Attention Astrologers: You're All Wrong!

[The Pair of Cats]

It's not a "wobble", it's caused by the precession of the equinox - known by astronomers/astrologers (the distinction has only applied in the past couple of centuries) for millenia. The first comment posted on Gene's link, from Rodsmith, explains the concept pretty much 100%.

Astrology is not about a cluster of stars and never has been: it's about the angle of the ecliptic divided into 12. It makes no difference what stars are in any 30 degree section of the ecliptic. Whether you have researched the subject/believe in it or not, you should know the basic principles involved. The author of this article obviously hasn't got a clue what he is talking about.

And that's the problem Archie. The people who comment on Astrology in the negative have never studied the mechanisms of astrology. They see the horoscopes in their local rag and think they understand it. It doesn't matter if they do or don't. Astrology neither rises or falls due to their opinion, it remains constant with millions of devotees around the world.

We could go on forever posting vids of for vs against Astrology. The pseudsceptics, horrified at their man Shermer receiving a one two punch from a vedic Astrologer, counter with Derren Brown. So what? You will believe what you want to believe.

I never did understand the fascination with Uri Gellar. His claims were/are absolutely ridiculous. Bending spoons, healing small electrical appliances and so forth. A talent for bending spoons is good for only one thing. Getting money off the rubes in a carny sideshow. Of course, he was shown to be a fraud on national television on more than one occasion over the years.

Here is a study of Gellar done by Hal Puthoff and Russel Targ, The co founders of Remote Viewing with Ingo Swann.

 

[Angel of Ioren]

You will believe what you want to believe.

Very right.
If you get something out of thinking astrology works for you, go for it. I used to think it was totally legit. Now, I obviously don't. As House would say, I stopped believing in that when I grew in my curly ones! I think he said that about god, but it applies here too.

 

[ArchieBedford]

Here is a study of Gellar done by Hal Puthoff and Russel Targ, The co founders of Remote Viewing with Ingo Swann.

Geller was tested to exhaustion at SRI and at Ed Mitchell's Institute of Noetic Sciences throughout the 1970s and 1980s under the control of a bunch of skeptics in conditions and procedures which no way could be staged or fixed. He was the real deal: no question. He could do that stuff, maybe still can. He was apparently an abductee with a number of experiences throughout his life, which might give a clue to how the faculties were opened up in the first place.

We're getting off the subject of astrology. The basic point is that the OP was based on ignorance of the subject and the mechanisms involved, and therefore a false premise. You might disprove astrology in various ways (unlikely to convince many, but you can try) but you're not going to disprove anything by getting your facts all wrong.

 

[Kieran]

And here is a counter to show that astrology is a trick more than anything else.

I have watched his show a couple of times, but everyone knows he is just a magician and illusionist. It blocked on copyright grounds in my country, so can't watch the video. It is a TV show it pre-recorded it does go out live every week. It is a controlled setting these tricks are planned well ahead of time. I don't no want the video is showing, so hard for me to comment on it, but if Derren, is doing a live reading in front of this person ya ok, but that can easily be manipulated, and lot of these people picked from the audience to participant may be in on the act for god sake. We don't no enough to know what goes on behind the scenes.

Uri Gellar a man who can bend spoons jeez put a spoon in block of ice-cream a spoon will bend for you. Amazing trick not

 

[Angel of Ioren]

I have watched his show a couple of times, but everyone knows he is just a magician and illusionist. It blocked on copyright grounds in my country, so can't watch the video. It is a TV show it pre-recorded it does go out live every week. It is a controlled setting these tricks are planned well ahead of time. I don't no want the video is showing, so hard for me to comment on it, but if Derren, is doing a live reading in front of this person ya ok, but that can easily be manipulated, and lot of these people picked from the audience to participant may be in on the act for god sake. We don't no enough to know what goes on behind the scenes.

Uri Gellar a man who can bend spoons jeez put a spoon in block of ice-cream a spoon will bend for you. Amazing trick not

Exactly, Derren is a magician. He knows the tricks that people like Gellar use and try their best to pass off as authentic.

 

[Kieran]

Here is a study of Gellar done by Hal Puthoff and Russel Targ, The co founders of Remote Viewing with Ingo Swann.

I watched a few minutes of the part 1 first video. I'm not a fan of Uri Gellar never seen convincing evidence for this person been the real-deal. I was little put off that we can't hear, what is actually taken place in the room. You hear a person narrating everything that is going on in the room allegedly, that is something you have to be weary of!

 

[The Pair of Cats]

Geller was tested to exhaustion at SRI and at Ed Mitchell's Institute of Noetic Sciences throughout the 1970s and 1980s under the control of a bunch of skeptics in conditions and procedures which no way could be staged or fixed. He was the real deal: no question. He could do that stuff, maybe still can. He was apparently an abductee with a number of experiences throughout his life, which might give a clue to how the faculties were opened up in the first place.

We're getting off the subject of astrology. The basic point is that the OP was based on ignorance of the subject and the mechanisms involved, and therefore a false premise. You might disprove astrology in various ways (unlikely to convince many, but you can try) but you're not going to disprove anything by getting your facts all wrong.

