Steven Greer

[Paul Kimball]

Maybe Dr. Greer is trying to put his copyright on this material?

I have to say that the more I find out about this guy the more loathsome he seems. Has anyone here ever been to a CSETI event or known someone who has? What are they like? What happens? On the Podcast I heard that someone who came back from one of those things wasn't eager to share anything.

I wrote about this exact subject at UFO Updates a few days ago. See: http://www.virtuallystrange.net/ufo/updates/2006/dec/m15-012.shtml

The relevant excerpt:

"They make sure that everyone signs a confidentiality
agreement, which reads, in part, "By my signature affixed below,
I agree to hold all proceedings of this CSET Ambassadors to the
Universe Training Retreat confidential and agree that it shall
not be shared publicly without the prior express written consent
of CSETI." (Note: considering the use Dr. Greer has made of
things without express prior written consent, this last bit is
quite amusing).

You can read it all at:

http://www.cseti.org/programs/Trainings2007.htm

All for the low, low price of USD $800.

As I said, given all of the above, I wouldn't be the least bit
surprised if someone hasn't complained, especially when you
throw in one final factor - people hate to admit that they've
been bilked or hornswaggoled, especially when they would have to
tell people that they paid $800 to beam some flashlights into
the night sky. Never underestimate the influence pure
embarrassment can have on a person who has been duped."

Paul

 

[Paul Kimball]

I think plagiarism is an interesting topic in ufology - if all these UFO stories are 'facts' can I rewrite someone's book and present it as my own? After all, I'm not copying anyone's 'fictional' ideas, just reporting historical facts...

...the flipside to that argument is can anyone retain exclusive rights to publish certain UFO stories?

The answer to those questions is a legal one, and is a bit complex. The long and the short of it, however, is that Greer went beyond any fair use - he took something written by others, and tried to pass it off as his own. That's a non-starter.

As for stories, no, you can't copyright them, although you can certainly copyright your account of it (i.e. a book by, say, Betty Hill).

In terms of your account, you could also sign an exclusive deal with a publisher etc., but that wouldn't stop someone from quoting from your account in a book of their own, so long as proper attribution was given.

But that's a big difference from what Greer did. See: NHNE News Flash: Steven Greer BAE Controversy

Note that Greer, who never backs down from anything, or any claim, backed down from this one.

Paul

 

[Tony2007]

"They make sure that everyone signs a confidentiality
agreement, which reads, in part, "By my signature affixed below,
I agree to hold all proceedings of this CSET Ambassadors to the
Universe Training Retreat confidential and agree that it shall
not be shared publicly without the prior express written consent
of CSETI." (Note: considering the use Dr. Greer has made of
things without express prior written consent, this last bit is
quite amusing).

Also amusing is that fact that Greer is the author of a book entitled Disclosure, and yet he's trying to prevent just that.

I guess UFOs belong only to a special, special few.

 

[morrison1976]

What is wrong with you people!! why is there no talk about the witnesess? are they all frauds too. It makes me sick when people concentrate on the negatives. Like i said before, i have seen this happen with nick pope, all because of a bit of media attention. I know that greer is making a bit of money, so bloody what!! Its his job, and he has to make a living. I would do the same, and i am sure you all would too. Do you think he should be doing this for free??? do you think he has a magic hat filled with money that never runs out? He has a family too, and above all, that is his main prioity. At least talk about the witnesess he has gatherd, if you have listened to them that is!

 

[TerraX]

I agree. Things should be put in proper balance. I also admit that I find the $800 charge to excessive and the 'non-disclosure' agreement rather unproductive to put it diplomaticly. On the other hand lets not forget the DP witnesses and lets view Greer's work from various angles.

 

[mjw]

What is wrong with you people!!

You're dealing with humans. Nothing bad about that though as I happen to enjoy being a human. I think that the tragedy and conflict we create is probably looked at as a form of high entertainment by advanced cultures throughout the universe. So they probably aren't going to land in the middle of Times Square and save us from our selves. There's no fun in that at all.

