Michael Horn & The Billy Meier Contacts

[legrand]

He Who Shall Not Be Named? & The Billy Meier Contacts

he who shall not be named is a liar, fool, coward, blowhard, and idiot. How some people fall for this crap astounds me. We see it all the time though don't we? At least I do. A picture of my genitals would be a better case for a ufo or alien then billy meiers crap. dave you are right they should be ashamed big time. I guess they think they can get away with it by attacking anyone who disagrees with them. I can attack too.

 

[ZTGR]

He Who Shall Not Be Named? & The Billy Meier Contacts

Mr. R,

Okay...I think reality disagrees with you...and that you are taken in by a not careful presentation in the garbage lid pictures. Mr. J. Deardoff makes much better argument...and it can be seen here http://www.tjresearch.info/wedcake.htm also even the lid is held for photograph. That looks the same to you? Not anyone else.

Then we all saw your 'cake pans' at Toronto...and you forgot maybe to put all that easy tacks and stuff on it? Why...was it too simple and...beneath you to prove it?

You look at the pictures from Meier...and from the critic site in France or somewhere...and you can see easy that no small clasps even could fit and be seen with the big globes. Why you did not photograph your pans...in same kind of outside set to show? Tell a stranger that one photo...yours or the Meier one...is a model and one real. Do you know what they choose?

Okay...go ahead and yell...but you had better case with little model photos than with Wedding cake...and everyone knows.

And you don't say for serious that the video of this Meier Wedding cake is of such a little thing...do you? Does anyone here say so? We were told that you also promised to do this video with your model...but no video was made? Meier video is online too...anyone can see it.

I should also say that you are just wrong about the books...it is impossible to have books out with bad copyright date...and for no one to notice in all the years? And I know when I bought the book with 2001 in copyright...and events happened years later. Also...since I have books with dates...it only make sense that the information is from before the dates...not after. You don't make any real argument with that. And I have first DVd from Mr. He Who with things foretold...that happened more than year later from 2004.

About dinosaurs...I give Meier benefit of doubt...you want us to give you benefit of doubt and not compare the Meier photos...that you can't duplacate and won't put side to side. If Meier photos are real UFos...who cares about dino?

For Wendel I also hear from people...a few years ago...that it was trumped to stop him and Meier case from being credible. Mr. He Who made good point...no before or after problems with Wendel...that is not true for real molesters.

And now we have a Mr. Lgrand who practices attack.

But maybe you are so unhappy that you don't win the challenge...that you want to just attack people?

So...if you don't really answer all up above questions...what Ufo case is better...has better evidence? Whoever tries to answer before...talks about abduction and every 'case' that has no evidence.

Maybe Mr. He Who is not so good with skeptics...because anyone can be so good when skeptics make just silly attacks.

ZTGR

 

[ZTGR]

He Who Shall Not Be Named? & The Billy Meier Contacts

P.P.S. Okay...now I see it. You are very clever here...because you make attacks to keep forum going. I see how many times they look at this one...and almost nothing for no one else.

Prove it? Okay...I stop writing for a while...one guy will be happy for no more Meier. Ha...but watch how no one comes to write...about anything else. And why? Cause just like I say...where is the better UFo case...only in your mind? I think so.

 

[David Biedny]

He Who Shall Not Be Named™ & The Billy Meier Contacts

ZTGR,

Your logic is as poor as your English.

Like the other Meierites, you can't seem to address legitimate issues - Jeff has made it plainly obvious that the wedding cake nonsense is a poorly fabricated toy, yet you ignore it and try to divert the debate to the model that Jeff made. What if he had never taken on the challenge, what would you focus on then? Jeff is exactly correct in that you appear to be nothing more than a parrot for the US rep. You want proof of a better UFO case? Pick anything from the Mexico City flap of the 90s, the New Mexico/Dulce situation, Betty and Barney Hill, anything seriously studied by Stanton Friedman, etc. There's plenty of stuff out there to consider. You don't seem interested in anything other than a flawed religion with bad photos and silly, inaccurate prophecies. Of course, the fact that I'm trying to reason with you is useless, you're not interested in UFOs or the paranormal, religious fanaticism and blind faith are obviously your cups of tepid tea.

