accusations of blasphemy, heresy, and doctrinal differences, which I'm just not up for having already had that experience in other forums. In my experience it just doesn't stay civil for long, and my relationship with God is a personal and private one that I'm not willing to parade for anyone, or be taken to task about.

You're right, discussing religion is one of the topics that generates the most visceral reactions from forum members. It is totally your choice as to whether you want to discuss your beliefs or not.

 

[Martina]

You're right, discussing religion is one of the topics that generates the most visceral reactions from forum members. It is totally your choice as to whether you want to discuss your beliefs or not.

Thank you sir!
(curtsy)