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Matthew Williams, Circlemaker

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¤ c i r c l e m a k e r s ¤[/quote]
I think that sounds a bit like a cop-out, and a very typical one for the paranormal scene, there's always a supposed conspiracy when things don't seem to work according to the convictions of the believers.

This is the ultimate character assasination, and it's a dirty trick.

I don't think it's character assassination, and it might well be true that MW is one the MI5 disinformation agents planted in Wiltshire. As for it being a dirty trick to speculate that MW is part of the decades-long manipulation and disinformation effort focused on crop circles, it hardly compares in terms of dirty tricks to said extended manipulation and disinformation. Why not read Colin Andrews's book Government Circles to get filled in on the history?
 
This all sounds very enticing, but it would be great if you could link direct referrences. Because what may look like UFO landing spots or whatever, to some, may look like very mundane and natural artifacts to others. As mentioned previously, crops beaten down by rain are not paranormal in my world, it's just what goes on in nature.
Rings and patterns are certainly not unknown in nature, as another poster mentioned, fungus may grow in perfect circles while expanding outwards, here's an example:
HekseringeSmaa.jpg


As you can hear, I'm sceptical, but I'd still like to see what you're adding to the mix here, I just don't have the time to look it all up for myself.

Here's a link to a conversation in an archaeology forum on facebook concerning what look like two crop circles appearing in a 2012 Google Earth image of a remote area in southwestern Australia. If you click on the photo it should enlarge. Greg Jefferys is a crop circle researcher who lives down there and is also interested in archaeology. It happens that one of the archaeologists in that forum lives 70 km from that area and visited it a few days after reading GJ's post to find out whether the apparent crop circles are remnants of ancient stone structures. You'll see how that develops in the conversation. Greg Jefferys has since looked at Landsat images of the area to see whether the formations were visible there previous to 2o12 and it turns out that they were not. So these formations might well be crop circles (wheat and oilseed rape are grown in those fields), and if they are, they are especially large crop circles.

Facebook
 
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I don't think it's character assassination, and it might well be true that MW is one the MI5 disinformation agents planted in Wiltshire. As for it being a dirty trick to speculate that MW is part of the decades-long manipulation and disinformation effort focused on crop circles, it hardly compares in terms of dirty tricks to said extended manipulation and disinformation. Why not read Colin Andrews's book Government Circles to get filled in on the history?
Why don't you give us an example? You can't just throw accusations around and call it a day. Please reveal exactly what your base your accusations and assertions upon, that would be a great help, thanks.
 
there are some pics here
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"It was a few hundred yards away and directly in front of us. As soon as I'd registered its presence I alerted my colleagues. Amazed, we stood there gazing at this football-sized orange light as it hung motionless, about forty feet above the surrounding countryside. After an estimated five seconds the light began to slowly descend. Within another five seconds it had descended about ten feet and had faded into invisibility."
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That sounds exactly like chinese lanterns.
 
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He also claimed at one point in one of his abductions that the aliens lent him a tripod because he left his at home. He needed the tripod so he could get shots of their ship. How extraordinarily convenient that advanced aliens from another galaxy flew across the universe or jumped in from a parallel dimension or whatever, with a tripod in tow for just such an occasion. ...
Haha, how lucky can a guy be :)
 
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Why don't you give us an example? You can't just throw accusations around and call it a day. Please reveal exactly what your base your accusations and assertions upon, that would be a great help, thanks.

There are many people over there who know more about (indeed have written about) the likelihood of organized governmental involvement in managing perceptions of cc than I do, especially Colin Andrews, who was the central focus of well-organized efforts (media spectacles) to put an end to speculations about the anomalousness of the cc phenomenon. I refer you to Andrews for the inside story.
 
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On his 1991 UFO sighting in South Whales. A seemingly strange orange triangular light seen for a very short period of time at night at some distance "sitting upright on the side of a hill" at the location of a
cairn mound doesn't qualify as a UFO sighting. For all we know, there were some people camped out up there, and what he was looking at was the glow through the translucent sides of an orange tent lit from the inside by lanterns. Imagine something like the triangular side of this tent seen from far away up on a hill at night:

201306_sneffels-tent-twilight.jpg

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Nice work Ufology, brilliant thinking there, and great illustration!
 
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There are many people over there who know more about (indeed have written about) the likelihood of organized governmental involvement in managing perceptions of cc than I do, especially Colin Andrews, who was the central focus of well-organized efforts (media spectacles) to put an end to speculations about the anomalousness of the cc phenomenon. I refer you to Andrews for the inside story.
Again, I ask you, what specific information do have to back up your accusations? Did you just throw it out there, just to stir the pot, without anything substantial to back it up? You accuse the man of being MI5 and you can't give one single specific detail about what evidence is there to prove that, so it seems to me that you refer to pure speculation and hearsay.
 
