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Invisible Empire

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Probably so, UNLESS they can destroy our economy first, which they are very close to doing.

The Banking Elite in certain countries caused this Economic recession Pixel. The US, UK, Spanish, and Irish Governments a few examples, never regulated or supervised the Banking system correctly and Guildlines and Rules therefore were never followed to the letter of the law. What would Have been the adequate response here for Governments to adopt once the crisis happened "fix the system that is broken" but No the Taxpayer was asked to carry the burden ( not asked to vote on it mind you)
Democracy?

What happened was Governments bailed out a flawed banking system with my hard earned Euro and your Tax Dollar Pixel for what. What gain has there been for the average citizen? There is average Citizens today who have lost there Jobs and unfortunately may not be able to afford their mortgage shortly. Are people that naive and find it ok that Banks after causing this mess should decide still and when and who should be thrown out on to the streets?

Banks after all have caused the increase in Houses prices in the last few decades. Like For Christ sakes a house is only Blocks and cement. Human beings are more important then making money.

I'm with Pixel here when it comes to this. There is a class divide and it is blatant and obvious and the elite who are elected to care for the average Citizen haven't help us one bit since this crisis occurred and if people can not see this, then take your head out of your backside and look around you.
 
This ain't a conspiracy. Certain privately owned large Bank's around the World in fact twisted the arms of a number of Sovereign, independent and Citizen elected Governments. With a policy "That if you don't gives us the money/ we will bring the whole banking system crashing down. That is a fact it occurred not in the distant past but recently 2008. I would consider this Blackmail/ no matter how good the intentions( laughable) I would consider the people who Run the largest Banks and have a important say in how thing get run to be a Cabal. It's obvious there is a number of well placed individuals calling the shots here guys and girls. Not elected Governments elected by the Ballot box so to speak.

Ummm ... I would call that a criminal conspiracy to keep control in certain hands and to control money supply ... :cool:.
 
That made me laugh, thanks.
Nothing against you pixel, but that was a funny. I won't hold it against you that you think this is a documentary.

no problem Angel.
jose - instead of playing circus music why not indicate the errors? lets pick this thing apart. cue Jeopardy music.
 
It can be 100% factually accurate and still be wrong. You could demonstrably prove I had eggs, flour and water but that wouldn't automatically mean I was baking a cake.
 

Mr Jones in fact 10 minutes or more into this particular documentary. Actually began advertising believe or not lol. The Documentary ( Invisible Empire) contained lot of speculation and speeches( Given by V.I.P's from around the World. These speeches also were completely taken out of context to put across a particular viewpoint.
That A New World Order was coming soon to a place near you. The maker of the video shouldn't have done that was a big mistake.

But for me, it wasn't a entirely bogus Documentary but speculation indeed overwhelmed the facts here so the Documentary achieved little for me personally.
 
The Banking Elite in certain countries caused this Economic recession Pixel. The US, UK, Spanish, and Irish Governments a few examples, never regulated or supervised the Banking system correctly and Guildlines and Rules therefore were never followed to the letter of the law. What would Have been the adequate response here for Governments to adopt once the crisis happened "fix the system that is broken" but No the Taxpayer was asked to carry the burden ( not asked to vote on it mind you)
Democracy?

What happened was Governments bailed out a flawed banking system with my hard earned Euro and your Tax Dollar Pixel for what. What gain has there been for the average citizen? There is average Citizens today who have lost there Jobs and unfortunately may not be able to afford their mortgage shortly. Are people that naive and find it ok that Banks after causing this mess should decide still and when and who should be thrown out on to the streets?

Banks after all have caused the increase in Houses prices in the last few decades. Like For Christ sakes a house is only Blocks and cement. Human beings are more important then making money.

I'm with Pixel here when it comes to this. There is a class divide and it is blatant and obvious and the elite who are elected to care for the average Citizen haven't help us one bit since this crisis occurred and if people can not see this, then take your head out of your backside and look around you.


Kieran,

Thanks for the post. I personally agree with much of what you wrote.