All I know is that one cold autumn night I followed a UFO in the sky that landed in a large field flashed a light at it and it flashed a million lights back before disappearing into nothing. So I can't really make fun of Dr. Greer and say that his CSETI outings are bogus. Because I don't know.

 

[CapnG]

What is wrong with you people!! why is there now talk about the witnesess? are they all frauds too. It makes me sick when people concentrate on the negatives.

Whoa there! Nobody said the witnesses were all phonies. In fact quite the opposite, we're saying Greer's antics are actually damaging potentially flawless witness testimony of the highest calibre. "One bad apple" and all that. We're capable of seperating wheat from chaff but john-Q public isn't because all he's going to get is the media filtered version.

Like i said before, i have seen this happen with nick pope, all because of a bit of media attention. I know that greer is making a bit of money, so bloody what!! Its his job, and he has to make a living.

Wrong. Greer's a surgeon. He says so all the time, he even balks at the idea that he's running these things to make money. A statement which I find flabberghasting. If he doesn't care about the money, why charge so much? Why charge at ALL? And why all the secrecy? If it walks like a scam and it quacks like a scam...

At least talk about the witnesess he has gatherd, if you have listened to them that is!

The thread topic is "Steven Greer" not "Steven Greer and every single witness in the DP stable". If you want to talk about the witnesses, start a new topic.

 

[hopeful skeptic]

I agree. Things should be put in proper balance. I also admit that I find the $800 charge to excessive and the 'non-disclosure' agreement rather unproductive to put it diplomaticly. On the other hand lets not forget the DP witnesses and lets view Greer's work from various angles.

Ufology is a divisive subject. If (and it's a big "if") Greer's motive is to draw as much public attention as possible to ufology - so much attention that competent scientists and investigators are prodded into action - than he has to keep everything above board. No one is perfect, but someone arguing that UFOs are real has to have his ducks in a row.

UFO enthusiasts love their subject, and are all too willing to forgive gaping flaws in methodology, rampant, incompetent investigation and defects in character in those who carry the standard. Greer has shown himself to be untrustworthy, unscrupulous, unable to fulfill promises, unable to back up his claims with proof and incapable of telling the truth.

No one is suggesting that a full-time "researcher" (I put that word in quotes, because it is thrown around ufology with terrifying randomness) doesn't have the right to make a living. But a person presuming to speak from a position of authority has a commensurate responsibility to do the right thing. You cannot accuse SETI of a grand conspiracy to hide alien contact without providing proof. You cannot promise the public release of countless "free-energy" devices (another term that deserves to be put in quotes) without delivering on those promises. You cannot drag gullible people into a cornfield, sign them to a non-disclosure agreement, hand them a flashlight and then point them to an orbiting satellite of terrestrial manufacture. You cannot claim close working relationships with presidents and heads of government agencies without providing documentation of those relationships (particularly when those contacts file affidavits attesting to the non-existent nature of said contact).

You aren't supposed to be a liar and get away with it. But ufology is a field that refuses to police itself, so....

(I also question how important the witnesses Greer collected for the NPC event really are. We have a plethora of UFO witnesses, but no incontrovertible, physical proof. How many witnesses do folks need? Thousands upon thousands of Americans have been witnessing UFOs in the modern era since 1947. If Greer had produced one indisputable physical artifact, then he would have made a lasting contribution to the study of UFOs. But gathering more witnesses in a cause already teeming with them doesn't seem to be getting anyone anywhere.)

 

[Paul Kimball]

But gathering more witnesses in a cause already teeming with them doesn't seem to be getting anyone anywhere.

Well, one can always use more witnesses I guess, but to what end? "Science" won't look at witness testimony, as it (wrongly, in my opinion) has no respect for it (which is not to say witness testimony is the be all and end all).

What new witnesses do is confirm the conclusions that the True Believers (a term I do not intend to be pejorative here) have already drawn, i.e. there is something paranormal flitting about in our skies, and it's aliens from another world (I find EDH proponents more cautious than ETH proponents in asserting their theory as a proven fact).