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Here's the clip posted on Steve Alexander's website, with the text he wrote when he released it on youtube 20 years after he took the footage. Other videos of BOLs have been obtained in Wiltshire fields and in crop circles in recent years by visitors to crop circles. If I can locate them I'll post them as well.



The Milk Hill UFO Footage

Very interesting footage Constance, thank you for posting the link. I can't see anything that would lead me to believe that it's a blatant hoax but there are a couple of strange points. First the constant green shifts in the video seem a bit odd, second the shift from the ball of light to the crop circle seems odd, if I was filming something like that I wouldn't take the camera off of it for a second but perhaps that's just me, and third towards the end of the video the guy says something like "A balloon..." or "the balloon" and I can't figure out what he's talking about, it seems strange that he would say something like that and then just drop it but it's very clear so I know I'm not mistaken. I have to wonder if he saw that his mysterious ball of light was just a foil like balloon caught in a draft and reflecting the sunlight. Also, why don't we have footage of the farmer with his stopped tractor? (EDIT: whoops there is a tractor on the video but if it was stopped by the ball of light, it was stopped for all of two seconds, not very impressive) All in all a very interesting video and besides those few little nitpicky points I can't see anything wrong with it. Still, I can't see it being an actual craft of some sort given that it was roughly the size of a beach ball according to the witnesses. I think it's a lot more likely that we're witnessing some kind of natural occurrence, kind of like earthquake lights or something similar. Colin Andrews has this article posted on his website which raises some interesting points about the BOL phenomenon:

Described as having roughly the size of soccer ball, these spheres have been seen flying over
the fields in an apparently intelligent manner, sometimes hovering from a few inches above the
ground up to several feet in the air. According to the numerous documentaries that mention
them, we know that some are silver, others purple, red, golden or blue.

In a book called Nikola Tesla Colorado Springs Notes 1899-1900 edited by Nolit in 1978
(probably still available through used book sellers online), there is a small section of scientific
commentaries written by Alexandar Marincic who was then associate professor of Electrical
Engineering at Belgrad University and scientific adviser to the Nikola Tesla Museum.

In January 3rd of 1900, Nikola Tesla, this famous electrical engineer to whom we owe the
discovery of the polyphased current and many other crucial inventions, was working in his
laboratory in Colorado Spring and he wrote, in his personal notes, the results he had obtained
from an electrical experiment that had produced «fireballs.»

Professor Marincic makes an extremely fascinating comment regarding this experiment. These
fireballs that Tesla was talking about behaved in many, if not all respects, like the balls of light
seen in the fields of England.

«Fireballs are considered to be a form of electrical discharge generated during thunderstorms.
(…) Fireballs are usually red, but other colors have also been observed: yellow, green, white
and blue. Their dimensions vary, a mean diameter being about 25 cm.
«Unlike ordinary lightning, fireballs move slowly, almost parallel to the ground. They sometimes
stop and change their direction of motion. They can last for up to 5 seconds.»
«(…) According to recent theories, fireballs consist of a plasma zone created by electrical
discharge.
«The latest research and calculations by Kapitsa show that the lifetime of a fireball cannot be
explained by the energy it receives at the time of the genesis, but that it must receive energy
from its surroundings. Kapitsa theorizes that this external energy is produced by a naturally
created electromagnetic field.»

Marincic continues:

«(…) The diameter of the plasma sphere is determined by the frequency of the external field,
so that a resonance occurs. The usual dimension of fireballs would require that the
electromagnetic field have a wavelength of between 35 and 100 cm. (…) It has been found that
to maintain a lump of plasma in air requires a power of the electromagnetic field of about 500
W.»

Now, let us compare the previous statements by professor Marincic to the observations that
were made of balls of lights in the fields of Southern England,

In the book that you have written with your friend Pat Delagdo, «Circular Evidence», a whole
array of events are described that lead the reader to believe that there is, put in a nutshell,
electricity in the air where crop circles are found: increased levels of magnetism, strange
noises coming out of nowhere (knocks, hissing, crackling sounds), compasses spinning in a
counter clockwise direction, bright flashes (maybe due to electrostatic reactions, the same that
occur when we remove our clothes in a dry room in the winter time?)

It seems that whatever makes the crop circles recognisable as «genuine» by the leading
researchers has something in common with electricity, magnetism, electromagnetism or all of
the above.

Maybe there is something in the geology of the Wessex Triangle that creates these reactions,
a hypothesis well worth exploring. But, let us return to our balls of light for the moment.

It is interesting to read Marincic’s comment regarding the lifespan of usual «fireballs». Five
seconds at most. There is credible footage, however, showing balls of light in the English
landscape having a much, much longer duration. Does this mean that balls of light are not
fireballs or plasma lumps after all? Not necessarily.

