Jabbermocky
Paranormal Maven
I don't mind the crowd...it's those ears...There's no room in there, because the Republicans were first in line.
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Obama on Gay Marriage
- Thread starter Angel of Ioren
- Start date
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P
pixelsmith
Guest
those are not ears. they are handles.
Jabbermocky
Paranormal Maven
at least he'd be quiet. I don't allow teleprompters in the house -- let alone the bedroom.those are not ears. they are handles.
Jack Burton
Skilled Investigator
Derp, TELEPROMPTER, MUSLIM, KENYAN, EATS DOGS, MICHELLES UGLY, AFFIRMATIVE ACTION, REV. WRIGHT Derp Derp!!11!!1 There did I get all of the idiotic talking points there for you, Jabber? Saved you some typing.
Jabbermocky
Paranormal Maven
ouch!! that hurt.
Actually I think Michelles (sic) quite hot. Don't really care Mr. Burton -- he ain't my president...
P
pixelsmith
Guest
Michelle makes me vomit in my mouth a little bit every time i see her.
Jack Burton
Skilled Investigator
Jabber, I love you man and have been lurking a long time. I just wish people would attack Obama on substance, not right wing talking points promulgated by the likes of a four times married and convicted felon Rush Limbaugh. I take it you are not American, then? Because as much as Bush caused me headaches he was still my president.ouch!! that hurt.
Jabbermocky
Paranormal Maven
Yeah, I was like that when I fell in love for the first time too.
P
pixelsmith
Guest
ish. she is repulsive.
Jack Burton
Skilled Investigator
Pixel. You don't surprise me at all. I wonder why you think that way about her? Hope you don't choke next time you see her.
Jack Burton
Skilled Investigator
Ha ha, now that was good, my man.
Jabbermocky
Paranormal Maven
I kind'a took a shine to Michelle when before the last election, in an interview with Jon Stewart (I think) she said something like, "...everybody's talking about [this, that and the other] and how hot somebody is [inference Palin],"... "and, I was talking about me!" I thought, as much as I find Palin hot (man this topic is going off the rails!), Michelle's (apparent) sense of humour puts her right up there. Of course I don't get a vote, so I just get to ogle and be happy with talking points. The one thing I did take exception to, and it is kind of in line with Jack Burton, when that complete muppet Russell Brand comes to the US and calls your President a "retard". Whatever you may think of your former President, a foreigner doing that on your soil, was to my mind, unacceptable. He's lucky he chose the US to be such a douchebag (now proven to be) on.
Kim323
Paranormal Maven
Now, now, now, and now, again, Ezechiel, what am I going to do with you? You said regarding Obama's statement that "it is a direct hit on Christian ideology."
I'm really not going to get into the politics per se, my social views are very liberal, and I've stated what I believe in other posts on this thread. I want to grab you by the ankles and drag you out of that hole you've wriggled yourself into, a deep hole where the sunshine of historical knowledge does not penetrate. To wit:
1. the comments about homosexuality in the Old and New Testaments are not that frequent, are open to different interpretations, and I know, you can find them all on the internet, no doubt.
2. Any direct references to homosexuality must be taken into the context of the story in the, usually, Old Testament, and this is where abysmal, ahem, lack of knowledge rears its head in the air, flaps its wings in defiance and false self-confidence, and crows mightily and lustily on its own hill of dung. That adapted from an old saying.
3. I'm afraid you're getting perilously near that site to which another esteemed poster linked on another thread and which took Old Testament stories out of context, ignored the whole story, was ignorant of the history, of the customs and situation of towns and customs and tribes during the history of the Jewish people, and gleefully took any thing out of the Old Testament surgically and portrayed it very profanely, the website, I mean. So, a story in Judges became a cock-crowing dismemberment story, and so on and on.
4. I believe a bit of introspection is needed to explore just why this subject affects you so very viscerally. It really is clear that it does.
