A Troubling Observation About UFO Reality

[Creepy Green Light]

It's just like the Betty & Barney Hill case. Once you peel back all the layers of the onion, you'll realize this is another garbage case. One to go in the same dumpster as Rex Heflin, Paul Trent, Ed Walters, Billy Meier, George Adamski, The "Guardian", Socorro and probably others.

 

[Burnt State]

I don't automatically reject contactee cases, but I wouldn't waste my time with icke

Out of curiosity which contactee cases resonate with you and why? To claim contact is a profound space, right up there with getting messages from a burning bush. The cohort of abductees & contactees occupy a very unique space in Ufology. They fascinate me the most and I am always interested in how others receive these narratives and why or what credibility is given.

 

[Burnt State]

It's just like the Betty & Barney Hill case. Once you peel back all the layers of the onion, you'll realize this is another garbage case. One to go in the same dumpster as Rex Heflin, Paul Trent, Ed Walters, Billy Meier, George Adamski, The "Guardian", Socorro and probably others.

You damn Socorro as well? The others I understand but why Socorro - what do you see at the centre of that case's layers?

 

[Randall]

It's just like the Betty & Barney Hill case. Once you peel back all the layers of the onion, you'll realize this is another garbage case. One to go in the same dumpster as Rex Heflin, Paul Trent, Ed Walters, Billy Meier, George Adamski, The "Guardian", Socorro and probably others.

What cases stand out in your opinion as non-garbage cases? Is there enough for even a top ten?

 

[Trajanus]

Out of curiosity which contactee cases resonate with you and why?

I'm not sure how contactee and abductee cases are distinguished but the Schirmer, Moody and Hermann cases were interesting to me. Of course KDR has raised doubts about at least one...

To claim contact is a profound space, right up there with getting messages from a burning bush.

But ET is inherently more credible than the supernatural.

 

[Trajanus]

You damn Socorro as well? The others I understand but why Socorro - what do you see at the centre of that case's layers?

Ufology suggested it was just a US experimental craft or lunar lander on a practice run. Maybe CGL accepts the student prank claim, lol.

 

[Trajanus]

What cases stand out in your opinion as non-garbage cases? Is there enough for even a top ten?

Previously he mentioned Coyne and cases investigated by Ted Phillips. No doubt, he'd reject them too if anyone had produced a clear photo in association with those cases. ANY superficial resemblance to a known object sinks any case in his view.

 

[Randall]

Ufology suggested it was just a US experimental craft or lunar lander on a practice run. Maybe CGL accepts the student prank claim, lol.

To be clear about The Socorro Landing Incident. It's not that I've decided that the craft was an LEM type craft. Rather, I'm saying that because we had the technology to build a craft that behaved the way the Socorro craft did, that there's insufficient reason to invoke an alien explanation. So my point is more about the way cases are evaluated rather than a conclusion about the case itself. It might be the case that the Socorro craft was alien. But because we have two clear possibilities, we can't rule either out, and IMO the best cases don't have that particular problem.

 

[Trajanus]

But because we have two clear possibilities, we can't rule either out, and IMO the best cases don't have that particular problem.

I doubt the "student prank" nonsense would've originated had investigators believed an earthly craft was there. After 52 years, there just isn't any documentation or witness testimony. And add Valensole, where clearly alien entities were seen associated with the same kind of craft.

 

[Randall]

I doubt the "student prank" nonsense would've originated had investigators believed an earthly craft was there. After 52 years, there just isn't any documentation or witness testimony. And add Valensole, where clearly alien entities were seen associated with the same kind of craft.

The student prank claim grew out of its own evidence, which if I recall correctly was a letter one of the college professors had written that came to light suggesting the idea. The rest of the reasoning doesn't matter because ultimately, unless we can go back in time and seize the craft and its occupants and verify it came from some alien location, nothing trumps the fact that because we had the capability to create such a craft, that it could have been made by humans, and therefore there's no need to invoke aliens.

 

[Sand]

we had the technology to build a craft that behaved the way the Socorro craft did

Ufology, do you have a reference for the idea that we had such technology? I’ve often heard that, but not seen evidence that we had anything close to that. And even if we did, it would never have been allowed to go winging its way unaccompanied across the countryside.

The actual Lunar Lander was, of course, built to operate in a vacuum and the 1/6 gravity of the moon. The design was far from anything that could have functioned in earth’s atmosphere and gravity. The closest we had were the lunar simulators (LLRV and LLTV) which were incredibly crude and unstable when compared to what was described at Socorro. The first flight of one of these did not take place until more than 6 months after Socorro.

