9/11

[cottonzway]

No need to keep on replying because I followed your advice by simply ignoring you. People like yourself add nothing to a topic like this and just try to create fighting. It's a failing approach by those who either are too ignorant to understand there is something wrong or those who work for those who helped cause something wrong. Reagrdless who you are, this will not work with me.

 

[interestedINitall]

No need to keep on replying because I followed your advice by simply ignoring you. People like yourself add nothing to a topic like this and just try to create fighting. It's a failing approach by those who either are too ignorant to understand there is something wrong or those who work for those who helped cause something wrong. Reagrdless who you are, this will not work with me.

I expect nothing less from a psychologically damaged, marginally educated individual such as yourself.

Oh well, there will always be conspiracy theories out there so at least you sad, little life will have some purpose.

Buh-bye

 

[Gene Steinberg]

I expect nothing less from a psychologically damaged, marginally educated individual such as yourself.

Oh well, there will always be conspiracy theories out there so at least you sad, little life will have some purpose.

Buh-bye

OK, folks, no more conversation about people being psychologically damaged, illiterate, or whatever. David and I will be examining the posts, and if they go over-the-top, they'll be removed. Disagree if you wish, but please try to be a little more civil.

 

[interestedINitall]

You'll notice that I asked this person for his opinion quite civilly more than once. I can't help if it paranoia wins the day. It's regrettable, to be sure. Don't worry, the IGNORE feature has solved a lot.

 

[cottonzway]

OK, folks, no more conversation about people being psychologically damaged, illiterate, or whatever. David and I will be examining the posts, and if they go over-the-top, they'll be removed. Disagree if you wish, but please try to be a little more civil.

You won't get any from myself Gene in regards to the fellow above. The ignore option is a wonderful thing.

 

[KorMan]

KorMan, what is with your demeaning attitude? I have always found that those who take that tone know the least about anything.

And I have found that people with thin skins should stay off of Web boards.

<hr>

I'm curious if you feel everyone who questions the official story says something other then Flight 77 hit the Pentagon?

No. Only the Alpha Level conspiracy buffs claim that. The dilettantes don't dare go that far out into left field.

I question a lot of the parts of Flight 77 but agree that the plane along with those people hit that building.

Good. That's a start.

Now who was flying it and under who's agenda I think is up for debate.

The plane was hijacked by men of middle-eastern citizenship. The "pilot" was one of those who took basic flight training for "heavies".

Hani Hanjour, the Saudi pilot who flew American Airlines flight 77 into the Pentagon, "had lived in the United States off and on throughout the 1990s, mostly in Arizona, intermittently taking flying lessons at several different flying schools." He was, in the view of one of his flight instructors, "intelligent, friendly, and 'very courteous, very formal,' a nice enough fellow but a terrible pilot." He finally got a commercial license from the FAA but was unable to find work here or in the Middle East.

The 9/11 Hijackers

As for whose agenda was in play, ask al Qaeda.

The more important question though is WHY it was allowed to hit the Pentagon?

How would you have stopped it once its target became clear? It wasn't doing a flaps-down final approach. It was hauling ass with the full intention to ram the building at high speed. That doesn't leave a lot of time for a military response.

Furthermore, it's not SOP in the USofA to shoot down hijacked planes. And can you imagine the screeching from the touchy-feely crowd if our military had dropped a commercial airliner onto a highly-populated area of Washington?

Have you ever seen Norman Minetta's at the 9/11 Commission Report telling Lee Hamilton Dick Chaney knew the location of that plane and an aid kept updating Chaney when it was X miles out?

And? Once the fact that it had been hijacked and was headed for DC became apparent, who ya gonna tell?

Do the orders still stand? What orders? It was from the hearings of the whitewash...err..I mean 9/11 Commission Report from C-Span. You can easily find it on Goolge video.

I don't trust the 9/11 Commission's "findings".

 

[DVS]

Someone like yourself takes the easy way out and groups all these people into one group. How about the "theory" of the 9-11 Comission Report? If you have not read it then you probably can't comment on it. Much of the info in there is either wrong, misleading, and much important info that was collected by the group was ommited for their "findings" on the matter. Focus on that group instead of being up all of the nonsese for crazies or disinfo agents.

