Really interesting Climate Change Data

[plumbbob12]

Alexei Dmitriev and others have discovered and published in Nature, which is a good journal that the solar system is going through an "energy cloud" of some sort, and might increase earth quakes, and all kinds of weird stuff. very interesting. here is a link: http://www.solar-storm-warning.com/

PB

 

[trainedobserver]

The climate changed this morning and I had to wear a jacket. Curse the Industrial Revolution!

 

[plumbbob12]

Train. Good one. Only one small point to make, and I am not trying to be a smarty-boots. Climate is not Weather. Climate is the historic study of changes of weather over time. Weather is what is happening right now. Peace PB

 

[pixelsmith]

Train. Good one. Only one small point to make, and I am not trying to be a smarty-boots. Climate is not Weather. Climate is the historic study of changes of weather over time. Weather is what is happening right now. Peace PB

We should not even be having this discussion. According to John Holdren, Obama's chief science advisor, we all died over 10 years ago from starvation brought on by an ice age. All he did was prove climate does in fact change naturally and humans have nothing to do with statistically significant warming or cooling of the planet.

 

[trainedobserver]

Train. Good one. Only one small point to make, and I am not trying to be a smarty-boots. Climate is not Weather. Climate is the historic study of changes of weather over time. Weather is what is happening right now. Peace PB

Don't try to confuse me with facts fella! (removes jacket and mops brow)

If we study the historic changes in weather over time don't we see many cycles of extreme temperature swings throughout the history of the Earth? Of course we do. What we need to do as a species is to make plans and develop technologies that DEAL WITH THE REALITY of cyclic climate change REGARDLESS of what we think the current cause may or may not be. We can argue about the cause up until we're all dog paddling and fighting over the last can of Alpo but I'm here to tell you unless we prepare to simply DEAL WITH IT we accomplish nothing. Pissing and moaning and self righteous finger pointing has accomplished what so far?

 

[pixelsmith]

Pissing and moaning and self righteous finger pointing has accomplished what so far?

Well, Al Gore and his ilk got plenty of cash from it. That was the only "green" objective he had in mind any way.

 

[plumbbob12]

Trained-ob: I could not agree more. I have written about climate change and likened it to your house being on fire. The first thing we need to do is put out the fire. Then we can argue over who, and how it started. Of course that analogy goes only so far as it relates to climate change, because we have to get everyone on board to stop pumping out all the green house gases. But as I have said before, and still think is correct, I think we have passed the point of no return, and we can only limit the damage at this point. Lastly, we can do nothing about our solar system going through this energy cloud, which could last thousands of years. Unfortunately, I think a lot of the human population will go away. Hopefully I am wrong. PB
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[Sean Elifritz]

Trained-ob: I could not agree more. I have written about climate change and likened it to your house being on fire. The first thing we need to do is put out the fire. Then we can argue over who, and how it started. Of course that analogy goes only so far as it relates to climate change, because we have to get everyone on board to stop pumping out all the green house gases. But as I have said before, and still think is correct, I think we have passed the point of no return, and we can only limit the damage at this point. Lastly, we can do nothing about our solar system going through this energy cloud, which could last thousands of years. Unfortunately, I think a lot of the human population will go away. Hopefully I am wrong. PB
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To liken it to a house on fire is almost certainly an exaggeration. But anyway, unless you can get EVERYONE on board the only thing the measures you speak of are going to accomplish is further bankrupting westernized countries and putting many thousands of people out of work. Now, I might be swayed otherwise if you can get the Chinese, Indians, and Mexicans to agree to do all of these things in their countries. Furthermore, convince South Americans to stop burning down the rain forest to make way for new grazing land and begin replanting in areas they've already destroyed (This is by far the most important step to halting the problem). If those things can be accomplished then true change might be possible. But skipping those steps while putting all of your attention on other ones (Western nations) is like trying to put out the fire you alluded to by pissing on it.

 

[pixelsmith]

Trained-ob: I could not agree more. I have written about climate change and likened it to your house being on fire. The first thing we need to do is put out the fire. Then we can argue over who, and how it started. Of course that analogy goes only so far as it relates to climate change, because we have to get everyone on board to stop pumping out all the green house gases. But as I have said before, and still think is correct, I think we have passed the point of no return, and we can only limit the damage at this point. Lastly, we can do nothing about our solar system going through this energy cloud, which could last thousands of years. Unfortunately, I think a lot of the human population will go away. Hopefully I am wrong. PB
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What "fire" are you proposing to put out? What "greenhouse gas" are you so fearful of? And what makes you think we have passed some sort of point of no return?