Really, though, we already have the best witnesses we're ever going to get - people like Kelly Johnson, the world's top aircraft designer (U-2, F-104 Starfighter, etc), and his top test pilots at Lockheed Martin, and military officers, and scientists, and fighter pilots, and... the list goes on. Many of these witnesses can be corroborated by independent hard data, like radar tracking. In the 1976 Tehran case, for example, there was also electromagnetic interference with F-4 on-board weapons, communication, and navigation systems. RB-47 cases (and there are more than just the classic 1957 cases) report the same effects.

To me, the key is to winnow down the mass of witnesses and cases to the best possible, and then move forward. My film is, in some respects, designed to begin that process, or at least get people thinking about it. People who matter are receptive to that kind of information - I know, because I've talked to them about it (including a Canadian cabinet minister, who was quite surprised to hear that UFOs were about more than just "little green men" proponents).

In short, it's quality, not quantity, that matters. The problem is that most ufologists have gone the other way (Greer being one of the worst examples), choosing quantity over quality, as if the sheer numbers will win the day - in the process, lumping the best witnesses and cases in with the mediocre, or even the lousy, ones.

It doesn't work that way... although it is great when preaching to the converted.

Best regards,
Paul

 

[Scully]

Whoa, what a thread!
I found my way here after listening to the latest Paracast interview with Dr. Greer and thought I'd read what everyone had to say about him. I decided to add some more discussion to the mix because I know him fairly well and have worked with him for 15 years. I have been with him during a couple of sightings and experienced other paranormal events around him.
This all is not so easy, or as solid as you'd expect.

I was dismayed to listen to the nit-picking of his of his achievements and the subsequent spiral into nay-saying and ego-bashing. But I have seen these countless times before. Seems you can't find anything or anyone that has credibility in this field anymore without all the personal bickering. Which is one reason I stay on the sidelines these days.

WWJD?
To listen to all of you, I feel like I've stepped into the middle of a discussion on the reality of the Bible, or the life of Christ. THAT is comparable to the study of ufos. Think about it. Can you prove Jesus existed? Yet there is a religion based around him...a belief system. Arguing whether Dr. Greer is right or not, or if he is the closest thing we have to proof, then I have to ask you............what WOULD you consider to be "proof"?

I can see how he has become the center of attention for his Disclosure Project, and I know how he got there. I knew him before that existed, and I know why he went there and I watched him become the lightning rod for that information. I saw his personal challenges and all he had to go through to GET that information to try and give it back to people.....just like you.
A pretty thankless job for the lot like you.
Easy for you to sit on the sidelines and say "Where's the PROOF?" when testimony isn't enough.
Easy for you to say "He's doing it for the money", when one field trip nets him only a few grand, several times a year. (He doesn't need the money folks.)
He's not perfect. ANY one who leads a dynamic, center-stage public life is going to be both loved and hated, especially if they are leading large groups of people. Not to compare Greer to presidential people, but look at all the discourse and dissention we had with Clinton and Bush. You can't please everyone; everyone's bound to have their own opinions.

Now, getting back to Greer. I would say to those of you who are trying to sift through ufo reports to LEARN something; then keep on reading. After 30 years of dissecting thousands of reports, I am back to Square One. There is nothing better than personal experience, an open mind and a little bit of faith that all will be revealed at the perfect time. You may, or may not get to this pinnacle of understanding in your lifetime.

No matter WHO controls all the ET information; YOU are not going to find out about it because you can never pierce that veil of government protected knowledge. Because it is a spiritual war, it is a time/space journey and we all are connected by our thoughts and actions. I can't blame you for continuing to search, to look for answers; but please don't put the burden on one man.
Dr. Steven Greer. He is a one of our spiritual warriors with all too-human traits. He doesn't have all the answers, but he is closer than you even expect. And I don't expect everyone to understand that, or even be able to take that as a definative answer; especially where ego or belief system is involved.

If we are to learn anything in this lifetime, then we must all accept responsiblity for our own actions. Live your life like there aren't any aliens, like there will never be any.
And live your life like there are.

 

[hopeful skeptic]

Seems you can't find anything or anyone that has credibility in this field anymore without all the personal bickering. Which is one reason I stay on the sidelines these days.

Until now.