"Somone like mysel"?? I actually did read the 911 Commiss. Report and if you and 'people like yourself' (I had to do that ) had also, you wouldnt be confused about who actually did it since there is a vast amounts of information on the hijackers and and their movements until 911 amongst many other findings that all point to radical islamic terrorists performing 9/11. I found more questions of intelligence failures and poor policy dating back to the first Clinton administration. I mean, where do you want me to go with that? I cant jump to an illogical conclusion that the CIA performed 9/11, or it was remote controll with implosions when all the information, and I have read numerous books about terrorism throughout the 90's, points to a holy war bing waged by islamic terrorists against the U.S. & the West.


I agree that the report is 'incomplete' and has 'CYA' written all over it. However, I stop short of these conspiracy theories, and I am trying not to generalize here, that try to say the CIA, or BUshCo, NWO, whatever they may be actually performed the attack. So, if the official story is that terrorists performed the 9/11 attacks, as stated in the 911 report, then sorry buddy, that is what I beleive happened. And no I am not a card carrying Neo-Con and never voted for Bush, and am not 'in on it' and I am far mindless.

I dont understand these kneejerk adverse reactions when someone states that terrorists actually performed 911. Like it has to be our own government, terrorists would never perform 911! Its not that hard to believe when learn the full scope of Al Queda and I find that the majority of these conspiracy theories are just pure crap that really doesnt stand when fully evaluated. Al Queda did take credit plenty of times for 9/11 and dont you think it would be more beneficial to them if they tried to maintain that Bush did it and not them?

 

[CapnG]

Like it has to be our own government, terrorists would never perform 911!

I don't think that's quite the issue. It's not the belief that terrorists wouldn't carry out 9/11 it's that terrorists wouldn't be able to carry out 9/11 (or, retrospectively, shouldn't have been able to).

You're basically given a choice: either you accept the idea that there's a dark, sinister uber-government, pulling the strings and making us dance like monkies to their infernal organ grinder OR you accept that the government is basically run by incompetant boobs who are so blinded by their personal ambitions that actual governance falls waaaaaaaaay down to the bottom of the agenda, allowing for huge security gaps and loopholes to open despite any efforts by so-called intelligence agencies.

I'm inclined to option C which is (naturally) that both things are true.

 

[cottonzway]

"Somone like mysel"?? I actually did read the 911 Commiss. Report and if you and 'people like yourself' (I had to do that ) had also, you wouldnt be confused about who actually did it since there is a vast amounts of information on the hijackers and and their movements until 911 amongst many other findings that all point to radical islamic terrorists performing 9/11. I found more questions of intelligence failures and poor policy dating back to the first Clinton administration. I mean, where do you want me to go with that? I cant jump to an illogical conclusion that the CIA performed 9/11, or it was remote controll with implosions when all the information, and I have read numerous books about terrorism throughout the 90's, points to a holy war bing waged by islamic terrorists against the U.S. & the West.


I agree that the report is 'incomplete' and has 'CYA' written all over it. However, I stop short of these conspiracy theories, and I am trying not to generalize here, that try to say the CIA, or BUshCo, NWO, whatever they may be actually performed the attack. So, if the official story is that terrorists performed the 9/11 attacks, as stated in the 911 report, then sorry buddy, that is what I beleive happened. And no I am not a card carrying Neo-Con and never voted for Bush, and am not 'in on it' and I am far mindless.

I dont understand these kneejerk adverse reactions when someone states that terrorists actually performed 911. Like it has to be our own government, terrorists would never perform 911! Its not that hard to believe when learn the full scope of Al Queda and I find that the majority of these conspiracy theories are just pure crap that really doesnt stand when fully evaluated. Al Queda did take credit plenty of times for 9/11 and dont you think it would be more beneficial to them if they tried to maintain that Bush did it and not them?

I think it is great that you read it. The bottom line is much of the info in the report is inaccurate, misleading, or flat omitted. Any "theories" come after that. If the report is at worst a "CYA" then we must have a report on this that is not. Do we agree there? I think the REAL truth would come out if there is an accurate looking into this. Above everything else that is what I want more then anything out of speaking about this topic. To re-open a true, fair investigation by people who are not compromised.

What I do not understand is how you came away from that book without more questions? It would take too much time to go over all of the issues I have with the report. I will try to touch on a few so you have an understanding why I am saying these things. I think just saying "gross incompetence" is letting the report off the hook and an injustice to not only the American people, but the world. 9/11 is a global issue because the aftermath of it effects many other parts of the world. I think that is a key issue many Americans need to realize.

