Whats the typical view of chem trails around here?

Gareth · May 21, 2009

Jose Collado said:
Actually, the bourdon of proof isn't on me. I say chemtrails are contrails because contrails are again, backed by physics and free of assumptions.

You say chemtrails are real because....of your observations?

So, if you believe chemtrails are real according to your observations, then you are basing that on an assumption and speculation.

So, until you can provide proof the contrails are anything but, you are welcome to include "I assume" or "I speculate" in your argument. In which case, your argument will be more acceptable...but still not qualified as proof.

"If youre basing the main thrust of your argument on a sighting of one jet leaving a long contrail and jet near it at the same time leaving nothing, then you have an incredibly weak case IMO."

No Gareth, I am basing my argument of facts. On basic physics. On general meteorology. What are the chemtrail activists basing their opinion? A ground level observation. Nice.

Yeah maybe it wasnt clear in my post. I was saying that the burden of proof is on them.

Jose Collado · May 21, 2009

My bad...I guess it pays to read a little more before posting a response

pixelsmith · May 21, 2009

No Gareth, I am basing my argument of facts. On basic physics. On general meteorology. What are the chemtrail activists basing their opinion? A ground level observation. Nice.

so you did the science on contrails? or you just read something on the internet like i did?:

mikepc · May 21, 2009

Extraordinary claims demand extraordinary evidence. When you make an extraordinary claim, the burden is on you to prove your claim is factual.

Otherwise we get pulled into discussions like..

Prove the universe wasn't created by time-traveling leprechauns! It's pure and utter nonsense, no matter how many idiots you can convince of this fact (and believe me there are people you could convince of this), it does not change the fact that I just made it up. The burden of proof is on the people making the claim, not the people asking the questions.

pixelsmith · May 21, 2009

demand all you want. i cant prove anything. hell, i cant prove i exist.

skunkape · May 21, 2009

pixelsmith said:
demand all you want. i cant prove anything. hell, i cant prove i exist.

I am in the same boat. I've seen jets spraying stuff. It wasn't contrails. Contrails come from engine exhaust. They don't come from the tail of the plane.
<input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden">

mikepc · May 22, 2009

I can prove at least someone exists that can log in with your credentials, though because you posted this message. This gives me strong evidence to suggest that YOU exist, as giving your credentials to someone else to have this discussion wouldn't make much sense. Is it proof? No. But there is definitely strong evidence to suggest it, strong enough that even someone skeptical of your existence would be hard pressed to refute.

My point is that you can believe anything you want, brother. I just have a different threshold on my bullshit-o-meter and chemtrails just don't cross it.

Jose Collado · May 22, 2009

skunkape said:
I am in the same boat. I've seen jets spraying stuff. It wasn't contrails. Contrails come from engine exhaust. They don't come from the tail of the plane.
<input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden">

Uhhh, no. Contrails don't always appear from the engine exhaust because contrails have existed since late into WW1. No jet engines in the early 1900's from what I gather.

Contrails can form behind an aircraft. In fact, they can form and you just can't see them from the ground.

Jose Collado · May 22, 2009

pixelsmith said:
so you did the science on contrails? or you just read something on the internet like i did?:

I went straight to the source. Meteorologists.

When I want factual evidence I'll speak with those in the know. When I want conspiracy bunk, I'll speak with people like Alex Jones.

skunkape · May 22, 2009

Jose Collado said:
Uhhh, no. Contrails don't always appear from the engine exhaust because contrails have existed since late into WW1. No jet engines in the early 1900's from what I gather.

Contrails can form behind an aircraft. In fact, they can form and you just can't see them from the ground.

I was seeing them from the ground with a telescope. The shit appeared to be spraying from the tail...two streams of "contrail" from jets with 4 engines...two of them, unmarked, laying out a tic-tac-toe pattern that diffused over time and formed a layer of cloud-cover over previously clear sky. I'm not being paranoid about it. I was assuming NASA was involved because it was near Houston. I know what I saw, though...more than once...it was large planes spraying something. Period.
<input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden"><input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden">

Jose Collado · May 22, 2009

skunkape said:
I was seeing them from the ground with a telescope. The shit appeared to be spraying from the tail...two streams of "contrail" from jets with 4 engines...two of them, unmarked, laying out a tic-tac-toe pattern that diffused over time and formed a layer of cloud-cover over previously clear sky. I'm not being paranoid about it. I was assuming NASA was involved because it was near Houston. I know what I saw, though...more than once...it was large planes spraying something. Period.
<input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden"><input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden">

They're known as wingtip vortices. They're not "spraying" anything. They're creating contrails. Easy explanation with no assumptions necessary.

pixelsmith · Jun 18, 2009

chemtrails or the official terms "weather modification", "geo engineering", "terraforming" etc.. are real. our government, private companies and the CFR (NWO) have been involved with this on-going program for years.

Jose Collado · Jun 18, 2009

pixelsmith said:
chemtrails or the official terms "weather modification", "geo engineering", "terraforming" etc.. are real. our government, private companies and the CFR (NWO) have been involved with this on-going program for years.

