-
NEW! LOWEST RATES EVER -- SUPPORT THE SHOW AND ENJOY THE VERY BEST PREMIUM PARACAST EXPERIENCE! Welcome to The Paracast+, eight years young! For a low subscription fee, you can download the ad-free version of The Paracast and the exclusive, member-only, After The Paracast bonus podcast, featuring color commentary, exclusive interviews, the continuation of interviews that began on the main episode of The Paracast. We also offer lifetime memberships! Flash! Take advantage of our lowest rates ever! Act now! It's easier than ever to susbcribe! You can sign up right here!
UFO over Jerusalem--- Don check this out
- Thread starter Skymon876
- Start date
Free episodes:
Infolad1
Purveyor of Hidden Things
While the analysis from The Dimension Zone was excellent, there's still something about that fourth video.
I guess if it is verified to be a hoax, it's a testament to some pretty good After Effects skills on the part of
the person or persons who did it.
An interesting point was made in the comments section of this link:
Jerusalem UFO 'Almost Certainly a Hoax' : Discovery News
quoting AndrewJ:
"I have been to the Dome of the Rock on multiple occasions, and I can tell you that, at any given time, there are no less than 50-100 people directly around the Temple Mount/Noble Sanctuary, an area that can only be accessed after going through Israeli Defense Force (IDF) security checkpoints. Other than this mix of civilians and worshippers of multiple faiths, there is also always a significant number of IDF soldiers around the perimeter of the Temple Mount/Noble Sanctuary (it's Jewish and Muslim identifiers, respectively). What I'm getting at is there should be at least several dozen eyewitnesses, the majority of them highly-trained soldiers. From what I know, the IDF has not officially taken a position on this. They might release a statement tomorrow, or they might never. Either way, if this is genuine, and this was not an elaborate feat of special effects, then investigators should have no problem tracking down eyewitnesses. As interested parties may have noticed, very few print or television news organizations have reported on this. "
While his comments about the area need to be verified, if they are fact, they do reinforce the idea that this was a hoax.
But what was the point? Who benefits? There's still the possibility that this was a psyop to evaluate reactions to anomalous phenomenon & it's effect on organized belief system worshippers.
Or it could be an elaborate hoax perpetrated by someone trying to be the next Federico Alvarez:
I really wish someone over there would do a professional level investigation to answer the various unanswered questions.
With that said, this kind of cements where I stand at this point. If you're not there, you CAN'T verify it (and sometimes not even then).
It'll be the ultimate irony if there are countless "real" videos online that people swear are fake because the lines are blurred so much by the "realistic fakes". State of the world today.
I guess if it is verified to be a hoax, it's a testament to some pretty good After Effects skills on the part of
the person or persons who did it.
An interesting point was made in the comments section of this link:
Jerusalem UFO 'Almost Certainly a Hoax' : Discovery News
quoting AndrewJ:
"I have been to the Dome of the Rock on multiple occasions, and I can tell you that, at any given time, there are no less than 50-100 people directly around the Temple Mount/Noble Sanctuary, an area that can only be accessed after going through Israeli Defense Force (IDF) security checkpoints. Other than this mix of civilians and worshippers of multiple faiths, there is also always a significant number of IDF soldiers around the perimeter of the Temple Mount/Noble Sanctuary (it's Jewish and Muslim identifiers, respectively). What I'm getting at is there should be at least several dozen eyewitnesses, the majority of them highly-trained soldiers. From what I know, the IDF has not officially taken a position on this. They might release a statement tomorrow, or they might never. Either way, if this is genuine, and this was not an elaborate feat of special effects, then investigators should have no problem tracking down eyewitnesses. As interested parties may have noticed, very few print or television news organizations have reported on this. "
While his comments about the area need to be verified, if they are fact, they do reinforce the idea that this was a hoax.
But what was the point? Who benefits? There's still the possibility that this was a psyop to evaluate reactions to anomalous phenomenon & it's effect on organized belief system worshippers.