Arguing whether Dr. Greer is right or not, or if he is the closest thing we have to proof, then I have to ask you............what WOULD you consider to be "proof"?

Proof is demonstrable, reproducable, incontrovertible physical evidence of the reality of UFOs. That is proof. Eyewitness testimony unsupported by actual evidence is only hearsay. It doesn't further the field, or bring UFOs into the realm of science.

I can see how he has become the center of attention for his Disclosure Project, and I know how he got there. I knew him before that existed, and I know why he went there and I watched him become the lightning rod for that information. I saw his personal challenges and all he had to go through to GET that information to try and give it back to people.....just like you. A pretty thankless job for the lot like you.

Who's making him stay in the field? If Greer feels that his efforts are wasted on us commoners, he can recuse himself from further publicity-seeking and fundraising. No one's twisting his arm.

Easy for you to sit on the sidelines and say "Where's the PROOF?" when testimony isn't enough.

Yes, it is easy. Testimony isn't enough.

Easy for you to say "He's doing it for the money", when one field trip nets him only a few grand, several times a year. (He doesn't need the money folks.)

A side gig that netted me a "few grand, several times a year" would be a pretty sweet deal. If he doesn't need the money then he shouldn't charge anything. If Greer can summon UFOs with a flashlight, he is the most important human being of the last half-century.

Arming folks with a flashlight to watch orbiting satellites of terrestrial manufacture while cloaking oneself with a non-disclosure agreement (as head of the alleged "Disclosure Project") is mendacity and hypocrisy. It ought not be tolerated by anyone with an ounce of self-respect or ethical fiber.

He's not perfect. ANY one who leads a dynamic, center-stage public life is going to be both loved and hated, especially if they are leading large groups of people. Not to compare Greer to presidential people, but look at all the discourse and dissention we had with Clinton and Bush. You can't please everyone; everyone's bound to have their own opinions.

I don't care a whit whether I agree with Greer's opinions or not. It is his personal conduct and track record of misrepresentation that is objectionable. When people lie, they take themselves out of the realm of discourse and into the arena of condemnation.

Now, getting back to Greer. I would say to those of you who are trying to sift through ufo reports to LEARN something; then keep on reading. After 30 years of dissecting thousands of reports, I am back to Square One.

This emphasizes the point that hearsay is meaningless without actual evidence to back it up.

There is nothing better than personal experience, an open mind and a little bit of faith that all will be revealed at the perfect time. You may, or may not get to this pinnacle of understanding in your lifetime.

Keep an open mind, but not one so open that your brain falls out.

No matter WHO controls all the ET information; YOU are not going to find out about it because you can never pierce that veil of government protected knowledge. Because it is a spiritual war, it is a time/space journey and we all are connected by our thoughts and actions.

Flummery. Conspiratorial double-speak. The only impenetrable veil here is the blather that defenders of a known fraud will hide behind.

I can't blame you for continuing to search, to look for answers; but please don't put the burden on one man.

No one here does. If I were dependent on Greer for my knowledge about UFOs, I'd be in a pretty sorry state. It is Greer who represents himself as able to call down UFOs with a flashlight, and can't. It is Greer who claims close, working relationships with presidents and heads of intelligence services, only to have all those people deny ever meeting the man. It is Greer who claims (monthly, it seems) to have access to all manner of "free energy" [sic] devices, and consistently fails to produce them.

You are throwing your support behind a fraud and a phony.

Dr. Steven Greer. He is a one of our spiritual warriors with all too-human traits. He doesn't have all the answers, but he is closer than you even expect. And I don't expect everyone to understand that, or even be able to take that as a definative answer; especially where ego or belief system is involved.

Right, right, right. If only we commoners could understand the mighty forces at play around us, and the transcendent motives of the great men of our times.

Good grief.

If we are to learn anything in this lifetime, then we must all accept responsiblity for our own actions.

You should reserve this comment and direct it at Greer. He needs it.

 

[CapnG]

Ladies (?) and gentlemen of the paracast forums, I give you the dictionary definition of hypocrisy:

Dr. Steven Greer. He is a one of our spiritual warriors with all too-human traits. He doesn't have all the answers, but he is closer than you even expect. And I don't expect everyone to understand that, or even be able to take that as a definative answer; especially where ego or belief system is involved.