Riiiiiiiiiiiight....you've nailed speculation, paranoia, antigovernment and anticorporation idealism in one sentence. Congratulations.

I assume you have some sort of supportive evidence right? Evidence which follows protocols that qualify it as such. Heads up, "Look around" or "do some research" aren't acceptable responses.

An official term? Really? On who's authority? What does "weather modification", "geo engineering" and "terraforming" have to do with contrails which are cirrus clouds by definition? Do you have anything at all to back anything you've said? Why would we need to terraform on Earth? That's a pretty strange concept.

I find it interesting that we live in a world where an aircraft can disappear in bad weather and it can take a prolonged period of time to locate it using the simplest methods...yet, somehow, we have the ability to control the weather on a global scale. This sort of thing is at home on the SciFi channel.

Contrails - backed by physics and free of assumptions

Chemtrails - speculative (at best)

dianadee13 · Jun 21, 2009

I thik they are something we should all be concerned about. Has anyone listened to the conscious media network? They have a bunch of stuff on this.

Jose Collado · Jun 21, 2009

They are contrails. Nothing more. Nothing less.

Don't you find it a little disturbing that the proponents of the chemtrail theory are yet to provide an ounce of credible proof to support their claims?

I find it difficult to believe anyone can take the chemtrail theory seriously when everything that comes out of the chemtrail supporter camp is nothing more than speculation.

Show me the proof.

Gareth · Jun 22, 2009

I agree that it seems strange that there is no proof of chem trails. While not all mysterious phenomena demand proof (UFO's for instance), I think the physical 'real-world' nature of chem trails suggests that - should they exist - obtaining proof would be a relatively straight forward task.

Now I'm not an idiot, and I realise it wouldn't be as easy as doing a PH test on the backyard swimming pool. However I do believe if someone was motivated enough they could do it. And why wouldnt they? If some of the claims are to be believed then chem trails are an extremely serious issue.

Experiencer7 · Jun 22, 2009

Aaron LeClair said:
I haven't seen anything that takes it out of the paranoid bullshit category.

I like the sprinkler lady. Anyone repost that vid for me?

Nm, I found it.

It's evil faerie dust, madam.

Experiencer7 · Jun 22, 2009

mikepc said:
Extraordinary claims demand extraordinary evidence. When you make an extraordinary claim, the burden is on you to prove your claim is factual.

Otherwise we get pulled into discussions like..

Prove the universe wasn't created by time-traveling leprechauns! It's pure and utter nonsense, no matter how many idiots you can convince of this fact (and believe me there are people you could convince of this), it does not change the fact that I just made it up. The burden of proof is on the people making the claim, not the people asking the questions.

I knew it! "Time Bandits" was a docudrama.

Jonah · Jun 22, 2009

Some may find the one of the names in the following familiar...it is in your best interest to know where the "chemtrail" conspiracy theory originated.

From the blog "Contrail Science":

"Looking at the previous year (199 9) on usenet, there is NO mention of chemtrails. The word “contrail” crops up 324 times, mostly in reference to meteors and rockets. There are a few references to the affect of contrails on climate change. But NOTHING about deliberate contrail creation, or anything like “chemtrails”.The web site chemtrailcentral.com was registered on May 6th, 2000, about a year after the “chemtrail” idea was created. The earliest archived page from there indicates a lot of local media involvement, and their archive indicates nothing before 4/24/2000, which said:

Monday a KHOU crew met with Chemtrail Tracking USA Club co-founders Lorie [Kramer] and Dona of Houston and member Rhonda from Ft. Worth, as well as other local members of the Yahoo! based club for the taping of a story on Chemtrails and public concern over their purpose and health impact. Reporter Ron Travino and cameraman Nathan visited for several hours at the house of Lorie, taping, talking, asking questions, and viewing photos and videos.

On chemtrailcentral, there’s actually a thread about the history of chemtrails. There people give their recollections of how it all started. Most date it to late 1998 or 1999. A few people report earlier contrails (1989, 1991) , and then surmise it must have started earlier.

A post there by 3T3L1 quotes chemtrail debunker Jay Reynolds:

derivation of the word “chemtrails”
Posted on August 26, 2001 at 09:06:54 AM by jayreynolds
was by Val Valerian(pseudonym for Former USAF captain [John] Grace) in April 1999. Grace/Valerian recognized that the power of suggestion worked against his claim and proposed coining a new term more suggestive of his claim

Jose Collado · Jun 22, 2009

I love the contrail science blog...or should I say, the blog that is being funded by the NWO and illuminati to keep the general population ignorant

Whats the typical view of chem trails around here?

Free episodes:

Nothin' to see here

Skilled Investigator

pixelsmith

Guest

Skilled Investigator

pixelsmith

Guest

Paranormal Maven

Skilled Investigator

Skilled Investigator

Skilled Investigator

Paranormal Maven

Skilled Investigator

pixelsmith

Guest

Skilled Investigator

Skilled Investigator

Skilled Investigator

Nothin' to see here

7L

7L

Skilled Investigator

Skilled Investigator