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The Internet was created by DARPA (ARPANET) in the United States of America and was originally only for government use. When it was "released to the general public" for web development, my guess is that we're in the same general area as approving certain frequencies for broadcast by radio stations

Sometimes I just hate myself for being so picky, especially since I agree with you that this whole 'controversy' is silly. So I don't blame you if you roll your eyes on this and think it pedantic, but (ahem) (1) There is no content regulation on the Internet as a whole, though some governments may impose filtering restrictions. There is no US governmental agency that rules the net. That's not to say you can't get busted for child porn or sued by the RIAA for downloading music, that can happen anywhere. (2) The Internet was not released to the general public for 'web development.' Though not as pervasive as today, the general public had access to the Internet way before the web was even invented. We used gophers for file content, ftp for transferring files, telnet to get from one computer to the other, and usually something like Pine for email. The 'web' is a relatively recent addition. Some people are nostalgic enough to think it was better then.

In terms of this ad, good Lord, get over it. If you paid for this content, they might not need to have advertisements. But you didn't, so you really don't have a say. If you don't like it, talk with your feet and walk away.
 
And, my discussion of this particular angle has nothing to do with a "Panicy Pete" scenario. I don't see why anyone would get freaked out over a storable food commercial. I think the whole thing is silly.

It's not the product, it's the tone. Long term storable food is a fine product I'm sure but the "RUN FOR YOUR SHELTERS!!!" sales pitch is a bit over the top.

If you don't get what the fuss is about, here it is in a nutshell: us loyal paracast fans love us some paracast because it's just about the ONLY responsible paranormal show out there. Having ads that sound like they should be running on C2C or Alex Jones on the paracast is... unsettling.
 
8)
It's not the product, it's the tone. Long term storable food is a fine product I'm sure but the "RUN FOR YOUR SHELTERS!!!" sales pitch is a bit over the top.

If you don't get what the fuss is about, here it is in a nutshell: us loyal paracast fans love us some paracast because it's just about the ONLY responsible paranormal show out there. Having ads that sound like they should be running on C2C or Alex Jones on the paracast is... unsettling.

Thank god for the Capn ... another fine post :)

Is it me or are some people not getting this point no matter we try to nutcracker it home??? This is really becoming a rather large thread over something that I thought was a no-brainer ... to some extent. Still that is only my opinion ... 8)
 
Thank god for the Capn ... another fine post :)

Is it me or are some people not getting this point no matter we try to nutcracker it home??? This is really becoming a rather large thread over something that I thought was a no-brainer ... to some extent.

Thanks! Devil's advocate is my main line but I moonlight as a distiller/translator of ideas. I often find I have to figure out just where the other guy is coming from to understand exactly why it is he doesn't understand me. Then I can explain it to him in terms he'll hopefully understand. I think I'm getting better at it...

schtick ... really starting to think that the Paracast discussion forums are maybe not for him (again only my opinion, folks).

Oh come on... we both know you're not going anywhere. Besides who'll be around to comment on my various witty remarks? Aaron can't be online ALL the time... can he?
 
Sometimes I just hate myself for being so picky, especially since I agree with you that this whole 'controversy' is silly. So I don't blame you if you roll your eyes on this and think it pedantic, but (ahem) (1) There is no content regulation on the Internet as a whole, though some governments may impose filtering restrictions. There is no US governmental agency that rules the net. That's not to say you can't get busted for child porn or sued by the RIAA for downloading music, that can happen anywhere. (2) The Internet was not released to the general public for 'web development.' Though not as pervasive as today, the general public had access to the Internet way before the web was even invented. We used gophers for file content, ftp for transferring files, telnet to get from one computer to the other, and usually something like Pine for email. The 'web' is a relatively recent addition. Some people are nostalgic enough to think it was better then.

In terms of this ad, good Lord, get over it. If you paid for this content, they might not need to have advertisements. But you didn't, so you really don't have a say. If you don't like it, talk with your feet and walk away.

Okay, now you're being super-nit picky and semantic. And a bit sad, really.

I put the part about The Internet being released to the general public for web development in quotes expressly so that it would be understood that I was generalizing. You've now taken it totally out of context and are showing off. I should have guessed you were going to pick up that stick and proceed to beat around the bush with it.

Here are the facts:

The Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency (DARPA) is an agency of the United States Department of Defense responsible for the development of new technology for use by the military.

DARPA developed the Internet. I've been to the Computer History Museum in Mountain View, CA, and seen the developers' photos and read their biographies, although I don't remember their names. I'm sure you'll help me with that.

http://www.isoc.org/internet/history/cerf.shtml

Later, HTTP and the protocols for developing the web were created, and the Internet became available for use by the general public when previously, it wasn't.

Furthermore, the government HAS, in fact, restricted the use of the Internet, along with Google; the Chinese government has restricted many parts of access to the Internet to Chinese citizens (called "The Great Firewall of China"), and have also done so in the United States. In schools, for one.