So, to recap, Greer's belief system is acceptable, that of those who question him is not.

The minutia of Greer and his goals has already been covered here ad infinitum by persons more elloquent that I, so I'll just be blunt: Scully, if you know Greer as you claim to, deliver this message to him- If you can call down UFOs at will, you are obligated to do so, in a populated area, at a moment of high traffic density, under conditions which absolutely CANNOT be refuted. Anything less is a waste of time.

Disclosure require DISCLOSURE, not talking endlessly about the possibility of it.

 

[mjw]

Scully, if you know Greer as you claim to, deliver this message to him- If you can call down UFOs at will, you are obligated to do so, in a populated area, at a moment of high traffic density, under conditions which absolutely CANNOT be refuted. Anything less is a waste of time.

What if the aliens don't want to show up in a populated area at a moment of high traffic density under irrefutable conditions?

Proof is demonstrable, reproducable, incontrovertible physical evidence of the reality of UFOs. That is proof. Eyewitness testimony unsupported by actual evidence is only hearsay. It doesn't further the field, or bring UFOs into the realm of science.

Yeah I forgot that eyewitness testimony doesn't mean anything. For example, I told a friend today about an incident that happened about a week ago while I was at work where I witnessed a driverless police car go through 6 lanes of traffic in reverse (without hitting anyone thankfully) and then go down a hill and slam into a parking garage. He said "prove it". I said that all I had was a pic of it on my cell phone. He asked me if that proof was demonstrable and reproducible. I said I wasn’t sure, it’s only a cell phone pic. He then asked me if said cell phone pic was incontrovertible physical evidence of the reality of my outlandish story. I said I guess not. He said that my story was nothing more than hearsay and that I should be ashamed to have ever spoken about it and that if I ever planned on telling him anything else that I had better come better prepared with more solid proof and perhaps a few other witnesses just so he can cross reference my story with theirs to see if there is any difference because one of us might be lying about it because there is so much at stake.

Has anyone here other than myself read Dr. Greer's book? I just don't understand why he would lie about it. Lying seems like such a big waste of time - especially when you are the one telling the story. I mean, it's easy to just deny something that someone else has said and lie about it. That doesn't take much effort at all. But to create a huge fictitious story that has not only changed your life but those closest and dearest to you - your spouse and children... It just seems like it's too much trouble to make up such a huge lie. Particularly when you were doing just fine before as a doctor. What's the point in lying?

If Dr. Greer was a lawyer would you believe him then? haha What an ironic and paradoxical world we live in.

 

[CapnG]

What if the aliens don't want to show up in a populated area at a moment of high traffic density under irrefutable conditions?

Not my problem, I'm not the one making outlandish claims about "vectoring".

As for the business with the police car, you at least have a PHOTO. Now, do we have proof that you don't have a buddy who's a cop and had him park it there so you could take the photo? Nope. Seems like an awful lot of trouble to go through though, therefore on the weight of that logic alone, your story seems credible. If Greer had a photo, just ONE, I'd certainly be more inclined to believe his claims (not convinced, but much more inclined).

It just seems like it's too much trouble to make up such a huge lie. Particularly when you were doing just fine before as a doctor. What's the point in lying?

So is he currently NOT working as a surgeon? Or is he continuing to work as a surgeon WHILE he does this? I'm not saying he's lying, I'm just saying if I could convince people to drop $800 a piece just for wandering around the desert with me whilst shining flashlights into the night sky, I probably would.

 

[hopeful skeptic]

What if the aliens don't want to show up in a populated area at a moment of high traffic density under irrefutable conditions?

One might assume that the aliens had reason for causing planet-wide panic, speculation and concern. One could assume that they have a strong sense of play. One could assume that they are somehow unable to physically interact with us. One might assume that they are somehow limited by another alien presence, or by our military, from making their presence felt.

More reasonably, one should assume that the idiot leading gullible people through a cornfield might be defrauding them. What seems most logical to you?