Here are some of the issues that do not add up to the findings of the Kean-Hamilton report from what I gathered reading the book:

- The report made reference to the WTC tower 1 and 2 having a hollow core. That is a critical error in trying to explain the reasons as why those buildings fell. This is misleading to everyone seeing the buildings indeed had a large core of 47 steel beams that made the buildings very unique. I think that is a pretty disgraceful way to explain the construction of those buildings. There is no question it is a false statement.

- The report failed to add vital testimony by Norman Minetta that directly contradicts the time line of knowing the locations of Flight 77 and Flight 93. This can be seen on video as it was taken during a session from the Commission on C-Span. You can easily watch this on Google video. Mr. Minttea said under oath and on national TV that Dick Chaney knew the locations of flights via aide that gave the coordinates of in particular Flight 77 as it approached the Pentagon. He said that when the plane was 10 miles out that the aide asked "Do the orders still stand?" Mr. Chaney said; "Yes they stand, have you heard anything to the contrary?" What orders? Why did Dick Chaney allow the Pentagon to be breached? Why is this not mainstream news? Do the orders still stand? This did NOT make it into the report.

- The hijackers. You brought them up. I have a slew of issues with this though. First of all a few of these men are reported by mainstream media to be ALIVE! Why was the considered "lead man", Mohammad Atta, trained at a US Naval base in Monterey, California? Why were others, including again Mr. Atta trained at the Pensacola Naval Station as well? Per those who trained them and it is mainstream news. Why were many of these men in the ABLE DANGER program allowed to get on a commercial airplane in the first place? If you are not familiar with ABLE DANGER I suggest looking up. Mr. Atta, again, was on this high level Pentagon list from the cell in Brooklyn, NY. Why was out friend Mr. Atta and other of these extreme Muslims on the Sun Cruz casino boat a few days before 9/11? Is drinking, drugs, gambling, and strippers the actions for a strict Muslim about to give his life of Allah? Why is FBI agent Robert Wright, who told the bureau 72 times in a lawsuit against his government! 72 times is not an exaggeration. They did add however how passports of two of the hijackers were found at the NYC site and in the Shanksville site. That is just insulting to add such an obvious plant of evidence. It is in there though. I could go on about this part of the topic but I'll move on.

- The omission of Sibel Edmonds' testimony. Sibel Edmonds worked for the government as a translator shortly after 9/11. She came across some information that showed at the least the US government had prior, detailed information about the attacks on September 11, 2001 and did not act on it. As of right now Sibel Edmonds is the most gagged by court order in the history of the United States. This woman gave her testimony to the 9/11 Commission and Mr. Hamilton himself chose not to include her words. They made no mention of her at all. Now if she was some "crazy" nobody would have a problem with what she had to say. The government would let her look like a "conspiracy theorist" but the difference is her information can be documented. She was able to get out that the United States had prior knowledge of this attack, on the day, and they didn't include her sworn testimony. I couldn't make this **** up if I tried, just look it up.

- The made no mention of the war games on 9/1. The MANY war games on 9/11 that leaked. FFA and many military agents had no clue what was real and what was fake on 9/11. Northern Vigilance. Vigilant Warrior. Vigilant Guardian. Global Guardian. That is four by my count. None of them in the Report. These are not "conspiracy war games" either. Confirmed war games by military officials. Look them up. Google. The Commission also failed to report that FEMA was in New York city on 9/10/01 per a FEMA agent who was on live national TV saying they were there with equipment to do a drill on 9/11/01. N one of included.

I can go on for hours about this. I have my questions based on these any many questions. The good thing about someone like yourself though is that even if you think that all of that doesn't add up to my conclusion you admit it is at least a "CYA" report thus have to justify a better report. That is what I want above all else.

 

[Aaron LeClair]

I'm still annoyed that people don't seem annoyed at the lack of effort in getting Bin Laden. Whether he was involved or not, aside a moment. Our gov. told us he was the mastermind behind the biggest attack on American soil, yet later Bush says "I don't know where bin Laden is. I have no idea and really don't care. It's not that important. It's not our priority."
- G.W. Bush, 3/13/02 The audacity is hard to believe.


At first, I thought Bush might be using that statement in hopes Laden would let his guard down and try to hide less (yes, I'm willing to give people the benefit of a doubt, even when it's a little crazy) but as time ticks with seeming no concern for his capture, I get more and more ticked.

