Travis Walton - September 21, 2014

[Christopher O'Brien]

Thanks for posting the audio by the way, Heidi.

...and thanks for your recap of the clips!

 

[marduk]

This is what bothers me about the incident. How does one lose 5-10 pounds and gain it back so fast? Also, having undergone hypnotic treatment once, wouldn't he be the least bit curious to see what else he was doing for five days that, after 40 years, he still does not remember?

So much for asking questions that weren't probing.

I may be able to elaborate, surmising on my own experiences.

There's at least one "high strange" event that I have no interest knowing more about.

I know something happened, and that little bit is terrifying enough.

Plus - and this is a big stretch - sometimes I have a sense that there are things we're not supposed to know. This sense is difficult to describe, it's like coming to a red light in the middle of the night on a deserted intersection. You get the sense you're supposed to stop, and there's a compulsion to sit there even though there's no real reason to do so.

And no, I'm not going to elaborate further on this experience, and I do not offer it as evidence of anything.

 

[Stagger Lee]

Many years ago, I would ponder the UFO mystery under psychedelic circumstances.. and would always come away with " a sense that there are things we're not supposed to know."

 

[Heidi Lemmer]

Thanks Jeremiah for the recap! From my perspective as a relatively newcomer, if someone were to just hit the net looking for things on Travis, well....not all true. This interview he did on the Paracast was the first time I've heard his version. Now, compare this version and the audio clips and hop on over to Shaeffer's site and you'll see a remarkable difference in tales. From simplistic, trauma, pounded by media to Klass'es version of deceptive, something to hide, elaborate hoax conman. And what's important about this is that Klass has had his way with not only the media but many people in this field. Essentially he' come to a case to drop the poison. So yah, these audio clips were awesome, to be taken back in time as the event is happening and see for one's self how it happened.

 

[Jeremiah Dugger]

Thanks Jeremiah for the recap! From my perspective as a relatively newcomer, if someone were to just hit the net looking for things on Travis, well....not all true. This interview he did on the Paracast was the first time I've heard his version. Now, compare this version and the audio clips and hop on over to Shaeffer's site and you'll see a remarkable difference in tales. From simplistic, trauma, pounded by media to Klass'es version of deceptive, something to hide, elaborate hoax conman. And what's important about this is that Klass has had his way with not only the media but many people in this field. Essentially he' come to a case to drop the poison. So yah, these audio clips were awesome, to be taken back in time as the event is happening and see for one's self how it happened.

Funny you mention that. I was just on FB the other day and messaged Shaeffer because I wanted some insight as Klass. He has not yet responded but he has moved on in the conversation. I'm beginning to think his relationship with Klass leaves him somewhat less than impartial.

 

[Jeremiah Dugger]

Edit to the above: " insight as to the motivations/ quality of research of Klass"

 

[Stagger Lee]

In a nut shell- there are five witnesses(co-workers) who went along with a grande hoax, even when the going was more than tough. Or Walton did engage a brilliant saucer hovering in the night sky. I find it impossible that one of these co-workers did not crack under the initial pressure- even more so when murder charges were thrown in their face. That leaves a hoax played on his co-workers, an impossible one that would take a team of professionals to pull off with todays technology. I just can't see how this group could maintain such a conspiracy all these years- much less be hoaxed by one of their co-workers(considering all their descriptions matched when describing the encounter)
I recall watching a recent interview with one of the loggers, where he was asked how the encounter has affected him in the present day. He broke down a bit, and mentioned a continuing fear of looking out a window at any given time and seeing a saucer. It was obvious this guy was not acting when describing his greatest horror of looking up one day and witnessing another craft.

 

[Randall]

In a nut shell- there are five witnesses(co-workers) who went along with a grande hoax, even when the going was more than tough. Or Walton did engage a brilliant saucer hovering in the night sky. I find it impossible that one of these co-workers did not crack under the initial pressure- even more so when murder charges were thrown in their face.

The rationale that they wouldn't have cracked and admitted a hoax because they were threatened with a murder conviction doesn't make sense. If it was a hoax then they would know that Walton was alive and would be found and therefore they would have no fear of any charges sticking ( let alone any conviction ). Their only fear would be of getting caught doing a hoax. So let's just dump that one once and for all.

That leaves a hoax played on his co-workers, an impossible one that would take a team of professionals to pull off with todays technology. I just can't see how this group could maintain such a conspiracy all these years- much less be hoaxed by one of their co-workers(considering all their descriptions matched when describing the encounter).

I don't see it as all that hard to pull off at all. Just keep your mouth shut about the hoax and repeat exactly the same story over and over again. The longer it goes on for, the more they have to lose and the more they have to gain. Offers to pay for more interviews started coming in even before Walton was found!

I recall watching a recent interview with one of the loggers, where he was asked how the encounter has affected him in the present day. He broke down a bit, and mentioned a continuing fear of looking out a window at any given time and seeing a saucer. It was obvious this guy was not acting when describing his greatest horror of looking up one day and witnessing another craft.

