• NEW! LOWEST RATES EVER -- SUPPORT THE SHOW AND ENJOY THE VERY BEST PREMIUM PARACAST EXPERIENCE! Welcome to The Paracast+, eight years young! For a low subscription fee, you can download the ad-free version of The Paracast and the exclusive, member-only, After The Paracast bonus podcast, featuring color commentary, exclusive interviews, the continuation of interviews that began on the main episode of The Paracast. We also offer lifetime memberships! Flash! Take advantage of our lowest rates ever! Act now! It's easier than ever to susbcribe! You can sign up right here!

    Subscribe to The Paracast Newsletter!

Stanton Friedman - Show

Free episodes:

One thing I did like though was when Gene challenged Stan on the ETH with other concepts like interdimensionality or time travel or whatever and Stan's answer basically boiled down to "Yes, that could be true but I don't care. I'm interested in this." I was so happy to hear that. Seems to me there's been alot of dumping on the ETH lately (espescially around here) and I've never understood why. It's not like it's LESS valid than the other theories nor is it presented as the ONLY theory available but what Stan is saying (and I agree with him on this) is that there are cases where the ETH seems the most likely explanation. And those are the cases he persues.

Fair enough. But I'm uncertain of how he pretends to find a valid answer to the UFO phenomenon, if he doesn't bother himself with the high-strangeness cases that are also meritorious of investigation. What is the measure of that selection?

It reminds me of a recent audio interview my friend Mike Clelland (who was once a guest on the show) had with Leo Sprinkle (you can download it here). At one point Leo says that there was a time when Ufologists were permitted to talk about strange lights in the skies, but you couldn't talk about structured craft; then things changed and there was a time when you could talk about structured craft, but you couldn't talk about landings; THEN things changed once again, and it was OK to talk about landings, but you couldn't talk about encounters with humanoids...

See where I'm getting at here? The biased pre-conceptions of researchers might blind them or turn them away from the real nature of the phenomenon. Meanwhile the phenomenon keeps changing in order to stay always one step in front.

We might argue Stanton is perfectly entitled to "specialize" in ETH Ufology —that is, the cases whose explanation could very well be interplanetary travelers— the same way a biologists are entitled to specialize in ornithology or ichthyology.

And yet I ask you: have we reached a point in UFOlogy when we feel we understand enough of the phenomenon to start branching out such specializations? Let us remember than an ornithologist is still required to take courses in general biology, in order to later take more specialized classes.
 
THERE! You see? You just did it!

But I'm uncertain of how he pretends to find a valid answer to the UFO phenomenon

THE UFO phenomenon. Not "the UFO phenomena". A presupposition of a singular source or an all-encompassing catagory. One box. I'm saying that's not good enough anymore (and in truth, probably hasn't ever been).

And yet I ask you: have we reached a point in UFOlogy when we feel we understand enough of the phenomenon to start branching out such specializations? Let us remember than an ornithologist is still required to take courses in general biology, in order to later take more specialized classes.

So don't think of it as specialization, think of it more as dispersal. Sticking with biology analogy, the way we keep looking at UFOs it's like were simply looking at life on this planet as animals instead of birds, reptiles, mammals, etc. Branching out is required, otherwise we could waste decades arguing about what kind of fish a bear is.
 
THERE! You see? You just did it!



THE UFO phenomenon. Not "the UFO phenomena". A presupposition of a singular source or an all-encompassing catagory. One box. I'm saying that's not good enough anymore (and in truth, probably hasn't ever been).



So don't think of it as specialization, think of it more as dispersal. Sticking with biology analogy, the way we keep looking at UFOs it's like were simply looking at life on this planet as animals instead of birds, reptiles, mammals, etc. Branching out is required, otherwise we could waste decades arguing about what kind of fish a bear is.

... more crickets chirping... the first 5 pages were more interesting.
 
THERE! You see? You just did it!



THE UFO phenomenon. Not "the UFO phenomena". A presupposition of a singular source or an all-encompassing catagory. One box. I'm saying that's not good enough anymore (and in truth, probably hasn't ever been).

For the record, I don't suscribe to the idea that UFOs come from just one single source, or for just one single purpose. In fact I try not to subscribe to any particular thesis —ETH, Cryptoterrestrial, Ultraterrestrial, etc, etc— since that allows me to analyze all the divergent data that seems to conflict any one of those theories at one time.