Yeah I forgot that eyewitness testimony doesn't mean anything. For example, I told a friend today about an incident that happened about a week ago while I was at work where I witnessed a driverless police car go through 6 lanes of traffic in reverse (without hitting anyone thankfully) and then go down a hill and slam into a parking garage. He said "prove it". I said that all I had was a pic of it on my cell phone. He asked me if that proof was demonstrable and reproducible. I said I wasn't sure, it's only a cell phone pic. He then asked me if said cell phone pic was incontrovertible physical evidence of the reality of my outlandish story. I said I guess not. He said that my story was nothing more than hearsay and that I should be ashamed to have ever spoken about it and that if I ever planned on telling him anything else that I had better come better prepared with more solid proof and perhaps a few other witnesses just so he can cross reference my story with theirs to see if there is any difference because one of us might be lying about it because there is so much at stake.

Somehow I strongly doubt you had anything like that conversation with anyone, let alone a friend who asked whether your pic was "incontrovertible and reproducable." But I digress.

All I see in your photo is a car under a bridge. Your story of how it got there is entirely your word. Scientifically, it means precisely nothing. All your photo proves is that a police car - somewhere - was once under a bridge - somewhere. That's it.

Thanks for that excellent example of precisely why eyewitness testimony is scientifically meaningless.

Has anyone here other than myself read Dr. Greer's book? I just don't understand why he would lie about it. Lying seems like such a big waste of time - especially when you are the one telling the story. I mean, it's easy to just deny something that someone else has said and lie about it. That doesn't take much effort at all. But to create a huge fictitious story that has not only changed your life but those closest and dearest to you - your spouse and children... It just seems like it's too much trouble to make up such a huge lie. Particularly when you were doing just fine before as a doctor. What's the point in lying?

Well, "Scully" (above) already noted that Greer has several thousand reasons, a few times a year, to lie. People lie for all kinds of reasons. A desire to involve themselves in a story that gives them some sense of self-importance and contribution. A desire to fool people. A desire to leave a lasting legacy. A desire to accumulate wealth. A desire to build a following of people too lacking in critical-thinking skills to question your conduct and credentials.

By your reasoning, John Mark Carr had no reason to lie about killing Jon Benet Ramsey. Ask a detective how many times he's had some village idiot walk into his station and confess to a crime he didn't commit. That happens quite often.

If Dr. Greer was a lawyer would you believe him then? haha What an ironic and paradoxical world we live in.

I'm not sure where you're reading "irony" into this situation. Or "paradoxical," for that matter.

If Greer was a lawyer, it would be less reason for me to believe him. On the other hand, his penchant for bilking the gullible would make more sense.

 

[Rick Deckard]

Proof is demonstrable, reproducable, incontrovertible physical evidence of the reality of UFOs. That is proof.

How does one apply that to a *transient event* such as a UFO sighting?

Can you demonstrate a UFO event to me?
Can you reproduce a UFO event for me?
What if UFOs don't leave physical evidence that we are capable of detecting?

I suppose, we must conclude that UFOs don't exist because we are unable to scientifically 'prove' they exist - and yes, I mean unidentified flying objects *rather* than ET craft (which did you mean?).

 

[Tony2007]

How does one apply that to a *transient event* such as a UFO sighting?

Can you demonstrate a UFO event to me?
Can you reproduce a UFO event for me?
What if UFOs don't leave physical evidence that we are capable of detecting?

I suppose, we must conclude that UFOs don't exist because we are unable to scientifically 'prove' they exist - and yes, I mean unidentified flying objects *rather* than ET craft (which did you mean?).

If a UFO lands in the woods and no one is there to witness it, did it really land?

After reading the last few days of posting, I feel like I should jump in like that guy in "Close Encounters" and shout, "I saw BIGFOOT once!"

Let's say for a moment that Dr. Greer is all that, and that his CSETI programs do everything that they advertise, and that by using the Force he can bring a UFO to any location (the possibility of which is laughable, at least on paper).

