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Reframing the Debate: A Path Forward or Backward?

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Going on similar events as folks on the forum one exception is sleep paralysis/dream state does not create physical object flying around the room and other eyewitness seeing the demon? type creatures not so call commercialism version of the Grey. Moreover, physical ability to morph into our reality with gnarly teeth and hot breath in your face. Long claws like a Werewolf like creatures and jumping through the yard. Also Orbs with glimpse into other Worlds which look similar to the Movie 'Avatar' which the event happen decade ago before the movie appeared on the screen.
I will say that they didn’t look like any depiction I’ve ever seen of them.

Communion’s face is too flat and the eyes are too slanted. The color is close, but not rich enough.

The closest I’ve seen is that almost assuredly fake ‘alien interview’ footage.

But even that one looks wrong to me - the lower jaw is too skeletal, and the ridges around the side of the skull weren’t there. But the eyes are closer and the roundness of the skull was similar.

But even that one is too big. Much too big. Take a good sized cantaloupe and a soccer ball - in between those sizes was the size of its head.

 
As I said on the show, the fact that it hasn’t yielded much doesn’t actually mean anything.

Saying a hypothesis doesn’t work before you even test it isn’t really rational unless you think it’s not worth testing at all.

Vallee is right; we haven’t even begun the basic science to test any hypothesis at all.

Saying the ETH is boring or invalid because it hasn’t yeilded results before you test it is like saying the earth isn’t round because I don’t know what the other side of it looks like... but I’m not going to leave my back yard.
But I'm not saying don't test it. I've emphasized that hard data is a necessity. Im not abandoning the ETH wholesale. But it's not being done by governments so that says something. And so then it's left to private individuals to take that on.

In the meantime what have we done with the hypothesis instead of testing it? We've run with it and created narratives and belief systems around it despite the fact it hasn't been tested. What should we do with an untestable hypothesis? What about working on other things that can be tested and interrupt the writing of a narrative that surrenders us to the role of passive test subjects for the Greys149857b8fa91a0b7699ee402e3ea35a8.gif .
 
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Counter thought, and one right out of homo deus:

We are already gods by any stretch of the pre-industrial imagination.

We speak and our voice is heard around the world. Our life span is 3x greater, with practical immortality around the corner. We can see atoms. We can see the cosmic superstructure of the universe. We can impregnate the barren, we can cure genetic diseases in the womb, and we are about to be able to design new human beings. Each of us has access to more new information created in a day than even existed in the entire historical record of humanity a couple hundred years ago. We can kill entire civilizations from half a world away. We are altering the weather of our planet. Each of us has access to more energy than the entirety of or species had access to collectively a few hundred years ago. Etc.

We are already our own gods.

Perhaps this is us inventing new ones?
Yes, because of our incredible capacities and imaginations it would be nice to see us stop inventing gods outside of us, when we have yet to live up to our species' potential. We are a paradox as a species, ruled by false gods, the seeking of power for power's sake, invoking false gods for our belief in control, our celebration of destruction, and yet we know we are made of the same stuff as stars. Maybe my call is to get back to the garden and rewrite the script, leave the false world behind, discover true gnosis. We all are motivated by the different stories we've learned over time. Some of them may even be true. Writing new ones is also a good thing.
GW-Image-quote-6.jpg
 
But I'm not saying don't test it. I've emphasized that hard data is a necessity. Im not abandoning the ETH wholesale. But it's not being done by governments so that says something. And so then it's left to private individuals to take that on.

In the meantime what have we done with the hypothesis instead of testing it? We've run with it and created narratives and belief systems around it despite the fact it hasn't been tested. What should we do with an untestable hypothesis? What about working on other things that can be tested and interrupt the writing of a narrative that surrenders us to the role of passive test subjects for the Greys149857b8fa91a0b7699ee402e3ea35a8.gif .
Bah.

Citizen science has been a thing for far longer than academic science has been a thing.

Just because we’ve abdicated our accountability doesn’t mean it isn’t still our accountability.
 