Or it could be an elaborate hoax perpetrated by someone trying to be the next Federico Alvarez:
I really wish someone over there would do a professional level investigation to answer the various unanswered questions.
With that said, this kind of cements where I stand at this point. If you're not there, you CAN'T verify it (and sometimes not even then).
It'll be the ultimate irony if there are countless "real" videos online that people swear are fake because the lines are blurred so much by the "realistic fakes". State of the world today.
ALPHA ROMEO UNIFORM
Whittingham
Still can't beat War of the Worlds , Day of the Triffids, Day Earth Stood Still and looking forward to
Infolad1
Purveyor of Hidden Things
I'll be there opening day for that one. I love a good alien invasion movie (and yes, the irony does not escape me
)When it comes to end of the world, balls to the wall Sci-Fi, George Pal did it better than anyone:
The "new" versions were ok. Real purdy though.
Of course Wise's "The Day The Earth Stood Still" is iconic.
And don't forget "Earth vs. The Flying Saucers!!" Harryhausen RULES!
JMikkola
Editor - World Nexus Publications
I guess Aristotle said it best: "Truth can influence only half a score of men in a century while falsehood and mystery would drag millions by the nose."
What's happening is again the same dichotomy of lies and truths that's been going on since the dawn of time... A 'Dark Ops' so to speak of using both factions, 'the believers,' and the 'non believers' to disseminate what's real and what isn't.
In a situation of alien extraterrestrials making themselves known to humankind, government believes their populations would not be able to handle the truth without panicking, which is most likely the part of the equation providing much of the mis-information. Religious factions on the other hand would be exposing themselves as having misled millions for millennial 'by hiding the truth in confusing parables as what the truth actually is'...after all...King James scholars were quite selective as to what epistles made it into the Bible and destroyed any evidence that would expose their plot. Even to the point of of slanting women as subservient, prostitutes, or unfavorably. As the truth could destroy organized religion. Ignorance after all keeps a population subservient to religion and government, and has created many Popes, Presidents, and dictators, throughout history, good or evil.
If you think about it, how much information (truth) is being passed to us through films, interwoven into a story that reveals only tidbits of what may be really going on? (It's kind of like decoding a spies communique!)
Hoaxing is a way for both these factions to keep us guessing, both mixing truths with lies. Thereby leaving us with no alternative to dismiss some truths, because we'd have to believe the lies (and visa-versa) The fact is, we're all susceptible to these tactics of manipulation.
Yet for those of that have actually witnessed UFOs or an alien abduction, no convincing is necessary, they know that something's up (no pun intended). And for most that haven't, they most likely will never really believe them to be real. It's for that reason that we created the Journal of Anomalous Sciences, and the Dimension Zone...So that both sides of the coin can be shown, by providing enough of a valid argument to allow people to think for themselves.
Let's just hope that we're just not preaching to the choir when we do.
Jari
Editor
World Nexus Publications
What's happening is again the same dichotomy of lies and truths that's been going on since the dawn of time... A 'Dark Ops' so to speak of using both factions, 'the believers,' and the 'non believers' to disseminate what's real and what isn't.
In a situation of alien extraterrestrials making themselves known to humankind, government believes their populations would not be able to handle the truth without panicking, which is most likely the part of the equation providing much of the mis-information. Religious factions on the other hand would be exposing themselves as having misled millions for millennial 'by hiding the truth in confusing parables as what the truth actually is'...after all...King James scholars were quite selective as to what epistles made it into the Bible and destroyed any evidence that would expose their plot. Even to the point of of slanting women as subservient, prostitutes, or unfavorably. As the truth could destroy organized religion. Ignorance after all keeps a population subservient to religion and government, and has created many Popes, Presidents, and dictators, throughout history, good or evil.
If you think about it, how much information (truth) is being passed to us through films, interwoven into a story that reveals only tidbits of what may be really going on? (It's kind of like decoding a spies communique!)