Why does he charge upwards of $800 for one of these events? I would love to go, absolutely love to go. I'll sign waivers, I'll sign agreements, I'll keep my yap shut if they want, I'll go for a spin in a UFO which would be a dream come true. But there is no way I could possibly afford that pricetag. That's essentially half of what I make in a month, and every last penny I make goes towards something that keeps me afloat, be it credit-card payments, car payments, insurance, groceries, gas, the little entertainment I allow myself from week to week.

And I'm not alone. So essentially this "Ambassador" training, if it can so be called, is being closed off to only those who can afford it. This smacks of class-snobbery, and is extremely off-putting in a field that is first of all still in relative infancy, that is largely unproven, and is filled with hucksters, cheats, liars and thieves.

The experience of UFOs, of Extra-Terrestrials, and the idea of life elsewhere are areas that demand, demand, that all humanity be allowed access to, not just the wealthy or the well-to-do. This was the spirit in which "Disclosure Project" was done, but it seems like now in order to go further than just hearing testimony, you have to pay up, and pay up big. So forgive me and others if we feel as though this may be the biggest screw-job in history.... Here's this professional-looking man who is well spoken... here's this press conference he gave with former military people who had UFO experiences... here's his noble, non-profit organization committed to furthering the cause... here's the price...

The bottom line is that Dr. Greer must do more if we're going to believe that this isn't anything more than the biggest sales-pitch in the world.

 

[CapnG]

And I'm not alone. So essentially this "Ambassador" training, if it can so be called, is being closed off to only those who can afford it. This smacks of class-snobbery

I think you've hit the crux there. Assuming Greer believes what he says (and why shouldn't he?) then we certainly don't want any old joe-six-pack to be the first person making contact with some alien race visiting earth for the first time, do we? No we want someone erudite, someone cultured, someone with money in the bank that can afford to show them around.

If that's the case then yeah, it's not about the money in the sense it's not about Greer fleecing people, it's about excluding the shabbier section of the populace.

Niether of those options rings as being very positive in my book.

 

[Rick Deckard]

If a UFO lands in the woods and no one is there to witness it, did it really land?

Way to go for dodging the question...

 

[Scully]

Some of you bring up good questions about Dr. Greer, especially the one of his price tags for his CE5 "Ambassador" trainings. I will admit that IS pricey, and smacks of a class war type thing. I can't afford it either. But I think it's based on the type of thinking, that anything worthwhile is worth paying for.
It's his price tag. These events take large chunks of his time away from him.
He sees it as worth it, from the comfortable class he travels in. Plus, he has spent a small fortune gathering all his information and contacts, and because you wish to travel with him and learn of these stories and contacts, you would be contributing back to that which he has already spent (freely, I might add.) From that point of view, it balances out.

I wouldn't take it personally. As for the others who think he should be able to call them down to the city streets in your neighbourhood........I can understand your thinking; but you probably don't know how "ufos" work.
You can believe that they are physical extraterrestial craft piloted by real aliens, or you might be of the school of thought, that they are multi-dimensional time machines responding to your consciousness stream.
Either way, you have no control.

I think those that find fault (and there are plenty here who find nothing BUT fault) with Dr. Greer have yet to come to the conclusion that the study of ufos is nothing more than that......a STUDY. Going back to the life of Christ as a perfect example, helps to prove my point. We know to some extent his beliefs and teachings were right, and there is a whole religion or BELIEF system that has formed around his image and lifetime, but there is still NO proof that he ever existed.

Other than eye-witness accounts, supposed miracles and maybe an image on a cloth. Even I have seen him once as a child in a vision, but does that make him REAL? I've seen a ufo up close and personal as well, but does that make them REAL? I believe that both exist, as a living CONCEPT, and yet I have no PROOF.

For all of you other who are mean-spirited in finding fault with Steven Greer, I ask you all to go to that mirror and look deeply within. Perhaps you find fault with a man who doesn't HAVE all the answers, and you want them on a platter. If only it were that simple. And today is a perfect example of my thinking, because it is Christmas with all the family get-togethers, gifts, food, warmth and laughter. It is a special time, a celebration. And all of you who would deny the existence of ufos or the life of Christ, please go back to that mirror and the inner workings of your heart and find the answer there.