IMHO most important (and way more interesting) as to finding out WHERE do UFOs come from, is asking ourselves WHY they are here. That might have been a good approach for the native Americans after spotting the Niña, the Pinta and the Santa María ;)




So don't think of it as specialization, think of it more as dispersal. Sticking with biology analogy, the way we keep looking at UFOs it's like were simply looking at life on this planet as animals instead of birds, reptiles, mammals, etc. Branching out is required, otherwise we could waste decades arguing about what kind of fish a bear is.

Ok, but one would think that those early biologists had already found a set of consensus regarding the main differences between a bear and a fish —something that seems sorely lacking in XXIst century UFOlogy ;)

I'm really not disagreeing with you here. But this discussion prompts one particular question: Since Stanton Friedman is arguably one of the most famous UFOlogists in the world nowadays, he would seem like the more logical choice for people to contact him and disclose their personal sighting.

So what happens if Stanton (hypothetically) receives a report that seems to divert from his "area of expertise"? Would he pass it along to some of his colleagues more interested in the "fringier" stuff? Would he contact Chris O'Brien, for example? or would that case be ultimately discarded by Stan?

[PS] My main point is this: I like Stanton, I have nothing but respect for him as a researcher; you can say whatever you want about the man, but he clearly is someone who does his homework.

But... sometimes it seems like he's drawn to the cases where he feels he'll find the answer he wants to hear. And that's not the way Science should be conducted, IMHO. That's why Tycho Brahe advised Kepler to study the orbit of the planet Mars, since it was the most eccentric and difficult to explain with the cosmological theories of their time.

(And that even forced Kepler to discard his precious theory based on Pythagorean solids. That probably wasn't easy for the poor guy —but look at what he received in return: the laws of planetary motion that we still use to this very day!)
 
the first 5 pages were more interesting.

Then go back to them and revel in your own self-congratulatory smugness. Shocking as it may seem, some of us aren't actually interested in your tiresome, repetitive tripe. Get a blog or something, that way you can post the same crap about global warming every single day and then respond to those posts with ego-stroking comments about how awesome about how right you are about it without bothering the rest of humanity.

So what happens if Stanton (hypothetically) receives a report that seems to divert from his "area of expertise"? Would he pass it along to some of his colleagues more interested in the "fringier" stuff?

Ideally, yeah. I mean it's already kinda like that but it should be something that's done actively instead of in the haphazard way it's done now.
 
Then go back to them and revel in your own self-congratulatory smugness. Shocking as it may seem, some of us aren't actually interested in your tiresome, repetitive tripe. Get a blog or something, that way you can post the same crap about global warming every single day and then respond to those posts with ego-stroking comments about how awesome about how right you are about it without bothering the rest of humanity.

Buzz off CapnG. I was on topic. I didn't bring the global warming subject up on the Stanton Friedman podcast, Gene did. I already tried to end the GW discussion on this thread but certain people keep trolling.
 
Buzz off CapnG. I was on topic. I didn't bring the global warming subject up on the Stanton Friedman podcast, Gene did. I already tried to end the GW discussion on this thread but certain people keep trolling.

Who's trolling about it Pixel? You're the one that brought it back up again with your comment. The thread got back on topic and hopefully it will stay that was. I had a hand in derailing it an I am sorry - I should know better than to get into that stuff with Pixelsmith.

Anyway:
THE UFO phenomenon. Not "the UFO phenomena". A presupposition of a singular source or an all-encompassing catagory. One box. I'm saying that's not good enough anymore (and in truth, probably hasn't ever been).

I totally agree with that Cap. Although I still think that all of these encounters can be explained without resorting to some sort of intelligent non-human lifeform, if there is something going on that is unknown to us, it's likely that it's multiple sources.
Friedman is set in his ways at this point and I'll be surprised if he ever drops the ETH as the ONLY possible idea.
 
Who's trolling about it Pixel? You're the one that brought it back up again with your comment. The thread got back on topic and hopefully it will stay that was. I had a hand in derailing it an I am sorry - I should know better than to get into that stuff with Pixelsmith.

Anyway:


I totally agree with that Cap. Although I still think that all of these encounters can be explained without resorting to some sort of intelligent non-human lifeform, if there is something going on that is unknown to us, it's likely that it's multiple sources.
Friedman is set in his ways at this point and I'll be surprised if he ever drops the ETH as the ONLY possible idea.