Hoaxing is a way for both these factions to keep us guessing, both mixing truths with lies. Thereby leaving us with no alternative to dismiss some truths, because we'd have to believe the lies (and visa-versa) The fact is, we're all susceptible to these tactics of manipulation.
Yet for those of that have actually witnessed UFOs or an alien abduction, no convincing is necessary, they know that something's up (no pun intended). And for most that haven't, they most likely will never really believe them to be real. It's for that reason that we created the Journal of Anomalous Sciences, and the Dimension Zone...So that both sides of the coin can be shown, by providing enough of a valid argument to allow people to think for themselves.
Let's just hope that we're just not preaching to the choir when we do.
Jari
Editor
World Nexus Publications
Infolad1
Purveyor of Hidden Things
I agree with most of JMikkola's points. It's good to have a forum such as this, where you have people with different
filters on to sift through the data, as was just done. "Believe" nothing.
The disinfo component is just one part of the high weirdness Baboshka Doll. Pieces within pieces.
I'm glad to see that you've taken a proactive stance with the creation of the Journal & Zone.
And I agree with your last paragraph. I do think the choir is being preached to though. Most people in the
mainstream see this stuff as entertainment. And the one's that half way look at it quickly turn away because it
seriously messes with their reality box. Which is probably for the best. There are some things that people aren't
ready to deal with.
filters on to sift through the data, as was just done. "Believe" nothing.
The disinfo component is just one part of the high weirdness Baboshka Doll. Pieces within pieces.
I'm glad to see that you've taken a proactive stance with the creation of the Journal & Zone.
And I agree with your last paragraph. I do think the choir is being preached to though. Most people in the
mainstream see this stuff as entertainment. And the one's that half way look at it quickly turn away because it
seriously messes with their reality box. Which is probably for the best. There are some things that people aren't
ready to deal with.
Ezechiel
Paranormal Adept
These videos are worthless without the people behind them. However does a witness without a video have more credibility ? Rendelsham comes to mind
JMikkola
Editor - World Nexus Publications
In speaking with Nick Pope (one of the UFO Advisors on the Journal), who investigated the evidence of the Rendelsham Forest incident n 1996 for the Daily Express submitted a new article to us regarding the case, based on his review of the case while with the MoD (Miliatry of Defence).
According to the article submitted...the answer to your question is a resounding YES! Only in this case, it's the credibility of ALL the witness involved for not only those in the USAF, but the RAF as well. Unfortunately, there was no video evidence, and what photographic evidence has long been lost (or so claimed) by the US Air Force. In the second half of his article he explains just how credible the evidence was...You can listen to a digitized the copy of the full infamous Halt tape (all 18 min 29 sec) that was provided to the journal by Mr. Pope at The Dimension Zone - anomalous, science, forum.
We also have been allowed to share the History Channel presentation of the Rendelsham case in the Dimension Zone's Occam's Enigma Video section:
The Dimension Zone - anomalous, science, forum.
And I totally agree, credibility from one person can be questionable, but with Rendelsham Forest there are dozens of credible witnesses who came forward, and their stories match!
Jari
According to the article submitted...the answer to your question is a resounding YES! Only in this case, it's the credibility of ALL the witness involved for not only those in the USAF, but the RAF as well. Unfortunately, there was no video evidence, and what photographic evidence has long been lost (or so claimed) by the US Air Force. In the second half of his article he explains just how credible the evidence was...You can listen to a digitized the copy of the full infamous Halt tape (all 18 min 29 sec) that was provided to the journal by Mr. Pope at The Dimension Zone - anomalous, science, forum.
We also have been allowed to share the History Channel presentation of the Rendelsham case in the Dimension Zone's Occam's Enigma Video section:
The Dimension Zone - anomalous, science, forum.
And I totally agree, credibility from one person can be questionable, but with Rendelsham Forest there are dozens of credible witnesses who came forward, and their stories match!