Although these vehicles were state of the art at the time, they were never flown off the base at which they were being tested, were never flown any significant distance horizontally, and always flown in the presence of a monitoring team. At best they could keep one person aloft for not more than 10 minutes. The idea that one of these would have gone flying off across the countryside is beyond consideration. And obviously they had no ability to fly silently. These vehicles were so unstable and dangerous that there was quite a debate within NASA as to whether these vehicles provided sufficient training benefit to justify the risk to the astronauts’ lives.

Of the five LLRV and LLTV built, three crashed. If we had the type of technology in 1964 that was described at Socorro, why were the astronauts lives being risked with the LLTV?

Here is a video of Neil Armstrong being almost killed in a 1968 crash of a LLTV.

 

[marduk]

We've had VTOL aircraft since 1955.
Ryan X-13 Vertijet - Wikipedia

 

[Randall]

Ufology, do you have a reference for the idea that we had such technology?

I'm not saying that the LLRV was the craft in the Socorro UFO report. I don't think it was. However the LLRV does prove the that the technology existed. The six month difference between the Socorro UFO report and the first known test flight of the LLRV is irrelevant to that point. It is still entirely possible that some other secret project we know nothing about is responsible. If a Socorro type craft had been reported back in the 1400s, then that would be another story. But that's not the case here. Always ask the question: Is it reasonable to suggest that we could have built the craft described in the report? Clearly the answer for the Socorro case is "Yes." and there's just no getting around it.

 

[victimized]

I'm not sure how contactee and abductee cases are distinguished but the Schirmer, Moody and Hermann cases were interesting to me. Of course KDR has raised doubts about at least one...



But ET is inherently more credible than the supernatural.

Phenomena, scientific conversion of the nuclear and its cause and effects.

Argument, who is causing the UFO condition.......science is.

Science is unnatural to life on Earth.

Life is a natural state, we procreate the species, we eat, drink and live. Science is an introduced choice of the human males, it is an applied condition of using machines and it then causes the natural states to alter and we get attacked.

Obviously you have been living and accepting science as if it is a natural part of life and have obviously forgotten that it is unnatural.

If you ask yourselves about phenomena, evil spirit manifestation, ancient attacks and advice about the UFO, the information of phenomena cause and effects were already stated.

The human male once existed in a manifested spiritual state on origin Earth, which in origin creation had a larger crystalline fusion. The male wanted to convert his manifesting spiritual presence back into the higher state. Instead he converted himself into a lower state and gained the attack on Earth, his irradiation and cellular conversion into a red celled manifested organic life. Due to the fact that the Earth stone/crystalline body was converted by a heated Sun that changed natural fusion into metals. Earth life was incinerated just as archaeological evidence attests.

Life re-manifested, providing evidence that the theory of evolution is wrong. The theory of evolution is supported by occultists who argue that the atmospheric condition formed the manifestation of a cellular body....rather than a previous existing light spirit who manifested into a lower organic form. (their interpretation of Satan...alien.....and the Christ spirit).

As the Ancient Shaman took the somatic juices of plants, the chemical imbalance that it gave his mind allowed him to review conversion, for he previously existed in the state of being converted himself from a higher light presence into an organic presence. On Earth origin only Nature and the human male manifested into organic life....the female herself had previously manifested, and demanifested.

The reason that modern males believe themselves female and the female male is due to this fact, for he wanted to convert himself back into the higher spirit he witnessed manifesting.....the female and changed natural light sound by his want to swap places. As light sound had already split into PHI, which is why the androgynous spirit manifested into a dual spirit, he caused Pi to be attacked...so Earth as the Pi body converted. The circular body of Earth changed its natural status into a pressurized converted body and shape.

The speaking burning bush is a past life occult attack where the human male was irradiated. Irradiation attacks the brain with burning, like intense prickling, and it also causes stigmata....unnatural bleeding from the organic cellular body. As animals attest, the physical organic attacks on the cells also causes the cellular body to split open as if it has been attacked by a knife. This is why the phenomena of the Christ was personally reviewed as an attack upon the spiritual life and cut by the sun metallic signals. The ancient phenomena advice gives the Christ symbols of swords and knives if you cared to review the literature.

Speaking of spirit is real........as the human mind is aware as causation by brain chemical changes as atmospheric feed back by nature's attack. As the UFO condition does combust/incinerate and explode, the information for conversion is related to human conscious awareness of plant matter. Bushes/trees did previously combust in the irradiation attack, just as they have in modern times. As the human life/conscious awareness is recorded by voice and also image in the atmospheric photon interaction, the feedback of voice heard when the bush burnt is a rational account of the incident when Mt. Sinai gained its blackened face, and Mt. Ararat had an Ark land on it that melted/fused/converted the stone into ballast leaving an Ark impression of stone melt in the ground face.