5. I recommend you read a good history of Judaism and Christianity. An excellent history of Christianity is by Diarmaid MacCulloch, Professor of the History of the Church at Oxford. His Christianity, the First Three Thousand Years, is available from Amazon for a mere outlay of sixteen and a half American greenbacks. To know Christian ideology, you have to know the history of Christianity, and that means actually reading its rich history, its complex history over centuries, the splits, the theological and doctrinal struggles (yes, not always pretty, but often resulting in things very, very good), and that will lead you to:
6. the Christian churches' struggles now over homosexuality. I, though a backsliding Presbyterian, am well aware of the for years now struggle within the Presbyterian Church USA over the issue. Are you aware of the details of the equally long struggles, still going on, among the churches of the Anglican Communion, and the Episcopal church(es) within it? In fact, are you aware at all over the course of centuries, the richness and development of fine points of doctrine and theology within the Catholic Church itself, and then the history of the English Reformations under Henry VIII and his son Edward VI? I mean, have you actually read any books on it? It's very fascinating, just from an historical perspective, and that's what I'm talking to you about, your statement about "Christian ideology" taking a hit from Obama's statements. Do you know how many millions of American Christians welcome Obama's statement?
7. It's very easy to take a simple view and make a simple statement that in its very simplicity, its much, much, much too-simple perspective, and crow it loudly in triumph. And for many people it will be taken as deep and profound. For many, many, many more, it exposes much else.
8. I do recommend that you read the Bible, not in a conversion way, but just read it for its history, and then read some books by scholarly historians that will bring the background events into a rich, rich perspective that will, yes, it's not hyperbole to say, rival a colorful, rich, vibrant, skin-tingling, skillfully woven tapestry of pleasure in the history, even if you don't believe in anything else regarding Judaism and Christianity.
9. The other issues you mentioned in your bullet points underneath the statement I'm talking about in this post are also issues that the Christian churches are struggling and wrestling with and have for years. There are millions upon millions of Christians who are all for stem cell research. I am, and those other issues cannot be seen as merely issues Christians are "against." To even suggest that exhibits simplicity, a clear too-simple lumping together, that speaks to a lack of understanding of history, past and current, of Christianity.
10. Remember, that book is available for sixteen and a half dollars. If you check pants pockets and underneath the cushions you will find enough change to buy it.
Kim
I'm really not going to get into the politics per se, my social views are very liberal, and I've stated what I believe in other posts on this thread. I want to grab you by the ankles and drag you out of that hole you've wriggled yourself into, a deep hole where the sunshine of historical knowledge does not penetrate. To wit:
1. the comments about homosexuality in the Old and New Testaments are not that frequent, are open to different interpretations, and I know, you can find them all on the internet, no doubt.
2. Any direct references to homosexuality must be taken into the context of the story in the, usually, Old Testament, and this is where abysmal, ahem, lack of knowledge rears its head in the air, flaps its wings in defiance and false self-confidence, and crows mightily and lustily on its own hill of dung. That adapted from an old saying.
3. I'm afraid you're getting perilously near that site to which another esteemed poster linked on another thread and which took Old Testament stories out of context, ignored the whole story, was ignorant of the history, of the customs and situation of towns and customs and tribes during the history of the Jewish people, and gleefully took any thing out of the Old Testament surgically and portrayed it very profanely, the website, I mean. So, a story in Judges became a cock-crowing dismemberment story, and so on and on.
4. I believe a bit of introspection is needed to explore just why this subject affects you so very viscerally. It really is clear that it does.