Jari
deadly.dostovei86
Paranormal Novice
webcam showing Ufo light was seen over Jerusalem | RealUFO's - The latest UFO Videos and News
I tried to find some sort of follow-up to this story and video. The above link is the best I could do while skimming. I wonder if some Israeli newspapers might hold some more clues.
Like the accompanying comment to the above video states, this is no proof of any sort to the Jerusalem Video, but, it does show a light around hte same time. Judge yourselves.
I tried to find some sort of follow-up to this story and video. The above link is the best I could do while skimming. I wonder if some Israeli newspapers might hold some more clues.
Like the accompanying comment to the above video states, this is no proof of any sort to the Jerusalem Video, but, it does show a light around hte same time. Judge yourselves.
JMikkola
Editor - World Nexus Publications
Again Deadly,
Without the original video it's really difficult to make a good assessment of the video, because even in HQ (yea right - HQ pixels) this video is highly pixelated by large pixel blocks. That aside, the area where the flash appears seems to be localized to a building which could be a tourist taking pictures with a flash camera that happened to get caught at the precise moment the time lapse shot was being taken.
When in doubt...throw it out! Sorry, but as much as I would like see an irrefutable video, I would still doubt this event even happened because of all the other crapola out there...
One can only hope that it will happen, and I wouldn't be surprised if it were sooner than later!
Jari
Without the original video it's really difficult to make a good assessment of the video, because even in HQ (yea right - HQ pixels) this video is highly pixelated by large pixel blocks. That aside, the area where the flash appears seems to be localized to a building which could be a tourist taking pictures with a flash camera that happened to get caught at the precise moment the time lapse shot was being taken.
When in doubt...throw it out! Sorry, but as much as I would like see an irrefutable video, I would still doubt this event even happened because of all the other crapola out there...
One can only hope that it will happen, and I wouldn't be surprised if it were sooner than later!
Jari
Infolad1
Purveyor of Hidden Things
LOL A picture truly IS worth a thousand words!
Do you know for a fact that it's a hoax? I've looked at some of the 'evidence' that all of these 'Jerusalem UFO' videos are hoaxes and none of the technical 'debunking' I've seen holds water, in my opinion. This includes edge analysis, comparing edges on architecture where one horizontal edge is completely still another diagonal edge is jiggling slightly. The implication being that both edges need to be still or show the same movement. The obvious explanantion for this, to me, is slight compression artifacting in the video.
It seems, to me, there is a lot of bandwangoning going on by 'true believers' on both sides of the arguement, but less actual investigation and real evidence.
Anyhow, I find the 3 videos (I think there are a total of three, real ones, so far) interesting. In my previous post in this thread I go into a bit more detail why. I think wait and see is still the best policy on this one.
JMikkola
Editor - World Nexus Publications
Good point softbeard,
World Nexus Publications tried contacting those who submitted the videos to acquire a copy in the original format directly from the video cameras that took the footage, as many of these videos have been copied, modified, and reposted (only adding to the quantization matrix falling below as much as 48% of the original - loss of clarity due to copying) it's difficult to say who has the original. Because to do a proper analysis we need a digital copy in its original format (h.264, AVI, M4P, etc.) whatever it was, and so far, no one as replied to our requests since these hit YouTube.
Since the original sources are unknown, I used several other techniques to analyze them without the availability of the original source file. Including observation of the various videos, and differences in them, a quantization analysis to determine the degradation matrix of pixel and pallet resolutions, ELA - Error level analysis of color pallet variances from various points of several freeze frames from several different videos (many of which have a wide variance). Most of which was color variance due to image recoloring (which only identifies a change in the color pallet making it highly suspicious). PCA - principal component analysis, a method to determine a breakdown denoted by fuzzy artifact halos caused by multiple re-saved imaging processes, usually noted within regions like the sky, buildings, and/or foreground focal points. And a heavy analysis of the wavelets (the crispness of images) in several videos that determines color transitions for sharpness and clarity. These often suggest multiple attempts at resizing to fit images into the frame, which causes the distortions...and ALL the video samples I used suggested major manipulation potentials with variances by as much as 5%, suggesting that there may as many as 5-9 layers of Photoshop magic taking place in each of the first 2 videos. I did not see a need to drag it out to the third.