From a 2006 post by Jeremy Reimer, "Stung by criticism after an MSN blog was pulled that contained criticism of the Chinese government, Microsoft has responded with an official press release outlining company policy on any future incidents of this nature.
The company will now only remove access to blog content when it receives a legally binding notice [emphasis mine] (such as a court order) from the government indicating that the material contravenes local laws, and will only block access from users inside the country in question. In addition, users that have been blocked from content will be informed of the reasons for the restrictions."

I was around when all but the very beginning of this was going on. Although (again) I AM NOT AN EXPERT, my father has been a computer science professor all of my life, and I grew up with a much better working knowledge of what was going on in computers and networking than most kids did.

I'm thoroughly familiar with Gopher, FTP, Fetch, and the pre (and post) web protocols like the Usenet, because I not only used them, but helped run a BBS. One of the reasons that many are nostalgic for this time is that if the government did (hypothetically) shut down the free web, we would have very little recourse, and most of the people that blog and email and use the net these days would have no idea what to do. This is a pretty common conspiracy theory that is being bandied about these days--that might signal the Orwellian crackdown that the patriot groups are expecting along with martial law and FEMA camps.

In fact, there ARE computer crimes divisions in various departments of the government (see the great book The Hacker Crackdown by Bruce Sterling for details) that have authority over the Internet. (I think "rule the Internet" is a horrible choice of words.) While it's left largely to the private sector (eBay is expected to regulate itself, et al) to self-police, the same segments of society that police the offline also do so in the online world (FBI, police departments, local, county, state, federal, etc.).

Of course there are divisions of the alphabet agencies whose sole purpose is to deal with people that abuse the system (from the earliest phone phreaks and people that were looking around in the phone system to Gary McKinnon, and the nefarious hackers that sell State secrets to foreign governments in between), many of these agencies had to develop as the new technology developed, and which ones had jurisdiction over these crimes changed hands as laws were passed, since the law enforcement side of it was generally behind the curve of the criminal element of it.

This is stuff that most of us already know.

The way the free web was let to develop (see the Clean Slate Project) required that once people started screwing around with it and trying to test the boundaries of it, somebody had to deal with it. So, government on all levels stepped up to the plate and developed their own ways of doing so. So, yes, there is absolutely regulation of the Internet (after the fact, largely, rather than before, which is what we think of when we hear the word regulation, especially in terms of broadcast regulation).

Those are the facts. If you want to argue with my interpretation of the facts, please, feel free. Knock yourself out.
 
I bought a bunch of dried food last month expecting an economic shitstorm.

Glad I stocked up.
 
Thanks! Devil's advocate is my main line ...
Oh come on... we both know you're not going anywhere. Besides who'll be around to comment on my various witty remarks? Aaron can't be online ALL the time... can he?

Devils Advocaat ... hmmm ... kind of catchy :D (know where you're coming from though :))

Oh yeah, I know. I deleted said comment from my post just now. It was a bit silly in retrospect since this is one of the few places where I can get reasonably sane paranormal/whatever news and comment. So yeah ... not really leaving here ... not just yet anyway :D
 
schticknz,

Listen, you're certainly entitled to your opinion regarding our advertisers, our content, our attitudes, whatever, but meanwhile, we're spending a significant amount of money on bandwidth, hosting, time and all the stuff that lets us get the show on the air. These guys provide a valuable service, the rep of their product is good, and quite frankly, the text of the commercial is pretty low key, there's nothing in there that says "BUY OUR FOOD OR DIE!". I really don't understand why your reaction is so negative, but as I've stated, I personally don't see any major issue here, neither does Gene. We're not going to let arms suppliers take out commercials for their weapons, no Army/Navy/Air Force recruitment ads, nothing that takes people's lives. This company advertises FOOD. Let's get some perspective here, OK?

dB
 
My guess, and I think it's been mentioned previously, is that there might be some sort of cultural - UK vs US at the very least - issue here (although I'm not sure where schticknz is from so perhaps I'm wrong). Although I could care less where people horde their nuts, I think this is an ad which rings certain alarm bells in some quarters, even if it is only for powdered milk and dried fruit!

That aside, my sense is that people aren't really concerned about the ad itself, they're concerned more about how it reflects on the Paracast (presumably no bad thing?) Obviously if you have a particular need for this type of service or at least are used to ads of this nature you're probably wondering what all the fuss is about (and to be honest, looking at the way people in New Orleans were treated during Katrina if I lived there I'd probably have these guys on speed dial.)
 
WHAT? WHAT? WHAT?!? WTF?!?!?

The guy says that things are getting weird, and you should have some emergency food supplies on hand. That's the ad. Nothing more. That's it.

Where's the outrage? Where's the freakout?

I don't get it folks, I guess I'm not that BATSHITINSANE yet.

dB
 
Well, I can only speak for myself, but the underlying theme seems to me to smack of paranoia and manipulation. I don't think anyone needs a history lesson from me about where fear, uncertainty and manipulation of public perception has led us over the past few years.