At the heart of it we are all responsible for the financial crisis. Banks and mortgage brokers were pushing out subprime and Alt-A mortgages which they knew that the borrowers could never service -- they were happy to get the origination volume with the knowledge that they could securitize the loans and onsell them to institutional fixed income investors (as well as Fannie and Freddie). The institutional investors, which included other banks (different departments internally), failed to do basic due diligence because they were getting the yields they required for their investors. The investment banks were happy to securitize these loans without the proper diligence and disclosure given the fees they were earning, and the internal mindset that "whistleblowers" aren't to be tolerated given that they kill deal fees.

Regulators did a horrible job regulating the banks, including sales practices, as well as ensuring that the banks maintained the proper capital levels to conduct business (look at the tangible common ratios of the banks in the U.K., for example). The mortgage brokers, which pushed the majority of these loans out the door, weren't even regulated. Let's not forget that in the U.S. there were public policies that supported loans being made to individuals who otherwise could not get those loans, in an effort to advance home ownership -- but without the proper underlying personal income to service the loan once rates would go up, which inevitably they would. This public policy initiative was supported by the government in part by the requirements put on Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac to buy these toxic loans and securitized securities to create a liquid secondary market for these questionable loans. Fannie and Freddie now hold more of this toxic waste than anyone -- by a country mile -- and the taxpayers on the hook.

Let's not forget the borrowers, who were taking out loans that they likely knew that they couldn't service long term. Yes, there were issues about disclosure from loan officers, but I have trouble seeing how zero equity loans with low teaser rates of interest wouldn't set off warning bells with the average citizen. It was cheaper to buy a house with these terms, rather to rent, and if things went belly up, you could always walk away from the property. There were also the speculators and local retail property developers, who made millions by the excessive use of leverage.

Finally, don't forget the government (more than the Federal Reserve), which kept interest rates low for a very long period of time. This is good politics, and served as a means to enhance the well being of the middle and lower classes who were seeing their earning power eroded given global economic trends (manufacturing jobs going to China, for example). How many people had the discipline to live within their means?

This was a complex problem with no easy solution. The banking industry had to be supported, or else the whole economy would have really been in trouble, although in theory letting foolish businesses fail is probably a good thing. Problem is there were multiple parties who made mistakes. The proverbial comedy of errors.

Tom
 
jose - instead of playing circus music why not indicate the errors? lets pick this thing apart. cue Jeopardy music.

Wow...I didn't realise I had to indicate any errors. Personally, I don't give a shit about how many errors there are. There could be a million. There could be none. That doesn't stop this work of fiction from being bullshit.
 
This was a complex problem with no easy solution. The banking industry had to be supported, or else the whole economy would have really been in trouble, although in theory letting foolish businesses fail is probably a good thing. Problem is there were multiple parties who made mistakes. The proverbial comedy of errors.

People shouting "Let them fail!" seem to think that any bank or business is like any other. They're not.

Try thinking of it like this: Imagine businesses are rocks and the global economy is your head. If a business fails, the rock drops on your head. On this scale, a mom-n-pop type store is therefore roughly the size of a grain of cat litter. AIG is roughly the size of a buick. If you still think it was smarter to let them fail, odds are you've already experienced the real-life version of this analogy...
 
Kieran,

Thanks for the post. I personally agree with much of what you wrote.

At the heart of it we are all responsible for the financial crisis. Banks and mortgage brokers were pushing out subprime and Alt-A mortgages which they knew that the borrowers could never service -- they were happy to get the origination volume with the knowledge that they could securitize the loans and onsell them to institutional fixed income investors (as well as Fannie and Freddie). The institutional investors, which included other banks (different departments internally), failed to do basic due diligence because they were getting the yields they required for their investors. The investment banks were happy to securitize these loans without the proper diligence and disclosure given the fees they were earning, and the internal mindset that "whistleblowers" aren't to be tolerated given that they kill deal fees.