In a fascinating report on ball lightning by the Tornado and Storm Research Organisation (www.
torro.org) we learn that during a hurricane in the Barbados, in 1786, «a monstrous ‘ball of fire’
(…) remained visible for close to 40 minutes.»

TORRO believes that it can appear in relation to geophysical environments as well as
particular atmospheric conditions.

According to Marinicic’s text, fireballs must receive energy from their surroundings in order to
«exist».

Is it possible that this could be the same energy whose effects have been observed in
association with (and not necessarily emanating from) the crop circles? Let us not forget that
an expensive BBC camera was rendered useless during a visit inside a crop circle. This
«energy» is also said to have disturbed helicopters’ and planes’ electronic systems.

Earthquake lights, which are very similar to balls of light, can occur during tectonic pressures in
subsurface areas (faults). Canadian scientist Michael Persinger, who has studied the balls of
light phenomena, quotes Finkelstein, Hill and Powel (1973) who noted that «the electric fields
associated with such mechanical distortion of prone crystal lattices generate values of more
than 100 000 Volts per meter and are capable of ionizing the local air over large areas.»

Note by Colin Andrews: I was given the video seen here and taken by Stephen Alexander
shortly after he filmed the orb at Milk Hill, Wiltshire in July 1990. It was my research that
found the tractor driver seen in the film. He told me that he stopped his tractor as the 'Ball'
floated about 35-40 feet above his head. In the original film with the contrast turned right
down, the orb can be seen silhouetted against the bright sky as it suddenly speeds
vertically up into the sky.
Note by Colin Andrews: This if the famous footage which became known as the 'Oliver's
Castle'
film. It was first said to have been filmed on the night of 10-11th August 1996 by a
man calling himself John Weyleigh. He asked to meet me which I agreed to do. A copy of
the film was handed to me for analysis with a hand written note agreeing terms by which it
could be shown. I sent the film to be analysed I also engaged a private detective to
investigate Weyleigh and his claim. The footage was potentially too important to accept at
face value and had to be authenticated. My detective infiltrated his family and the film studio
he worked at. The footage was found to be a fraud and later the same people, including
Weyleigh, whose proper name is John Wabe, made a second video showing how the first
film was made. This they tried to sell to Nippon Television in Japan, who would not show it
but kindly provided me with the film for my library. It is a fairly accurate depiction of the balls
of light seen in that area but none so far have been seen making crop circles.


On its website, the US Geological Survey Earthquake Hazards Program (http://earthquake.usgs.
gov) states that «earthquake lights», which include seismic lightning and «globular
incandescent masses (…) are a recognised geophysical phenomenon.» EHP says that the
proposed mechanisms «include piezoelectric, frictional heating, exoelectron emissions,
sonoluminescence, phosphine gaz emissions and fluid injection (electrikeinetics).

In his paper entitled «Transient Geophysical Bases for Ostensible UFO-related phenomena
and Associated Verbal Behaviour» published in 1976 in the peer-reviewed publication
Perceptual and Motor Skills, professor Michael Persinger from the Laurentian University in
Canada writes extensively about the balls of light.

They were sometimes described, he says, in very interesting ways such as «chains of spheroid
glows moving in the same direction».

Persinger mentions that the luminosities and ionization «can occur in areas of tectonic stress,
without gross seismicity.»

He also mentions facts regarding these luminous sphere that are also familiar to those who
have been inside crop circles: «Close proximity («encounters») to the field (even below
luminogenic potentials) could evoke «tingling/prickly sensations», «apprehension»,
piloerection. (…)»

Balls of light are not a rare phenomenon in Southern England although this area of the world is
not famous for its earthquakes. So what generates them? And what energy sustains their
existence long enough for witnesses to film them for minutes at the time? Should we look into
other forms of energies such as scalar waves to comprehend this mystery? The debate is open.
 
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Again, I ask you, what specific information do have to back up your accusations? Did you just throw it out there, just to stir the pot, without anything substantial to back it up? You accuse the man of being MI5 and you can't give one single specific detail about what evidence is there to prove that, so it seems to me that you refer to pure speculation and hearsay.

That may be the way it seems to you, but that's not the way it is. The governmental (likely MI5) role in cc history in Wiltshire has been part of crop circle discourse for decades. I'm not going to write a paper about it for you and I'm not going to argue with you. Why do you seem so keen to protect Matt from any reference to this context? He's well aware of it and he can handle the situation on his own.
 