Maybe he's a convincing actor. Or maybe there was a bright flash of light from something like one of the armed forces helicopters with a powerful search beam ( remember the "high pitched whine" that was reported? ).

 

[Jeremiah Dugger]

The rationale that they wouldn't have cracked and admitted a hoax because they were threatened with a murder conviction doesn't make sense. If it was a hoax then they would know that Walton was alive and would be found and therefore they would have no fear of any charges sticking ( let alone any conviction ). Their only fear would be of getting caught doing a hoax. So let's just dump that one once and for all.

I don't see it as all that hard to pull off at all. Just keep your mouth shut about the hoax and repeat exactly the same story over and over again. The longer it goes on for, the more they have to lose and the more they have to gain. Offers to pay for more interviews started coming in even before Walton was found!

Maybe he's a convincing actor. Or maybe there was a bright flash of light from something like one of the armed forces helicopters with a powerful search beam ( remember the "high pitched whine" that was reported? ).

When you involve the police in a hoax, you bet your ass they charge you. Try it sometime.

 

[Randall]

When you involve the police in a hoax, you bet your ass they charge you. Try it sometime.

That's OK, I believe you ! Which is why if we assume a hoax, the only real fear they would have had was getting caught perpetrating that. There would be zero fear of getting charged with murder.

 

[Gene Steinberg]

It appears to be a misdemeanor in Arizona if you file a false police report.

13-2907.01. False reporting to law enforcement agencies; classification

I expect the penalty would depend on the severity of the crime, so it could be a fine, probation, possibly a prison term, or some combination of the three.

 

[Randall]

It appears to be a misdemeanor in Arizona if you file a false police report.

13-2907.01. False reporting to law enforcement agencies; classification

I expect the penalty would depend on the severity of the crime, so it could be a fine, probation, possibly a prison term, or some combination of the three.

Any past records ( if any ) might also play a part in sentencing, which might include restitution at the judge's discretion.

Didn't you mention someplace that perhaps there was the possibility that it may have been a military operation of some kind? I've been giving that more serious thought since one person claimed that a military presence in the area was fairly common, and that a there was the sound of a "high pitched whine" associated with the alleged UFO.

 

[Burnt State]

In a nut shell- there are five witnesses(co-workers) who went along with a grande hoax, even when the going was more than tough. Or Walton did engage a brilliant saucer hovering in the night sky. I find it impossible that one of these co-workers did not crack under the initial pressure- even more so when murder charges were thrown in their face. That leaves a hoax played on his co-workers, an impossible one that would take a team of professionals to pull off with todays technology. I just can't see how this group could maintain such a conspiracy all these years- much less be hoaxed by one of their co-workers(considering all their descriptions matched when describing the encounter)
I recall watching a recent interview with one of the loggers, where he was asked how the encounter has affected him in the present day. He broke down a bit, and mentioned a continuing fear of looking out a window at any given time and seeing a saucer. It was obvious this guy was not acting when describing his greatest horror of looking up one day and witnessing another craft.

I really can't see how all five could possibly be upholding any allegiance at all to each other if they were in on it together. The running hoax theory is that the driver Mike Rogers & head of the crew needed to get out of a logging contract and alien abduction would qualify as an act of god. Then he could break a contract he could not complete and was continually losing money on it. In this way it's The Walton's, but no John-boy, Rogers & some even suggest mom as part of a great con. But the main hoax theory via Schaeffer and Klass is that the pact of three forever more shall be. If so then these three would have to have a very serious agreement and one in which no one else could possibly know. $$$ would have to be continually changing hands. Does that work as a narrative? Is there any evidence of this in the present?

Now the quote from Steve Pierce about not seeing the top, bottom, nor back of the thing, and how at first it looked to him like some kind of hunter's blind put up in a tree. Do I have that right? It really gives you the option for hoax in that scenario. In this version of events Travis is whisked off by a confederate in the woods after all evidence of the event is cleared completely, and not necessarily in the dark thanks to whatever lighting there was. What's described as being seen on the hill by other witnesses is just a light in the woods I believe. But it certainly wasn't a helicopter. So then he hides out, eats little, and puts on a stellar performance for 39 years and counting. So why isn't he getting more acting gigs in L.A.? However, I'm still interested in how Walton does smoothly downplay certain features of his experience, history regarding UFO's specifically. It's a tight script and he sticks to it.

Was there really a bolt of lightning that hit him and made him fly through the air, and if so how do you rig that Hollywood style stunt without cgi? It's got a lot of exceptional features, this case, yet things just don't add up one way or another. Like many UFO abduction narratives, it's slipperier than a hovercraft of eels, or speaking in Manx for that matter.

This case BTW is the first time we hear about the Nordic style aliens being together on board with the greys. This will indeed become a future meme. Travis described these non-speaking humans as having hazel coloured eyes. Of course later on in our stories there would be no end to the many combinations of different aliens that would come together to abduct us, like some kind of strange multiverse comic book crossover where all the superheroes and supervillains are in one compendium together.

 

[Jeremiah Dugger]

That's OK, I believe you ! Which is why if we assume a hoax, the only real fear they would have had was getting caught perpetrating that. There would be zero fear of getting charged with murder.