Regulators did a horrible job regulating the banks, including sales practices, as well as ensuring that the banks maintained the proper capital levels to conduct business (look at the tangible common ratios of the banks in the U.K., for example). The mortgage brokers, which pushed the majority of these loans out the door, weren't even regulated. Let's not forget that in the U.S. there were public policies that supported loans being made to individuals who otherwise could not get those loans, in an effort to advance home ownership -- but without the proper underlying personal income to service the loan once rates would go up, which inevitably they would. This public policy initiative was supported by the government in part by the requirements put on Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac to buy these toxic loans and securitized securities to create a liquid secondary market for these questionable loans. Fannie and Freddie now hold more of this toxic waste than anyone -- by a country mile -- and the taxpayers on the hook.

Let's not forget the borrowers, who were taking out loans that they likely knew that they couldn't service long term. Yes, there were issues about disclosure from loan officers, but I have trouble seeing how zero equity loans with low teaser rates of interest wouldn't set off warning bells with the average citizen. It was cheaper to buy a house with these terms, rather to rent, and if things went belly up, you could always walk away from the property. There were also the speculators and local retail property developers, who made millions by the excessive use of leverage.

Finally, don't forget the government (more than the Federal Reserve), which kept interest rates low for a very long period of time. This is good politics, and served as a means to enhance the well being of the middle and lower classes who were seeing their earning power eroded given global economic trends (manufacturing jobs going to China, for example). How many people had the discipline to live within their means?

This was a complex problem with no easy solution. The banking industry had to be supported, or else the whole economy would have really been in trouble, although in theory letting foolish businesses fail is probably a good thing. Problem is there were multiple parties who made mistakes. The proverbial comedy of errors.

Tom

Thanks Tom. Your Post explained the situation adequately. I have no problems with what you've posted here:)

Actually something came to me just there. I think one of the problems for me was the "Reaction from the Banks after the Crisis happened. There was no sincere apologise, and the same old practices that went before never changed. World wide economies are still suffering one to two years after the crisis even after all the Bailouts. What is going on here? Where has all this money gone?
I do understand your point Tom. There was no possible way any serious Government could allow their particular Banking system to fail, but something doesn't feel right to me here. I think crimes were indeed committed here and we can't get away from that fact Tom.
The Rich are not beyond the law in my book.
 
Thanks Tom. Your Post explained the situation adequately. I have no problems with what you've posted here:)

Actually something came to me just there. I think one of the problems for me was the "Reaction from the Banks after the Crisis happened. There was no sincere apologise, and the same old practices that went before never changed. World wide economies are still suffering one to two years after the crisis even after all the Bailouts. What is going on here? Where has all this money gone?
I do understand your point Tom. There was no possible way any serious Government could allow their particular Banking system to fail, but something doesn't feel right to me here. I think crimes were indeed committed here and we can't get away from that fact Tom.
The Rich are not beyond the law in my book.

Senior management at some institutions have demonstrated contrition, but you probably won't see very many criminal charges. Oftentimes it was incompetency and greed within the bounds of the law -- but not the bounds of morality -- which was at play. The current SEC action against Goldman Sachs may herald in a wave of lawsuits against investment banks, which are recording strong profits after being supported during the crisis (given their thin capital levels and dependence on liquidity from the wholesale markets, they would have been the first to go, like Bear Stearns and Lehman). For commercial banking, the real debate centers on the larger players being "too big to fail" and how to circumvent the power this provides them. No easy answer, quite frankly, although they may be able to be restructured internally to allow bankrupt subsidiaries to go under without taking down the entire institution.

Ironically, the U.S. government is making money on its investments (support for) some of its bailed out institutions! Oftentimes the best time for a government to invest in financial services is during a time of distress.
 
China has the US in handcuffs, think of them dumping every dollar asset now.

Actually, the U.S. got China over the proverbial barrel. They absolutely depend on the U.S. as an export market, without which they face significant internal social dislocation, reverting to historical norms. Yes, they can try to unload their Treasury holdings, but that will not threaten the U.S.'s social stability, like a trade embargo would for China.

Most strategic thinkers and market participants believe China blows up within this decade given its extraordinary growth over the past 25 years. The macro-economic numbers are also probably cooked: a consistent 9% GDP growth with only 2% inflation. Why do you think that all the banks are now rapidly raising capital, including an abruptly re-commenced IPO by Agricultural Bank of China? Some argue that the Chinese authorities see another financial crisis immediately over the horizon.
 
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