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The Official Paracast Political Thread! — Part Four

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pixelsmith said:
Check out your fellow Canadians concerns.
Home - Vaccine Choice Canada


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It's unfortunate that organizations like that exists - the motives of these people are not bad. They probably care deeply about the health of their children, but because of a misguided notion and perhaps a distrust of the establishment, they do not think the research is correct.
I would like to understand more: how is it that you trust people like those that create organizations like this, and not those actually doing the research. You do realize that the ones at the top of the chain of the anti-vaccine movement have a financial interest in this too, right? The myth, the legend, Andrew Wakefield misrepresented his results because of lawyers and lawsuits - everything comes from him.
 
Angel of Ioren said:
It's unfortunate that organizations like that exists - the motives of these people are not bad. They probably care deeply about the health of their children, but because of a misguided notion and perhaps a distrust of the establishment, they do not think the research is correct.
I would like to understand more: how is it that you trust people like those that create organizations like this, and not those actually doing the research. You do realize that the ones at the top of the chain of the anti-vaccine movement have a financial interest in this too, right? The myth, the legend, Andrew Wakefield misrepresented his results because of lawyers and lawsuits - everything comes from him.
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If you bothered to check out your sources you will find they are bought and paid for.
Wakefield never misrepresented his results ever. His results were misrepresented. Why not watch vaxxed for 4 bucks and actually learn something. You are completely wrong about his study


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Angel of Ioren said:
It's unfortunate that organizations like that exists - the motives of these people are not bad. They probably care deeply about the health of their children, but because of a misguided notion and perhaps a distrust of the establishment, they do not think the research is correct.
I would like to understand more: how is it that you trust people like those that create organizations like this, and not those actually doing the research. You do realize that the ones at the top of the chain of the anti-vaccine movement have a financial interest in this too, right? The myth, the legend, Andrew Wakefield misrepresented his results because of lawyers and lawsuits - everything comes from him.
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Why not read this organizations information instead of ridiculing them? The people involved were probably pro vaccine at one time like I was.
If or rather WHEN your children become injured you are going to feel horrible you didn't check out the real facts from people just like you who didn't do proper research.


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No, I'm all good Pixel.

Perhaps you're trying to play to my emotions by telling me that I'm hurting my children? Please stop - you're wasting your time and you're slowly lowering my opinion of you, which as you know from the past, I actually think you're not a bad guy.

At least you've given me some great material to use on a segment I have planned for my podcast - arguing with people on the internet that you know are wrong.
 
It's all good when your kids seem fine. And the rest of us parents with injured or dead kids are crazy. We are told to accept that adverse reactions are normal and to be expected. I tell you what, I would rather my kids go thru a few itchy days from measles or sore throats from mumps then have life long immunity then to be brain damaged, immunocompromised with learning disabilities and booster shots for the rest of their lives. Once you fuck up your kids immune system they are life long customers of big pharma. They is no profit in healthy kids.


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Ok so I am crazy for being upset that vaccines injured my kids and my girlfriends kids for the rest of their lives.
Gee thanks. My opinion of you is lowering by the minute.


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pixelsmith said:
It's all good when your kids seem fine. And the rest of us parents with injured or dead kids are crazy. We are told to accept that adverse reactions are normal and to be expected. I tell you what, I would rather my kids go thru a few itchy days from measles or sore throats from mumps then have life long immunity then to be brain damaged, immunocompromised with learning disabilities and booster shots for the rest of their lives. Once you fuck up your kids immune system they are life long customers of big pharma. They is no profit in healthy kids.


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I always hold out the possibility that I'm wrong, that there's some detail that I'm not aware of. Those rules of learning apply in this context as well.

However, I'm stuck on climate change denialism and what this very likely indicates about one's internal error correction practices. The person who denies climate change on the basis of conspiracy likely applies the same mental practices to everything else, which would arguably predictably produce similar false returns.

Anyone who has followed the "debate" about climate change has probably come across this slightly older study showing a link between climate change denial and conspiratorial belief:

Link Between Climate Denial and Conspiracy Beliefs Sparks Conspiracy Theories

What indications of conspiracism are there in your posts, I've been asking myself. You mention that kids with early onset medical conditions can become lifelong customers of the pharmaceutical industry. This indeed might happen, but I wonder if you believe that is by design. Granted, many dubious characters prowl the corporate boardrooms doing shitty things. But, what might seem to be conspiracy might actually be the result of poor human judgment, institutional inertia and status quo bias.
 