Obviously equating an ad for people who want to stock up on frozen peas with the global political situation is something of a stretch, but if you want to know why it leaves a sour taste in the mouth there you have it. Personally I'm not offended by the ad at all, I just find it somewhat ridiculous. If it pays your hosting bills, good on you, I'm probably guilty of worse.
 
Is it me or are some people not getting this point no matter we try to nutcracker it home??? This is really becoming a rather large thread over something that I thought was a no-brainer ... to some extent. Still that is only my opinion ...
cool.gif

Its you....
 
I have to admit I found the ad troubling, and I don't think I'm being precious about this. What struck me was the pretended certainty of the statements about what will happen in the future: these are things which are currently unknowable, so the ad comes across as a cynical attempt by eFoods Direct to cash in on the gullibility of the uninformed and easily alarmed. While a cynic might argue that that's what all commerce is about, it does strike me as being uncomfortably close to scaring the village idiot out of his last dollar.
 
You put it a lot better than I did, Kevin, thank you!

David - this is (I think) constructive criticism, at least that's the way it's intended.
 
The guy says that things are getting weird, and you should have some emergency food supplies on hand. That's the ad. Nothing more. That's it.

Where's the outrage? Where's the freakout?

I don't get it folks, I guess I'm not that BATSHITINSANE yet.

dB

One more time: it's the tone, not the content, THE TONE. Maybe it really is an amero-centric cultural thing. To be clear, the tone of this ad sounds like overly paranoid, deliverance-cabin-in-the-woods level survivalist spookage to the rest of us. Maybe you're just acclimatized to it? I'll let you decide whether or not that's a good thing.

You are clearly batshitinsane however. You'd have to be, you do a weekly radio show on the paranormal where you have to deal with the likes of Paola Harris and then log onto the boards where you have to deal with the rest of us all for no pay and no pension. You're telling me that's sane? Not a chance.
 
You are clearly batshitinsane however. You'd have to be, you do a weekly radio show on the paranormal where you have to deal with the likes of Paola Harris and then log onto the boards where you have to deal with the rest of us all for no pay and no pension. You're telling me that's sane? Not a chance.

That's a damned good point. Alright, bring me my straightjacket!

dB
 
I'm not knocking the needed ad revenue your show may need. Although the emergency food supply may suit some natural disaster prone States. As a demographic consumer retailer group, besides those with a bunker in there back yard in the more extreme example.


I am curious as to what states would not be "natural disaster prone"?
I cannot think of a state that is not vulnerable to at least one type of event such as earthquakes (New Madrid fault comes to mind), floods, tornadoes (Riverside, CA last year), blizzards, hurricanes, high winds that spread fires, volcanic activity (how many volcanoes are in the NW?). Just exactly where is the state that is not "natural disaster prone"?
I see no problem with this type of advertiser. We have already seen by way of Katrina that you had better not expect the Feds to come help you in case of disaster. You need to take care of your own family.:confused:
 
Its you....

Well looking at some of the posts I shall take that as a plural "you" then.

See CapnG, see KevinDaly, see Macavity ... hopefully I'm not just reading things into their posts and I can quote them as being in the same frame of mind as me on this things.

[if I am please, CapnG, KevinDaly and Macavity ... please let me know]

schtick
 
schticknz,​


Listen, you're certainly entitled to your opinion ...​

dB​

dB ... my opinion is somewhat negative since I've heard their truly awful fearmongering ads in the past, and they really made me feel uncomfortable. In my mind, they were trying to extract money from people from pure fear of the not so distant future, and I just find that really objectionable and to put it bluntly, immoral (things are not black and white of course but I feel they were more towards the immoral side than the moral side).

This is the same reason why I gave up listening to Alex Jones after two weeks. Its not constructive (although ironically what they are selling probably is), and it adds to the terrible air of fear that was ramped up after 9/11.

I have nothing against storable food or ads usually. I find efoodsdirect though ... [arrghh :D trying to extract a cogent argument or even a sentence that makes any sense is real hard sometimes :D] ... I don't know ... suspicious (?? ... does that go too far) ... and I feel that this might taint The Paracast somehow.

As somethings are sometimes, its a gut thing, and my gut is telling me at the moment that this is not good ... although of course it may be food poisoning :eek:

Anyway, I think I've made more than enough comments about this now, so I shall shut the heck up, and go and listen to this weeks episode. As always I shall fast forward through the ads. As I've said before, you can only listen to the Rockoids ad so much before one's brain melts :D.

All the best

schtick
 
Hi All,

On a lighter note aren't you glad Gene & David I initially broached this topic? (I can picture David with a IRC Trout ready to lay the smack down on me) :p

Perhaps to liven up the commercial portion that Gene is reading from his script on eFoods Direct. Have David casually being heard in the background munching on potato chips asking Gene for one of eFood Directs candy/granola bars.

That could inject some levity into the commercial. ;)
 
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