 

[Burnt State]

But ET is inherently more credible than the supernatural.

I don't see much difference between the Contactee talking about messages from aliens that preach peace and that we need to love one another and a Prophet who was in touch with a god who says you need to preach about peace and loving one another. Same degrees of proof exist for both.

 

[victimized]

I don't see much difference between the Contactee talking about messages from aliens that preach peace and that we need to love one another and a Prophet who was in touch with a god who says you need to preach about peace and loving one another. Same degrees of proof exist for both.

When life is reviewed as owning natural, and then we review the conditions of phenomena.

Who caused phenomena has been the human question.

We review life, life is natural we eat, drink and live. Our brother owns a conscious choice, and as a brotherhood or group of males took over natural life and then began his ownership condition of life. Part of the ownership review is that he invented science and conversion of nuclear fusion.

Life was then attacked by his choice. Therefore there is nothing to review about the alien/UFO condition other than it is unnatural to natural life, for science and conversion is a choice, it is a human applied condition that involves machines. Natural life does not own machines.

The atmosphere also is a natural condition....the organic life form, and earth stone is interacted with the photon condition, and sound/image gets recorded every day.

Depending on the amount of living bodies, depends on how large the atmospheric recordings are. At the moment life has a huge population on Earth, therefore via the condition human awareness is given the feed back advice attack of the alien/UFO attack by population recording.

As the human life/awareness advised itself that science attacked it, that life survival and life continuance on Earth needed to be notified, then it gave its own understanding/awareness the conditions of its advice.

As the ancient occult conversion of Earth's nuclear condition was only applied up until it atmospherically nuked natural life or attacked natural life.....the modern occult applied conditions has allowed the alien condition to have a higher contact interaction with the natural life and mind of humanity. Therefore the past occult attack allowed a more spiritual human mind advice, which is how the story was advised....and the discussion was likened to human spiritual personages...or human prophets/human spirits.

This is due to how the scientific conversion is applied....and how the recorded feed back is advised as advice of presence/image via conditions..........for the ancients did not have nuclear power plants for the resourcing of nuclear fuel. Therefore their spiritual understanding as a human aware mind advice had different owned human aware concepts of spiritual feed back compared to modern life atmospheric fed back awareness involving alien spirits speaking the same advice.

It is obvious when you decide to review data as it exists instead of imposing your own fake values upon the alien/UFO condition.

As human life as personal consciousness/awareness is the Creator/inventor and causer of the phenomena and the attacks as fed back advice, when the human mind/physical self has been attacked enough is when it decides personally to stop the attacks.

Obviously the modern day occult scientists have not been attacked enough themselves and as they already own a mutated mind/DNA mind fed back advice are not as aware as a spiritual mind advice of cell loss and chemical change to the natural life. As ancient information attests, when they do personally get attacked is when they personally decide against the practices of nuclear conversion.

Why is it that the owners/causer of the attacks is the last to take action.....only due to their inherited mind condition as the believer of alien creation.

 

[marduk]

I don't see much difference between the Contactee talking about messages from aliens that preach peace and that we need to love one another and a Prophet who was in touch with a god who says you need to preach about peace and loving one another. Same degrees of proof exist for both.

The ETH doesn't require any magical thinking.

 

[victimized]

The ETH doesn't require any magical thinking.

The human self exists as the human self without owning an imposed singular status, when reviewed does not exist as the whole.

Modern occult scientists have tried to impose singularity as a description of life as if it only exists as data.....such as stating life is DNA.

A human being is a whole presence and owns the condition of DNA, DNA is only information and life is natural as a whole state.

A human owning their natural self in a complete state of self wants to own their own self as if they never existed, so we should ask the valuer of information and applier of singularity why?

It is because he wanted to own personally all other information himself.....yet he only owns his own person.

This is the very reason why our ancient spiritual brother sought out occultists and thinkers of magic and murdered them........ for they have never lived as a rational human life being equal and accepting everything else as equal to his person by using rational thinking.

As I exist in human form at the same time that everything else exists in its own "owned" form, then if I try to own it by valuing it, then I will only be destroyed.

Our brother had this situation brought to his awareness before when he applied occult conversion of matter.

 

[Burnt State]

The ETH doesn't require any magical thinking.

Yes, that's an opinion. For others the very concept of aliens from other worlds visiting here is entirely a magical concept.

 

[marduk]

Yes, that's an opinion. For others the very concept of aliens from other worlds visiting here is entirely a magical concept.

Why? It is entirely in the realm of what we understand of the universe.

God requires faith and a suspension of all we know to be true.

Knowing that there is life out there is just math.