Anyway, either make your point or blow off. We all have better things to do than try to reason with those incapable of any sort of deductive reasoning or analytical thinking. If you're the poster child for the Meierites, I'll take the chicken sandwich on rye, hold the B.S.
dB

 

[David Biedny]

He Who Shall Not Be Named? & The Billy Meier Contacts

ZTGR,

If you promise to stop writing for awhile, I'll send you a {wedding} cake. Chocolate.

dB

 

[jritzmann]

He Who Shall Not Be Named? & The Billy Meier Contacts

nevermind, just not worth the effort anymore. When you have something to ask I havent replied 100 times to lemme know. I'm tired of typing endless replies to repeat questions. The answer is the same.

 

[Mannyp4]

He Who Shall Not Be Named? & The Billy Meier Contacts

"First...I will answer somethings that I have learned. The UFo photos of Meiers are not earth parts" Now that you see the parts in those pictures, what do you have to say?
they have been identified as I previously told you.

"I don't go for all the stuff like dinosaurs" I understand why, because they are photos from meier and as you can see they are 100% fakes, so saying I don't go for all that stuff doesn't really let you out of the hook, with that answer you just admitted that they are so ridiculous so how can it be true.

"And as for evidence from another world...I do have the books and material that documents...the investigation with names of many more expert people. I have done what I don't hear you tell you have done and read it." You call books and documents proof of another world? then all the cases in ufo are real to you right? what I meant was all the photos has nothing alien like, everything looks earth parts for the time, again see the photos posted. all identified parts. nothing to say now I bet, unless is your usually comment: Yeah meier is for real, but I can't say or post here why. : are you for real?

"I feel sorry for the people who know that it is true...and have to hear all the foolish attacks...when not one of the attacking ones know anything." I feel sorry for people like you that are working to fool others into buying a dvd so you can make money out it and if you say you are not him, so you are working for him which makes you a .......... :

I know some people maybe believe in this because all of the strategy use to convince them to buy the dvd, trust me you are not one of them, so you either him or someone working in advertisement this crap for him like that newinitation or something guy. you and him just go forum to forum to spread this crap. I wonder how many cents you guys get pay. Is it by who post the most or clicks or who keeps the thread going longer? :

Let me use your logic, meier is not true, but i can't post why.

 

[jritzmann]

He Who Shall Not Be Named? & The Billy Meier Contacts

There's really no more point Manny, just let the zealots and devotees believe what they want to. The place to be doing this is where theyre trying to spread this crap all over the net. Most places they get driven off of, or banned from so the outlets are becoming more limited.

These people just become more like snarling dogs: "I think a monkey could do a better job of analysis then the sith Jeff. Who just wallows in his dark hole between his legs."

Mature. Thats the kind of "person" (and I use the term loosely) youre dealing with. I think this is the same genius would couldnt wait til us vocal non believers were "cleansed from the earth". Sure because you dont give them the answer they want, youre worthless, a liar, etc, etc. I have 2 degrees in imaging and David is one of the most well known experts in digital imaging and Photoshop on the planet. But we dont give them the answers they want. With every lame comment they make they just show you how flatly clueless they are. Thats satisfaction enough for me.

Leave the lunatics and children who wouldnt dare say it to your face to the asylum where they belong.

 

[Mindsky]

He Who Shall Not Be Named? & The Billy Meier Contacts

ZTGR. How much of this thread have you read? Many issues raised have already been covered before.

I can't believe people actually buy into the time traveling aliens who programmed the minds of trash can lids makers etc. Strange the ETs provide BM with evidence of their existence, only to debunk it and make it look un-credible later. Guess they don't want the prophet to be taken seriously. Which makes no sense.

Some people won't conclude BM is a fraud until every single photo and vid is proved to be faked independently. Well, maybe then they will fall back on the metal sample which can't be found now, nor examined. They'll just keep saying, yes, but what about these photos. After they are debunked, oh, well the MIB tampered with it, or the aliens wanted it to look fake.

 

[ZTGR]

He Who Shall Not Be Named? & The Billy Meier Contacts

I guess we are all happy it is the weekend now. Okay...too bad that Jeff remarks are gone cause I thought...he made some good points. Like he complained about all this trouble that no one...except here...agrees his photos are good as Meiers.

So Jeff R he can think how he feels...like Meier...in a funny way!...and it's not good feeling I'm sure. Even if don't think his photos as good...I can know that it is for him frustrating. So imagine that Meier is not so happy with how people attack his real ones!