The last 2 podcasts included discussions on Global warming. I bit my lip on the Brandenburg podcast and then when Gene brought it up with
Stanton I addressed it and got crap for it.

Gene and Chris, in future podcasts PLEASE tell us what we are allowed to comment on.

There is another new topic for GW stuff. I will gladly discuss this AGW stuff there.
 
The last 2 podcasts included discussions on Global warming. I bit my lip on the Brandenburg podcast and then when Gene brought it up with
Stanton I addressed it and got crap for it.

Gene and Chris, in future podcasts PLEASE tell us what we are allowed to comment on.

There is another new topic for GW stuff. I will gladly discuss this AGW stuff there.

This is a paranormal radio show. You're supposed to know. :D
 
There is another new topic for GW stuff. I will gladly discuss this AGW stuff there.

Please do.

I thought that I knew. I better check with CapnG.... hey Capn....on the forums we discuss what the hosts and guests talk about, right? or... do we check in with you first? :p

Were the first 5 pages in this thread not enough for you? Because if it's all the same to you, I was hoping to discuss Friedman's work in UFOs and where the field is headed (or isn't as the case may be). I just want to check and make sure...
 
Friedman is set in his ways at this point and I'll be surprised if he ever drops the ETH as the ONLY possible idea.

The area of interest for Friedman is structured craft whose behavior is beyond our technological capacity but built by civilizations less than a few thousand years ahead of us. Any civilization that can operate beyond 20 light years of their home world (galactic sector) is somebody else's ball game.

I fully understand the need to limit the scope of interest in the UFO phenomenon to something we have at least a slim chance of decoding intent and tech of an alien civilization.

Esoteric manifestations, transdimensionality or other unfathomable behaviors may be valid expressions of alien intelligence but they have very limited potential in convincing uninitiated audiences.

Imho, Stanton Friedman has the right formula to channel to the masses and maybe inspire them to investigate further and proceed to the next level ;)
 
The area of interest for Friedman is structured craft whose behavior is beyond our technological capacity but built by civilizations less than a few thousand years ahead of us.

Or million. Or billion. Dude's got a real thing for Zeta Reticulli.
 
Or million. Or billion. Dude's got a real thing for Zeta Reticulli.

I stand corrected lol, Reticuli is 40 light years away still fairly close... And star is a billion years older than sun.

What he's concentrating on is structured craft originating from presumably the local galactic area..... As opposed to multidimensional phenomenon potentially originating from anywhere.

Is the following formula:
nuts and bolts = (relative proximity to earth) x (civilization less than 2 billion years older than ours)
Flawed ? ;)
 
Really interesting show this week an enjoyable two hours of radio. Firstly, I do appreciate Stanton, many years of endevour, of trying to figure out the UFO Phenomenon. Also I hope my opinions, will not be viewed as been too derogatory in tone, I'm just expressing feelings on what Stanton said, during the show.

Stanton seems like a nice man, his style of laughing scary, but who among us is perfect. His beliefs are well articulated, some of those beliefs he has, though are not deserving of lot of attention and respect. Stan belief or opinion, is that aliens may have appeared, showed up right after our Atomic testing, as a preventing measure keeping an eye on us for their own protection and safety. Interesting theory.

How realistic is it "Aliens" been so far away, light years away, could have spotted what we were doing on this planet. And then taken an interest to what we were doing to motive themselves to travel across space to come here and keep us in check. Why even notify the primitives of your existence? Would that make it not more desirable fo us to explore, to get out there quicker, knowing other live forms exist in the vastness of space? Would it not be better for the "others" to remain silent totally to us and stay away?

What threat are we to an intersteller species coming here from the vastness of space. We as a species, can't even get pass our own moon, we have not got the technology to go to other planets, that exist outside of the solar system. And us getting out of here, is not likely to happen in our near future. I think we have to be realistic in outlook here. If aliens are now here and are arriving in giant-motherships miles long in length. We have hardly no chance of fighting of an attack if it happened in theory, their survival is not really an issue. In theory we probably end up wiping out ourself in defending the planet.

In aroundabout way Stan "Opinion" is not all different to mine. We differ slightly. I think the interest for visitors, may be less about security preventing us from travelling to other planets, their far more interested I think in the protection of this planet and nature for their own well-being agendas and goals.