Fair enough. But if all they wanted was out of a contract, can't you imagine a simpler way to meet that goal? It's tough for me to picture this being the the 39 year long hoax which I believe you're arguing it is. It's tough for me to see them dreaming it up, let alone agreeing to it unanimously AND keeping a solid front between themselves for so many years.

 

[Randall]

I really can't see how all five could possibly be upholding any allegiance at all to each other if they were in on it together. The running hoax theory is that the driver Mike Rogers & head of the crew needed to get out of a logging contract and alien abduction would qualify as an act of god. Then he could break a contract he could not complete and was continually losing money on it. In this way it's The Walton's, but no John-boy, Rogers & some even suggest mom as part of a great con. But the main hoax theory via Schaeffer and Klass is that the pact of three forever more shall be. If so then these three would have to have a very serious agreement and one in which no one else could possibly know. $$$ would have to be continually changing hands. Does that work as a narrative? Is there any evidence of this in the present?

I see it far more plausible that five people in a pact together would hold up their allegiances than a group who weren't in on it together, and you can plainly see them in the photo together holding their tabloid cheques. Once the ball started rolling it has just kept on rolling for 40 years.

Now the quote from Steve Pierce about not seeing the top, bottom, nor back of the thing, and how at first it looked to him like some kind of hunter's blind put up in a tree. Do I have that right? It really gives you the option for hoax in that scenario. In this version of events Travis is whisked off by a confederate in the woods after all evidence of the event is cleared completely, and not necessarily in the dark thanks to whatever lighting there was. What's described as being seen on the hill by other witnesses is just a light in the woods I believe. But it certainly wasn't a helicopter. So then he hides out, eats little, and puts on a stellar performance for 39 years and counting. So why isn't he getting more acting gigs in L.A.? However, I'm still interested in how Walton does smoothly downplay certain features of his experience, history regarding UFO's specifically. It's a tight script and he sticks to it.

Not so sure we can rule out a helicopter if the report of a "high pitched whine" is true. As for Walton's "tight script", there are inconsistencies I've pointed out already, like the prior interest in the subject matter mentioned by his brother.

Was there really a bolt of lightning that hit him and made him fly through the air, and if so how do you rig that Hollywood style stunt without cgi? It's got a lot of exceptional features, this case, yet things just don't add up one way or another. Like many UFO abduction narratives, it's slipperier than a hovercraft of eels, or speaking in Manx for that matter.

If there was a beam of light perhaps it wasn't a "lightning bolt", but a searchlight, and Walton simply bounded away from it instinctively and fell. But then there should have been at least some disruption of the ground where he landed, yet none was found by the investigating officers.

This case BTW is the first time we hear about the Nordic style aliens being together on board with the greys. This will indeed become a future meme. Travis described these non-speaking humans as having hazel coloured eyes. Of course later on in our stories there would be no end to the many combinations of different aliens that would come together to abduct us, like some kind of strange multiverse comic book crossover where all the superheroes and supervillains are in one compendium together.

It just adds that much more to the unbelievability of the story.

 

[Randall]

Fair enough. But if all they wanted was out of a contract, can't you imagine a simpler way to meet that goal? It's tough for me to picture this being the the 39 year long hoax which I believe you're arguing it is. It's tough for me to see them dreaming it up, let alone agreeing to it unanimously AND keeping a solid front between themselves for so many years.

Not admitting to a hoax ( if it was one ) doesn't sound all that difficult to me. Not admitting something takes very little effort. I have little doubt that there are plenty of older unsolved crimes, and without more evidence it's just another cold case, and if it is a hoax, what incentive is there for any of them to come clean? None. Plus the contract motive may have been incidental to simply hoaxing the abduction and seeing where it would lead.

 

[Jeremiah Dugger]

Not admitting to a hoax ( if it was one ) doesn't sound all that difficult to me. Not admitting something takes very little effort. I have little doubt that there are plenty of older unsolved crimes, and without more evidence it's just another cold case, and if it is a hoax, what incentive is there for any of them to come clean? None. Plus the contract motive may have been incidental to simply hoaxing the abduction and seeing where it would lead.

Secrets are not that easy to keep between a group of only loosely associated loggers. Where's the cause for such deep and long lasting solidarity? I mean, who are these guys? The Sopranos? The CIA? Where's the vast fortune holding this silence together???

 

[Randall]

Secrets are not that easy to keep between a group of only loosely associated loggers. Where's the cause for such deep and long lasting solidarity? I mean, who are these guys? The Sopranos? The CIA? Where's the vast fortune holding this silence together???

What would make it so hard to simply not say something? I don't see the problem.

 

[Jeremiah Dugger]

Don't get me wrong. I'm not Fox Moulder. I do NOT want to believe. I Need to know.

 

[Jeremiah Dugger]

What would make it so hard to simply not say something? I don't see the problem.

I just tend to think that with this many 'collaborators' over this much time, and with no cottage industry of their own to show for it, at least one of them would have struck out on their own by now and tried to turn a buck blowing the whistle. Profit motive, baby.