In a way same thing...two people who are attacked....not so much fun huh? And Jeff R. only has bad time for what...months...or maybe a year. We can read that Meier has bad time for 30 years. Okay...maybe people should say sometimes "I don't know...for sure" and not say "You are fake for sure."

Also...why are they here so upset...when watchdog makes bad remarks too....and no proof from him?

And everyones here are lying? I don't thinkso...don't look like lies and liars to me:

http://www.tjresearch.info/witness.htm
http://www.tjresearch.info/witnessa.htm

Okay...I could take a cake from DB...must be he has hobby as baker...and I like chocolate cake. There's older woman here who always say "That takes the cake." Okay...I take the cake too.

So DB sends cake...and now I have free DVd and cake.

 

[jritzmann]

He Who Shall Not Be Named? & The Billy Meier Contacts

I guess we are all happy it is the weekend now. Okay...too bad that Jeff remarks are gone cause I thought...he made some good points. Like he complained about all this trouble that no one...except here...agrees his photos are good as Meiers.

Oh please, look at ATS, *the* UFO message board on the internet, masses of people saying mine look better, and joking asking if they can join my "cult". Man just get over yourself. You have no clue what youre talking about.

So Jeff R he can think how he feels...like Meier...in a funny way!...and it's not good feeling I'm sure. Even if don't think his photos as good...I can know that it is for him frustrating. So imagine that Meier is not so happy with how people attack his real ones!

I'm not the one claiming contact with Plejarens and making cash off it. The only people with issues about my duplications are you Meier supporters, and truthfully thats not that big a deal to me. What sickens me is the slimy supporter's tactics of threats. I'd like to see one of these P.O.S. say anything to my face. You people wanna talk all this peace and love stuff and then act like animals. I'm sick of the lot of you.

Billy Meier has made himself a public figure who has made claims that have to be investigated and sorted through. I havent made outraegous claims like he has, nor do I deserve the venomous attacks that have been leveled at me since I started publishing finding on the net. Did you know that I started into the Billy Meier case at Horn's request? I'll bet you didnt. He posted an open invitation to any researcher willing to look. I was willing and offered him my time and equipment to do the job. And he might as well have spit in my face.

So you ZTGR, youre not saying anything new to me, nor are you being clever. I know you think youre real slick, but you dont have any idea what the hell youre saying, or who youre talking to. You dont want truth, because you dont care about it...you want your belief system...so have at it.

 

[Mannyp4]

He Who Shall Not Be Named? & The Billy Meier Contacts

Have you noticed how he just focuses on posting about the duplications of the photos?
Like if no-one can do a perfect duplication (and people already did, even better) that will mean meiers are real? What a stupid logic! yet he says he is not him or a puppet/helper! :

I think it is time to close this thread or do a ban! why a ban? because he keeps posting irrelevant , meaningless bull of s***.

I vote = yes

 

[Mindsky]

He Who Shall Not Be Named? & The Billy Meier Contacts

This isn't the only place where you can find people who think jritzmann's photos are as good or better than BM's. So what if it was? Would we be a minority, or would it be because no one else has seen it other than a few BM supporters? If a majority is of concern, then consider MOST people think BM's photos are bunk.


Keep in mind Manny, by banning this thread others get censored as well.

 

[ufoman]

He Who Shall Not Be Named? & The Billy Meier Contacts

I'm back after a few months. As somebody who was not that familiar with Mr. Meiers case as others here it wasn't until I heard the show on at Paracast, that I decided to investigate the case more on my own. And not take anybody's word for it either pro or con. And after months of studying different things about the case. There is definitely something going on here. I don't feel like debating & rehashing over and over on this form and I don't feel like proving anything or disproving. But I have to say there is definitely something going on here, whether it's government disinformation or government cover-up. There is definitely more to this case than just the photos. You cannot rely solely on the photos to prove this case. I will continue my studies on the case. But it's definitely not a case to be written off and Ignored.

 

[Mindsky]

He Who Shall Not Be Named? & The Billy Meier Contacts

If you don't know as much as us about the case, don't give details or want to discuss it with us via the board, have vague pointless conclusions like, "something going on" (of course there is) then why did you post your reply? If you are trying to spark interest in examining the case, point us in the direction. Then again, everyone here is still looking at the case and not brushing it off. Or do you mean, don't conclude in a way in which I don't conclude because I say so? I doubt people will change their minds about their conclusions on the vague suspicion you semi shared.