Personally, I believe the body of evidence points to whatever this is, has been with us for a very long time. We certainly were not flying aerial vehicles around the planet, 150 years ago, never mind a couple of thousand of years ago in the past. I think the interest UFO's have in our Atomic weapons and Nuclear power plants, as I said before, could be more a caring to the well-being of the planet, then us, actions tell alot.

I don't think Aliens, would have cared if we blown ourself up. How many of us have died in wars famine illness sickness and so on no aliens have ever stepped in to stop that, but when he used a couple of nukes on Japan. There does to seem to have been a reaction from whatever this is. If aliens if there hiding out among us may not have liked this, ye kill yourself away, as long as you do it in a way, that does not harm us, pissed of they'd got a little worried we'd wreck the biosphere for them, a biosphere that we had no right to wreck. Is that the reason UFO's have been reported messing with our weapons of mass-destruction, remainding us we are not alone, and we have no right to wreck for them too?

I can't discount the ETH hypothesis. I think some of what is happening could be dimensional in nature. I think we have to be open to the possibility, if there was interaction in the past between humans and others. Ancient cultures from around the world, may have had reasons to point to certain star areas of our sky?

Orion, Sirius and Pleiades, star cluster were extremely important locations for ancient man. These areas in the sky were important enough for ancient cultures to put the effort into building, monuments, temples, structures, with a purpose of marking those locations in the sky above.

Is this real prove aliens interacted with humans on the ground, no it does not at all, but those areas in the sky captured their imaginations, enough to do what they done. We also have to remember there is velocity of light constraint. They can't get there from there the distances are too far. The theory of general relativity as opposed to the special theory of relatively, makes lot more sense in explaining how an advanced other could have got here from there. An advanced species, many thousands of years old millions of years even, might have knowledge of science we don't understand, and their technology is so advanced, their bypassing the speed of light constraint that does exist.

Any advanced species milions of years old who lives on a planet in this space and time. May be using additional dimensionalties to get here. Skipping to an area a dimension closer to this planet and then entering that way to here. Is possible but still only a theory as this stage. When your advanced enough in technology, anything could be possible. Anything we have thought of in science-fiction movies and drama, could exist in reality on another planet. We do time-travelling with our minds, having visions of what is possible, but lot of it does not exist it fantasy what we love to see happen, but it is likely, we could fulfil those fantasies given enough time and space and effort.

Anyway, I like to comment more on what Stan said, but this post would take too long to write out. Finally since this is a debate taking place on the forum. Global warming.

Stan should no better then saying C02, is not that important. Stan should be aware extra C02 can thicken our atmosphere. Carbon-dioxide is not a pollutant at sustained regular levels, but at higher levels C02, can be detrimental for the climate. The extra carbon-dioxide will increase the temperatures on the planet, and our weather patterns could change for the worse, and it very possible we are beginning to feel the effects already of global-warming this year. Take a look at what is happening in Australia at the moment. There seeing floods on the biblical scale. All the best for people who live over there!

The planet will live on go on, no matter what happens to us. It not that well understood this area, But global warming can also cause a global cooling of the planet as well as a warming up of our climate. There is lot of science supporting global warming. But this is just an example of what is happening and can be put down to temperature rise of the oceans.

When large areas of ice sheets melt due to the extra heat in the atmosphere and the increased heat of the water. The extra water flowing into the seas and oceans, right away, causes the normal sea levels to get higher. The extra water adds more moisture to the air. More clouds form leading to extra rain that extra rainfall can overflow rivers and lakes. All this in combination and more has lead to widespread flooding we have seen across the world.

Get a jug with a marked level. Fill it with a water to that level (that is our sea level) what happens if you pour more water in. It overflows, just imagine outside of the jug land exists! this is really basic, but you can understand, why it very important for us, to stop the ice caps from melting and prevent what is happening, even if not all our fault we still are part of the problem. I think the sun is playing a role in the weird weathers we are having lately too. I think from what I have seen in last few years. The weather has changed not sure how bad it will get longterm?
 
Really interesting show this week an enjoyable two hours of radio. Firstly, I do appreciate Stanton, many years of endevour, of trying to figure out the UFO Phenomenon. Also I hope my opinions, will not be viewed as been too derogatory in tone, I'm just expressing feelings on what Stanton said, during the show.