And Bush picked on Kerry for flip flopping. Read Flippin Bush quotes here:
Buzzflash Headlines

 

[cottonzway]

I'm still annoyed that people don't seem annoyed at the lack of effort in getting Bin Laden. Whether he was involved or not, aside a moment. Our gov. told us he was the mastermind behind the biggest attack on American soil, yet later Bush says "I don't know where bin Laden is. I have no idea and really don't care. It's not that important. It's not our priority."
- G.W. Bush, 3/13/02 The audacity is hard to believe.


At first, I thought Bush might be using that statement in hopes Laden would let his guard down and try to hide less (yes, I'm willing to give people a benefit of the doubt, even when it's a little crazy) but as time ticks with seeming no concern or progress to his capture, I get more and more ticked.

And Bush picked on Kerry for flip flopping. Read Flippin Bush quotes here:
Buzzflash Headlines

Have you considered that he mat be dead? There are a lot of reports that he passed away in 2002 due to liver failure. I can't confirm if the man is alive or dead by there was a great deal of info looked into his passing in late 2002. No question, without a doubt the "confession video" that we have all seen is NOT Bin Laden. That has been confirmed by experts in the photo and audio field. I do not know if he is alive though, but strong rumors (and we must take rumors for what they are so I understand questions) that he passed away already.

 

[Moshi Dayan]

If the flight did indeed hit the pentagon, where were the bodies?

If the flight did hit the pentagon at the speed suggested, how did they overcome the lift factor of "ground effect" to get low enough to hit the building?

Why were the photographs of the one engine found in the center a military engine and not the expected civilian unit?

Why was authority over the matter taken from the FAA?

Why were no Arabic names on the passenger manifest?

Where are ALL the 911 black boxes?

Where was NORAD?


SOCIOLOGICAL IMPLICATION
if enough obvious lies are projected as truths the human mind becomes overwhelmed, and does not reject the lies.
The human mind seeks the concensus of the masses, and even knowing "common knowledge" is flawed, will none the less defend the lie in an effort to retain social standing.


Hoyce Gracie, Greatest Teacher of Submission Grapplers on earth.

 

[KorMan]

 

[Rick Deckard]

That's pathetic Korman - how about some discussion?

What did happen to the black boxes - the fireservice made a statement saying they had helped recover 3 of the 4 black boxes from the towers - the official report says they were not recovered...

...is that correct or BS?

 

[cottonzway]

Hoyce Gracie, Greatest Teacher of Submission Grapplers on earth.

Even Royce says Rickson is 10x the better grappler. I am a Gracie student and I look up to Royce big time, but Rickson is the family champ. He really has been light years ahead of others in his submissions.

Off topic I know, but I had to say it.

 

[KorMan]

That's pathetic Korman - how about some discussion?

How about something worth discussing? Crackpot conspiracy theories are great for wasting Web time, but not for serious discussions.

What did happen to the black boxes - the fireservice made a statement saying they had helped recover 3 of the 4 black boxes from the towers - the official report says they were not recovered...

And are you by that "argument" trying to say that the planes that hit the Twin Towers in fact did not do so?

...is that correct or BS?

The plethora of utter crap about 9/11 by looneytoons IS pure BS. And the Internet is a veritable fountainhead of psychoceramic BS.

 

[Rick Deckard]

You're pretty pathetic Korman.

I'm saying no such thing - I'm asking if the black boxes were recovered. How can that possibly be construed as me denying that the planes ever hit the towers.

You are a troll. There is no other reason for you to be posting here.

 

[KorMan]

And of what relevance are the black boxes? Their function is to provide information when researching plane crashes the causes of which are not known. They are of no value whatsoever in determining the cause of the two crashes into the WTC. They were aimed at it by terrorists.

Therefore, the "controversy" about whether the boxes were or were not found in the millions of tons of rubble serves only those zealots to whom there are conspirators lurking behind every bush and under every bed, and who have no lives.

You are a troll.

And you, sir, are incapable of discussion. You are irrelevant and are now on my Ignore list.

BTW, look up synonyms for "pathetic" and put a little variety in your ramblings.

 

[Rick Deckard]

And you, sir, are incapable of discussion. You are irrelevant and are now on my Ignore list.

LOL - you took the words right out of my mouth.

Go and hide under your bridge. Troll.

 

[pixelsmith]

ambushco needs to be tried for conspiracy. simple as that. hell, lets see if we can drag grand poppy prescott into the picture as well.