5. I recommend you read a good history of Judaism and Christianity. An excellent history of Christianity is by Diarmaid MacCulloch, Professor of the History of the Church at Oxford. His Christianity, the First Three Thousand Years, is available from Amazon for a mere outlay of sixteen and a half American greenbacks. To know Christian ideology, you have to know the history of Christianity, and that means actually reading its rich history, its complex history over centuries, the splits, the theological and doctrinal struggles (yes, not always pretty, but often resulting in things very, very good), and that will lead you to:
6. the Christian churches' struggles now over homosexuality. I, though a backsliding Presbyterian, am well aware of the for years now struggle within the Presbyterian Church USA over the issue. Are you aware of the details of the equally long struggles, still going on, among the churches of the Anglican Communion, and the Episcopal church(es) within it? In fact, are you aware at all over the course of centuries, the richness and development of fine points of doctrine and theology within the Catholic Church itself, and then the history of the English Reformations under Henry VIII and his son Edward VI? I mean, have you actually read any books on it? It's very fascinating, just from an historical perspective, and that's what I'm talking to you about, your statement about "Christian ideology" taking a hit from Obama's statements. Do you know how many millions of American Christians welcome Obama's statement?
7. It's very easy to take a simple view and make a simple statement that in its very simplicity, its much, much, much too-simple perspective, and crow it loudly in triumph. And for many people it will be taken as deep and profound. For many, many, many more, it exposes much else.
8. I do recommend that you read the Bible, not in a conversion way, but just read it for its history, and then read some books by scholarly historians that will bring the background events into a rich, rich perspective that will, yes, it's not hyperbole to say, rival a colorful, rich, vibrant, skin-tingling, skillfully woven tapestry of pleasure in the history, even if you don't believe in anything else regarding Judaism and Christianity.
9. The other issues you mentioned in your bullet points underneath the statement I'm talking about in this post are also issues that the Christian churches are struggling and wrestling with and have for years. There are millions upon millions of Christians who are all for stem cell research. I am, and those other issues cannot be seen as merely issues Christians are "against." To even suggest that exhibits simplicity, a clear too-simple lumping together, that speaks to a lack of understanding of history, past and current, of Christianity.
10. Remember, that book is available for sixteen and a half dollars. If you check pants pockets and underneath the cushions you will find enough change to buy it.
Kim
Jack Burton
Skilled Investigator
Sorry to take the convo. off track so badly. But my last point is the fact that every right winger calls O a socialist and how he is going to ruin the U.S. and all of that bull. In reality he is to the right of Nixon and Eisenhower. I wish the teabaggers would have any sense of history or else they would see that the best economic times in this nation were when the tax rates were much higher. Hell, even ST. REAGAN raised taxes in the 80's. I just find it very interesting that the right had no problem with huge spending (TWO WARS) until Jan. 2009 when a black pres. was sworn in. People have lost their gd minds over this. Same with the stuff about his wife. No one ever said such horrible things about a person's wife, how cowardly and sick. She is not even a politician. There should be more shaming of this sort of thing.
tyder001
Paranormal Adept
Well, they roughed up Hillary pretty good so I wouldn't say Michelle is the first one to take shots. Agree about the two wars and the silliness of the socialist attacks from the right. Now, on the other hand. Obama is a big boy and chose to run and win the highest office in the land. Everybody from Nixon to Carter before and after gets caracatured. Is any of it racist? Sure. But, to hide behind that and therefore give this president a pass is a bad precedence. I do get tired of the "Oh so sappy treatement that people like Chris (there's a tingle up my leg) Matthews gives Obama. There are people that voted against him because of his race. There are people that voted for him because of his race. I still remember (I'm getting old) when Jimmy Carter ran for prez. Many of my fellow southerners here in Bama and Georgia and other places said "He talks like us." "He has our values." But, somehow I knew even at that young age that you don't vote for a person because they talk have the same accent as you or the same color or the same heritage. You vote for who you think will do the best job for the nation. I will wait and see. Right now I'm not sold on the republicans but I'm also not going to blindly support our half white president either.