Stanton seems like a nice man, his style of laughing scary, but who among us is perfect. His beliefs are well articulated, some of those beliefs he has, though are not deserving of lot of attention and respect. Stan belief or opinion, is that aliens may have appeared, showed up right after our Atomic testing, as a preventing measure keeping an eye on us for their own protection and safety. Interesting theory.

How realistic is it "Aliens" been so far away, light years away, could have spotted what we were doing on this planet. And then taken an interest to what we were doing to motive themselves to travel across space to come here and keep us in check. Why even notify the primitives of your existence? Would that make it not more desirable fo us to explore, to get out there quicker, knowing other live forms exist in the vastness of space? Would it not be better for the "others" to remain silent totally to us and stay away?

What threat are we to an intersteller species coming here from the vastness of space. We as a species, can't even get pass our own moon, we have not got the technology to go to other planets, that exist outside of the solar system. And us getting out of here, is not likely to happen in our near future. I think we have to be realistic in outlook here. If aliens are now here and are arriving in giant-motherships miles long in length. We have hardly no chance of fighting of an attack if it happened in theory, their survival is not really an issue. In theory we probably end up wiping out ourself in defending the planet.

In aroundabout way Stan "Opinion" is not all different to mine. We differ slightly. I think the interest for visitors, may be less about security preventing us from travelling to other planets, their far more interested I think in the protection of this planet and nature for their own well-being agendas and goals.

Personally, I believe the body of evidence points to whatever this is, has been with us for a very long time. We certainly were not flying aerial vehicles around the planet, 150 years ago, never mind a couple of thousand of years ago in the past. I think the interest UFO's have in our Atomic weapons and Nuclear power plants, as I said before, could be more a caring to the well-being of the planet, then us, actions tell alot.

I don't think Aliens, would have cared if we blown ourself up. How many of us have died in wars famine illness sickness and so on no aliens have ever stepped in to stop that, but when he used a couple of nukes on Japan. There does to seem to have been a reaction from whatever this is. If aliens if there hiding out among us may not have liked this, ye kill yourself away, as long as you do it in a way, that does not harm us, pissed of they'd got a little worried we'd wreck the biosphere for them, a biosphere that we had no right to wreck. Is that the reason UFO's have been reported messing with our weapons of mass-destruction, remainding us we are not alone, and we have no right to wreck for them too?

I can't discount the ETH hypothesis. I think some of what is happening could be dimensional in nature. I think we have to be open to the possibility, if there was interaction in the past between humans and others. Ancient cultures from around the world, may have had reasons to point to certain star areas of our sky?

Orion, Sirius and Pleiades, star cluster were extremely important locations for ancient man. These areas in the sky were important enough for ancient cultures to put the effort into building, monuments, temples, structures, with a purpose of marking those locations in the sky above.

Is this real prove aliens interacted with humans on the ground, no it does not at all, but those areas in the sky captured their imaginations, enough to do what they done. We also have to remember there is velocity of light constraint. They can't get there from there the distances are too far. The theory of general relativity as opposed to the special theory of relatively, makes lot more sense in explaining how an advanced other could have got here from there. An advanced species, many thousands of years old millions of years even, might have knowledge of science we don't understand, and their technology is so advanced, their bypassing the speed of light constraint that does exist.

Any advanced species milions of years old who lives on a planet in this space and time. May be using additional dimensionalties to get here. Skipping to an area a dimension closer to this planet and then entering that way to here. Is possible but still only a theory as this stage. When your advanced enough in technology, anything could be possible. Anything we have thought of in science-fiction movies and drama, could exist in reality on another planet. We do time-travelling with our minds, having visions of what is possible, but lot of it does not exist it fantasy what we love to see happen, but it is likely, we could fulfil those fantasies given enough time and space and effort.

Anyway, I like to comment more on what Stan said, but this post would take too long to write out. Finally since this is a debate taking place on the forum. Global warming.

Stan should no better then saying C02, is not that important. Stan should be aware extra C02 can thicken our atmosphere. Carbon-dioxide is not a pollutant at sustained regular levels, but at higher levels C02, can be detrimental for the climate. The extra carbon-dioxide will increase the temperatures on the planet, and our weather patterns could change for the worse, and it very possible we are beginning to feel the effects already of global-warming this year. Take a look at what is happening in Australia at the moment. There seeing floods on the biblical scale. All the best for people who live over there!