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I hope you discuss on your podcast that there is a possibility it is you that is wrong because you haven't looked at the evidence and science presented by the other side. If you don't mention it then you shouldn't be doing podcasts or any sort of journalism. Right?


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I hope you also mention that a person you are arguing with at one time believed he was he was right too. Turns out I was wrong... just like you are now.


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pixelsmith said:
I hope you also mention that a person you are arguing with at one time believed he was he was right too. Turns out I was wrong... just like you are now.


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I'm open to the idea that I'm wrong, but the evidence is overwhelmingly against that right now. Arguing with you is a lot of fun, but please don't tell me I'm a bad parent. I'm not.
 
Angel of Ioren said:
I'll leave you with these:

Vaccine Safety: Examine the Evidence

Vaccine Safety | immunizecanada

Of course you'll find some reason that these sites are wrong and we're back to the Backfire Effect.
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Well it sounds like your government like ours has a financial interest in vaccines and your adverse reaction program is just as corrupt as ours. Why on earth would you trust anything they say over those with vaccine injured kids and no vested interest?
What's wrong with you Angelo? How does that not compute in your brain?
 
Sign up for the free series that starts tomorrow night. You will be shocked at what you don't know. It is full of credible scientists, doctors, former vaccine makers, researchers and parents of injured kids.
You will probably agree with everything I say after watching it.


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One of the only vaccinations I received as a kid was a SV40 tainted polio vaccine. I am at risk for cancer now because of it.


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Angel of Ioren said:
No, I'm all good Pixel.

Perhaps you're trying to play to my emotions by telling me that I'm hurting my children? Please stop - you're wasting your time and you're slowly lowering my opinion of you, which as you know from the past, I actually think you're not a bad guy.

At least you've given me some great material to use on a segment I have planned for my podcast - arguing with people on the internet that you know are wrong.
Click to expand...

At this point we are wrestling with a pig, albeit one with wings.

On the upside i found a Pigasus award of a size fitting the magnitude of silliness we have here


FLYING PIG IN NOVEMBER - Leela Devi Panikar Blog
 
Angel of Ioren said:
Look at the author: Gretchen DuBeau is Executive Director of Alliance for Natural Health US

She also writes for Natural News! The site that thinks AIDS isn't a real thing and that Microsoft is practicing eugenics.

Seeing Even More Quackery in Your Facebook Feed? Natural News Is to Blame.
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Bill Gates is indeed a eugenicist. He has been responsible for over 47,000 vaccine related injuries and deaths recently.
Natural News is indeed correct about AIDS
Wake the f up. When you getca little older you will realize the more you know, the more you realize you don't know.
Study the real history of AIDS.
 
pixelsmith said:
One of the only vaccinations I received as a kid was a SV40 tainted polio vaccine. I am at risk for cancer now because of it.


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Assessing a truth claim sometimes involves evaluating the reliability of the one making it. One thing to look for is indications of bias. So, when I see a comment like the above my first thought is, 'Oh, confirmation bias. I wonder how strong that is.'

Clearly we're dealing with multiple levels of causation in the case of the tainted vaccine you claim to have received. The immediate cause of your increased risk is, so you claim, the vaccine itself, but this story is incomplete. How was the vaccine tainted? What institutional, regulatory, professional, systemic or other factors were at work? And, to my point, why is it that out of all of these factors it's the vaccine itself that gets the blame?

What this tells me is that you're taking invalid mental shortcuts in order to justify your anti-vaccine commitment. This can't but cue others as to the possibility that you have a belief system and not a carefully thought through critique.
 
EricTheRed said:
Assessing a truth claim sometimes involves evaluating the reliability of the one making it. One thing to look for is indications of bias. So, when I see a comment like the above my first thought is, 'Oh, confirmation bias. I wonder how strong that is.'

Clearly we're dealing with multiple levels of causation in the case of the tainted vaccine you claim to have received. The immediate cause of your increased risk is, so you claim, the vaccine itself, but this story is incomplete. How was the vaccine tainted? What institutional, regulatory, professional, systemic or other factors were at work? And, to my point, why is it that out of all of these factors it's the vaccine itself that gets the blame?

What this tells me is that you're taking invalid mental shortcuts in order to justify your anti-vaccine commitment. This can't but cue others as to the possibility that you have a belief system and not a carefully thought through critique.
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What this tells me is you are very much unqualified to even participate in the dialogue. Please get educated from both points of view and come back.
I have studied both sides since 1984 when my first born was vaccine damaged.
I have a few years and countless hours of research ahead of you. Please hurry.
 
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