Very interesting footage Constance, thank you for posting the link. I can't see anything that would lead me to believe that it's a blatant hoax but there are a couple of strange points. First the constant green shifts in the video seem a bit odd, second the shift from the ball of light to the crop circle seems odd, if I was filming something like that I wouldn't take the camera off of it for a second but perhaps that's just me, and third towards the end of the video the guy says something like "A balloon..." or "the balloon" and I can't figure out what he's talking about, it seems strange that he would say something like that and then just drop it but it's very clear so I know I'm not mistaken. I have to wonder if he saw that his mysterious ball of light was just a foil like balloon caught in a draft and reflecting the sunlight. Also, why don't we have footage of the farmer with his stopped tractor? All in all a very interesting video and besides those few little nitpicky points I can't see anything wrong with it. Still, I can't see it being an actual craft of some sort given that it was roughly the size of a beach ball according to the witnesses. I think it's a lot more likely that we're witnessing some kind of natural occurrence, kind of like earthquake lights or something similar. Colin Andrews has this article posted on his website which raises some interesting points about the BOL phenomenon:

Muadib, I'm interested in reading your observations about the video and discussing it with you, but I've got to leave for work now. Will return tonight.
 
OK, so this post is going to be a little uncharacteristic of me as it's a bit conspiracy theory-ish but I've always wondered about this and I think it's an interesting anecdote to the whole crop circle story. When I was in elementary school, we used to receive a newsletter called the Scholastic Reader that was aimed at elementary school age children and contained stories about current events and things of that nature. I can't remember how often these things were published but I think it was a monthly type thing.

Anyway, one day we received our Scholastic Reader newsletter and the cover story was about crop circles and how they were all explained as the product of human beings, in fact the famous Doug and Dave were the main focus of the article and I believe it contained an interview with the two men in which they were credited with producing not just some, but all of the crop circles. I was in the third grade at the time and I had no clue what a crop circle was, much less who Doug and Dave were, but it's something that has always stuck with me. It seemed strange that they would cover such an esoteric subject in a newsletter aimed at elementary school children that never covered anything but academic type news and other world events. They never talked about UFO's or anything like that, why in this one instance was this story being presented to children who had no idea that this kind of thing was even going on? It always seemed very off to me, I guess it was a current event but it seemed totally uncharacteristic of the usual tone of the newsletter.

If I was conspiracy minded, I would say that it seemed like a story was being floated in order to take the focus off of the strangeness of the events and that the powers that be wanted to make it clear to everyone, even school age children who had no inkling of the phenomenon, that these circles were the product of nothing but hoaxers and charlatans. I wish I would've kept those newsletters now but sadly I lost them a long time ago. I wonder if anyone else who was in school at the time remembers this newsletter, it was a pretty big thing here in the states and went out to thousands of elementary schools across the country for years and years. Anyway, just a little bit of weirdness that has always stuck with me that I thought was relevant given the topic of the thread. I'm interested to hear if anyone else remembers the newsletter and this particular article.
 
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Those are birds, as far as I can see. It's certainly not evidence of anything strange.

This illustrates why I keep pressing you to back up your claims.

I thought of birds as well and so did the people in the video, in fact the guy in the video says at one point "Is that a bird?" and the woman he's with says "What, shiny birds?" I'm not a video analyst but I don't think I've ever seen a bird reflect the sun quite like that, I guess it's possible but I wouldn't be so quick to jump to that conclusion, it could be something totally benign and natural and yet not a bird. I'd be interested in hearing the opinion of some of our members who are a bit more knowledgeable than I about video production and things of that nature.
 
That may be the way it seems to you, but that's not the way it is. The governmental (likely MI5) role in cc history in Wiltshire has been part of crop circle discourse for decades. I'm not going to write a paper about it for you and I'm not going to argue with you. Why do you seem so keen to protect Matt from any reference to this context? He's well aware of it and he can handle the situation on his own.
You play a dirty game Constance, but I've seen it before among paranormal believers. You're the one with personal emotions at stake here, and you're the one with an agenda you keep pushing, but you can't or won't back it up with something concrete.

I don't give a damn about 'crop circle discourse', so please, enlighten everyone else here to the specifics which make you state your accusations. Otherwise it's just noise, and it's annoying.
 
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I simply see it as overexposure of the white plummage, an artifact.

Interesting, I wonder if we could find similar footage that we know is of birds causing the same type of effect. Seems totally plausible to me but I'm not willing to state that I know for certain it's a bird, I don't believe I have the expertise to make that call.
 
OK, so this post is going to be a little uncharacteristic of me as it's a bit conspiracy theory-ish but I've always wondered about this and I think it's an interesting anecdote to the whole crop circle story. When I was in elementary school, we used to receive a newsletter called the Scholastic Reader...
That just sounds like a bit of soft or curiousity-news to me. I think teachers get many questions about current events that the kids can't quite grasp, and perhaps the editors thought this was a 'hot topic' which would fascinate some kids, and which the teachers were ignorant about. It sounds very innocent to me.
 
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