 

[TerraX]

He Who Shall Not Be Named? & The Billy Meier Contacts

And everyones here are lying? I don't thinkso...don't look like lies and liars to me:
Testimony from some Meier-case witnesses
Earliest testimony from Meier-case witnesses

So you want to talk about witnesses ZTGR? I want to ask you something, what is the difference between an eyewitness in the Meier case and an eyewitness in another case?
There is no difference, right? The funny thing is ZTGR, is that Meier has a lot of discrediting comments about other persons experiences and as a final insult to intelligence many Meier supporters adopt the same phylosophy without giving it that much thought. Apparently eyewitnesses are a great addition to the 'evidence' of the Meier case but not so when it comes to other material. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that the people on the witness list that you put up are lying. I am saying that Meier is lying and the people that simply copy his behavior are lying to themselves.

 

[jritzmann]

He Who Shall Not Be Named? & The Billy Meier Contacts

Terrax, many times you and I (even though we come down at very different sides of the fence as far as our standpoints on other cases) have done this dance with these people. I think it's high time we just let it go and more onto better things. We're talking about people who refuse to see at all, the many issues with the case, it's "investigators" and "evidence". These are the same people who are just now realizing I myself have had "experiences" in the UFO realm of things. I've done 2 Paracasts, a huge thread on ATS and lectured about these experiences for almost 13 years.

LOL...theyre just now finding this out. Great researchers.

Anyway, at this point they're claiming I'm "after" the Meier case because I'm jealous that he gets more attention then me. LOL...I wouldnt want his kind of attention. My thread at ATS was essentailly started because so many people asked me why I was so adamant about frauds and hoaxes being exposed. I stated in the thread that I believe the UFO/alien question is not only very important, but one thats personal to me as well. It sickens me to see people throw mud in already murky waters like the Meier case in my opinion does.

However at this point that PAR members have awakened to my years old and well known "secret", they'll throw yet another stone to evade or ignore the real issues I and many others (including yourself) bring up. Forget the fact that Meier has said flatly that all of us who've had any alien experience at all are as a whole, crazy or liars...hell it's not as if anyone with half a brain listens to him anyway. But, if they'd like to look at it that way, Meier threw the first stone didnt he? LOL

Do we not see at this point that these people are beyond *any* reason? Theyre looking for *anything* they can to throw on what I have presented. First it was the NALCOM FTL issue that I exposed, now it's this.

This is worse then running for President. Evade the issues and sling the mud. It is after all, all they have left. I'll love it when they find out I never sold a picture, wrote a book, started a pseudo religion, asked for 7% of everyone's income who "believes" me, or charged for a lecture.

I believe this question we all have in relation to UFOs is important. It impacts people's lives. Not always in a good way either. Those that prey upon people's desire to know "truth" or whatever, to me are the lowest form of slime. As far as I'm concerned Meier is only one of those. There's many more.

And at this point, have we not done enough? I think we have. If new stuff pops up in this case, sure we can respond to it. But this endless beating is counter-productive. We've done I think, all we can or all we care to do. I think we've found out and shown quite a bit of information that shows this case isnt at all what it claims to be.

If ya think we havent been successful, look at how much the PAR people talk about you, me, David and Gene, etc. Yet they claim we're idiots. I've never seen idiots' information so aggressively talked about, to the point of trying desperately to disprove it by any means necessary. Have you? No, they protest too much, and what does that tell us all. You've seen it before Terrax, that when the public doesnt agree with Meier information...the public (or anyone) in their view...is...scared of the "truth". We both know it's not that, and we know full well what "it" is. :

We are feeding this. It's time to starve it until there's something new to say.

What does everyone think?

 

[Mannyp4]

He Who Shall Not Be Named? & The Billy Meier Contacts

Mindsky I meant banning any poster that does this:
posting irrelevant , meaningless bull of s***. ;D

Well said J.R. I meant to say that too like lets stop giving him materials and lets see how his billions or is it trillions? visitors (per day or year) website does. lol

I wonder if they will offer to pay you, so you can keep them alive. If anyone pay attention they really have nothing interesting to talk about unless is about someone like J.R. that tell them how it was done.

so what is the aliens message again? buy a dvd and get saved! : well they are coming back in 700 years, to whom or to where are they coming back to? uh oh I got a prophecy here, earth and the human race will not be destroy in the next 700 years ( I can't promise about 701 years though ;D) hmm I wonder if a dvd last for 700 years :

 

[TerraX]

He Who Shall Not Be Named? & The Billy Meier Contacts

Jeff, I'm still amazed at how these discussions progressed (or the lack there off) over the years. There are enough discrepancies within the Meier case to make you wonder about the authenticity of it and the claims that were being made. Yet I see a number of people just staticly and mindlessly defend the case, against what I feel is better judgement. What's also fascinating is that some people flatout believe everything when it isn't proven in the slightest, we've had quite a few of those here on the forum.