I do get tired of the "Oh so sappy treatement that people like Chris (there's a tingle up my leg) Matthews gives Obama. There are people that voted against him because of his race. There are people that voted for him because of his race. I still remember (I'm getting old) when Jimmy Carter ran for prez. Many of my fellow southerners here in Bama and Georgia and other places said "He talks like us." "He has our values." But, somehow I knew even at that young age that you don't vote for a person because they talk have the same accent as you or the same color or the same heritage. You vote for who you think will do the best job for the nation. I will wait and see. Right now I'm not sold on the republicans but I'm also not going to blindly support our half white president either. 
Bob Watson
Paranormal Adept
In the 20s my great grandma (the same who survied the titanic) was arrested in front of the white house in support of a womans right to vote. "I surrender wy liberty so others can have it! " she said as she was lead away. In the 60s we had riots and killings to gain eqil rights for all races. It will be the same. Here. Gay marrage should have been left to the church. It is not a matter for the state.
I know a gay couple who conider themselves married. They live a happy and loving life.so why deney them happieness?
I know a gay couple who conider themselves married. They live a happy and loving life.so why deney them happieness?
Jack Burton
Skilled Investigator
Well, they roughed up Hillary pretty good so I wouldn't say Michelle is the first one to take shots. Agree about the two wars and the silliness of the socialist attacks from the right. Now, on the other hand. Obama is a big boy and chose to run and win the highest office in the land. Everybody from Nixon to Carter before and after gets caracatured. Is any of it racist? Sure. But, to hide behind that and therefore give this president a pass is a bad precedence.
Valid point about Hillary. Maybe it was because democratic, not black, maybe. There is a ton that has not made me happy about Obama, a ton. Like not closing Gitmo, continued drone attacks, continued spying on citizens, not putting the banksters that took the country down in jail and the like. Chris Matthews said virtually the same thing about Bush in his codpiece flight suit. Remember "Mission Accomplished"? Ha. Can any sane conservative, who is not a multimillionaire, please tell me one thing the republicans are doing for them? One thing other than restricting rights of others. It seems like it is peasants protecting the king, like serfs. You are from Bama, can you explain to me why no democratic pres. has won the south since 1964? I wonder what happened then, hmmm? Explain that without race coming into it. That is what they do, they divide us and tell us, "you don't want THEM to get your benefits, right? Vote Repub." Tell me what it is.
Edit: I guess one other thing they do is cut taxes on the very rich and make taxpayers pay to have our armed forces be larger than the next eight largest countries combined.
tyder001
Paranormal Adept
Well, I agree about much of it. Also, I didn't say there was no race involved. I said as president and as a nation we can't hide behind it everytime somebody is critical of the president. I was horrifed that two black panther thugs were allowed to intimidate American voters. That should never happen and was a slap in the face to American servicemen/women everywhere of every color and creed who have died for this nation. As for democratic governers I will tell you this. In Alabama back around 1978 or so (I'd have to google the right year) We were staunchly democrat in selecting governors. We had elected a candidate named Bill Baxley to run in the primary. But, his opponent made some legal challenges and accusations and got the election messed up. The voters punished the democrats that year since they had voted for Baxley (a democrat) and the party had allowed the other guy (right or wrong) to upsurp him. A republican went into office (I cringed everytime he opened his mouth) and the rest was history. Also, little known fact. George Wallace won his last election because he carried the black vote in the state of Alabama. Anyway, things are changing. Slowly, as things do in this world but still changing.
tyder001
Paranormal Adept
Got my facts and memory a little screwed up there. Not a biggie but if anybody cares this is the link to the story I butchered. Also, it was 86 not 78 but what's a year of 8 or 9 among friends?
The Cleburne News - Governor s race of 86 long remembered
The Cleburne News - Governor s race of 86 long remembered
Jack Burton
Skilled Investigator
But those "thugs" intimidated no one. I am sure you saw that video. That is a Fox news ploy to get people to be all like, "See, scary black guys, OOGAA BOOGAA!" Kinda proves my point. We have legitimate voting rights issues occurring, that was not one of them. Since there are only about three members of the New Black Panthers in existence.