 

[trainedobserver]

There are laws against yelling "Fire" in a crowded theater you know.

 

[dyingsun]

The simple point here seems to be, human life on this planet creates pollution. I hope no one debates that.

 

[bgudeman]

Weather control starts with H.A.A.R.P. and when they want change it will happen. Look up in the sky and take you head out of the computer screen.

 

[Angel of Ioren]

The simple point here seems to be, human life on this planet creates pollution. I hope no one debates that.

If someone argues that, he or she is high. I think the main point of contention is that most climate scientists agree that the pollution we are causing is changing the climate, more so than what is believed to be the natural cycle of the earth. They have found a correlation between the two that seems to indicate causation as well. However, there are some that think the data is flawed. Unfortunately, politics seems to determine where many people stand in this argument, not science - and that goes for both sides of the argument.

---------- Post added at 10:15 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:12 PM ----------

Weather control starts with H.A.A.R.P. and when they want change it will happen. Look up in the sky and take you head out of the computer screen.

Really? That's up there with the moon landing hoax as one of the most far fetched conspiracy theories.

 

[NTS]

"WHERE the plans are for adapting and benefitting from this theoretical global warming scenario? "

http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2008/11/sea-change/7072/

Countries bordering the Arctic Ocean are scrambling to assert territorial claims that will be useful for port facilities and resources as the polar icecap melts.

 

[trainedobserver]

The simple point here seems to be, human life on this planet creates pollution. I hope no one debates that.

After reading some of your posts I'd say it's undeniable. I joke. You rock.

I think the main point of contention is that most climate scientists agree that the pollution we are causing is changing the climate, more so than what is believed to be the natural cycle of the earth.

Ok. I give. Uncle. What do we do?

 

[pixelsmith]

"WHERE the plans are for adapting and benefitting from this theoretical global warming scenario? "

http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2008/11/sea-change/7072/

I am not sure what your point is with this link.

 

[cottonzway]

I'm probably just going to rant and rave at people so I'll pass on this thread....for now.

 

[Sean Elifritz]

If someone argues that, he or she is high. I think the main point of contention is that most climate scientists agree that the pollution we are causing is changing the climate, more so than what is believed to be the natural cycle of the earth. They have found a correlation between the two that seems to indicate causation as well. However, there are some that think the data is flawed. Unfortunately, politics seems to determine where many people stand in this argument, not science - and that goes for both sides of the argument.

---------- Post added at 10:15 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:12 PM ----------



Really? That's up there with the moon landing hoax as one of the most far fetched conspiracy theories.

I don't dispute that humans are making an impact. I do, however, dispute the extent of the impact some scientists are claiming. But that is neither here nor there. As I've said several times in this thread if you want to do something about global warming start with the rainforests, the Chinese, the Mexicans, the Indians, etc. If they give you the finger (And they will) you are wasting your breath. Demanding that only western nations do something about it when our borders are finite will change barely anything aside from costing us billions of dollars and scores of jobs. If we are to take a huge economic hit to institute change then our competitors should have to as well to keep the playing field fair. It's becoming more impossible to compete with the Chinese everyday and anything you would have us do they should agree to do.

 

[NTS]

"I am not sure what your point is with this link."

It's a concrete example of how nations bordering the Arctic Ocean are moving to take advantage of the very non-theoretical melting of the icepack, a result of global climate change. You asked the question.

 

[Angel of Ioren]

After reading some of your posts I'd say it's undeniable. I joke. You rock.




Ok. I give. Uncle. What do we do?

I never said I know what to do or whether any proposed solutions are valid. All I am saying, and the whole point of this thread, is that the evidence for climate change caused by humans is quite strong. Stronger than any evidence for anything remotely paranormal, say EVPs, or ghosts, or alien abductions, yet many people here have no trouble thinking that's real.

---------- Post added at 08:47 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:46 AM ----------

I don't dispute that humans are making an impact. I do, however, dispute the extent of the impact some scientists are claiming. But that is neither here nor there. As I've said several times in this thread if you want to do something about global warming start with the rainforests, the Chinese, the Mexicans, the Indians, etc. If they give you the finger (And they will) you are wasting your breath. Demanding that only western nations do something about it when our borders are finite will change barely anything aside from costing us billions of dollars and scores of jobs. If we are to take a huge economic hit to institute change then our competitors should have to as well to keep the playing field fair. It's becoming more impossible to compete with the Chinese everyday and anything you would have us do they should agree to do.

You make excellent points. Extremism on both sides of the argument is not helpful.