Yes, because of our incredible capacities and imaginations it would be nice to see us stop inventing gods outside of us, when we have yet to live up to our species' potential. We are a paradox as a species, ruled by false gods, the seeking of power for power's sake, invoking false gods for our belief in control, our celebration of destruction, and yet we know we are made of the same stuff as stars. Maybe my call is to get back to the garden and rewrite the script, leave the false world behind, discover true gnosis. We all are motivated by the different stories we've learned over time. Some of them may even be true. Writing new ones is also a good thing.
GW-Image-quote-6.jpg
How is any of that a paradox?

We are about to literally be able to create life.

With an extension of AI, we may begin to know all that is knowable.

When or if we create our own homo deus, effectively immortal, with tools like AI, nanotechnology, genetic engineering, augmented reality...

The only limitation we will have as a species will be access to energy and matter.

And since that’s really the same thing and we’re in a lumpy solar system, that’s not much of a limitation.

We’re a couple generations away from some of this stuff. Our kid’s kid’s may not recognize us as human because we are so limited.
 
Marduk,
Indeed, #dataviz - The (not really) new form a scicomm - The Plainspoken Scientist
Here is a few good links Of Karst! – short episodes about karst
Hydraulic fracturing close to groundwater wells
Alauda Airspeeder: World's First Flying Car Race
A Rover’s Eye View of Moving Martian Dunes - Eos
On matters which science can't explain at the moment
Four Planetary Landscapes That Scientists Can’t Explain - Eos

These encounter of unknown objects are not one type only and suggested not the "Grey " which does not match at all unless they keep pets like humans do? Time Travel aspects is very interesting and the string theory . Also cloaked propulsion systems domestic or foreign? traversing through dimensional Worlds using different types of "Tricksters : as Chris calls them" agendas.
 
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I think of it as a very sophisticated form of the kind of consciousness control that we have over our pets - I can get my dog all riled up by playing rough but well-intentioned, or I can put him to sleep by petting him with a meditative vibe, or I can make him sad by becoming sad. It's a crude analogy, granted. But it shows that a superior consciousness can directly control the state of consciousness of a less advanced conscious being.
Do you really think we are like trained pets for aliens?
No that’s not what I said at all. Humans can influence any animal, not just their own pets, but it is much easier with domesticated animals. And I don’t see how anybody could argue that we humans have thoroughly domesticated ourselves. So we’re also susceptible to manipulation, just like our pets are. These beings are just way better at it, apparently. That’s my point.

But somehow the [ETH] narrative writes itself.
That happens when you’re on the right track - things make sense and fit together without having to excise all of the physical evidence and abductive logic from the equation.

Yet we have no real proof of alien visitation.
It rubs me the wrong way to hear ufologists sounding like “the noisy negativists,” as Uncle Stanton loves to call them. And “proof” is a relative concept. I’m sure that many ufo witnesses feel that they’ve seen proof of alien visitation – at least “alien” in the sense of “I have no idea wtf that was,” if not the outright “that ain’t from here” sense.

And the rest of us have a significant body of persuasive evidence, and strong and ever-growing scientific arguments in favor of extraterrestrial intelligent life and visitation. I don’t think the objective evidence rises to the level of “proof” yet. But if the trajectory of the last seven decades is any indication, then it seems inevitable. Creepy Green Light keeps wondering where the surveillance camera footage is, and so do I – perhaps the only difference between us is that I’m expecting it to happen sooner or later. I‘ve seen a pair of these babies zig-zagging through the sky in perfect formation alongside five of my neighbors, like watching some kind of extraterrestrial air show. I even ran to my house to get the camera. I have no doubt that those things would’ve shown up on film. One of these days something like that is going to turn up on video, and everybody’s going to say “wtf is that?”

So now we're also helpless and confused in the face of it all. Why give over all power to an unproven entity? Why not start with us first as we are the ones seeing things? Wouldn't that be the first step as opposed to just taking things as they are and identifying us as utterly submissive to our all powerful alien overlords?
This kind of argument strikes me as clear evidence of the nearly infinite expanse of human hubris: “something amazing was witnessed – I must be behind it because I’m just that awesome: god-like, really.” When you think about it, primitive man expressed a similar narcissism when stuff like solar eclipses and earthquakes happened, and they explained it as the gods punishing them or sending them a message. It was always about us. Now the co-creation hypothesis tries to make ufo sightings all about us. It’s just a modern expression of the same humancentric conceit that the universe revolves around us. How many different ways do we have to see that premise proven false before we finally face the music and admit to ourselves that we’re just another transient species in evolutionary history and the cosmos doesn’t give a damn how important we think we are.