Quite right, there is a great deal of ignorance of the subject. As for the subject of twins. Any time difference in the birth of the two will show up in the charts of the individuals, albeit slight. Astrology, in part, is measured in degrees. Each sign being 30 degrees. Also the movement of the planets, measured in degrees. The deviation of just 1 degree can result in the relationship between the planets or aspects, to be totally different.
Personality traits are defined by a few different things. The sign on the ascendant, the sign the moon and mars were in along with the sign the sun was in at the time of birth. The various angles that these planets have to each other and the other planets modifies the resulting analysis. So people born on the same day, same year but different hour can have different personality traits as defined by their chart. Also taken into consideration is the location of the birth and the place or community the person is born in to. Cultural biases and beliefs cannot be discounted.

 

[Kieran]

Exactly, Derren is a magician. He knows the tricks that people like Gellar use and try their best to pass off as authentic.

I don't disagree with you. The video Pair of cats posted in a different thread is a different matter. Skeptics constantly argue people make claims all the time, and their claims can never be tested. But that video was videoed under a controlled setting by a skeptic. I guess nothing will satisfy you, even when evidence appears from your side of the fence.

 

[The Pair of Cats]

Below is a chart compiled for Albert Einstein.


Whilst it is a bit blurry it shows a basic zodiac chart gleaned from software widely used.
The outer ring shows the signs of the various Houses. The ring inside of that shows the various planets and their positions within the houses. The inner and largest circle shows the aspects or angles between the different planets.

 

[Sean Elifritz]

Very right.
If you get something out of thinking astrology works for you, go for it. I used to think it was totally legit. Now, I obviously don't. As House would say, I stopped believing in that when I grew in my curly ones! I think he said that about god, but it applies here too.

Seriously? You really thought astrology was legitimate at one time? Goodness, even when I was a kid I put no stock into it. How can you be so extreme in one direction and then suddenly go hard to the other?

Gotta' say though I don't like being accused all of a sudden of being a Leo. Not that I believe this stuff for a minute but perhaps by lucky coincidence when I look at what my sign allegedly was for years now, Virgo, I feel it fits me much better than Leo, what this report says I really am, does.

 

[ArchieBedford]

Below is a chart compiled for Albert Einstein.

The house positions of his planets would be a little different had the astrologer calculating the chart employed the equal house system - i.e. Uranus in 2nd, Moon in 5th and a ton of planetary placings in the 9th house (including the Sun) instead of the tenth. More Einstein's true character, I think.It's hard using the Placidean house system for births well away from the Equator.

 

[MVoltage]

So they didn't see this one in the stars then? Oh no....of course not......the stars were not working right.....

["Stop being so flippant, MVoltage"....Ed]

 

[ArchieBedford]

Seriously? You really thought astrology was legitimate at one time?

As with so many things Eddie, it depends how deeply and how long you study it. You might be surprised, if you gave it the effort and time, to learn why so many millions have valued it for so many millennia. People are generally not deluded on this scale. Unfortunately, most people have neither the time nor motivation to look into the subject with the correct skeptical rigor and make judgments on the strength of little or no investigation.

 

[Angel of Ioren]

@ wickerman
I wasn't too clear I guess. This was a time when I also thought a guy in a red suit came through the chimney and gave me a Dinobot for christmas.

 

[Sean Elifritz]

@ wickerman
I wasn't too clear I guess. This was a time when I also thought a guy in a red suit came through the chimney and gave me a Dinobot for christmas.

I never believed that one either. Guess my skeptical side got going at a younger age than yours did.

 

[Angel of Ioren]

Some children are more easily fooled than others I guess. The same goes for adults judging by some of the posts in this thread.

 

[Kieran]

Some children are more easily fooled than others I guess. The same goes for adults judging by some of the posts in this thread.

I give up pointless no offence Angel. We get called crazy all the time, but sometimes I wonder about the sanity on the other side.

 

[Sean Elifritz]

Well, regardless of what's real and what isn't, who's right and who's wrong, I'm sticking with Virgo. Been a Virgo for 38 years and have gotten use to it. Don't want some smartass emerging out of nowhere to tell me I'm a damned Leo anymore than I want someone telling me my first name is actually something else. Ya' just get accustomed to certain things. And when I look at Virgo, whether by pure coincidence or not, that fits me a hell of a lot better than Leo.

 

[trainedobserver]

People are generally not deluded on this scale.

You might want to think about that one.

How many people have bathed and drank from the filthy Ganges river which is full of the bloated corpses of humans and animals thinking they would be blessed for doing so?

 

[ArchieBedford]

You might want to think about that one.

How many people have bathed and drank from the filthy Ganges river which is full of the bloated corpses of humans and animals thinking they would be blessed for doing so?

Sure TO, people believe some weird shit. It's sad.

We're not talking about belief. We're talking about studying something in depth, over a long period of time, with a skeptical attitude and from initial incredulity. I can have my mind changed by evidence, if the evidence is compelling enough at a deep level of study. For me, eventually it was.