However, if I had the original footage to review, I would also be analyzing it frame by frame to determine if the tracking information between frames, verifying to see if speed and tracking had been altered, including the sound track channels...But with the FLV formats from YouTube, that's not possible.
To me it is obvious (without the originals) that these videos were prime targets of extensive manipulation, recoloring, and rendering attempts. But I could be wrong...but I believe I did what I could, with what I had to work with...
Jari
World Nexus Publications tried contacting those who submitted the videos to acquire a copy in the original format directly from the video cameras that took the footage, as many of these videos have been copied, modified, and reposted (only adding to the quantization matrix falling below as much as 48% of the original - loss of clarity due to copying) it's difficult to say who has the original. Because to do a proper analysis we need a digital copy in its original format (h.264, AVI, M4P, etc.) whatever it was, and so far, no one as replied to our requests since these hit YouTube.
Since the original sources are unknown, I used several other techniques to analyze them without the availability of the original source file. Including observation of the various videos, and differences in them, a quantization analysis to determine the degradation matrix of pixel and pallet resolutions, ELA - Error level analysis of color pallet variances from various points of several freeze frames from several different videos (many of which have a wide variance). Most of which was color variance due to image recoloring (which only identifies a change in the color pallet making it highly suspicious). PCA - principal component analysis, a method to determine a breakdown denoted by fuzzy artifact halos caused by multiple re-saved imaging processes, usually noted within regions like the sky, buildings, and/or foreground focal points. And a heavy analysis of the wavelets (the crispness of images) in several videos that determines color transitions for sharpness and clarity. These often suggest multiple attempts at resizing to fit images into the frame, which causes the distortions...and ALL the video samples I used suggested major manipulation potentials with variances by as much as 5%, suggesting that there may as many as 5-9 layers of Photoshop magic taking place in each of the first 2 videos. I did not see a need to drag it out to the third.
However, if I had the original footage to review, I would also be analyzing it frame by frame to determine if the tracking information between frames, verifying to see if speed and tracking had been altered, including the sound track channels...But with the FLV formats from YouTube, that's not possible.
To me it is obvious (without the originals) that these videos were prime targets of extensive manipulation, recoloring, and rendering attempts. But I could be wrong...but I believe I did what I could, with what I had to work with...
Jari
This is what I think. From what I've seen so far, most of the technical analysis and attempts at debunking is zooming in on and amplifying noise in these videos; probably mainly compression artifacts. Conclusions are being jumped to mainly based on noise, not real information. Some form of statistical analysis with confidence intervals needs to be done.
As I said before, if it's a hoax it looks like a pretty good one. Still, tricks may be involved that made production of these videos a lot simpler than it appears at present.
Hotkafka
Sanity is a default
I haven't seen anyone mention the fact that what we've seen with this videos is only a fragment of what was recorded. The full version documents a prank that was being played on one of the persons involved in the filming. If you haven't viewed this in its entirety, I'd definately suggest it. Context is everything. And to me, this reeks of schenaniganry...
Well, that video I think certainly will help in adding information... But I don't understand, how does this show it as a prank? Can somebody provide translation for the video? Is there discussion of a setup or prank in this video?
Brian Now
Paranormal Pimp
One odd thing is that it doesn't seem like anyone ever addressed the person filming. Seems like if they were just 4 friends riding around they would all be talking to each other, in fact even talking over each other since in the Hebrew description on youtube they say they were drunk! I don't think the camera guy ever says a word, does he? That makes it a little suspicious.
Too bad they're talking too fast or I would try to translate. On the youtube page this comes from they say they are on Mount Scopus, if anyone was interested in their vantage point.