Multitudes of credible reports indicate that these extremely unfamiliar, I daresay alien, beings demonstrate complete or nearly complete control of our consciousness when we’re in their presence: total blackouts are common, missing memories, screen memories, thought transfer, paralysis, inexplicable compliance. If our pets could share their stories about a trip to the vet, it would probably sound a lot like the close encounter experiences that so many people report. It’s wishful thinking to proclaim our dominance when all of the reports indicate otherwise. Nobody’s saying that they’re all-powerful. But they seem to traverse the stars with ease, fly circles around our most advanced aircraft, and exercise nearly complete control of our minds in their presence. So yeah, we’re steeply outmatched in all of those areas.

I’m sure that we surpass them in some things, perhaps things like rock’n roll, film production, dancing, whatever. Maybe droves of them showed up throughout the seventies to download our radio broadcasts, and now some of them are poking around inside of us to figure out what makes us such damn fine musicians. Hell if I know. But are we in charge of this phenomenon? Hell no.
 
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Marduk,
Indeed, #dataviz - The (not really) new form a scicomm - The Plainspoken Scientist
Here is a few good links Of Karst! – short episodes about karst
Hydraulic fracturing close to groundwater wells
Alauda Airspeeder: World's First Flying Car Race
A Rover’s Eye View of Moving Martian Dunes - Eos
On matters which science can't explain at the moment
Four Planetary Landscapes That Scientists Can’t Explain - Eos

These encounter of unknown objects are not one type only and suggested not the "Grey " which does not match at all unless they keep pets like humans do? Time Travel aspects is very interesting and the string theory . Also cloaked propulsion systems domestic or foreign? traversing through dimensional Worlds using different types of "Tricksters : as Chris calls them" agendas.
I don't know how to connect those things together.

Maybe I haven't had enough coffee yet?
 
Let me describe an encounter, but please understand it's difficult and personal for me.

One night as a teenager, I woke up as a bunch of tiny deer walked into my bedroom. I was in some kind of altered state, but in a state of wonder about it. Like "cool, somehow deer came in the house!"

They were very tiny. Like maybe 50 lbs. Big eyes that stared at you. Typical screen memory stuff.

One hopped up onto my bed and kind of sat down, just staring at me. I reached out and grabbed it's hoof. Only it didn't feel like a hoof - it felt warm and soft, more like a cat's paw.

But deer don't have cat's paws... when I realized that, the deer on my bed changed into a prototypical grey - only he wasn't grey at all. He was tan, his skin was warm and soft, he was toddler sized but very thin... and his eyes were very large and black. Just stared at me while I held it's hand. I got the sense that he was simultaneously fascinated, amused, and terrified of me... and that it was a 'he.'

And then I blacked out. There's no sense of time, no fade away, just a knife edge where you're conscious and then you're not. If you've ever been anesthetized, it's like that - only faster. Just a switch and then a discontinuity to your memory.

Now, one could say the deer was a screen memory, one that I 'saw through.' But I don't even know that it was actually a grey - maybe that was another deception. Or maybe my consciousness built an overlay just because it couldn't deal with what was happening. Or maybe whatever he was was rifling through my consciousness to find something I would accept.

Or one could say I just had a very strange dream, or that I'm crazy of course. I have no way to objectively prove anything happened at all, but even as I type this, it gives me goosebumps.

Just curious, Mrdk, some time ago you described seeing a huge dragonfly as a teen. Was that near the same time period of this experience? Any sensation of connection between the two experiences?

I had a troubling "dream-state" experience as a teen, in which I sensed a landed UFO outside in the yard, and in this "dream-state" I looked down out the window from the second floor bedroom and saw a classic disc, maybe twenty-feet across, sitting in the yard, reflecting bright moonlight. Then suddenly, in a shift of scene, there was a weird, menacing, foot and a half tall, living "kewpie-doll"-like being, with a stupid single antenna coming out if its head, standing on the inside window sill just at the head of my bed. YIKES!!! I awoke very troubled, and I looked out the window, and there was no disc, and not even moonlight as had been in the "vision." I count this experience as a dream, but I also think dreams are some kind of real thing that can involve external "actors" who somehow are able to participate in the dream-scape.
 