I noticed the 'charming' comments on the PAR forum (where I'm not allowed to post), now you and I have an agenda. Last time I was a 'robot' and I think before that I was a paid disinformant agent. Those people who make these comments remind me of the spanish inquisition. "Not for my religion? I'll burn you at the stakes or put you on the torture tabel." Geesh, where do these people come from! Did I ever say they were robots or something of that nature? No I didn't and to me they are still human. Maybe I'm more humane despite their spiritual endeavours. I think that both you and I just have our own opinions on the case. You and I can change our positions when new data comes our way. Can Meier supporters do the same?

Around 5 years ago my interests in ufology came back to life again and I looked into much research on the internet. Found Meier's site and decided to join the forum. I've had a fascination for contact cases and I naively thought the Meier case would be a continuation from the 'early contactees'. Later I found out that was totally the opposite. So I discussed ufological matters on that forum and ran into a number of peculiarities. Others beside Meier were all frauds according to most supporters and I was told a number of times to do my homework. So I did. Then I found even more discrepancies to put it mildly. What broke the camels back for me is that some supporters implement such a methodology where they are always right and that same methodology is completely dropped when it comes to other material. It's just setting the standard where it suits you. 'Plausible deniability' is used in abundance to fill up the gaps but have you seen it being used in other material? I have not.

On that forum I eventually asked a question to Billy Meier himself. I asked him why he insisted that others (namely Adamski and Menger) were frauds while at the same time many witnesses supported some of their claims. First I received the question if I was a robot and then I got the standard 'party line' that the eyewitnesses were influenced by some sort of hypnosis. Totally B.S. if you ask me. Unsubstantiated nonsense which some Meier supporters swallod hook, line and sinker. I had already done quite a bit of homework by this time and found out stuff you probably wont hear at a lecture from Horn. Seeing that Meier spend a great ammount of time in prison and the insane asylum, subsequently escaped, joined and deserted from the French Foreign Legion, I started to wonder about the distinct possibility that Meier is the biggest fraud of them all. His checkered past does fit the profile.

What to do? It's almost useless to debate some supporters who don't listen to your arguments. It's like talking to a brick wall and some act like the new apostles of the new and improved "Jesus Christ" who lives in Switzerland carrying a big gun. On the other hand I feel morally justified to speak up when I see people serve the Meier menu on the internet pretending it is the finest quisine when I know it's a shit-sandwich. Perhaps we're helping the Meier 'waiters' to do their jobs. Maybe we shouldn't 'order' anything but you know waiters, they'll always come back to ask if you want something more.

Ask for the check?

 

[Mindsky]

He Who Shall Not Be Named? & The Billy Meier Contacts

Best way to make a thread die is to not partake in it. I sound like a broken record.

I'm not bothered by this thread. I tried to let it bother me. I just can't do it. Dunno how. I had a 3 yr old stare at me in the store the other day. I felt a little uneasy, but then thought to my self, "This is stupid. That's what kids do. I'm feeling uneasy due to a kid?" Later, I had my niece call me a stinky poopoo head. I didn't get bent all out of shape. I didn't try and censor her. I didn't say, "You shouldn't say that". I saw her as an immature, young brat. I didn't argue back with her. I just went about my business. I could have stayed telling the brat about how much of a waste of time it is that I sit there and talk with him/her. But, that is... well...... unintelligent. If it was really a waste of my time and I wanted to prove it to the brat, I would demonstrate it, by acting it out.


I see some smart people in this thread, lose their intelligence when faced with a dumb person or two. Guess what? They need your intelligence. Try and keep your wits and stay centered when faced with the dumb. If not, you will only add to stupidity.

Jeff, I read how you responded to MH over at ATS. I think you handled it great and didn't stoop to his level. I applaud that, but past few pages, I think you may be letting it get to you. There is no reasonable reason to let it do that. That I can think of at least. In my humble opinion, you're at your best when you don't let the troll get to you, so to speak.