The planet will live on go on, no matter what happens to us. It not that well understood this area, But global warming can also cause a global cooling of the planet as well as a warming up of our climate. There is lot of science supporting global warming. But this is just an example of what is happening and can be put down to temperature rise of the oceans.

When large areas of ice sheets melt due to the extra heat in the atmosphere and the increased heat of the water. The extra water flowing into the seas and oceans, right away, causes the normal sea levels to get higher. The extra water adds more moisture to the air. More clouds form leading to extra rain that extra rainfall can overflow rivers and lakes. All this in combination and more has lead to widespread flooding we have seen across the world.

Get a jug with a marked level. Fill it with a water to that level (that is our sea level) what happens if you pour more water in. It overflows, just imagine outside of the jug land exists! this is really basic, but you can understand, why it very important for us, to stop the ice caps from melting and prevent what is happening, even if not all our fault we still are part of the problem. I think the sun is playing a role in the weird weathers we are having lately too. I think from what I have seen in last few years. The weather has changed not sure how bad it will get longterm?

You had me until the end my friend... i suggest several more years of research in that area. The flooding in Australia right now is cyclical and anyone who lives there should have had it on their calendars because of the repetitive flooding over the last several hundred years. Come on over to the current "global warming" thread and review some links I posted. CapnG does not allow this sort of discussion here.
 
The area of interest for Friedman is structured craft whose behavior is beyond our technological capacity but built by civilizations less than a few thousand years ahead of us. Any civilization that can operate beyond 20 light years of their home world (galactic sector) is somebody else's ball game.

But what's the criteria to discern which UFO is "made in Reticuli"? ;)

Imho, Stanton Friedman has the right formula to channel to the masses and maybe inspire them to investigate further and proceed to the next level ;)

I agree with that. As his nephew Paul showed with the documentary "Stanton Friedman is real", his main contribution to the UFO field has been raising the awareness of the public to the subject.


He's the Carl Sagan of UFOlogy :cool:
 
Buzz off CapnG. I was on topic. I didn't bring the global warming subject up on the Stanton Friedman podcast, Gene did. I already tried to end the GW discussion on this thread but certain people keep trolling.

That's just the point, ... you are NOT on topic. Let me remind you of the OP's comments:
"I must first warn all that it is not my intent to discuss the belief system of whether or not global warming is real or not. After all, as we have discussed in the past, one cannot debate a belief system"

It was not his intent to discuss the truths or mistruths about global warming. But you went trudging along anyway. I was under the assumption that we discussed what the actual topic was. And the topic wasn't "tell us why we are all idiots and why global warming is a farce". It was, .... well it doesn't matter because you're not going to listen anyway. Go ahead and rehash everything you've said countless times in the other thread.

In fact I like Capn's idea. Just start a blog and reference you're blog whenever you feel the need.
 
"And the topic wasn't tell us why we are all idiots and why global warming is a farce".

If you feel you are an idiot that is fine, you said it not me. Gene said they were going to "discuss all the work Stanton Friedman has done". I guess you were not paying attention when Gene mentioned the book by Stanton T. Friedman and Kathleen Martin called "Science was Wrong". Being that he co authored this book it would fall into one of the many things Stanton has done... do you follow so far? If this confuses you maybe you can get someone to explain it to you. ;)

I am not discussing a belief system like many here do. I would prefer to discuss the actual science and natural climate cycles as Stanton does. We can discuss all this on the new thread that was started. CapnG is trying to keep GW off this thread because it seems to cause him fits.

One way to keep from "wetting your pants" over this subject is to NOT READ IT. This is easily done, when you see something you do not want to read try closing your eyes. NOTE: you WILL have to open them again at some point so try to move your eyes to the side a little so you do not see the same offending words again. You can also try to skip ahead but you may get confused or dizzy. If this happens you may have to log out and back in again then try again.

CapnG may not understand this whole concept so after you figure it out maybe you could explain it to him as well. ;)

Please, if anyone else has a comment about the GW part of this interview do not post it here. I am not sure CapnG or TClaeys could handle it. ;)
please post your GW comments here: New Not-So-Improved GW Perspective
 
Back
Top