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Just curious, Mrdk, some time ago you described seeing a huge dragonfly as a teen. Was that near the same time period of this experience? Any sensation of connection between the two experiences?

I had a troubling "dream-state" experience as a teen, in which I sensed a landed UFO outside in the yard, and in this "dream-state" I looked down out the window from the second floor bedroom and saw a classic disc, maybe twenty-feet across, sitting in the yard, reflecting bright moonlight. Then suddenly, in a shift of scene, there was a weird, menacing, foot and a half tall, living "kewpie-doll"-like being, with a stupid single antenna coming out if its head, standing on the inside window sill just at the head of my bed. YIKES!!! I awoke very troubled, and I looked out the window, and there was no disc, and not even moonlight as had been in the "vision." I count this experience as a dream, but I also think dreams are some kind of real thing that can involve external "actors" who somehow are able to participate in the dream-scape.
Hmm.

I think that was later the same year, actually.

It was far away, in the interior of BC, and I’ve never connected the two before... maybe?

Wow you have a good memory!
 
What makes you think this?

Well, first of all, I don't think the vast majority of my dreams have external "actors" involved. They are just the typical weird jumping from subject to subject and context to context, and then you wake up not understanding a thing. But there are a small number of dreams that seem to be quite a different character from my typical dreams, and I can only say that the content and circumstances seem to me to bear out some kind of intelligent external input. Let me say that over the years even in a waking state I have had some memorable experiences that would be called "religious" in which I perceived external communication. I doubt I can explain it satisfactorily, but the bottom line for me is something along the lines of the wisdom of the cookie-baking-cigarette-smoking-grandma-prophetess of Matrix, about "know thyself", which can be found in ancient Greek and Latin. Since I was a teen in the late 60s early 70s, I've tried to be careful about considering my thought processes, so that I can begin to know myself. Evaluating experiences from that vantage point, over the years, I am personally convinced that non-human external actors, good and bad, can access our mental "receiver" to communicate with us, and not always verbally. But not every weird sensation is necessarily an external actor - as in "the devil made me do it." Finally, I have no ready proof of this for someone else, though there is a cumulative human testimony of similar stuff, whether much or any of the testimony is good enough for a law court or not. Oh well.
 
Posted on Twitter:

NASA Kepler and K2
‏Verified account @NASAKepler
Dec 8
Tune in Dec. 14 to http://nasa.gov/live to hear about our planet-hunting @NASAKepler mission’s latest discovery, which was made by researchers using machine learning from @Google. Have questions? #askNASA Details: https://go.nasa.gov/2yPr9hZ

ETA: Thursday, Dec. 14, 1 p.m.: Kepler discovery teleconference.

This teleconference reported the ability of computer neural networks to be capable of discerning far subtler physical manifestations of planets elsewhere in our galaxy, exponentially increasing the number of planets that can be taken to exist in our galaxy. The teleconference will likely be archived at the page linked above, which also provides a Reddit link to a thread discussing this discovery.
 
Yeah that thing would scare the living christ out of me too - I'd probably throw my own mother at that thing to get away from it, or perhaps just fall to my knees and babble for mercy like a terrified child.

UFOlogists often complain about the government withholding information about UFOs but...no wonder it does. I'm sure considerable progress has been made but people are still unready for open revelation of ETs.
 
Yeah that thing would scare the living christ out of me too - I'd probably throw my own mother at that thing to get away from it, or perhaps just fall to my knees and babble for mercy like a terrified child.

The terror isn’t like that. It’s unlike any other experience I’ve ever had - and I’ve been close to death a few times.

It’s like your neocortex goes away. You’re an animal. Rational thought just doesn’t exist.

I have a visceral sense that’s how a prey animal feels when it’s being hunted - imagine a gazelle that just got pounced on by a lion. You know you’re screwed and just react.

It’s a visceral body reaction.
 
UFOlogists often complain about the government withholding information about UFOs but...no wonder it does. I'm sure considerable progress has been made but people are still unready for open revelation of ETs.
You know, that actually makes sense to me, you know?

Imagine you knew that these freaky bastards can just come into you - or your children’s bedroom in the middle of the night. Any night. And there’s not a damn thing you or your government or your military can do about it.

That would be a giant reason to never admit anything.
 
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